[Archived] Everton Preview

[RIML]

The reason we lost yesterday was nothing to do with the style of football played by either side, it was this, Sams brand of football relies heavily upon good defending throughout the team and yesterday we didnt do that, was it the change in defence (ie Nelsen) or was it the change in midfield which didnt give the defence the protection?? I will leave it to you to decide, but those were the reasons as I saw it.

I'd have to say it was the change in midfield because Nelsen and Jones did well against Man United last week, the difference was Grella imo but we can't rely on him being fit.

[John]

But only for the last 20 mins. The first hour was one-dimensional, Unibond Premier, hoofball toss. And with his one-striker system we lost 1-0, with 4-4-2 we at least scored and drew 2-2!

We have players easily good enough to play football, but the current regime doesn't allow them too. The tactical plan is simply hoof forward at the earliest possible opportunity. A work of genius.

The current regime is helping us punch above our weight, again.

You hate him, but our club is in very capable hands.

[ultrablue]

Possession:

Rovers 37% Everton 63%

Allardyce ignores this stat far too much. How can our possession be so low with 5 across midfield?

There needs to be big big changes in the middle. No one in there deserves to start next season except Dunn - they just don't have the quality.

There better be some good midfielders coming up on free transfers otherwise its another season of drab, up and under, territorial anti- football next year.

[Ossydave]

I was simply stating that Samba has been a liability too just season, he is our first choice centre half without a doubt but people think Nelsen is now our 4th choice centre half when Givet played in that position against Liverpool and was slated on MOTD for his performance. I wouldn't say Givet is any better in that position than Nelsen and Jones has been good but he showed yesterday he his human and will make mistakes, just like all our defenders, they've all made mistakes, out of Jones, Givet, Nelsen and even Chimbonda I think Nelsen is the best option we have.

I'd take Jones or Givet over Nelsen any day of the week. He was awful yesterday, he was also easily beaten by Cahill on one occasion, but he missed an absolute sitter.

[RIML]

I'd take Jones or Givet over Nelsen any day of the week. He was awful yesterday, he was also easily beaten by Cahill on one occasion, but he missed an absolute sitter.

Givet was awful against Liverpool and Stoke too, Samba's had his bad days but I'll be honest I've never seen Nelsen play so bad. I wouldn't say he was easily beaten by Cahill, it wasn't exactly a free header and he did enough to make him head over. I've seen Samba beaten like that this season, think it was at home to Birmingham.

[toetoe]

He also appears to have turned into a plodder recently.

He's been injured the last 2 months, hasn't he?

No idea why you are so obsessed with Nelsen but even a blind man could see that Samba is ten times the player he is.

When did this "Samba is by far our best defender" conclusion get made? From getting the most unnecessary red cards to missing the ball and to making reckless challenges, Samba is not 10 times better than Nelsen.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

It's hard to know where to start. There's been a lot of sense already talked on this thread. Was I entertained ? Yes to a point. I saw a second half rally that made a game of it right to the end, I saw two great goals from the Rovers, one possibly our goal of the season. I saw a lot of clever possession play from our opponents which ultimately allowed them to pin us back into our penalty box and score the winning goal. The first 20 minutes was like attack and defence , Everton just passed through our midfield at will Rovers seemingly under instructions not to press the ball unless it came into our last third of the pitch. Nelsen made an extremely rash tackle on Arteta, penalty played for and got, so we were up against it from the start. For the first 35 minutes Rovers hardly strung two passes together and watching Kalinic fail to evade the two or three markers Everton could put on him became mind numbing.

In the ten minutes before half time we had a little flurry of play when one of two passes stuck.

At half time I put the radio on for the scores and caught Stuart Hall on 5 live referring to our brand of football as " Alehouse ". Could we argue, I've seen better football from some alehouse teams.

The second half carried on in this meandering fashion for a while,then Roberts came on and at least the Everton centre halves had to break sweat. It took a right foot thunderbolt from Nzonzi to wake us up and start performing.

We were looking much better at this point but an elementary failiure to deal with a throw in led to Yakubu scoring with a first touch tap in. At that point against the run of play. Back we came for Roberts to score with a goal almost the equal of Nzonzi's. I thought then we've got a good point here, but Sam had other ideas and threw on another forward Hoilett, I would have put Grella on , bolstered the midfield and took the point.

With Rovers having Kalinic, Roberts And Hoilet on up front and the rapidly tiring Dunn, Ollsen and Nzonzi in midfield Everton totally dominated the last 5 minutes and laid siege to our goal. Two well worked shooting openings were spurned but the third time they opened us up was fatal.

All in all a draw and maybe a point each would have been fair, but if one team had to win I can't complain.

If you give any team twice as much of the ball as you have yourself it's normally only going to end one way.

Scores - Not for those of a nervous disposition !

Robbo 5 Did he make a save ?

Salgado 7 Very impressed with this guy, never say die attitude and he'll run all day. Just a shame he's the wrong side of 30.

Jones 6 Steady and competent performance, he got done at the end by a guy who was fresher and quicker. He'll learn from that. At the risk of offending his fan club, distribution of the ball is not his strong point at the moment.

Nelsen 5 Dropped a clanger really early on and never really got going after that. He's behind Samba, Jones and Givet in the centre half pecking order for me.

Givet 7 Did really well for me ,strong sturdy defender, I don't think he missed an header all day. He's not got much of an attacking game but if he had he wouldn't be at Rovers.

Pedersen 4 Ineffectual,lacks aggression. When the likes of Arteta start poking you in the eye you know you've been tumbled. I can think of one or two old Rovers who would have snapped that finger off.

Andrews 4 Ineffectual, just ambles around looking like he still can't believe his luck.

Dunn 5 It took me 30 minutes to realise he was playing, why does he get 5 and the previous two get 4- He's a local lad.

Nzonzi 7 Battled to keep the sinking ship that was our midfield afloat, scored a contender for our goal of the season but was running on his tongue at the end.

Ollsen 6 Ran hard all day but never got any sort of service or support. I like Givet but when he's at left back anyone further forward is strictly on their own.

Kalinic 5 Up against Jagielka and Distin with no service , that equals no output unless you're Rooney or Torres or Drogba - and he isn't. He's a good player but he's wrong player for our system, we need some one like Doyle at Wolves. Strangely when Roberts came on to give him a lift he made a goal with a neat pass.

Subs

Roberts 6 Made a difference when he came on , scored a Sheareresque goal. Proves to me he's an impact player not a starter.

Hoilett 5 Ineffectual , barely touched the ball.

Di Santo - Came on for the last two minutes , didn't get a touch.

[Ossydave]

He's been injured the last 2 months, hasn't he?

When did this "Samba is by far our best defender" conclusion get made? From getting the most unnecessary red cards to missing the ball and to making reckless challenges, Samba is not 10 times better than Nelsen.

In my opinion he IS 10 times better than Nelsen

[47er]

But only for the last 20 mins. The first hour was one-dimensional, Unibond Premier, hoofball toss. And with his one-striker system we lost 1-0, with 4-4-2 we at least scored and drew 2-2!

We have players easily good enough to play football, but the current regime doesn't allow them too. The tactical plan is simply hoof forward at the earliest possible opportunity. A work of genius.

I have to agree with the posters who say Nelsen is looking cumbersome too - he seems to have declined rapidly - even Zurab would probably get in ahead of him tbh!

Harsh on Nelsen imo.The whole team was slow out of the blocks for some unknown reason and Arteta was left completely unmarked well to the right of the attacking penalty area. Nelsen had to rush way out of position to attempt to retrieve a very bad situation. he didn't do it well I admit but he shouldn't have had to do it at all. After that he was fine. I love the way fans go on endlessly about how there's no loyalty in football anymore but turn on loyal and long-serving players with out a second thought.

[USABlue]

HAving had the nights sleep and time to reflect I can only say I'm disappointed. I simply cannot believe how a ref can make a decision to give two yellows in the eye poke incident and not a straight red. The more I think about it the more it beggars belief. It is espescially irksome when you reflect on one or two of our weak sendings off. Since when do refs have a right to change the letter of the law. Marriner should be punished for that clanger yesterday because Blackburn Rovers were.

On the upside, Sunderland did well and Fulham and stoke all dropped points so top half is still acheivable.

[47er]

Possession:

Rovers 37% Everton 63%

Allardyce ignores this stat far too much. How can our possession be so low with 5 across midfield?

There needs to be big big changes in the middle. No one in there deserves to start next season except Dunn - they just don't have the quality.

There better be some good midfielders coming up on free transfers otherwise its another season of drab, up and under, territorial anti- football next year.

So N'Zonzi doesn't deserve to start next season? I'm sure he'll be starting somewhere else then.

And where do we find the money to replace an entire midfield given that Dunn has a bad injury record? The Walkers? Selling more enormously expensive season -tickets? The Lottery?

[RIML]

In my opinion he IS 10 times better than Nelsen

Maybe you could explain why you think he's 10 times better

I've pointed out the few mistakes Samba has made and I know Nelsen has made mistakes but he's not been ten times worse than Samba and Samba hasn't been 10 times better than Nelsen. Just a few league stats from this season to consider but it depends on what you think makes him a better player.

Appearances (as sub)

Nelsen 25 (3)

Samba 28 (0)

Goals

Nelsen 3

Samba 3

Assists

Nelsen 2

Samba 0

Shots on target

Nelsen 7

Samba 18

Fouls committed

Nelsen 30 (26 according to Premier League stats)

Samba 42 (43 according to Premier League stats)

Yellow cards

Nelsen 3

Samba 4 (5 according to Premier League stats)

Red cards

Nelsen 0

Samba 1

Goals Conceded/Game

Nelsen 1.46

Samba 1.32

Clean Sheets/Game

Nelsen 0.42

Samba 0.43

To me it concludes Samba is slightly better defensively but his fouls counts and card counts are higher. I don't think you can prove he is 10 times better, I've said Samba is our first choice centre half but he's no way 10 times better than Nelsen, he has a slight advantage with his age and height but it's a close call.

[Eddie]

We don't need to replace the entire midfield, we just need to bring in one central midfielder with a bit of class who can run the show for us and add some composure. N'Zonzi is fine doing his job, but he needs someone with skill to play alongside him.

[Paul Mellelieu]

We go to 442 and concede two poor goals.

[RIML]

Harsh on Nelsen imo.The whole team was slow out of the blocks for some unknown reason and Arteta was left completely unmarked well to the right of the attacking penalty area. Nelsen had to rush way out of position to attempt to retrieve a very bad situation. he didn't do it well I admit but he shouldn't have had to do it at all. After that he was fine. I love the way fans go on endlessly about how there's no loyalty in football anymore but turn on loyal and long-serving players with out a second thought.

People must think he's made the most mistakes this season, I think that's quite funny how they can think that with the mistakes the other defenders have made which have obviously gone unnoticed and all have been forgotten.

[thenodrog]

Givet 7 Did really well for me ,strong sturdy defender, I don't think he missed an header all day. He's not got much of an attacking game but if he had he wouldn't be at Rovers.

He was guiltier than Nelsen of poor defending for the penalty. I think his mind was still in the changing room.

btw How the hell can you give MGP and Andrews the same score?? Andrews had his worst game ever for us imo. He was nowhere near the action all the time he was on the field. His claim for offside in the first half was laughable. No mailce to him but he really should not be playing in the Prem.

[RIML]

btw How the hell can you give MGP and Andrews the same score?? Andrews had his worst game ever for us imo. He was nowhere near the action all the time he was on the field. His claim for offside in the first half was laughable. No mailce to him but he really should not be playing in the Prem.

Not to mention that bit of skill he tried to pull off what was he thinking it looked like he was trying to do some fancy Ronaldoesque step over but he slipped.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

He was guiltier than Nelsen of poor defending for the penalty. I think his mind was still in the changing room.

btw How the hell can you give MGP and Andrews the same score?? Andrews had his worst game ever for us imo. He was nowhere near the action all the time he was on the field. His claim for offside in the first half was laughable. No mailce to him but he really should not be playing in the Prem.

Easy, they both contributed roughly the same amount of nothingness. If you rolled both of them together you wouldn't have a footballer.

[Tom]

Yet pedersen created 3 or 4 good chances in the first half with his deliveries, how does that equal contributing nothing?

[MarkBRFC71]

The current regime is helping us punch above our weight, again.

You hate him, but our club is in very capable hands.

Hating him would be childish and is the wrong word - but intensely disliking the way we play, the fully-justified hoofball public image he's foisted onto Rovers, and the arrogance of the man? I make no apologies for that.

I still maintain if the players were allowed to play rather than being instructed to launch it at every opportunity we would be punching higher.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Yet pedersen created 3 or 4 good chances in the first half with his deliveries, how does that equal contributing nothing?

What three or four good chances were they ? I can't remember many chances whilst he was on, just several hurried snap shots that hit Everton defenders. Can we carry on playing a guy just for the odd corner that he lands in the penalty area or a guy that gives the opposition centre halves a migraine with his long throws ? Last week some fool had a Ferdinand miss kick down as a Rovers attempt on goal ! It wasn't you was it ?

[MarkBRFC71]

Harsh on Nelsen imo.The whole team was slow out of the blocks for some unknown reason and Arteta was left completely unmarked well to the right of the attacking penalty area. Nelsen had to rush way out of position to attempt to retrieve a very bad situation. he didn't do it well I admit but he shouldn't have had to do it at all. After that he was fine. I love the way fans go on endlessly about how there's no loyalty in football anymore but turn on loyal and long-serving players with out a second thought.

No doubts he's been a wonderful servant to Rovers, but whether it's down to injury or time inevitably catching up with him, he is not the player he was. Hopefully a good, full pre-season will get the old Admiral back but at present he is 4th choice imo.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

No doubts he's been a wonderful servant to Rovers, but whether it's down to injury or time inevitably catching up with him, he is not the player he was. Hopefully a good, full pre-season will get the old Admiral back but at present he is 4th choice imo.

I can't argue with any of that but to me he's never been quite the same since he had that very serious injury a while back. I remember reading about it at the time and thinking he'll be lucky to play again at any professional level. He lost a yard of pace at least then and a bit of spring in his jumping for headers. Given the fact that in his prime his speed and decisiveness in the tackle were his main assets it was a big loss.

Yesterday we had two guys at centre back neither of which are particularly comfortable on the ball, and whose distribution is not their strong point ( Jones may grow into a more accomplished passer of the ball in time, Nelsen won't ). That led to a lot of ball not sticking to a Rovers player when it was cleared from defence.

[Exiled_Rover]

We don't need to replace the entire midfield, we just need to bring in one central midfielder with a bit of class who can run the show for us and add some composure. N'Zonzi is fine doing his job, but he needs someone with skill to play alongside him.

One that can get up and down the field. The last thing we need is a talented, but static central midfielder.

[RIML]

No doubts he's been a wonderful servant to Rovers, but whether it's down to injury or time inevitably catching up with him, he is not the player he was. Hopefully a good, full pre-season will get the old Admiral back but at present he is 4th choice imo.

I don't understand why people would rather see Givet in the centre ahead of Nelsen. If you look at Givet's record when he's played there it's no better, the games we've kept clean sheets in, whilst Givet played in the centre are the home games against West Ham, Hull and Bolton. Samba and Nelsen played in the away fixtures and surprisingly we kept clean sheets against the same three teams.

In the cup game, when Givet played in the centre we didn't manage to keep a clean sheet against lower league opposition, Gillingham and Peterborough, something Nelsen did manage against Nottingham Forest

Ok I'm boring myself now, I'm just trying to make a point.