[Archived] Facism- Alive And Well And Living In Israel

[Steve Moss]

Do you mean the "non-binding" United Nations resolutions? If so, the "non-binding" part of the UN resolution should be a clue that it isn't law.

The corpus of international law is very small. Even when it exists, the enforcement mechanisms are very limited. That is a reality of our world. Always has been and likely always will be in light of the many nation states who have the power to literally destroy large portions of the world.

Israel has acted contrary to the proclamations and resolutions of many countries. So what? Proclamations are NOT law, they are PR ploys..

[cletus]

United Nations resolutions are being broken by Israel.

Indeed they are, & Israel should be 'forced' to tow the line......but the United Nations as we all know is nothing but a talking shop. The UN has no real power. The United States, Russia & China are where the power is at. Britain pretends to be at the big boys table but we`re not, we`re just the USA`s lapdogs.

If the UN really wanted to force Israel into changing it`s land-grabbing policies, it could be easy to blockade & sanction a small country surrounded by much larger unsympathetic neighbours. A sea blockade would be the final nail in the coffin if Israel failed to comply......but there`s little or no will to go down that route.

Can i ask what the UN has said about the palestinian/hamas rocket attacks on Israeli towns & villages?

[Bazzanotsogreat]

United Nations resolutions are being broken by Israel.

And so they are in Darfur, in far more vile ,ethnic cleansing sort of way. But still it is acceptable as it is Muslims are doing the murdering.

[thenodrog]

And so they are in Darfur, in far more vile ,ethnic cleansing sort of way. But still it is acceptable as it is Muslims are doing the murdering.

Indeed bazza. Genocide must have a different definition in Africa. Half a million or so dead at the last count with 5 times as many displaced from their homeland by Sudanese govt sponsored guerillas. Google tells me that thats a figure about double the entire population of the Gaza strip! Our bleeding heart brigade don't have very much to say about that do they?

[colin]

Indeed bazza. Genocide must have a different definition in Africa. Half a million or so dead at the last count with 5 times as many displaced from their homeland by Sudanese govt sponsored guerillas. Google tells me that thats a figure about double the entire population of the Gaza strip! Our bleeding heart brigade don't have very much to say about that do they?

I'm not too sure what your post means.

The discussion is about Israel's actions on boarding & invading & killing people on a peaceful convoy to Gaza.

I'm not sure what Sudan has got to do with it.

Perhaps if you started a new thread about Sudan and tell us what you are doing to help the Sudanese people. You obviously care about them because you disparage the "bleeding heart brigade" who you think don't care.

Would you like to share with us what you are doing to alleviate the suffering of the Sudanese people? I'm sure we would all be interested, so that we could perhaps follow your humanitarian example.

Cheers

[thenodrog]

I'm not too sure what your post means.

The discussion is about Israel's actions on boarding & invading & killing people on a peaceful convoy to Gaza.

I'm not sure what Sudan has got to do with it.

Perhaps if you started a new thread about Sudan and tell us what you are doing to help the Sudanese people. You obviously care about them because you disparage the "bleeding heart brigade" who you think don't care.

Would you like to share with us what you are doing to alleviate the suffering of the Sudanese people? I'm sure we would all be interested, so that we could perhaps follow your humanitarian example.

Cheers

OK Colin. I'm employing it as a comparison to outline the emphasis of our very own media skewed bleeding hearts club..... and then ignoring it.

Rem the age old truism 'Life's cheap in Africa'. Well it is, and not just in Africa.

Cheers

[neekoy]

For the millionth time they are breaking international law and so should return it just as any other country illegally occupying territory should.

Hold on, need to pull you up on this. They don't need to hand back anything, the law you are throwing around talks about relocation of citizens of an occupying force.

They haven't relocated anyone, the populations were there before and are moving voluntarily.

[philipl]

The Israelis are deservedly facing several problems now:

- legal actions by the citizens of several countries for unlawful arrest and imprisonment on the high sea- the French have a particularly juicy case coming forwards

- the Turkish Navy are planning to accompany the next flotilla

- the German Jewish community are sending a relief boat direct to Gaza

- the Irish have just refused an Israeli diplomat clearance over abuse of Irish passports

I am surprised more has not been reported on the experiences and eye witness accounts of the people who were on the flotilla which was attacked.

[thenodrog]

I am surprised more has not been reported on the experiences and eye witness accounts of the people who were on the flotilla which was attacked.

Me too. Golden propaganda opportunity missed. What had they to hide do you think?

[jim mk2]

I am surprised more has not been reported on the experiences and eye witness accounts of the people who were on the flotilla which was attacked.

You're reading the wrong newspapers philip.

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=21434

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/01/gaza-flotilla-eyewitness-accounts-gunfire

http://www.inminds.co.uk/article.php?id=10400

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/10206802.stm

http://www.tmponline.org/2010/06/06/flotilla-de-jong-colborne/

[thenodrog]

http://www.tmponline.org/2010/06/06/flotilla-de-jong-colborne/

Described as 'Activists'!! When they see a bit of action they don't like it. Bet those f~~~~munchers were at Greenham Common too.

[cletus]

The Israelis are deservedly facing several problems now:

- legal actions by the citizens of several countries for unlawful arrest and imprisonment on the high sea- the French have a particularly juicy case coming forwards

- the Turkish Navy are planning to accompany the next flotilla

- the German Jewish community are sending a relief boat direct to Gaza

- the Irish have just refused an Israeli diplomat clearance over abuse of Irish passports

I am surprised more has not been reported on the experiences and eye witness accounts of the people who were on the flotilla which was attacked.

I read somewhere the Iranian President intends to send some warships to the med to 'support' the aid ships going to Gaza.

It`s probably just a bit a sabre rattling from the Roy Keane look-a-like. He likes to publicly 'hate' Israel, cos it goes down well with the people at home & he likes to think he`s the spokesman of the greater arab world.

It might get a bit tasty over the coming months.

[thenodrog]

Interesting to those following this thread.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/7920330/Fury-as-Israel-president-claims-English-are-anti-semitic.html

[Bazzanotsogreat]

Interesting to those following this thread.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/7920330/Fury-as-Israel-president-claims-English-are-anti-semitic.html

I must say that I agree with Peres assessment. There is most defiantly an undercurrent of anti-Semitism in our nation.

[thenodrog]

I must say that I agree with Peres assessment. There is most defiantly an undercurrent of anti-Semitism in our nation.

An 'undercurrent' in some areas of the country will be a tsunami in others.

[Paul]

I must say that I agree with Peres assessment. There is most defiantly an undercurrent of anti-Semitism in our nation.

Out of interest amongst whom? I have to say the Peres quotes are nonsense in my opion. He may be confusing anti-Israeli sentiments and translating this into anti-semetic problems. That's his problem, not ours

[FourLaneBlue]

Hmmm...facism, eh?

So what is facism? What do Israelis have against faces? I know their women aren't exactly up there with those of Brazil or Sweden, say, but targetting all faces is a bit over-the-top and extreme I would say. Furthermore, I am not sure that whatever happened to faces under the Nazis is at all relevant here.

Anyway...that's two pennorth's worth on the subject.

[Bazzanotsogreat]

Out of interest amongst whom? I have to say the Peres quotes are nonsense in my opion. He may be confusing anti-Israeli sentiments and translating this into anti-semetic problems. That's his problem, not ours

Virulent new strain of anti-Semitism rife in UK, says Chief Rabbi

On Top of Sachs assesment cnecdotally, one only has to look at some of the stances and opinions expressed on this messegeboard. If for example, someone has expressed similar views against say Muslims you would expect a ban of some sort. It does seem in general okay to be anti-Semitic.

[Paul]

Have to say Sacks may well be correct in the specific incidents he quotes but his generalisation is foolish. People may well be anti-Israel, after all they are renowned bullies who ignore world opinion, but to suggest Jews are hated is daft. As for anti-semitism on the MB can you point to examples?

Other than a few idiots who refer to Spurs fans as yids, I can't recall the last time I heard or read anti-Semitic remarks yet everyday life I'd littered Wight anti-Islamic remarks.

[thenodrog]

Other than a few idiots who refer to Spurs fans as yids, I can't recall the last time I heard or read anti-Semitic remarks yet everyday life I'd littered Wight anti-Islamic remarks.

Wrong Paul. Yid is short for yiddish. And yiddish is a bona fide term for a Jew of eastern european origin. Many people assume that it is insulting simply through ignorance of the facts.

An example being that Spurs fans call themselves Yids. "Yids" or "Yiddos" began to be used in the 1980s, mainly by rival Arsenal fans towards Tottenham fans as a term of abuse because of the large Jewish population in the Haringey/Stamford Hill area. The Spurs fans made the nickname a badge of honour by calling themselves the "Yids" or "Yiddos".

Ignorance all around still does not make the term yid or yiddish offensive in itself.

[Paul]

Yes, thank you I have a perfectly adequate command of the English language. The use of the word "yid" has different meaning and interpretation depending on the circumstance. I suggest most people are wary of using the term in order to avoid the potential for offence, clearly football fans never intend to cause offence and use the correct pronunciation and nuance at all times and are no doubt fully aware of the derivation. I seem to recall the same discussion has occurred about other words with similar overtones.

Oxford English Dictionary

Wikipedia

[thenodrog]

Wikipedia

Highly contradictory. I assume you didn't read past the 1st sentence?

[Paul]

Highly contradictory. I assume you didn't read past the 1st sentence?

My second sentence in the post you quote from: "The use of the word "yid" has different meaning and interpretation depending on the circumstance." which leads me to assume YOU didn't read past the first sentence. Or more likely you simply ignored the bits that don't suit your personal agenda.

[thenodrog]

My second sentence in the post you quote from: "The use of the word "yid" has different meaning and interpretation depending on the circumstance." which leads me to assume YOU didn't read past the first sentence. Or more likely you simply ignored the bits that don't suit your personal agenda.

Well done Paul. You've scrabbled around well to nearly but not quite recover from your earlier error. Keep it up.

Now as my command of the English language is not quite as perfect as you deem yours to be would you mind translating the meaning of this ....? "...yet everyday life I'd littered Wight anti-Islamic remarks."

[philipl]

I occasionally see people reacting to orthodox jews in the same way they react to islamic-dressed women and indeed to nuns. To the extent that jewish people have expressed their identities more in recent years and Israel has behaved provocatively, anti-jewish reaction might have ticked up a notch.

However, the way the Israeli apologists scream anti-semite at anyone who posits a reasoned argument against the Israeli Government is utterly ridiculous- some of the strongest critics of Likud are in fact people with the deepest love and sympathy for Israel. It is painful watching someone you admire debasing themselves which I think is a fairly mild description of what is going on over there- viciously criminal might be more appropriate.

Just like their islamic brothers, jewish people in the UK sometimes do not help themselves. I saw something quite astonishing on a busy bus yesterday- a little boy of perhaps 7 wearing a skull cap strongly and noisily objected when a white lady in her thirties attempted to sit next to him. It appeared he had been brought up to regard all women of menstrual age as potentially unclean and therefore not to risk contamination from them.