[Archived] Tony Blair - A Journey

[koi]

This is not a political thread so if you want to debate politics run along. Right, leaving aside personal opinion on TB and New Labour I decided to purchase this, I'm not usually a fan a this type of book and usually only purchase those of significant individuals. However, I picked the book up at 10pm for a quick read to send me off for the night and before I knew it the clock had turned 1am before I forced myself to put it down and stop annoying the missus. Yes it's egotistical and no my opinion has not changed but it's very enlightening and entertaining. Recommended read.

[den]

This is not a political thread so if you want to debate politics run along. Right, leaving aside personal opinion on TB and New Labour I decided to purchase this, I'm not usually a fan a this type of book and usually only purchase those of significant individuals. However, I picked the book up at 10pm for a quick read to send me off for the night and before I knew it the clock had turned 1am before I forced myself to put it down and stop annoying the missus. Yes it's egotistical and no my opinion has not changed but it's very enlightening and entertaining. Recommended read.

Bought it myself Koi. Got it delivered yesterday and looking forward to reading it. I'll be amazed if this doesn't descend into another political fighting thread though. Wonder who will be the first to launch a tirade?

[koi]

Bought it myself Koi. Got it delivered yesterday and looking forward to reading it. I'll be amazed if this doesn't descend into another political fighting thread though. Wonder who will be the first to launch a tirade?

If it does I'll be asking for it to be locked.

As I said in the OP so far I'm really enjoying it, it's very revealing and actually quite funny in parts - there's a dark humour there, something that I never saw in Blair. Anyway, I wont spoil it!

[ultrablue]

thats because you can't put politics aside if you discuss a book such as this. Isn't their a book review thread for simple recommendations/reviews?

[den]

thats because you can't put politics aside if you discuss a book such as this.

Well yes you can if you want to.

Isn't their a book review thread for simple recommendations/reviews?

What difference is that going to make?

I haven't read the book yet, so surely it's better to read it first before deciding what the discussion might be about? - Or at least hear what people who have read it, say about it.

In the introduction, he says that he isn't intending to give accounts of the history of his Premiership, because there have been plenty of those so far and there will be, no doubt, more. He says what he's trying to do is give you an impression of what it's like to be a human being at the centre of all this, because there's only one person who can know that. It's supposedly an account of how he himself changed from being one kind of leader into another. That's why he calls the book "A Journey"

So it is possible to discuss this without getting involved in the straight political side of things. I haven't read it yet, but let's see how long this thread lasts before it's used for political propoganda by people on here.

[koi]

Well yes you can if you want to.

What difference is that going to make?

I haven't read the book yet, so surely it's better to read it first before deciding what the discussion might be about? - Or at least hear what people who have read it, say about it.

In the introduction, he says that he isn't intending to give accounts of the history of his Premiership, because there have been plenty of those so far and there will be, no doubt, more. He says what he's trying to do is give you an impression of what it's like to be a human being at the centre of all this, because there's only one person who can know that. It's supposedly an account of how he himself changed from being one kind of leader into another. That's why he calls the book "A Journey"

So it is possible to discuss this without getting involved in the straight political side of things. I haven't read it yet, but let's see how long this thread lasts before it's used for political propoganda by people on here.

So far that's true, sure he talks about his background and how that's shaped his beliefs but from there it's much more about his life as the PM and refreshingly free of political drivel. It also confirms how worryingly real 'The Thick of It' is!

[ultrablue]

Isn't their a book review thread for simple recommendations/reviews?

What difference is that going to make?

I haven't read the book yet - you need a review

so surely it's better to read it first before deciding what the discussion might be about? the discussion has already started without you- in reviews

Or at least hear what people who have read it, say about it. BINGO - you got there in the end

Just trying to make the point that if you don't want this to become the inevitible political thread you think it will be, put the OP alongside other book reviews, thus making it about the contents of the book, rather than Blair

[den]

Just trying to make the point that if you don't want this to become the inevitible political thread you think it will be, put the OP alongside other book reviews, thus making it about the contents of the book, rather than Blair

I can't put it anywhere ultrablue. Koi put it on here and I replied with no problems at all. It isn't difficult.

If Koi and the mods want to move it though, that's up to them, not me.

[ultrablue]

thought you were admin - my mistake

[tmap]

I'm on Chapter 4. Easy to read, vivid, occasionally quite funny.

My only literary criticism to date is that he gets terribly mealy-mouthed about the Smith succession; you can tell that his emotions still aren't really clear about it. Could have made the same points in far fewer words. He also lapses into some slightly grating cheerful soundbites sometimes (complete with irritating exclamation marks - I half expected to see "smileys"), but I suppose that really is how he speaks.

I am, as ever, appalled at his apparent inability to see the limitations of government. He really does think he's "in charge of the country", rather than just administering some aspects of its governance. In that however he is the same as pretty much all politicians.

[den]

thought you were admin - my mistake

S'OK. I used to be a moderator, - that's probably what you were thinking of - but not now.

[thenodrog]

Has he said what he'll do with any profits? He hardly needs the money and I assume that the book was about the time he was in public office so to gift any profits to good/needy causes would be a good move. I might even consider buying a copy myself if he promised to do that.

Any suggestions?

[den]

Here Gordon.

[koi]

Has he said what he'll do with any profits? He hardly needs the money and I assume that the book was about the time he was in public office so to gift any profits to good/needy causes would be a good move. I might even consider buying a copy myself if he promised to do that.

Any suggestions?

Of course he's open to cynicism the irony of the cause he's donating too is not lost on anyone (least alone me) but it's a whole lot a wonga for a very good cause.

[FourLaneBlue]

Has he said what he'll do with any profits? He hardly needs the money and I assume that the book was about the time he was in public office so to gift any profits to good/needy causes would be a good move. I might even consider buying a copy myself if he promised to do that.

Any suggestions?

He has decided to give it all to the British Royal Legion. So, no excuses now Gordon!

All in all, I still think Blair was a genuine-enough guy who did believe he was doing the right thing. Of course, this didn't stop him spectacularly messing up at times (and the Iraq war will always be held against him) but, like John Major before him, they tried to do their best. Not sure if history will be particularly kind to him or not. Hard to say. Ultimately, the country voted for him three times.

I cannot think of any Prime Minister we have ever had who could not pilloried for some of their actions. Certainly Winston Churchill (a hero to all of us) was not without his moments, including many years before he finally become PM. Are there any who could be said to have been wholly positive for the nation?

EDIT - I see den posted a link.

[jim mk2]

. Not sure if history will be particularly kind to him or not. Hard to say. Ultimately, the country voted for him three times.

Tony Blair won 3 elections in a row which says it all about his popularity, although his detractors might say the Tories were in disarray and unelectable in that period. Read the book in 48 hours - it's one of those that you cannot put down. Apart from a 12-page eulogy to the US and the American dream which is way over the top, the book is informative and entertaining and very different to the usual fare from former political leaders. A must read for those who enjoy the machinations at Westminster.

Are there any who could be said to have been wholly positive for the nation?

Harold Wilson - England won the World Cup while he was in power.

[FourLaneBlue]

Harold Wilson - England won the World Cup while he was in power.

Rovers won the Premiership while John Major was in power...

[thenodrog]

Harold Wilson - England won the World Cup while he was in power.

But for a dog called Pickles Wilson would have seen that competition devalued under his leadership along with the £ and just about everything else too.

[broadsword]

Well yes you can if you want to.

What a bizarre thing to say, den.

It's a book about someone's political life, it's impossible to discuss it without discussing politics. Unless you want to kiss his back end and call him "a pretty straight kinda guy".

Personally, I wish Tony Blair would go on a bleeding journey. One where he's never seen or heard of ever again.

[philipl]

Maureen Dowd of the New York Times destroys the poodle without pity.

[thenodrog]

Maureen Dowd of the New York Times destroys the poodle without pity.

Is it possible Tony Blair was unloved as a child?

"Tony wants everyone to know he has feelings.

Do they really suppose I dont care, dont feel, dont regret with every fibre of my being the loss of those who died? he asks of his critics."

"Blair writes that he thought he was right and that he and W. rid the world of a tyrant. But he winds up with a bitter anecdote: I still keep in my desk a letter from an Iraqi woman who came to see me before the war began. She told me of the appalling torture and death her family had experienced having fallen foul of Saddams son. She begged me to act. After the fall of Saddam she returned to Iraq. She was murdered by sectarians a few months later. What would she say to me now?

There is no apology, but Blair sounds like a man with a guilty conscience."

I've only read bits on here but all this unecessary pulling of heart strings and hand wringing suggests to me that Tony Blair was never proper Prime Minister material? imo he seems to want history to show him as a nice kinda guy rather than a strong leader. This book might have plonked Blair right into Neville Chamberlain's pigeon hole.

[den]

Well yes you can if you want to.

What a bizarre thing to say, den.

Why Bryan, - I've managed it so far with no problem? Others, with agenda's ovbiously can't.

[thenodrog]

Why Bryan, - I've managed it so far with no problem? Others, with agenda's ovbiously can't.

I think Jim is the only one to show any political bias up to now, and everybody knows how heavily agenda'd he is.

Anyway why are you being so smug Den? It's a stupid request like reviewing Simon Garner's book and not mentioning football and BRFC.

[jim mk2]

Waterstones are reporting that Tony Blair's book is the fastest selling tome they have ever had. I wonder why it has caught the public's imagination ? Perhaps it is because Tony Blair set up a new political party, New Labour, that transformed British politics; perhaps it is because he dominated Westminster for more than a decade, smashing the Tories in 3 successive elections; perhaps it is because he was a breath of fresh air after 19 years of Tory mis-rule; perhaps it is because he led the radical rebuilding of Britain destroyed by the ravages of Thatcherism; and perhaps it was because, even now, despite vilification in the right-wing press, he is genuninely liked by the British public who see a man of conviction and style, Britain's greatest prime minister of the past 100 years.

[thenodrog]

Waterstones are reporting that Tony Blair's book is the fastest selling tome they have ever had. I wonder why it has caught the public's imagination ? Perhaps it is because Tony Blair set up a new political party, New Labour, that transformed British politics; perhaps it is because he dominated Westminster for more than a decade, smashing the Tories in 3 successive elections; perhaps it is because he was a breath of fresh air after 19 years of Tory mis-rule; perhaps it is because he led the radical rebuilding of Britain destroyed by the ravages of Thatcherism; and perhaps it was because, even now, despite vilification in the right-wing press, he is genuninely liked by the British public who see a man of conviction and style, Britain's greatest prime minister of the past 100 years.

Hook all baited up now with the most ridiculous and inflammatory statement you can think up.... all you have to do now Thrush mk2 is simply wait for someone to bite.