[Archived] Rovers Takeover: End game ?

[Bobby G]

Whelan seems to be saying what many of us on here have been saying from the start. The business plan is entirely based upon attracting huge numbers of supporters in India and on that new support generating large levels of income, one way or another.

It seems to be fairly widely accepted now (even by Nicko?) that VH Group aren't as rich as was first reported, and that they don't have anything like the resources of the Trust.

I think that leaves us in a dodgy situation. If the business plan fails (which Whelan thinks likely) then VH Group do not have the resources to put alternative money into Rovers. We'll then be in a worse position than we are now. At least now we know the Trust definitely have access to money if Rovers were truly desperate. The same cannot be said of VH Group, they will only have the money if the business plan works.

Is it worth gambling the whole future of Rovers on an untried business plan?

Will they even care, or feel obliged to (if the original business strategy fails) as the Trust cause of Jack Walker's will? I dont think so.

[broadsword]

Time to wake up and smell the coffee, the world turns whether we like it or not.

I'm smelling the coffee, and it smells like it's been filtered through Sam Allardyce's undercrackers.

Just because something appears inevitable doesn't mean I can't point out the pitfalls of it. Potentially it could work, but my intuitive feeling says that it will all end in tears.

[Spansterkid]

Will they even care, or feel obliged to (if the original business strategy fails) as the Trust cause of Jack Walker's will? I dont think so.

I agree.

[Balwer]

Just because something appears inevitable doesn't mean I can't point out the pitfalls of it.

Exactly, if everything is inevitable and not worth critiquing then this message board becomes immediately obsolete.

[Bobby G]

Only a fool will eat everything he is fed without asking himself questions about it first.

[Parsonblue]

Is it worth gambling the whole future of Rovers on an untried business plan?

Clearly the Trust think it is which is why they are selling the club to Venky's. Obviously they have seen things which have convinced them that Venky's is the way forward for the Rovers. The truth of the matter is that the club's future was always going to be uncertain once the Trust decided they wanted to part company with the club. At the end of the day it was the Trust who decided to end their relationship with the Rovers and it is the Trust who believe that the VH Group are the best bet of those who have made bids for the club. Ultimately, all we can do is hope that they are right.

[thenodrog]

Whelan seems to be saying what many of us on here have been saying from the start. The business plan is entirely based upon attracting huge numbers of supporters in India and on that new support generating large levels of income, one way or another.

It seems to be fairly widely accepted now (even by Nicko?) that VH Group aren't as rich as was first reported, and that they don't have anything like the resources of the Trust.

I think that leaves us in a dodgy situation. If the business plan fails (which Whelan thinks likely) then VH Group do not have the resources to put alternative money into Rovers. We'll then be in a worse position than we are now. At least now we know the Trust definitely have access to money if Rovers were truly desperate. The same cannot be said of VH Group, they will only have the money if the business plan works.

Exactly. It'll be just fine until we or they hit a sticky period and then Venky's commitment will be laid bare for all to see. Still there's sweet FA we can do about it apart from stay home every other Saturday.

Hey! Wait a minute..... Ever thought this might be a double bluff by the Walker family planned to suit the best interests of the club? There is no money to invest so why not sell for as much as possible to a buyer with the least abilities to make a success of the venture before buying the club back for a fraction of the cost a year or two after? 40m reasons is mighty persuasive.

[broadsword]

Clearly the Trust think it is which is why they are selling the club to Venky's.

They are selling to Venky's because it is the right thing for teh Trust, not necessarily the right thing for Rovers.

[Balwer]

They are selling to Venky's because it is the right thing for teh Trust, not necessarily the right thing for Rovers.

Nail. Hammer. Head.

[John]

Thing is, even with spending some money in the transfer market, it means nothing and guarantees nothing. Not all clubs can finish in the top 4-6 and we can’t all win the same trophies.

Dave Whelan is just stating the obvious with his comments – this deal is a massive risk for us and what will happen when the exciting element of running a football club, which will struggle to make money, runs out?

VH are basing a large part of their strategy on marketing, let’s hope their website is nothing to compare this to as that is truly shocking to look at.

[T4E]

The last time people tried the backwards talk, they all got a 2 week posting suspension. They will be getting at least that again if it continues

!!!!TIHS DLO ELBARESIM UOY

[thenodrog]

They are selling to Venky's because it is the right thing for teh Trust, not necessarily the right thing for Rovers.

If that is the case they have their priorities in the right order.

[Balwer]

If that is the case they have their priorities in the right order.

Of course that's the case, why on earth would people think differently? The Trust aren't Jack, they've made that abundantly clear the past few years.

[47er]

If I was a prospective owner of the Club and read comments like some of those I read on here, I would say "Stuff you and your club with you." and take my money somewhere else.

Plan B anybody?

[PAFELL]

"The Blackburn deal doesn't sound right, and it doesn't look right," I have to agree Brownie- when you have an instinctive business man like Whelan saying things like that (and a guy who knows a thing or two about selling football shirts) it cannot help but cause concern.

This is the David Conn comment article in the Guardian this morning. At last a broadsheet takes an indepth look into the Rovers takeover- even the Sheffield Wednesday and Charlton ownership issues have drawn more comment than the Rovers'.

Conn writes- "However, there is no suggestion that Anderson would have preferred-agent status at Blackburn if Venky's does buy the club." He obviously doesn't read the Mirror or People then.

There are very different messages coming out of Venky's and from nicko about the role of Anderson/Kentaro going forwards although the body language of Anderson and Belaji at Ewood means nicko's posts cannot be dismissed despite howls from elsewhere.

This is critical to Rovers ability to operate in the transfer market right now- it is not an issue to be ducked and left for the fullness of time. You can be sure that every agent Rovers have dealt with or will ever deal with will have those images of Belaji and Jerome Anderson firmly imprinted on the back of their retinas whenever Blackburn Rovers get mentioned.

The other thing which strikes me is that whatever way you translate the Venky's/VH finances, nicko's point that they are significantly less wealthy than the Trust is the key one.

These guys simply cannot afford their Rovers venture not to be a commercial success. If Whelan is right, we are up to our necks in chicken effluent.

David Conn's pay-off line is:

"The truth is they know clubs like Blackburn cost money, they do not make money, and they never expected to be in charge for 10 years after Walker died.

"The trustees, though, are responsible for passing the club to safe hands and a period of worry will follow, in Jersey and in Blackburn, if they do indeed pluck out Venky's as the future owner of the club that Jack built."

For ages you have said we can trust the trustees of the walker trust. Now you are basically saying we cannot do so now, because they are leaning towards the Venky's.

Which is it today, "trust the trust or not trust the trust, that is the question".

Why do you think the trustees are still in discussions with Venky's if the dea is dodgy or dangerous for the club. Maybe it is because they know more than yourself and anybody else on this MB about the deal and the plans of Venky's. There can be no other answer.

Unless we cannot now trust the trust as they will do whatever they think is right for themselves and not the club. The trust selling Rovers gets a burden off their shoulders. A burden that drains money from their other buisnesses. Therefore the trust will have then done what is in the best interests of their other business. Therefore conforming to the instructions given by Jack before he died.

[Guest Walshy]

If I was a prospective owner of the Club and read comments like some of those I read on here, I would say "Stuff you and your club with you." and take my money somewhere else.

Plan B anybody?

I dont think a popstar rapper will be able to help us out!!!

[Balwer]

If I was a prospective owner of the Club and read comments like some of those I read on here, I would say "Stuff you and your club with you." and take my money somewhere else.

That would imply your primary concern was to satisfy the club's fan base rather than your wider business interests. It would also make you a pretty poor businessman if you let your moods dictate your business decisions. Haven't seen the Glazers spit the dummy yet have you?

[nicko]

Conn writes- "However, there is no suggestion that Anderson would have preferred-agent status at Blackburn if Venky's does buy the club." He obviously doesn't read the Mirror or People then.

There are very different messages coming out of Venky's and from nicko about the role of Anderson/Kentaro going forwards although the body language of Anderson and Belaji at Ewood means nicko's posts cannot be dismissed despite howls from elsewhere.

This is critical to Rovers ability to operate in the transfer market right now- it is not an issue to be ducked and left for the fullness of time. You can be sure that every agent Rovers have dealt with or will ever deal with will have those images of Belaji and Jerome Anderson firmly imprinted on the back of their retinas whenever Blackburn Rovers get mentioned.

The other thing which strikes me is that whatever way you translate the Venky's/VH finances, nicko's point that they are significantly less wealthy than the Trust is the key one.

These guys simply cannot afford their Rovers venture not to be a commercial success. If Whelan is right, we are up to our necks in chicken effluent.

Hold the phone.

Who is interested in a cuttings job from the Guardian, trying to get a new handle on the Rovers situation?

Yet you jump on it for crumbs to back up your own agenda.

Yes...Kentaro are deeply involved in this. No...we don't know how that will work. Any agents I have talked to have said 'so what?' and 'wish I had thought of that idea.'

But, above all, at what point did I say VH had less money than the Trust - and what would be the relevance of that anyway? Your beloved Trust have had their hands in their pockets for the past few years, so that is just more of your babbling nonsense.

You and your dwindling allies are thrashing around like a man with no arms trying to swim.

Dave Whelan says it's a shame nobody local is taking on the club - true, but we know that. As for saying the club 'has fears' - I think he has to be more specific.

The trouble is while everybody waits for the deal to be closed it creates a limboland that lives and breathes on tripe and guesswork.

[Spansterkid]

Hold the phone.

Who is interested in a cuttings job from the Guardian, trying to get a new handle on the Rovers situation?

Yet you jump on it for crumbs to back up your own agenda.

Yes...Kentaro are deeply involved in this. No...we don't know how that will work. Any agents I have talked to have said 'so what?' and 'wish I had thought of that idea.'

But, above all, at what point did I say VH had less money than the Trust - and what would be the relevance of that anyway? Your beloved Trust have had their hands in their pockets for the past few years, so that is just more of your babbling nonsense.

You and your dwindling allies are thrashing around like a man with no arms trying to swim.

Dave Whelan says it's a shame nobody local is taking on the club - true, but we know that. As for saying the club 'has fears' - I think he has to be more specific.

The trouble is while everybody waits for the deal to be closed it creates a limboland that lives and breathes on tripe and guesswork.

It's not really a cuttings job though is it? It is far more than the lines Whelan spun for you when he fancied a free advertisement of his sale of Wigan in a national paper Nicko.

As for 'dwindling allies', adding Dave Whelan to those concerned hardly constitutes 'dwindling' does it? Quite the opposite actually!

And if you can't work out that the VH Group have less money than the Trust... investigative journalism is not your strong point!

[Iceman]

Dave Whelan says it's a shame nobody local is taking on the club - true, but we know that.

when he says local, does he mean local as in the town of Blackburn or surrounding areas? Or does he mean in terms of England as a whole? If he means local as in Blackburn, then im not sure why that rich individual has not stepped forward to buy the club.

If its throughout the country, then perhaps, but again, why has nobody stepped forward. The only ones interested were Chris Ronnie i think, and Dan Williams.

He also mentions selling the club to somebody for nothing, but that would just lead to so many chancers and the club landing into the wrong hands.

[nicko]

It's not really a cuttings job though is it? It is far more than the lines Whelan spun for you when he fancied a free advertisement of his sale of Wigan in a national paper Nicko.

As for 'dwindling allies', adding Dave Whelan to those concerned hardly constitutes 'dwindling' does it? Quite the opposite actually!

And if you can't work out that the VH Group have less money than the Trust... investigative journalism is not your strong point!

The 'review' of the takeover is just a re-hash of everything that is already out there.

Dave Whelan's interview is fine, very quoteable man. But what does he say that is new on the subject?

I'll let you work out the total worth of the VH Group. You made a bit of a hash of that last week. What is it you do again? Hope it doesn't involve counting.

The Trust may have more cash. It has no relevance. Apart from the fact that they should have spent more of it on Rovers in the past few years.

You can add that up if you want to as well.

[PAFELL]

Hold the phone.

Who is interested in a cuttings job from the Guardian, trying to get a new handle on the Rovers situation?

Yet you jump on it for crumbs to back up your own agenda.

Yes...Kentaro are deeply involved in this. No...we don't know how that will work. Any agents I have talked to have said 'so what?' and 'wish I had thought of that idea.'

But, above all, at what point did I say VH had less money than the Trust - and what would be the relevance of that anyway? Your beloved Trust have had their hands in their pockets for the past few years, so that is just more of your babbling nonsense.

You and your dwindling allies are thrashing around like a man with no arms trying to swim.

Dave Whelan says it's a shame nobody local is taking on the club - true, but we know that. As for saying the club 'has fears' - I think he has to be more specific.

The trouble is while everybody waits for the deal to be closed it creates a limboland that lives and breathes on tripe and guesswork.

I think some forget that Kentaro are not just involved with players, but TV rights for international matches etc. I wonder Nicko, do you think that in itself could mean that some of that money coming Rovers way. Because Rovers could have there own TV channel in places such as India, which in itself would generate interest in Rovers from over seas. Advertisments / sponsorships etc. Venky's owner has said she sees wants to exploit the premiership football and interest in India - not the club. With a Venky and a Kentaro partnership and Rovers it could be done. A successful club would bring success to both Venky's and kentaro's own individual interests. Generate the football interest in India. Help them see (india) that eventually holding a World Cup in India would be worhtwhile.

It would be a slumdog millionare type story, small town club makes it big in another part of the world. (I can dream)

[imy9]

Spanster- dont make me laugh, you did a detailed analysis of VH groups finances and you said a number of times they are worth very little, then jumped on a Times of India article about the group taking money from a bank, saw this as gospel- again- failing to highlight that that article said that VH group was group about 500 million, so which one is fact now? You are constantly moving with the direction of the wind.

edit- did you not also say that you/your partner know a lot about finances?

Also DW said was correct, however where does he say that the trust are worried about the Group as some have implied?

[chilly]

I highly doubt sometimes that some of u think before speaking..

Right now everyone is acting like the best option would be a super rich sugar daddy. Well let me tell you, we would still have the same concerns, if not greater concerns...

What if he stops investing in us because he loses interest or his businesses doesnt do as well?we'll be left with a huge wage bill and will go into administration. This is still what the forum would be full of. And then everyone would be crying for a Venkys style bidder, a company with a proper business plan.

What would you rather? a rich sugar daddy who splashes the cash but could stop at anytime and leave us facing major bankruptcy?

Or a company wanting to run us as a proper business?with a proper business plan? Its true most football teams don't make money. But what Venkys have done is very clever. They have seen a club that is very nearly self sufficient. Add some extra income by way of sponsors from India wanting a piece of the new headline grabbing football club in india and the fact that the club has no more large interest payments for its debts. Mix that with saving money by getting good players on the cheap through Kentaro/sem, lesser wages as some of the players are young, finally add abit of income from overseas tv deals and you'll have a club making a small profit. This by far the most plausible business plan a football club like us could have. At a time when most clubs look like they'll go bust, Utd n Liverpool included, i think we are lucky to have potential owners with a proper very plausible plan.

Oh n those complainin bout the sem/kentaro involvement can any of you say you wouldnt have took petrov, corluka and elano from kentaro/sem like man city did? So stop complaining about them, i know i'd love players like that here!

[Spansterkid]

The 'review' of the takeover is just a re-hash of everything that is already out there.

Dave Whelan's interview is fine, very quoteable man. But what does he say that is new on the subject?

I'll let you work out the total worth of the VH Group. You made a bit of a hash of that last week. What is it you do again? Hope it doesn't involve counting.

The Trust may have more cash. It has no relevance. Apart from the fact that they should have spent more of it on Rovers in the past few years.

You can add that up if you want to as well.

I stand by the figures I quoted. You know the ones published by the VH group! Are you still imagining they're billionaires?

Have you registered for that GCSE maths course yet?

The Trust may have more cash.

Now you're getting it.... at last!