[Archived] Wigan Vs Blackburn Rovers

[darwenblueswearehere]

Kean is just another guy who talks a good game, yet when it comes to it HE falls short of the winning post more times than not.

If, Rovers survive this season they certainly wont come next season under Steve Kean.

And you base all this on a handful of games? Deary me.

[tony gale's mic]

Sam's gone - end of story. Knee jerk reactions (on either side of the 'debate') after every game are not the way to approach this. Let's judge Kean on his own merits after a sustained run of games. It takes time to change a team tactically. What's the bloody point in comparing our current and previous managers after every match???

I believe this debate was started with Bucky saying:

I think we can all agree on one thing.

We are all glad Sam is no longer in charge.

[darwenblueswearehere]

I believe this debate was started with Bucky saying:

Not disputing that - and nor am I taking sides, which is why I said "on both sides". It seems to me that, however Rovers get on result-wise, or performance-wise, someone always has to come on and make either pro or anti Sam comments. Isn't it time we all moved on and got behind Kean, rather than making futile comparisons with days of yore?

[Eddie]

Not a good result.

It's like groundhog day

We're not good enough to pass it round all day. We haven't got the right players (yet)

The core of today's side could not do it under Ince's tactics (use the word loosely)...or under Allardyce's'. We still haven't got a midfielder that can sit and pass or a 20 goal striker.

Until then we will be a bottom to mid table team - that's the reality.

Kean deserves a crack but feel that they should be looking to bring in a Director of football type presence (not Maradonna!)

This season was always going to be a struggle after the lack of spending in summer. If anyone in summer had said you can have new investors and 17th place I'd have taken it in a shot.

Forget Europe and top ten. Keep out of the bottom 3, carry on the rebuilding in summer. Three or four 1st team signings then and we can look upwards.

See this is just wrong. Fact is we had the better of the game for the vast majority of the game. It was careless defending that cost us, not that we gave the ball away too much, failed to create chances or ran out of ideas. Fact is we went away from home and scored 3 goals and could have had more. Now we didn't concede goals because of our open style, we let in goals because defenders went to sleep and made mistakes. That can happen regardless of tactical approach and would have happened regardless of our tactical approach. Mistakes like that we happening with Allardyce as well, but with Allardyce's tactics it was those mistakes that decided games whereas at least now we stand a chance of overcoming those errors by outplaying the opposition.

It's not a good result, but the analysis of the result from a good percentage on here is simply laughable.

[Exiled in Toronto]

See this is just wrong. Fact is we had the better of the game for the vast majority of the game. It was careless defending that cost us, not that we gave the ball away too much, failed to create chances or ran out of ideas. Fact is we went away from home and scored 3 goals and could have had more. Now we didn't concede goals because of our open style, we let in goals because defenders went to sleep and made mistakes. That can happen regardless of tactical approach and would have happened regardless of our tactical approach. Mistakes like that we happening with Allardyce as well, but with Allardyce's tactics it was those mistakes that decided games whereas at least now we stand a chance of overcoming those errors by outplaying the opposition.

It's not a good result, but the analysis of the result from a good percentage on here is simply laughable.

Agreed. It was individual unforced errors that cost us today, nothing to do with how we were playing ahead of the back 4

[JAL]

And you base all this on a handful of games? Deary me.

If this pattern of results under Kean remains constant where will that leave us in the near future.

The guy has no experience so can we really allow him continue with the probability that this set of result wont get any better. Afterall he's employed Keef in a game thinks Lowe is good enough, along with that Larsson of Brum all really not good enough for Rovers to improve and progress.

[tony gale's mic]

Not disputing that - and nor am I taking sides, which is why I said "on both sides". It seems to me that, however Rovers get on result-wise, or performance-wise, someone always has to come on and make either pro or anti Sam comments. Isn't it time we all moved on and got behind Kean, rather than making futile comparisons with days of yore?

But what does "getting behind Kean" mean when you're on an internet messageboard?! We're all desperate to see him do well as it means Rovers do well.

But does that mean blindly cheering him on? When we beat West Brom away and Liverpool I said both results did him a lot of credit. But the way things have progressed it seems increasingly like that was new manager bounce and we're seeing the true effects of having a novice manager in charge with a limited squad. My only hope is that we might have enough points on the board already that we can scrape a few more before the end of the season to see us safe. But with Wolves winning today, who knows.

[darwenblueswearehere]

If this pattern of results under Kean remains constant where will it leave us in the near future.

The guy has no experience so can we really allow him continue with the probability that this set of result wont get any better. Afterall he's employed Keef in a game thinks Lowe is good enough, along with that Larsson of Brum all really not good enough for Rovers to improve and progress.

Yeah, its all been negative since he took over hasn't it?

We can all speculate about 'the probability' of what may or may not happen, results-wise, till we're blue in the face and that is all you are doing. No manager on earth can legislate for the type of dozy defending that happened today, no matter how experienced.

I know that I'm looking forward to making the fortnightly 400 mile round trip to Ewood these days and that's all that concerns me tbh.

[tony gale's mic]

See this is just wrong. Fact is we had the better of the game for the vast majority of the game. It was careless defending that cost us, not that we gave the ball away too much, failed to create chances or ran out of ideas. Fact is we went away from home and scored 3 goals and could have had more. Now we didn't concede goals because of our open style, we let in goals because defenders went to sleep and made mistakes. That can happen regardless of tactical approach and would have happened regardless of our tactical approach. Mistakes like that we happening with Allardyce as well, but with Allardyce's tactics it was those mistakes that decided games whereas at least now we stand a chance of overcoming those errors by outplaying the opposition.

It's not a good result, but the analysis of the result from a good percentage on here is simply laughable.

For the majority of the game away to Bolton under Sam we were the better side. We still lost because of individual errors, yet that was the game which got him sacked.

For the majority of the game vs Birmingham near the start of the season we were also the better side, but again a few silly mistakes cost us.

Only both of those sides are considerably better than Wigan.

[BuckyRover]

Yeah, because that's what I said.

Wigan's pitch isn't usually as bad as that - the recent rain made it a hell of a lot worse than it is. It might not be the best pitch in the league but it's nowhere near that bad - the fact the game was talked about as being called off is testament to this. Therefore both teams had to contend with pitch conditions they weren't used to.

Notts County on the other hand play in a lower league where pitch standards aren't as good, but they're used to it. However even then the pitch was only one of several factors into why they did so well against City - City having a very bad day being another because good pitch or bad pitch a team of seasoned internationals should be wiping the floor with Notts County.

As for Ince (funny you should bring him up though since you kept backing him long after most of us realised he was a dud) - he is nowhere near Premier League standard as a manager. Nevertheless, it is possible that one manager can outsmart another on any given day (see the hundreds of cup upsets over the years) and this might've happened in the City game too.

Ah yes, comparing a man who beat Real Madrid with Aberdeen in a European final with our man who had never managed before.

You really are on fire today...

Shouldn't you be on call?

I think you need to work a bit harder for your 250k p/a.

Remember, I pay your wages

You point was inexperience bad / experience good. You need to work a bit harder.

[Mattyblue]

I think we can all agree on one thing.

We are all glad Sam is no longer in charge.

Speak for yourself.

I was all for a change in the summer, midseason was and is still a gamble. Lets just get to 40 points as quickly as we can.

[BuckyRover]

For the majority of the game away to Bolton under Sam we were the better side. We still lost because of individual errors, yet that was the game which got him sacked.

For the majority of the game vs Birmingham near the start of the season we were also the better side, but again a few silly mistakes cost us.

Only both of those sides are considerably better than Wigan.

Bolton with ten men are better than eleven man Wigan. On what are you basing that assumption?

[Amo]

Only both of those sides are considerably better than Wigan.

Would that be the same Birmingham who are in the relegation zone?

[imy9]

If this pattern of results under Kean remains constant where will that leave us in the near future.

The guy has no experience so can we really allow him continue with the probability that this set of result wont get any better. Afterall he's employed Keef in a game thinks Lowe is good enough, along with that Larsson of Brum all really not good enough for Rovers to improve and progress.

Employed Keef in a game as opposed to Sam who did it consistently. Sam thought Chimbonda was a top notch left back and Benjani a striker, Larsson is not even playing for us FFS! I only bring up Sam as it is clear you still want him here. I am willing to bet that Kean will be here next year regardless of results.

[tony gale's mic]

Bolton with ten men are better than eleven man Wigan. On what are you basing that assumption?

They had eleven men for the majority of the game...

[mode_m]

good game, unfortunate penalty, terrible pitch.

[tony gale's mic]

Would that be the same Birmingham who are in the relegation zone?

It was the same Birmingham who were starting the season on the back of finishing 9th the season before. Besides, they've played 23 games and most of the league have played 25-26 which makes a big difference in a tight league.

[imy9]

Brum have been dire this year, I have had the misfortune to see them a number of times this year Inc the Rovers game- where they looked relegation fodder- as did we.

[BuckyRover]

They had eleven men for the majority of the game...

They managed to score two in that time

[chris]

good game, unfortunate penalty, terrible pitch.

you don't half ramble on and on

[tony gale's mic]

Shouldn't you be on call?

I think you need to work a bit harder for your 250k p/a.

Remember, I pay your wages

You point was inexperience bad / experience good. You need to work a bit harder.

Funnily enough I am on call - I'm currently writing this from the doctors' room which is why I'll be posting on here this evening instead of going out drinking. The very definition of being "on call" though is that you only work when they call you. Which, thankfully, they haven't really done very much today.

My point was that experience is better than inexperience when dealing with a limited side on a limited budget.

You equated the "inexperience" of Alex Ferguson (Scottish League winner, European Cup Winners' Cup Winner, Scotland manager) with the inexperience of Steve Kean. Which was pretty laughable.

Oh and if you do indeed "pay my wages" and wish to actually start paying 25 year old junior doctors 250k a year, that would be much appreciated.

They managed to score two in that time

...thanks to individual errors. Which serves my point perfectly that the same people who crucified Sam for the individual errors made at Bolton and supported his sacking (despite us having much the better of the game) are now defending Steve Kean conceding 4 at Wigan again down to "individual errors".

[bluebruce]

If this pattern of results under Kean remains constant where will that leave us in the near future.

This exact pattern? With 42-43 points every season, and safe forevermore. He's still averaging 1.1111 points a game (and if we beat Newcastle, 1.3 which averages as 49.4 a season). I wish some people would put their razor blades back in the bathroom.

[sambo]

Dire.

Salgado was horrendous, looks way out of his depth at the moment. Stupid tackling, skinned every time. Samba was poor too.

Only 2 or 3 players bothered to applaud the fans. Played/ran off at the end of the final whistle like they just couldn't wait to 'get out of the cold'. Real poor do.

Where was Kalinic?

Dunn provided some spark when he came on, but hardly anyone else could be bothered.

The pitch was woeful.

Rant Over

[BuckyRover]

Funnily enough I am on call - I'm currently writing this from the doctors' room which is why I'll be posting on here this evening instead of going out drinking. The very definition of being "on call" though is that you only work when they call you. Which, thankfully, they haven't really done very much today.

My point was that experience is better than inexperience when dealing with a limited side on a limited budget.

You equated the "inexperience" of Alex Ferguson (Scottish League winner, European Cup Winners' Cup Winner, Scotland manager) with the inexperience of Steve Kean. Which was pretty laughable.

Oh and if you do indeed "pay my wages" and wish to actually start paying 25 year old junior doctors 250k a year, that would be much appreciated.

...thanks to individual errors. Which serves my point perfectly that the same people who crucified Sam for the individual errors made at Bolton and supported his sacking (despite us having much the better of the game) are now defending Steve Kean conceding 4 at Wigan again down to "individual errors".

I'm glad such a flippant and obviously flagrant remark could generate such a response. That's power

[tonygreenbank]

Was sat in the South Stand opposite the Rovers fans and what fantastic support they gave to the team. It was deafening at times.The result left us all shell-shocked.Brilliant play in the first 30 minutes from Rovers and I thought we were cruising after that great goal.What a pass from Hoilett!

Second half the pitch worsened and we couldnt keep playing the expansive football we had in the first half. Salgado did trip their forward and Mike Dean evened things up with the tackle on Dunny.

We have had such contrasting football this season. Do we want the safety first of Allardyce to the fast pacy style of Kean? On balance I want the latter as Rovers were exciting to watch at times today and we could have won it just like on Wednesday. Rovers will win more than they wil lose playing the new way plus winning new admirers as Martinez acknowledged after the game.