[Archived] Steve Kean

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Kean's taken 10 points from 10 games, that's 10 points out of a possible 30 which included 2 wins over a West Brom team in freefall and victory over a demotivated Liverpool.

Now I might be in a minority here but I don't enjoy watching Rovers lose. It really spoils my weekend in fact. So perhaps you might like to explain why you enjoy watching this "breath of fresh air" football under Kean that has so far led to 6 defeats in the league and a dire draw with West Ham that could easily have been another loss.

Hmm - I make it nine games ?

On a like for like comparison (excluding the two wins against WBA) we are one point down on our equivalent games last season. Makes you think.

[jim mk2]

Can we please have a rule to ban Sam discussions from every flipping match thread, it's tedious and pointless.

Personally I think Ken Furphy would have got us three points yesterday, which is about as relevant.

Sam was unfairly sacked and has been replaced by an inexperienced manager who it is increasingly apparent doesn't know what he's doing so there are bound to be comparisons. It might be tedious to you but it is not to others and it certainly isn't pointless because the owners might yet have to swallow their pride and reappoint Sam to get us out of the fix they created.

Never mind Ken Furphy, bring back Jack Marshall.

We've scored 3 twice already in away games under Kean, could you in your wildest dreams have imagined us doing that under Sam? Didn't think so.

I think we all need to get behind Kean now and give him at least until the end of the season before we get the knives out.

Erm, what's so great about scoring 3 when the opposition score 4 ? And West Brom should have had a hatful against us. Di Matteo's demise shows what happens to managers who think playing a passing game matters more than results.

The knives will be out for Kean if we lose to Newcastle.

[bazza]

Why don't we just let the owners own the club and run it their way; let the manager manage his way and let the players play without us booing them?

[67splitscreen]

It's all conjecture at the moment, it will be revealed when company records are out in the public domain.

We couldn't find any thing on their other companies because they are PLC and Venky's London is a PLC so what makes you think they will give us the privilege of putting them in the public domain.

[47er]

Why don't we just let the owners own the club and run it their way; let the manager manage his way and let the players play without us booing them?

Irrespective of outcomes?

[imy9]

We couldn't find any thing on their other companies because they are PLC and Venky's London is a PLC so what makes you think they will give us the privilege of putting them in the public domain.

It's not my field of expertise but Phillip says that they will have to.

[darwenblueswearehere]

Sam was unfairly sacked and has been replaced by an inexperienced manager who it is increasingly apparent doesn't know what he's doing so there are bound to be comparisons. It might be tedious to you but it is not to others and it certainly isn't pointless because the owners might yet have to swallow their pride and reappoint Sam to get us out of the fix they created.

Never mind Ken Furphy, bring back Jack Marshall.

Erm, what's so great about scoring 3 when the opposition score 4 ? And West Brom should have had a hatful against us. Di Matteo's demise shows what happens to managers who think playing a passing game matters more than results.

The knives will be out for Kean if we lose to Newcastle.

Bit of a pathetic point really. You could just as easily ask what's so great about scoring 0 when the opposition score 3, or how about scoring 1 when the opposition scores 7.

[jim mk2]

Bit of a pathetic point really. You could just as easily ask what's so great about scoring 0 when the opposition score 3, or how about scoring 1 when the opposition scores 7.

You were celebrating scoring 3 goals away from home but failed to mention we lost the match. I think you find at the end of the day (after 90 minutes) it's the result that counts.

[Exiled in Toronto]

Sam was unfairly sacked and has been replaced by an inexperienced manager who it is increasingly apparent doesn't know what he's doing so there are bound to be comparisons. It might be tedious to you but it is not to others and it certainly isn't pointless because the owners might yet have to swallow their pride and reappoint Sam to get us out of the fix they created.

Yes, but there are other threads for that. It certainly makes a thread about one specific match tedious to get dozens of posts that are identical to ones that appear in every other match thread.

Someone posted earlier about Howard Kendall's ability to grind out results and how Kean could learn from that. An ability that Kendall did not acquire overnight as after his first 10 games for us we hadn't won a single home game and were 2nd from bottom. If we'd had messageboards then I'm sure everyone would have been 100% behind him. Now, of course, we just need Kendall's 12 wins and a draw out of 13 games that came later in the season.

[Parsonblue]

Never mind Ken Furphy, bring back Jack Marshall.

Now you're talking Jim. There was a manager who could deliver attacking football in abundance.

On a more serious note, I agree that it is too soon to judge Steve Kean. I admit that I have huge reservations about the guy, particularly with regard to his tactics, but it is early days. The move from coach to manager is not an easy one, particularly when the move is made at the same club. The relationship with the players suddenly becomes different, as a coach you are still one of the 'boys' as it were and can act as a buffer between the manager and the players. Now Kean's relationship with the players is bound to change as he is picking the team.

I also agree that there is no point making comparisons with Sam. I liked Sam, I thought he was good for the club and had the ability to keep us afloat in the Premier League. However, he is no longer here and to continually compare him to Kean is a pointless exercise. If we are to stay in this League it will be down to Kean not Sam. Simliarly, if we were to slip into the Championship it would be down to Kean not Sam.

With a five point margin between the Rovers and the relegation zone, Kean still has some breathing space. However, defeat on Saturday would put him under tremendous pressure with a couple of tough away games to follow. As Roberto Di Matteo found out today, sticking with your footballing philosophy can be a dangerous game to play. Sometimes you have to opt for a more pragmatic approach and make sure you get some points on the board. With the bottom half of the table so tight, it is vital that Kean is able to set up a team that is capable to getting points. Mrs Desai may well have expressed her confidence in him and given him the security of a contract, but I don't think relegation is part of the Venky business plan and it will be interesting to see what happens if results don't improve in the next few weeks.

Like all fans, I hope that Kean makes a success of the job because that means the club is doing well. Hopefully the revival will start with three points against Newcastle.

[ben_the_beast]

A combination of the two would be nice. Sam Kean. Sounds good.

Alternatively we could just bring Sam into the back team as say I dunno, first team coach.

The perfect balance!

[92er]

A combination of the two would be nice. Sam Kean. Sounds good.

Alternatively we could just bring Sam into the back team as say I dunno, first team coach.

The perfect balance!

Would Sam B. Kean?

[darwenblueswearehere]

You were celebrating scoring 3 goals away from home but failed to mention we lost the match. I think you find at the end of the day (after 90 minutes) it's the result that counts.

No, I was making a general point that games are better to watch under this fella. Which as I pointed out is fairly important when you travel 400 miles to do so. Makes the trip back less boring if you actually have some action to discuss...........

Your blind defence of Sam is embarrassing.

[jim mk2]

No, I was making a general point that games are better to watch under this fella. Which as I pointed out is fairly important when you travel 400 miles to do so. Makes the trip back less boring if you actually have some action to discuss...........

Your blind defence of Sam is embarrassing.

The games may be "better to watch" but what matters are the results, which have got appreciably worse under this manager. If you cannot understand this it is you should be embarrassed.

[RevidgeBlue]

The games may be "better to watch" but what matters are the results, which have got appreciably worse under this manager. If you cannot understand this it is you should be embarrassed.

I must be mad for biting but I really regret having fallen asleep and missed this wonderful parallel universe in which we swept all before us under Sam that you and posters like tony gale's mic and Mercerman keep alluding to.

21 points from seventeen games under Sam.

10 points from nine games under Steve Kean. Or 20 points from 18 games.

One or two good results and Kean's ratio would be better.

Not exactly "appreciably worse" is it? If however we lose the next six or seven games then you would have (more than) a point.

[47er]

I must be mad for biting but I really regret having fallen asleep and missed this wonderful parallel universe in which we swept all before us under Sam that you and posters like tony gale's mic and Mercerman keep alluding to.

21 points from seventeen games under Sam.

10 points from nine games under Steve Kean. Or 20 points from 18 games.

One or two good results and Kean's ratio would be better.

Not exactly "appreciably worse" is it? If however we lose the next six or seven games then you would have (more than) a point.

Thats wrong-if we lose the next six or seven games we won't have any points!

Seriously, 1.235 per game under Sam =47 points per season.

1.111 per game under Keane =42 points per season.

Closer than I thought but you would be well clear of the relegation zone with 47 points but not so with 42. Further we we were picking up at the time Sam was sacked which I imagine was why the owners felt it was safe to act.

The way we are playing now I'm worried other sides will find us out. If the Venkys lot demand all-out attack we are not up to it. Kean has to compromise to some extent if we are not to get sucked into the relegation scrap.

[darwenblueswearehere]

The games may be "better to watch" but what matters are the results, which have got appreciably worse under this manager. If you cannot understand this it is you should be embarrassed.

Check them out, then come back on and justify this comment. I mentioned three of them at the start of this mini debate. How can you get 'appreciably worse' than shipping 7 in a match????

[jim mk2]

Check them out, then come back on and justify this comment. I mentioned three of them at the start of this mini debate. How can you get 'appreciably worse' than shipping 7 in a match????

One-off heavy defeat is irrelevant in the overall context - see the post above yours.

[Bobby G]

People seem to forget that Mark Hughes enjoyed letting in 6 from time to time against Arsenal.

[jim mk2]

I must be mad for biting but I really regret having fallen asleep and missed this wonderful parallel universe in which we swept all before us under Sam that you and posters like tony gale's mic and Mercerman keep alluding to.

21 points from seventeen games under Sam.

10 points from nine games under Steve Kean. Or 20 points from 18 games.

One or two good results and Kean's ratio would be better.

Not exactly "appreciably worse" is it? If however we lose the next six or seven games then you would have (more than) a point.

No one suggested "we swept all before us under Sam" - have you been drinking ?

After three defeats in the past four league matches Kean will be under severe pressure if we lose the next two, never mind six or seven.

The Newcastle game is a must-win for Kean - he has to show he can address the defensive failings his teams have shown so far and be pragmatic in his formations and tactics. Fancy football that ends in defeat is pointless. Ask the last two managers at West Brom.

[47er]

No one suggested "we swept all before us under Sam" - have you been drinking ?

After three defeats in the past four league matches Kean will be under severe pressure if we lose the next two, never mind six or seven.

The Newcastle game is a must-win for Kean - he has to show he can address the defensive failings his teams have shown so far and be pragmatic in his formations and tactics. Fancy football that ends in defeat is pointless. Ask the last two managers at West Brom.

If we lost the next six or seven we would be doomed. No, got to think positive. Shore up the mid-field Kean and protect the defence and we'll get there.

[Roaming Rover]

How many of those saying it was a mistake to sack Sam and appointing someone with no experience would have been delighted if we had appointed Shearer?

Kean needs to tighten up the team, I mentioned that at the West Brom home match. But he has noted it and is, from what he has said, prepared to work on that area. As has been mentioned combining both Kean and Big Sam would be perfect. The difference is Sam did not seem to want to change ‘his way’, Kean at least seems to want to change and improve the way the team plays.

Let’s be honest, we have lost to Chelsea away, Villa away in the cup and Spurs at home. Hardly disgraceful is it. Wigan was hopefully a blip. Yes we need to improve and we need to beat Newcastle but we have had some tough games over the last few weeks.

Let’s be honest last season we drew away to Hull, Wolves and Wigan, lost 5-0 to Chelsea and lost 2-1 to Sunderland. At home we got beat 2-0 by spurs, drew 0-0 with Liverpool. If I remember this time last season we were in pretty big trouble under Sam, but had a late surge and did OK.

So all in all, both managers have had bad and good results!

[92er]

Let’s be honest, we have lost to Chelsea away, Villa away in the cup and Spurs at home. Hardly disgraceful is it. Wigan was hopefully a blip. Yes we need to improve and we need to beat Newcastle but we have had some tough games over the last few weeks.

We have also lost at home to Stoke and away to Sunderland.

I suspect that a fair number of fans questioning Kean are fearful he won't make the necessary adjustments to the team formation or will question the players he chooses because they don't want to get sucked into a relegation battle with someone at the helm who has never previously managed.

[JAL]

How many of those saying it was a mistake to sack Sam and appointing someone with no experience would have been delighted if we had appointed Shearer?

Kean needs to tighten up the team, I mentioned that at the West Brom home match. But he has noted it and is, from what he has said, prepared to work on that area. As has been mentioned combining both Kean and Big Sam would be perfect. The difference is Sam did not seem to want to change ‘his way’, Kean at least seems to want to change and improve the way the team plays.

Let’s be honest, we have lost to Chelsea away, Villa away in the cup and Spurs at home. Hardly disgraceful is it. Wigan was hopefully a blip. Yes we need to improve and we need to beat Newcastle but we have had some tough games over the last few weeks.

Let’s be honest last season we drew away to Hull, Wolves and Wigan, lost 5-0 to Chelsea and lost 2-1 to Sunderland. At home we got beat 2-0 by spurs, drew 0-0 with Liverpool. If I remember this time last season we were in pretty big trouble under Sam, but had a late surge and did OK.

So all in all, both managers have had bad and good results!

A good manager is one who can identify the BEST players and then mould/shape them into a team.

Can Kean identify and bring in the best players for Rovers ?

[Miker]

Kean needs to tighten up the team, I mentioned that at the West Brom home match. But he has noted it and is, from what he has said, prepared to work on that area. As has been mentioned combining both Kean and Big Sam would be perfect. The difference is Sam did not seem to want to change ‘his way’, Kean at least seems to want to change and improve the way the team plays.

Isn't this just what we already had while Sam and Kean were part of the same backroom staff? I don't want to start another argument, but I felt we played good football in quite a few games under Sam. I could see that the squad was slowly improving both as a defensive unit and a more mobile attacking unit with Olsson and Hoilett slowly growing in influence. Ideally, I was hoping it would continue in that fashion and I'm quite confident it would have. In fairness, it seems now that Kean has continued doing a good job from an attacking perspective, but we're starting to regress quite badly defensively.