Semi Finals Discussion

[philipl]

Because England should be in the semi-finals and not the Germans... and of course we would have knocked out Argentina

[broadsword]

This is the semi-finals discussion, why are we discussing England again?

cos topman is bitter and twisted?

[tony gale's mic]

Hear hear.

The Hermans need taking down a peg or three.

My hatred for them is now back to 1996 levels (who remembers Andy Muller strutting at Wembley?)

Sorry but I don't understand where all this hatred for this German team comes from. They're a completely different breed to any other German team, play a different brand of football, have a very different mix of personalities and best of all not a single mullet in sight.

There's no arrogance whatsoever except for the confidence that one would expect a side who just knocked 8 goals past Argentina and England to have.

[jim mk2]

There is nothing likeable about German football teams. They are similar to their cars - efficient and everything works but soulless.

Sorry but I don't understand where all this hatred for this German team comes from. They're a completely different breed to any other German team, play a different brand of football, have a very different mix of personalities and best of all not a single mullet in sight.

There's no arrogance whatsoever except for the confidence that one would expect a side who just knocked 8 goals past Argentina and England to have.

Some of us cannot forget the trauma of Leon 1970 and many other defeats at the hands of German teams since then. Losing to them hurts like no other team. And yes, they are arrogant. It goes with the territory of being German.

[tony gale's mic]

There is nothing likeable about German football teams. They are similar to their cars - efficient and everything works but soulless.

Some of us cannot forget the trauma of Leon 1970 and many other defeats at the hands of German teams since then. Losing to them hurts like no other team. And yes, they are arrogant. It goes with the territory of being German.

Put your copy of the Sun away jim.

I spent some time in Berlin last month and it was a city bursting at the seams with soul, creativity, heart and expression. The people were fantastic and on more than one occasion I found a German person on the subway striking up a friendly conversation with us when they realised we weren't local - certainly something you would never see in London.

If you can't see the evidence on the pitch that this German team is both efficient and a joy to watch with much more flair and creativity than other German teams then you're blinded by jingoism. How are the Germans any more arrogant than the English?! Did you not hear some of the patronising comments from our players about the group games? Or maybe the arrogant English press both at the time of the World Cup draw and at some points during the group stage?

I can understand the dislike of Argentina - twice they've cheated us, Maradona in '86 obviously and then Simeone going down like a sack of spuds in '98. However whenever Germany have beaten us they've done it without cheating, sure with some luck but they've rarely set out to con the referee.

[jim mk2]

If you can't see the evidence on the pitch that this German team is both efficient and a joy to watch with much more flair and creativity than other German teams then you're blinded by jingoism. How are the Germans any more arrogant than the English?! Did you not hear some of the patronising comments from our players about the group games? Or maybe the arrogant English press both at the time of the World Cup draw and at some points during the group stage?

The England players believe the media "hype" that they play in the best and richest league in the world and are therefore are better than anyone else. Their comments are stupid rather than arrogant because the history books will tell them that England habitually fail at international level. All the German footy players and fans that I have met have an arrogane about them that irritates me intensely - the comments of Beckenbauer about England before and during the WC are fairly typical. And no, I don't by choice read the Sun.

[SouthAussieRover]

Out of the four I hope Spain don't win it.

Pretty passing movements but little goalmouth action.

They've bored the proverbial out of me in this competition.

[dave birch]

Well, for me, the Germans have played some pretty good football. They deserve to be still in it.

I'd really like to see a Germany v Holland final.

Though the dutch, in their first game were bordering on the violent with some of their over the ball hits. Since then they have played some good football.

[tmap]

They're not arrogant, just ignorant.

You can't seriously tell me that the English national side has the same arrogant attitude as the germans.

I'm struggling to even work out what you mean here.

Are you seriously suggesting that the Germans are anywhere near as arrogant as England?

There's a big difference between "arrogant" and "really really good".

[thenodrog]

The England players believe the media "hype" that they play in the best and richest league in the world and are therefore are better than anyone else. Their comments are stupid rather than arrogant because the history books will tell them that England habitually fail at international level. All the German footy players and fans that I have met have an arrogane about them that irritates me intensely - the comments of Beckenbauer about England before and during the WC are fairly typical. And no, I don't by choice read the Sun.

Typically accurate Jim. Der Kaiser was only giving an honest opinion and one which we should all praise for it's accuracy. Few pundit's, ex-pro's, press media commentators in this country appeared able to see it before the tournament and the gullible and naive British public swallowed the lot...... In fact just as you and 3 more numpties did here http://www.brfcs.co.uk/mb/index.php/topic/22877-england/page__view__findpost__p__886602

I can only suggest that your knowledge of football matters is only rivalled by your knowledge of politics.

[CrazyIvan]

Typically accurate Jim. Der Kaiser was only giving an honest opinion and one which we should all praise for it's accuracy. Few pundit's, ex-pro's, press media commentators in this country appeared able to see it before the tournament and the gullible and naive British public swallowed the lot...... In fact just as you and 3 more numpties did here http://www.brfcs.co....post__p__886602

I can only suggest that your knowledge of football matters is only rivalled by your knowledge of politics.

I agree about Beckenbauer, he called it and he was proven right. It might have annoyed some people but if you actually read what he said, he was perfectly within his rights and correct in his assessment.

As for the typical anti-German sentiment, it's silly and childish. Funny at times but ultimately it holds the England team back. The German players always come together, they are a proper team and not a bunch of overpaid individuals who haven't got any fire in their belly. They are young, hungry and very talented. They have a lot of admirable qualities that anybody with any footballing sense would admire. You might not like them but by god they are good. I happen to work with Germans and most of them are very likeable, very hard working and put a lot of the rest of Europe to shame. There really is nothing wrong with the Germans.

All the anti-German bias and feeling that gets paraded before us in the papers (especially the Sun and the like) are so silly it makes us a laughing stock. We're holding on to that history like a drowning man hanging onto a plank of wood. In the end it's like Basil Fawlty said, 'Just don't mention the war.'...

[thenodrog]

...... I happen to work with Germans and most of them are very likeable, very hard working and put a lot of the rest of Europe to shame. There really is nothing wrong with the Germans.

I must say they were exceptionally friendly towards us when we stayed in Cologne for the Bayer Leverkeuson fixture.

[broadsword]

I'm struggling to even work out what you mean here.

Are you seriously suggesting that the Germans are anywhere near as arrogant as England?

There's a big difference between "arrogant" and "really really good".

As stated previously, the English players aren't arrogant, just really thick and ignorant.

[RoyRover]

That's true, I can't. The German's is somewhat justified.

Typically accurate Jim. Der Kaiser was only giving an honest opinion and one which we should all praise for it's accuracy. Few pundit's, ex-pro's, press media commentators in this country appeared able to see it before the tournament and the gullible and naive British public swallowed the lot...... In fact just as you and 3 more numpties did here http://www.brfcs.co.uk/mb/index.php/topic/22877-england/page__view__findpost__p__886602

The people who signed up to the usual pre-World Cup hype in this thread, despite the Englands abject failures over the past decade, probably wish they hadn't now!

As for the semi-finals I think both games are going to be close. I think Spain have to improve if they want to win. They were my tip for the World Cup and still think that they are good enough to win it, but I feel that Torres needs to be dropped and either bring in Llorente, Jesus Navas, Fabregas or Pedro. The last 20 minutes against Paraguay showed how much more fluid the team was when a few of these players were bought in. The German midfield has been superb at the World Cup, especially in their last two games, but if there is a midfield that could out do them it is the Spanish one, where Xavi and Iniesta are the best in the business. Thomas Müller will be a big miss for the Germans, but they have good players to come in. On form Germany should win, but if Spain can raise their game, then I think they could spring a surprise.

As for the other game, I don't see many goals being scored. The Dutch have been much more conservative in this World Cup and it has worked. I don't see them approaching this game any differently, as Diego Forlan has the ability to punish any mistakes. Uruguay have also kept things very tight at this tournament and it has been very affective. I'm delighted that a smaller nation like theirs has made it so far. They will miss Suarez, but they have a chance. Holland are favourites, but I wouldn't be surprised if Uruguay went through on penalties.

[dave birch]

The people who signed up to the usual pre-World Cup hype in this thread, despite the Englands abject failures over the past decade, probably wish they hadn't now!

As for the semi-finals I think both games are going to be close. I think Spain have to improve if they want to win. They were my tip for the World Cup and still think that they are good enough to win it, but I feel that Torres needs to be dropped and either bring in Llorente, Jesus Navas, Fabregas or Pedro. The last 20 minutes against Paraguay showed how much more fluid the team was when a few of these players were bought in. The German midfield has been superb at the World Cup, especially in their last two games, but if there is a midfield that could out do them it is the Spanish one, where Xavi and Iniesta are the best in the business. Thomas Müller will be a big miss for the Germans, but they have good players to come in. On form Germany should win, but if Spain can raise their game, then I think they could spring a surprise.

As for the other game, I don't see many goals being scored. The Dutch have been much more conservative in this World Cup and it has worked. I don't see them approaching this game any differently, as Diego Forlan has the ability to punish any mistakes. Uruguay have also kept things very tight at this tournament and it has been very affective. I'm delighted that a smaller nation like theirs has made it so far. They will miss Suarez, but they have a chance. Holland are favourites, but I wouldn't be surprised if Uruguay went through on penalties.

Roy, you should be in politics!

[RoyRover]

Roy, you should be in politics!

If the graphic design doesn't work out, then a career as a fence sitting politician could be in the pipeline!

[tmap]

As stated previously, the English players aren't arrogant, just really thick and ignorant.

England's players consistently think they are way better than the evidence shows, they are dismissive of supposedly inferior opposition, they are vastly overpaid compared even to the other competitors, and they rely on fan-boy juries to get them out of their periodic bouts of GBH. What exactly would qualify as "arrogant" if it's not that?

Germans are undaunted by big occasions and big-name opposition, and celebrate their frequent victories looking like they always knew they were going to win. If that's "arrogance" then I'd rather have more of it in the England team.

Anyway, I agree with the post above that Uruguay could well spring a surprise tomorrow, while the Spain Germany game is anyone's. Oddly, I think the Germans may well miss Mueller, and his booking was a moment of shocking weak-mindedness by the ref.

[broadsword]

England's players consistently think they are way better than the evidence shows, they are dismissive of supposedly inferior opposition, they are vastly overpaid compared even to the other competitors, and they rely on fan-boy juries to get them out of their periodic bouts of GBH. What exactly would qualify as "arrogant" if it's not that?

Being paid mega-money and getting let off easy when they break the law doesn't necessarily make them arrogant.

I meant "arrogant" in the sense of not being good winners. England should've beaten USA and Algeria but didn't (just look at our qualifying record) - however I think it's too easy to ascribe that to just a single factor (arrogance). It seemed to be more down to not wanting to be there - which is hardly the same as looking down your nose at everyone.

English footballers are completely removed from reality, and may well treat the fans with arrogant disdain. But I don't think they have the same attitude as the germans.

[JAL]

English footballers are completely removed from reality, and may well treat the fans with arrogant disdain. But I don't think they have the same attitude as the germans.

Think you mean just a few English players here in the likes of your Terry's and Gerrards and Coles.

If you'd met lads like Gally, Dunny, Bret Omerod, Mat Derbyshire and many more you'd soon know that these English footballers are more than in touch with reality, living closely amongst the supporters, sharing exactly the same emotions as the supporters do just probabaly having a little bit more background knowledge of their fellow pros.

[philipl]

Boy, we are underwhelmed by this World Cup judging by the contents of this thread!

[tmap]

But I don't think they have the same attitude as the germans.

Sadly not, no.

[Eddie]

Boy, we are underwhelmed by this World Cup judging by the contents of this thread!

I think this will go down as one of the worst ever tournaments.

[thenodrog]

I think this will go down as one of the worst ever tournaments.

In what way?

[Eddie]

Very few good matches, no great matches so far, terrible officiating, questions over the ball, sub-par performance from virtually all of the best teams and best players, very few good goals...could keep going really. It is by far the worst world cup I have ever watched.

[G Somerset Rover]

I don't think it's been that bad. The terrible noise at matches and match balls have been the two biggest issues that I have had but the football on show has been pretty decent. Just because the big guns (players and teams) have underperformed doesn't make it a bad tournament. It's been refreshing to see teams like Uruguay and Ghana having excellent competitions and putting the likes of France and dare I say it, England, to shame.

I can't wait for Spain vs. Germany tomorrow. Germany it would seem, now love to attack whilst the Spanish will obviously try to pass them to death. Also pleased that David Villa is finally getting the recognition he deserves.