[Archived] The Relegation Battle Aftermath

[DE.]

As long as we don't lose to West Ham and Wolves there's still a fair chance of us staying up, even if we draw with Bolton. Our survival will depend on whether we can stop those teams from beating us, really.

[jim mk2]

. As I've said before, the teams at the bottom are all down there for a reason - they're not very good - no matter how they might look on paper. It's quite possible imo that none of the teams in trouble will win the games they need and that three very fortunate teams will somehow limp to safety with little more by way of points than they have now.

If all the relegation rivals had matches against top-half teams that would be true but unfortunately West Ham and Wolves both have matches against us.

It only needs Wolves or West Ham to win either of those games and we would probably be sunk. Obviously draws would be OK for us but I don't have any faith in our team to avoid defeat in those matches.

[rovgers]

Sorry, not looked at the board since the beginning of March. I don't suppose Mark Lawrenson has either. Which is why he made the comments yesterday, I'm guessing.

I'm glad there is now a concensus that sacking Allardyce was ridiculous. There didn't appear to be last time I looked at the board, hard though it may be to believe.

Thanks for the snarky comments, by the way.

This is not a "snarky2 comment but I take it you've not read a lot of Mark Lawrenson's predictions? If you had you'd have noticed his comments have a recurring theme to them. In fact he's repeated the "sacking sam" line at least three times in the last month! We all know the situation Mark just change the record!

The way he keeps repeating the "Sam sacking" story, he'd fit right in on this board!!

Can't be bothered to trawl through his comments but this is what he said last week "what we are also seeing is that the sacking of Sam Allardyce just before Christmas was nonsensical unless they had someone with experience ready to step in." Sound familiar?!

[m1st]

I really don't understand this "We'll lose all our games" and "everyone will win all theirs" mentality. As I've said before, the teams at the bottom are all down there for a reason - they're not very good - no matter how they might look on paper. It's quite possible imo that none of the teams in trouble will win the games they need and that three very fortunate teams will somehow limp to safety with little more by way of points than they have now.

Blackpool for example are in even worse form than we are as inpossible as that may be to achieve.

Four, certainly five points will see us safe imo and I believe we'll just about get them. Not that that makes it a satisfactory season by any stretch mind.

The one positive out of the current situation is that our destiny is very much in our own hands

It's ages since I last visited this thread and life's too short for me to go back to the last post I read; so apologies if I'm repeating what someone else has said, but let's not forget that we've got significantly the best least bad goal difference of the five lowest-placed clubs.

Even allowing for the fact that we have to welcome Trafford United on Cup Final Day, I can't see any of the four clubs below us altering that situation.

[jim mk2]

It's ages since I last visited this thread and life's too short for me to go back to the last post I read; so apologies if I'm repeating what someone else has said, but let's not forget that we've got significantly the best least bad goal difference of the five lowest-placed clubs.

Even allowing for the fact that we have to welcome Trafford United on Cup Final Day, I can't see any of the four clubs below us altering that situation.

Goal difference is irrelevant if either West Ham or Wolves (or both) beat us.

[gumboots]

Goal difference is irrelevant if either West Ham or Wolves (or both) beat us.

The thing that really annoys me is that the mess we've ended up in means that I have to want teams I absolutely loathe to win if they are playing one of the teams around us. I'd never support Newcastle against Blackpool but there I was wanting them to win. I'd want Birmingham to win against Wolves when I like Wolves far better than Birmingham, but Birmingham are highly unlikely to get relegated now so it's better if they win. I want to be able to get back to watching football without worrying how the result affects us, knowing that we can beat enough teams to stay out of trouble.

[BRFC1995]

wolves 33pts to play.......brum/wba/sunderland/rovers

blackpool 34pts to play...........stoke/spuds/bolton/united

wham 32pts to play.......city/rovers/wigan/sunderland

wigan to 34pts play............everton/villa/wham/stoke

rovers 35pts.......bolton/wham/united/wolves

fearing the worst i would'nt be suprised if wolves got 4pts before playing us, Blackpool look almost certainly gone with those fixtures, Quite sure wham will beat us and no suprise if they did a last day escape again with another win, wigan look certain to go with their fixtures and we are as poor as i can ever remember feels so strange going into matches knowing a win is just a remote possibility something that happens at other clubs.

wolves 38pts

wham 38 pts beat us and sunderland to relegate us

rovers 37pts draws with bolton wolves, 14 games without a win, 16pts from 22 games from kean.

wigan 35pts

blackpool 35pts

[philipl]

This is going to put the kaibosh on things but Rovers, Blackpool and Wigan all to win today effectively raising the safety target back to 40 points?

[John]

Gumboots, you wanted to watch some better football to watch so the mess we ended up in was always going to happen.

[gumboots]

Gumboots, you wanted to watch some better football to watch so the mess we ended up in was always going to happen.

And how exactly is any of this my fault? Did I call for allardyce's head? No. Did I appoint Kean? No. Did I ease John Williams out of the club? No. How many fans wouldn't have liked to watch better football? It's this idea that it was Allardyce or nobody and that Saint Samuel was somehow the only manager we could have who would have kept us safe whilst providing something a bit more exciting sometimes that I can't get my head round. The mess is not my fault. There was not a groundswell of opinion to get rid of Allardyce at the time the owners did. they did it off their own bat. They and those who advised them that an untried man was the correct person to manage us, without even giving him an experienced back up team, are the ones responsible. they weren't interested in the opinion of the fans and didn't sack allardyce because of a fan's dislike of him.

[Tom]

Can we bring back the +1 button just for the above post?

[John]

Not your fault obviously however time for reflection for many as letting a good manager go is always going to harm a club, with few financial resources, such as ourselves.

[Ozz]

Best case scenario today is Rovers win, Blackpool and Wigan lose. That puts us four points clear, with three games left. We may just limp over the line with another point then.

Worst case scenario, Rovers lose, Blackpool and Wigan win. (They are both at home to teams with little agendas.(Stoke and Everton)). Rovers in the bottom three for the first time this season, with Wolves away (Never won there since 1990) Man United home (enough said) and West Ham away (Not won there since 1994.

[Parsonblue]

And how exactly is any of this my fault? Did I call for allardyce's head? No. Did I appoint Kean? No. Did I ease John Williams out of the club? No. How many fans wouldn't have liked to watch better football? It's this idea that it was Allardyce or nobody and that Saint Samuel was somehow the only manager we could have who would have kept us safe whilst providing something a bit more exciting sometimes that I can't get my head round. The mess is not my fault. There was not a groundswell of opinion to get rid of Allardyce at the time the owners did. they did it off their own bat. They and those who advised them that an untried man was the correct person to manage us, without even giving him an experienced back up team, are the ones responsible. they weren't interested in the opinion of the fans and didn't sack allardyce because of a fan's dislike of him.

The groundswell you talk about seemed to totally underestimate what Sam did at this club. The view that any manager could keep us up has been proved completely wrong. You need the right manager and, unfortunately, having had the right manager we now have Steve Kean.

[John]

Not just that but what must the players think.Paul Robinson believed Sam was the best manager he ever worked under. He also believed with a little bit more finance he could have really made us a powerful club. He was not the only senior player to think that too.

[gumboots]

The groundswell you talk about seemed to totally underestimate what Sam did at this club. The view that any manager could keep us up has been proved completely wrong. You need the right manager and, unfortunately, having had the right manager we now have Steve Kean.

What groundswell? there wasn't one - that's the whole point. and even those who didn't really object to the owners getting rid of Allardyce generally qualified it with the opinion that we needed a good manager to take over. I don't think anyone underestimates what Allardyce did. Many felt however that he was very set in his ways as though there is only one way to be a good manager. A proper manager could have kept us up. Kean, unfortunately, has fallen far short of being that manager. I hoped he might be since he was what we got and from very early on it semed fairly obvious we were getting nothing else,but hoping and thinking are 2 very different things.

[Parsonblue]

Kean, unfortunately, has fallen far short of being that manager. I hoped he might be since he was what we got and from very early on it semed fairly obvious we were getting nothing else,but hoping and thinking are 2 very different things.

And that in a nutshell is the problem. The owners are clueless when it comes to knowing anything about what constitutes a good manager. If we lose this relegation battle, Desai's decision to sack Allardyce and appoint Kean will probably go down as one of the most disastrous days in the club's entire history.

[thenodrog]

Dear me Gordon, Why, because we're owned by "injuns?"

And would you care to expand on why they're in your words "corrupt?" I'm sure you'd have been delighted to applaud good play under the previous regime, I'm not sure I can see the difference.

Inept = manager. Corrupt = Advisors. Foolish = thinjuns. Does that help Simon?

The atmosphere was like nothing I've experienced before, and I've seen enough relegations played out to spot the difference.

[tcj_jones]

We will lose to United at home and I cannot see us winning our away games, such is our appauling away record. Therefore, I think we're down unless we win today. Massive game.

[PAFELL]

We will lose to United at home and I cannot see us winning our away games, such is our appauling away record. Therefore, I think we're down unless we win today. Massive game.

Well we got the win - WHU next. Win -the best result and we are safe. A draw not ideal for any team - but better than nothing. A draw would not help WHU if they lose to city. They would be down.

[Iceman]

tthing is, if West Ham lose tomorrow, then a draw wouldn't be bad for us. A win though, and we would be safe and West Ham down

[DE.]

If we draw against WHU and Wolves we'll stay up, regardless of the Utd result. It's a big ask considering our away record, but it's what needs to be done at the very minimum.

[pick32]

sky bet has it

blackpool 2/7

west ham 2/5

wigan 8/15

wolves 8/13

blackburn 4/1

[Tom]

I still feel there is a lot of work to be done but now there is hope when there was little before.

Stop either West Ham or Wolves and it should be enough.

Obviously all ifs and buts but if West Ham were to lose tomorrow then a point there next week would make it nigh on impossible for them to catch us.

[RevidgeBlue]

I really don't understand this "We'll lose all our games" and "everyone will win all theirs" mentality. As I've said before, the teams at the bottom are all down there for a reason - they're not very good - no matter how they might look on paper. It's quite possible imo that none of the teams in trouble will win the games they need and that three very fortunate teams will somehow limp to safety with little more by way of points than they have now.

Blackpool for example are in even worse form than we are as inpossible as that may be to achieve.

Four, certainly five points will see us safe imo and I believe we'll just about get them. Not that that makes it a satisfactory season by any stretch mind.

The one positive out of the current situation is that our destiny is very much in our own hands

Phew, so far so good, let's hope the situation I've described above holds true for another week or two.

Many thanks to philip for putting the kibosh on Wigan and Blackpool with his usual unerring lack of accuracy.