[Archived] Stoke Preview

[RevidgeBlue]

I didn't go to the game but from listening on the radio and watching MOTD highlights it appears we played the entire 90 minutes simply to muster a weak attempt from Emerton which was comfortably cleared away from a few yards in front of the line.

What's the point in that? You might as well not bother turning up at three o clock.

I have to shake my head when I hear Sam's style of play being referred to as "percentage football" because quite clearly the way he sets the team up does not work away from home. His overall record in away League games is W6 D8 L20. Where are the percentages there?

He surely has to try and adopt a more expansive style away from home or we'll be in real trouble as we surely can't rely on having such a good record at home this season.

In fact as Sam is so big on his stats, I'd expand slightly on the above and say that the only time we've really looked like doing anything away from home was immediately after he took over and we were playing a little more in the 442 format favoured by Hughes.

At first our away record was a very respectable W2 D2 L2. Then he played a deliberately weakened side at Arsenal, we got tubbed 4-0, he came up with the brainwave of playing Samba up front on his own at Liverpool, we got tubbed 4-0 again and from that point on it's really been downhill all the way on our travels.

Yes, we know Sam has had a raw deal with finances etc etc but that doesn't excuse not attempting to play a bit of football or failing to show any ambition away from home.

[Exiled in Toronto]

Haven't watched the game yet and I don;t know if I can be bothered to turn on the PVR given what I've been reading on here. I thought Sam's after match comments were among the worst I can remember from a Rovers manager, making Souness's "Lady Luck" mantra seem like deep analysis. Publicly naming and shaming specific players is poor and his reply to the question about wehter or not he was concerned about how few chances we made was disingenuous. He now classes Nico as being little more than a YTS trainee - no mention of paying 6 million for him - and no mention of freezing Roberts out, a player who can do a job at this level.

I know it has become accepted fact that Sam wasn't allowed to spend any money, but I'm not sure it's as black and white as that. Williams, in the last annual report, said that we were moving from being a selling club to being a trading club. No-one ever said, potential takeovers or not, that we were a buying club. So surely the main reason we didn't buy anyone this summer is we didn't do any trading.

We have 4 centre halves all good enough to be automatic starters, yet 2 of them are being shoehorned in playing in positions where they are ill-suited. Trading means selling where you have an over-abundance so you can buy where you are short. Selling Samba to be able to buy some better quality in midfield or up front would, I believe have made us stronger. Playing centre backs out of position and signing forwards who aren't good enough has made us weaker.

Maybe Sam wasn't allowed to trade, which would be a major failure on William's part and another major risk taken with our wellbeing to go along with him putting Shearer and Ince top of his recruitment list last time around.

[trueblue]

Yes, we know Sam has had a raw deal with finances etc etc but that doesn't excuse not attempting to play a bit of football or failing to show any ambition away from home.

Excellent comment Rev, and one I totally agree with.

[Mr. E]

I have to say, Morten's blog post at least cheered me up a little - S**t game, I'm going to Norway

[Miker]

miker, as much as Jones is a good player, as a midfielder he is not good enough. yesterday, Olsson should have started, and Kalinic should have started. against better opposition,i can understand 1 striker, but against teams in and around us, we should really be going for an attacking lineup.

He has not shown anything to suggest he is doing poorly in midfield this season and played a decent game against Stoke. I still maintain that he has been making some very good runs into the box and he has the potential to be a fairly good box-to-box midfielder. Our only other choice in midfield was Andrews, to which I say no thanks.

Olsson had to have won his place in the team ahead of either Emerton or Diouf, while Emerton hasn't been at his best, he put in a great performance against Stoke and surely justified his place in the starting line up. Absolutely no reason to drop Diouf.

Only thing I'll agree with you on is that Kalinic should have started, M Diouf was completely ineffectual up front.

I won't get into the whole 4-4-2 vs 4-5-1 argument because it's completely pointless.

[smithsblue]

Kalinic would have been eaten alive by Huth Shawcross et al in my opinion.

MBDiouf worked his socks off but was unsupported despite Pedersen attempting to play in the hole.

Benjani physically stronger but he didn't get a sniff either when he came on.

Chris Sutton is available !

[Amo]

I have to say, Morten's blog post at least cheered me up a little - S**t game, I'm going to Norway

Does it mention if he'll stay there?

[roversmum]

Personally, I would have put Roberts up front. At least if they do push him around, he's pretty good at falling over ...

[Dan]

I have to say, Morten's blog post at least cheered me up a little - S**t game, I'm going to Norway

That blog is very funny!

Here's a classic: "I see the ball bouncing over the head of a Blackpool player, and I’m just supposed to take the ball with me, then I got a sudden case of “hole in my foot” and the ball went under my foot and they scored on the following chance. Boring, but ###### happens. Luckily Brett Emerton shows up in overtime and saves the day. Thank you Brett.

Now I’m at the airport in Olso on my way to Tromø, and while I’m waiting for my luggage this little thing came on the caroselle.

It’s a bra, and the owner obviously has big tits.. Lucky husbond"

[broadsword]

Olsson was awful when he came on.

Last season was a blip, he's a Championship winger at best. Might yet make a good attacking full back, but he's too limited as a wide player in this league.

That's funny, because after his first few appearances, people said he wasn't good enough to be a full-back, but would be OK as a winger!

[Dan]

He has not shown anything to suggest he is doing poorly in midfield this season and played a decent game against Stoke. I still maintain that he has been making some very good runs into the box and he has the potential to be a fairly good box-to-box midfielder. Our only other choice in midfield was Andrews, to which I say no thanks.

Olsson had to have won his place in the team ahead of either Emerton or Diouf, while Emerton hasn't been at his best, he put in a great performance against Stoke and surely justified his place in the starting line up. Absolutely no reason to drop Diouf.

Only thing I'll agree with you on is that Kalinic should have started, M Diouf was completely ineffectual up front.

I won't get into the whole 4-4-2 vs 4-5-1 argument because it's completely pointless.

Jones does a job and can definitely put a tackle in and help the team. But, he is a bit if a round peg in a square hole, though he shows the odd gimpse if good attacking moves, it's few and far between. Plus with N'Zonzi in there we can two cente mids that are more defensive.

Diouf isn't looking too great, but he is ineffectual because of the tactics we are using. His game is about pace and scoring goals. He doesn't look like the kind of player that can hold the ball up with no support when it's pumped up to him. He needs through balls and crosses. Same with Niko, who though does an better job at holding the ball up. Any forward in the world would struggle with lack of service and even though we have a midfield that is lacking attacking flair, hoofing it forward doesnt help one bit.

[Hughesy]

I watched the game. Did you?

Yes I went on the bus from the spinners - did you go? Or do you just comment from streams each week?

[Dan]

I didn't see the highlights of the game. I'm not too disappointed by the result. Stoke are a good side, who've spent quite a bit of money over the summer. We can't win every game we play. Our style of play is a problem and I'm in total agreement with you Tyrone. This is something that I've been saying for months; our tactics for scoring are based solely on getting the ball into the box and creating a scramble and hoping that one of players manages to scrap the ball into the net. I was explaining this to a Spurs supporting friend of mine on Friday night and he said how depressing that sounded. Big Sam looks to maximise the advantages we have in our team, like size and power. However, whenever play a team that is equally as strong and can defend set pieces properly we have no other game plan. We don't hold onto the ball and stay patient, but persist with lumping the ball up the field in the hope that something happens.

It was quite obvious to everyone that we were not going to beat Stoke at their own game. Why did Sam, who some people here think is a good manager, realise thus and adopt a different approach? He is very limited as a manager and has no plan B. These players are better than hoofers. We have only looked good this season when we've got the ball on the floor a bit. Sam doesn't see this though. I'd hate to see what I'd be like if his horse died.

[Dan]

Yes I went on the bus from the spinners - did you go? Or do you just comment from streams each week?

I didn't go. I didn't need to be there to see how poor we were. We created one good chance. Did you see something that I didn't see on my 90 minute coverage with numerous replays and analysis? Maybe I was watching the wrong game?

[SamTheShrew]

I didn't go. I didn't need to be there to see how poor we were. We created one good chance. Did you see something that I didn't see on my 90 minute coverage with numerous replays and analysis? Maybe I was watching the wrong game?

That's because we don't try and create chances Dan, "thats not the way we play."

[47er]

Jones does a job and can definitely put a tackle in and help the team. But, he is a bit if a round peg in a square hole, though he shows the odd gimpse if good attacking moves, it's few and far between. Plus with N'Zonzi in there we can two cente mids that are more defensive.

Diouf isn't looking too great, but he is ineffectual because of the tactics we are using. His game is about pace and scoring goals. He doesn't look like the kind of player that can hold the ball up with no support when it's pumped up to him. He needs through balls and crosses. Same with Niko, who though does an better job at holding the ball up. Any forward in the world would struggle with lack of service and even though we have a midfield that is lacking attacking flair, hoofing it forward doesnt help one bit.

If we had a decent squad Jones would be gradually introduced as a future centre-half and would never be considered for a mid-field birth. He does not have the creativity or the finishing skills to be a box to box midfielder. Until we have a good,balanced midfield we won't improve our style of play. That means until a takeover comes along.

[RibbleValleyRover]

If we had a decent squad Jones would be gradually introduced as a future centre-half and would never be considered for a mid-field birth. He does not have the creativity or the finishing skills to be a box to box midfielder. Until we have a good,balanced midfield we won't improve our style of play. That means until a takeover comes along.

That's probably true in the long term but looking at it currently its more the case that Sam doesn't want to drop Nelsen but at the same time wants Jones getting minutes on the pitch.

Long term we will ultimately know whether this stint in midfield has damaged his development or not. Personally I see a great prospect, probably the best we have had at the club since Duffer and a potential international defender on our hands here. If it was me i would be doing all that I can to help his development and I would be playing him in central defense not in midfield. Even Sam says he sees him as a central defender long term not a midfielder.

Yeah I know that means someone has to be dropped but I am thinking long term here, for the lad personally and also our future financially if the situation arises.

[47er]

That's probably true in the long term but looking at it currently its more the case that Sam doesn't want to drop Nelsen but at the same time wants Jones getting minutes on the pitch.

Long term we will ultimately know whether this stint in midfield has damaged his development or not. Personally I see a great prospect, probably the best we have had at the club since Duffer and a potential international defender on our hands here. If it was me i would be doing all that I can to help his development and I would be playing him in central defense not in midfield. Even Sam says he sees him as a central defender long term not a midfielder.

Yeah I know that means someone has to be dropped but I am thinking long term here, for the lad personally and also our future financially if the situation arises.

fair point--can't disagree really. I suspect Jones will be a regular centre-back next season. But in the meantime, we are playing with 2 defensive central midfielders and no attacking one (unless you count Pedersen---and I don't!)

[Mike Graham]

I was so angry after the Stoke game that I waited 2 days to post.

I have been to all of Rovers games this season bar the Arsenal home game, thank goodness I am going to miss the Wigan, Newcastle, Chelsea and Spuds games due to holidays...I just cannot see where the next points will come from.

To be frank we were dire on Saturday. One chance in 94 minutes and £50 wasted watching sh**e. I am sorry to those with rose tinted specs but the fans will not continue to turn up and watch this rubbish, I have held back from calling BFS but Saturday was yet another nail in the coffin as far as I am concerned.

Yes I will continue to watch the Blues (bar holidays) but my confidence in them has waned and I am fed up of watching utter dross.

BFS and JW: sort it out or get out!

[RoversSG]

Is Sam's contract expiring at the end of the season? If so, i think it would be best for all parties that he leaves.

Watching Rovers this season has been tedious to say the least and that is something i never thought i would say. I really cannot remember when was the last time we actually pass the ball more than 5 TIMES before hoofing it up.

And can anyone explain why Pedersen is still in the side? He might offer some help to the defence when he's on the wing but he's offering absolutely nothing in the centre. His passing is terrible, his first touch is bad, he slows down every counter attack and he's poor in the air. The only time i see him in a match is when he takes ANOTHER terrible long throw or corner. What does Sam see in him??? I'll even take Andrews over him on current form!

[Hughesy]

The problem we have is that you can only wee with the willy you are given.....no funds, no new talent = serious deficiences in our squad. Hopefully Sam can keep us mid table until some investment comes.

[Mike Graham]

The problem we have is that you can only wee with the willy you are given.....no funds, no new talent = serious deficiences in our squad. Hopefully Sam can keep us mid table until some investment comes.

Sorry Hughsey but it is how you use your willy that counts, and BFS seems incapable of telling the players where to put their willy (does Peds have one?) and what a tackle is for. He uses his willy like a teenager rather than like a more mature person with some years experience.

[Hughesy]

Sorry Hughsey but it is how you use your willy that counts, and BFS seems incapable of telling the players where to put their willy (does Peds have one?) and what a tackle is for. He uses his willy like a teenager rather than like a more mature person with some years experience.

MGP likes to put his willy in the wrong places

[Mike Graham]

MGP likes to put his willy in the wrong places

He can't get it past the 1st man.

[Dan]

The problem we have is that you can only wee with the willy you are given.....no funds, no new talent = serious deficiences in our squad. Hopefully Sam can keep us mid table until some investment comes.

We have good enough players to mix it up and play a bit if football though. The hoofball isn't working and it's time for a plan B. I wouldn't mind negative tactics, but it's not working. We've been very lucky this season to have as many points as we have. The way he's got us playing, mid table is not going to happen.