Group H Discussion - Chile, Honduras, Spain, Switzerland

[Tom]

This could make things interesting, I wonder who the favourites are right now, none of the favourites have really turned it on.

Out of all the big name players Messi has looked by far the most likely to do damage

[Eddie]

5 minutes of stoppage time? Is Ferguson a Spanish supporter?

[Tim Southampton Rover]

The Swiss are doing all they can to time waste.

Bringing on subs, the goalie wasting time....which was awesome because he then got booked which meant more time was wasted and he had to re-take the kick.

They need to do a Tugay and walk from one side of the pitch to the other.

Well done Swiss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Amazing result.

[Eddie]

Wonderful.

[neekoy]

Wow, not exactly champagne football but I guess they do what they have to.

[tcj_jones]

If Spain come second in this group then, in all likelihood, Italy will get an easy route to the semis. Surely nobody wants Italy boring their way to another final?

Spain played a lot of nice passing football, but none of it was incisive. They needed two up top and more width.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Outstanding defensive performance from Switzerland, Hitzfeld is a great coach.

Spain are seriously going to have to step up another gear. Sides will have seen this performance, put up a solid defensive wall and ask Spain to break them down.

[neekoy]

It seems to be the way to play though, try and play open and get smacked 4-0, close up shop and hope for a goal or draw.

Until they change the rules in world football to reward attacking play then we are going to continue to see lesser lights close up shop and play for set peices.

[Eddie]

They looked great playing in front of Switzerland, which was exactly what the Swiss allowed them to do, but they struggled to open them up. Only the opening game, so can't judge them too harshly, but their defensive problems will probably be more of a concern.

It seems to be the way to play though, try and play open and get smacked 4-0, close up shop and hope for a goal or draw.

Until they change the rules in world football to reward attacking play then we are going to continue to see lesser lights close up shop and play for set peices.

Change the rules in world football? This coming from someone who loved Inter winning the champions league and supports Blackburn Rovers? Switzerland were the better team today, stuck to their game plan and Spain couldn't break them down.

[Rovermatt]

Shocking result for Spain. They were absolutely hopeless. The world and his wife knew that the Swiss were going to shut up shop. No ideas, no hope.

A load of bolloks.

[neekoy]

Eh? I didn't want Inter to win the CL and I started following Rovers long before we turned into a set peice team.

The swiss did a great job in closing the game down, they won so that is all that matters in the scheme of things, there should however IMO be a greater reward for attacking play.

I always liked the goals, corners, shots on goal

The swiss goal over rules everything but if it stayed nil all Spain had 25 shots and 12 corners compared to 9-3

[philipl]

Cracking performance by the Swiss who are in the driving seat to win this Group now. If Spain can beat Chile, they are probably playing Brazil in the last 16!

I only saw the second half and thought it was a really good game- the much maligned Howard Webb was outstanding.

[Claytons Left Boot]

Result!! Look forward to watching any highlights tonight.

[jim mk2]

Hitzfeld has been taking notes from Mourinho on how to negate Spain's wonderful passing game.

Good game to watch. The Swiss are on a roll.

[DeadlyDirk]

I enjoyed the game, thought it was a good tactical battle between two sides trying to do different things. What I liked about the Swiss is that although they were very defensive they still got players forward when they had the ball and didn't just look to hoof it.

The only thing that almost made it unwatchable was more trash from Mick F'n McCarthy, I really have no interest in anything he says.

[Tom]

Eh? I didn't want Inter to win the CL and I started following Rovers long before we turned into a set peice team.

The swiss did a great job in closing the game down, they won so that is all that matters in the scheme of things, there should however IMO be a greater reward for attacking play.

I always liked the goals, corners, shots on goal

The swiss goal over rules everything but if it stayed nil all Spain had 25 shots and 12 corners compared to 9-3

What on earth are you talking about?

Should we make it the team with the most shots win? If it stayed at nil nil then the Swiss did their job and would have achieved the same result as Spain and therefore take equal points.

What you are suggesting can only be achieved by changing the entire game of football.

Got to say thats one of the more bizarre posts I've seen on a football forum. Each to their own though.

[LeChuck]

I didn't see Spain's game, but did they start with three defensive midfielders? i.e. Alonso, Busquets and Xavi?

[Billy Castell]

I have no problems with the defensive stance of the Swiss. Anyone who does can take their bottle of weak American beer and watch some bollards like the Harlem Globetrotters or the 100 greatest goals. Football is played in a variety of ways, and the Swiss tailored their tactics to thwart a team that passes and moves with a very eye catching smoothness. They didn't have the players to adopt those tactics, so they defended like the 300, and nullified the opposition.

[RibbleValleyRover]

I didn't see Spain's game, but did they start with three defensive midfielders? i.e. Alonso, Busquets and Xavi?

Yes, though Xavi was slightly further forward. Spain looked a better side when they went to a 4-4-2 with Torres and Villa up front and Navas on the right hand side.

[Eddie]

I'm not saying that you wanted Inter to win, but you were quick to praise Mourinho and his tactics, which were largely based on stifling their opposition.

Reward attacking play? How would you do that? Have to agree with TCO in that being one of the oddest things I've ever read and it would be a complete @#/?ization of the game of football and turn it into some easily digestible TV version for the masses.

The only way you could do it is a rugby or cricket style bonus points system where more points are awarded for winning by a number of goals or keeping a clean sheet? Even then that wouldn't have changed the fact that Spain lost today. It also only really needs to be used in those sports as goal difference, or at least their equivalents, is less significant.

[Rovermatt]

The Swiss had every right to shut up shop against Spain. Spain simply had no ideas but should have put away at least one of their chances. Pique's miss in the first half was a real waste.

This is the sort of opposition that top sides have to learn to deal with. We saw how Brazil weathered the North Korean's smothering defence before allowing their superiority to shine through. Xavi, Iniesta et al wound up looking like Arsenal on a bad day by the end.

[Silencio]

Shocking result for Spain. They were absolutely hopeless. The world and his wife knew that the Swiss were going to shut up shop. No ideas, no hope.

A load of bolloks.

"absolutely hopeless"

What are you talking about? There have been plenty of "absolutely hopeless" performances in this tournament (England's being one of them), but Spain's was not. The Swiss were, however, very well organised and Hitzfeld is a coach with a very good record.

Thought it was a very good game to watch and Spain, as usual were excellent in possession. They made chances but didn't stick them away but I am sure they will win the next two games as Chile are pretty open.

Spain definitely looked better with Villa and Torres on together, they both should have scored at least one each.

I've always thought that Puyol is a bit overrated. Anyone else?

[Rovermatt]

"absolutely hopeless"

What are you talking about? There have been plenty of "absolutely hopeless" performances in this tournament (England's being one of them), but Spain's was not. The Swiss were, however, very well organised and Hitzfeld is a coach with a very good record.

I thought they were really poor. Passing the ball from side to side is all very well but they could be playing until next week and they still wouldn't have scored.

[neekoy]

I'm not saying that you wanted Inter to win, but you were quick to praise Mourinho and his tactics, which were largely based on stifling their opposition.

Reward attacking play? How would you do that? Have to agree with TCO in that being one of the oddest things I've ever read and it would be a complete @#/?ization of the game of football and turn it into some easily digestible TV version for the masses.

The only way you could do it is a rugby or cricket style bonus points system where more points are awarded for winning by a number of goals or keeping a clean sheet? Even then that wouldn't have changed the fact that Spain lost today. It also only really needs to be used in those sports as goal difference, or at least their equivalents, is less significant.

What about instead of penalties? I suppose for a group match a nil all draw could be deemed acceptable.

Easily digestible TV version for the masses may be, the American market would eat it up. Everyone I know who DOESN'T watch football says they don;t because they don't see the point in a defensive nil all draw.

Wanna know my other bizarre idea? No points for a draw but 3 for the win and 1 for a loss.

[Miker]

What about instead of penalties? I suppose for a group match a nil all draw could be deemed acceptable.

Easily digestible TV version for the masses may be, the American market would eat it up. Everyone I know who DOESN'T watch football says they don;t because they don't see the point in a defensive nil all draw.

Wanna know my other bizarre idea? No points for a draw but 3 for the win and 1 for a loss.

I think I know what you're trying to get at, but it's a pretty ridiculous suggestion. The only marginally viable idea would be to eliminate draws altogether, so that teams have to play for the win. The issue here is that unlike footy or other high scoring games, it's not that easy to have a clear winner, draws will always be common place after 90 minutes. So a tie will have to be decided by something else after 90 minutes, and I'm not sure how effective a penalty shootout is for that. I think a penalty shootout would still encourage poorer teams to hold out for the draw and have a chance in the penalty shootout to win 3 points. Making teams play longer than 90 minutes to decide a tie isn't an option either as the fitness levels wouldn't last over an entire season.