[Archived] Wigan Vs Blackburn Rovers

[booth]

Awful. I think giving Salgado a new contract was a mistake, he can barely run and is being targeted every week as our 'weak link'.

Barely run?

He's played 3 games in 8 days, in the EPL. He's been one of our better players this season but you can't expect him, at his age, to pull a blinder every match. Blame the manager for being naive enough to believe he can if you must.

[Mercer]

I think we can all agree on one thing.

We are all glad Sam is no longer in charge.

No we are most definitely not and I speak for many people who I sit round at Ewood

Park and away grounds including Wigan today!

[bluebruce]

On that logic they should hire me. I've coached 15 youth teams, am a positive thinker and I believe, if given the chance, that I could be a success at the Rovers.

Where do I sign?

Right, except that really wasn't the logic I was employing, was it? I've never said I approved of hiring Keane in the first place, I most avowedly didn't. However, he's in there now, and isn't doing too badly. If you had been hired, I'd have been enraged, saying who the hell is this clown, but if you'd had an identical start to Steve Kean, I'd be saying look we need to give him a bit more of a chance yet. If Keane had been really cocking it up, averaging say, 0.6 points a game, I'd be saying yeh let's get shut.

[Tom]

Calmed down a bit now but still sore from that one, next week is huge.

I like a lot of what I've seen from Kean so far but if we go on a run not getting results we could get drawn into a relegation battle quick enough.

[Mercer]

Difficult at times to understand people's perceptions.

I have sat through four consecutive Rovers away defeats and I can tell you that many, many supporters felt that under Sam we were more likely to get a result and that's what we wanted.

Good 'pressers' don't get you PL points.

Give me substance over style every day of the week.

Will not be following Rovers away any longer until I feel that we have a REAL chance of getting a result. Sorry to say this but I think this job is a bridge too far for Mr Kean.

[darwenblueswearehere]

Difficult at times to understand people's perceptions.

I have sat through four consecutive Rovers away defeats and I can tell you that many, many supporters felt that under Sam we were more likely to get a result and that's what we wanted.

Good 'pressers' don't get you PL points.

Give me substance over style every day of the week.

Will not be following Rovers away any longer until I feel that we have a REAL chance of getting a result. Sorry to say this but I think this job is a bridge too far for Mr Kean.

The epitome of a part time supporter

[sambo]

Barely run?

He's played 3 games in 8 days, in the EPL. He's been one of our better players this season but you can't expect him, at his age, to pull a blinder every match. Blame the manager for being naive enough to believe he can if you must.

Fair point. Missed the last 2 games due to distance issues, so probably just naively didn't see it as a reason.

With the pitch the mess it was today too, it was always going to take it out on his legs.

Difficult at times to understand people's perceptions.

I have sat through four consecutive Rovers away defeats and I can tell you that many, many supporters felt that under Sam we were more likely to get a result and that's what we wanted.

Good 'pressers' don't get you PL points.

Give me substance over style every day of the week.

Will not be following Rovers away any longer until I feel that we have a REAL chance of getting a result. Sorry to say this but I think this job is a bridge too far for Mr Kean.

I never really expected anything away under Sam, especially in certain games. Only the must win ones I expected anything, eg derby games vs Burnley, which was fantastic but his away record wasn't great.

Too many fairweather fans

[Mercer]

The epitome of a part time supporter

If you want to continue investing substantial time and money then fine. Some supporters know when a dead horse is being flogged!

[67splitscreen]

If you want to continue investing substantial time and money then fine. Some supporters know when a dead horse is being flogged!

Surprised then that you didn't give up over a year ago, very strange!

[47er]

Surprised then that you didn't give up over a year ago, very strange!

Easy--we were not a dead horse then! We were a lively horse that bolted to tenth.

We lost 4-3 today to mediocre local opponents, Blackpool lost 5-3 to mediocre local opponents.

Thats what we are in danger of becoming--the new Blackpool. Everyone will love us but we won't get the points.

[Tom]

Easy--we were not a dead horse then! We were a lively horse that bolted to tenth.

We lost 4-3 today to mediocre local opponents, Blackpool lost 5-3 to mediocre local opponents.

Thats what we are in danger of becoming--the new Blackpool. Everyone will love us but we won't get the points.

But we have been poor away from home for a few years

[J*B]

I can't understand some of Kean's decisions today.

Firstly, why on earth start with Roberts and Benjani? Benjani, Liverpool and 35 minutes of Chelsea apart, has offered nothing to the club. I would have rather started with 10 men, if Rodallega was our only striker option. He looked lively, and capable, throughout the game.

Roberts is clearly an impact player - and thats all. With 20 minutes left, opposing defenders would hate a strong, fit Jason Roberts running at them.

The pitch did us no favours. The attacking, passing play we've been playing recently was completely eradicated due to the dire conditions (One distinctive moment comes to mind, when the ball was switched across our back line and literally stuck in the pitch due to the water-log on the pitch). However, a play B should have been introduced as soon as our usual style of play was noted to be failing. As much as its horrible to say, Sam's long ball, percentage football would have been far more effective.

Kalinic must be wondering how on earth Benjani gets a start before him. Kalinic is triple the player Benjani will ever be.

Pedersen, Benjani, Emerton and Salgado all had poor performances.

Jones NEEDS to stop being such a "hard man" in and around our penalty area. He's giving away free kicks which the better teams will happily score from. In the middle of the park, its just about justifiable, obviously he's trying to make his presence known.

Samba improved as the game went on in my eyes, but still isnt 100% here in his head. Maybe he should have been sold in January after all, if his heart isnt in it?

If we wernt lucky enough to have Robinson in goal I'd be far more worried.

Newcastle is huge, and I can see them turning us over unless we buck our ideas up.

[roverwhelmed]

We always seem to lose whenever there's a 'they've not won for ... matches' or 'he's not scored for ... matches' - it seems to be the Rovers way!

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Not read all the comments - would imagine for most that the sky is falling down.

For large parts of the match I felt very comfortable - after 20 minutes we should have been 2 or 3 up - not taking chances is really hurting us.

Overall the pitch was awful - and didn't aid many of our players who run with the ball (Olsson, Hoilett etc) - or our new attempt at a passing style.

Personally I like Kean - and his approach - however we are getting caught out tactically. It is very obvious that teams have targeted Salgado as our weak link - time and time again Moses was one on one with Salgado. He needs to either drop him - or give him more protection than the current "diamond" formation currently gives him (IMO the latter). He needs to learn to change his tactics mid-match. Personally I would have reverted to an orthodox midfield at half time - Dunn on for Benjani - and push Hoilett up front to play just behind Roberts. We need to give Hoilett the best opportunities to show his talents - and that has to be just behind the forward.

My formation for the next match (injuries permitting) would be :-

Robbo

Salgado Nelsen Samba Givet

Emerton Jones Nzonzi/Dunn Olsson

Hoillett

Roberts

You can see what Kean is trying to do - and we aren't too far off. In this match - but for school boy defending, and poor finishing we would have got at least a point if not more.

Its not all doom and gloom - but we do need to start picking up points again (though is it not only 2 consecutive league defeats ?)

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Easy--we were not a dead horse then! We were a lively horse that bolted to tenth.

Lets not forget that mid last season rumours were doing the rounds that Sam would be sacked due to our bad run. A good run of results and performances towards the end of the season masked what was a very average season - both in terms of performances and results (other than last few matches).

Many of us hoped that the style of the end of the season would carry onto this - but we reverted to the same drudged style of the previous early season.

Lets not forget how many times we won away under Sam - and how many times we let in stupid goals (as today). These problems pre-date Kean - he may or may not be the man to address these problems - but he deserves to be given the chance.

[damo100]

No we are most definitely not and I speak for many people who I sit round at Ewood

Park and away grounds including Wigan today!

Mercer, You could ask every single Rovers fan about sam, and the supporters from other premier league clubs, and i'm sure you would find the majority are glad we don't have to put up with the awful football he chose to play!!

Don't let the appointment of Kean cloud you're judgement fella!!!

[beerwins]

Do we ever win, lose or draw a match without it being compared to Allardyce, for the love of god :!: Sam did well but we are in a new chapter of Rovers now.

The takeover and the new owners ideas should have sought to that previous train of thought, still so many people still clingling to the old regime of premiership survival at minimal costs, Steve Keane will continue to play this brand of football and by the sound of him he will rectify the mistakes that come with it which is more than previous managers have done.

Go down or stay up seems to be the one major thing on most fans minds, well if you want to takeover a Premiership club and put your own ideas into it you may have to expect a few losses. Steve Keane has made plenty of mistakes already but he has also identified that our strikeforce is poor, our central midfield is weak and the creativity at Rovers is near zero, something which the fans have known for years but was felt like we were going to be waiting with baited breath. He cant make massive changes in personel and tactics in the time he has had as manager but what he has done he has done reasonably well. He has identified our problem areas and tried to address them within the budget.

Today he was shown up by being naive, I dont expect its a mistake he will make again, you cant go into every match with the same gametype there are too many underlying problems like pitches for one. He seems to learn fast and I dont expect he will be given the boot anytime soon (which is good for promoting our own managers) so we should be behind him instead of clinging to the past.

[Veevs]

Don't get me wrong here, I like the idea of where Mr Kean is going with the squad, but today he was very very naive in terms of his tactics, the conditions and his team selection.

IMO We started too quick (the pitch was bound too tire players in the long run), tried too pass the ball around neatly in the worst areas of the pitch, pushed jnr closer too the middle in the second half when flanks where the best areas of the pitch (very telling given all the best players on the pitch where the wingers)..

Given time I reckon things will work out for him, but boy does he need too look at the oppposition more and adapt too both them and the conditions, this I guess will take a little time as he works on the transition from training field tactics too match tactics.

As for those saying the pitch made no diff of course it did, wigan would of trained on the pitch prior too the game, would know the weak areas and the good areas of the pitch, they also widened the pitch (too the max width) during the summer for this part of the season (Rugby time of course). Was very interesting that last season it was their home form from this part of the season that saved them from what was relegation form.

Please not this is not an excuse, just saying the manager should of changed tactics too meet the conditions put in front of him, just like you change tactics based on opposition players.

[tony gale's mic]

You can see what Kean is trying to do - and we aren't too far off. In this match - but for school boy defending, and poor finishing we would have got at least a point if not more.

Big deal, the same could be said about Birmingham away and Bolton away this season too. Playing expansive football and leaving yourself open at the back will mean less emphasis is placed on defence so the overall quality of the defending will drop, but equally creating chances with poor strikers up front is not that likely to result in success. The fact we have poor finishers should be taken into account when formulating tactics.

Lets not forget that mid last season rumours were doing the rounds that Sam would be sacked due to our bad run. A good run of results and performances towards the end of the season masked what was a very average season - both in terms of performances and results (other than last few matches).

A season is over 38 games. The league does not lie. 50 points was our sum total and that would get us tenth most seasons too; and had the season before that started with Sam's first game we would have finished 10th that season too. Last season was a very good season, all told. We finished as close to relegation as we did to a Champions' League spot.

The takeover and the new owners ideas should have sought to that previous train of thought, still so many people still clingling to the old regime of premiership survival at minimal costs

We were more than just a survival team under the old regime. 20 points from the drop zone last season says as much.

[JMillZz]

Not read all the comments - would imagine for most that the sky is falling down.

For large parts of the match I felt very comfortable - after 20 minutes we should have been 2 or 3 up - not taking chances is really hurting us.

Overall the pitch was awful - and didn't aid many of our players who run with the ball (Olsson, Hoilett etc) - or our new attempt at a passing style.

Personally I like Kean - and his approach - however we are getting caught out tactically. It is very obvious that teams have targeted Salgado as our weak link - time and time again Moses was one on one with Salgado. He needs to either drop him - or give him more protection than the current "diamond" formation currently gives him (IMO the latter). He needs to learn to change his tactics mid-match. Personally I would have reverted to an orthodox midfield at half time - Dunn on for Benjani - and push Hoilett up front to play just behind Roberts. We need to give Hoilett the best opportunities to show his talents - and that has to be just behind the forward.

My formation for the next match (injuries permitting) would be :-

Robbo

Salgado Nelsen Samba Givet

Emerton Jones Nzonzi/Dunn Olsson

Hoillett

Roberts

You can see what Kean is trying to do - and we aren't too far off. In this match - but for school boy defending, and poor finishing we would have got at least a point if not more.

Its not all doom and gloom - but we do need to start picking up points again (though is it not only 2 consecutive league defeats ?)

I can't justify putting Roberts up front on his own. Although he scored today it was put on a plate for him and more often than not he was frustratingly poor.

All 3 strikers that played today didn't put in enough of a shift to justify a start next week. If I had to pick two it would be Roberts and Kalinic as Niko needs to play and Benjani and Diouf weren't good enough today. (whenever I say today I mean yesterday)

[RevidgeBlue]

Sam's gone - end of story. Knee jerk reactions (on either side of the 'debate') after every game are not the way to approach this. Let's judge Kean on his own merits after a sustained run of games. It takes time to change a team tactically. What's the bloody point in comparing our current and previous managers after every match???

None whatsoever.

However you forgot the proviso that we're not allowed to compare the two records if a couple of good results for Keane gives him a better ratio than Sam this season. Because Sam built his record up over the years.

However if a couple of bad results for Kean mens Sam temporarily has the better ratio then obviously you are then allowed to compare the two.

[RevidgeBlue]

I have sat through four consecutive Rovers away defeats and I can tell you that many, many supporters felt that under Sam we were more likely to get a result and that's what we wanted.

I'm not sure where you and all these other fans thought we were more like to get a result away from home under Sam.

Wasn't it something like six away wins in two seasons and 38 PL away games under Sam?

[RevidgeBlue]

Tactics schmactics, the manager this, the manager that, I'm still not too sure how we managed to lose that game after dominating the first half and going a goal up but yet again it simply boiled down to failing to take straightforward chances at one end and making basic individual defensive errors at the other. By way of contrast Wigan converted a couple of sharp chances for two of their goals.

Until the players put both those aspects right we aren't going to win many games. We've become a soft touch over the last seven days and three games in that practically every time the opposition have gone forward they've scored. At the other end, notwithstanding the fact we scored three today, we aren't being clinical enough with the chances we create.

Yesterday we just seemed to have a mad twenty minutes or so after half time where we just weren't at the races which isn't good enough.

Certainly not time to press the panic button just yet. I think I'd be more worried if we weren't creating anything. However another couple of bad results and obviously the pressure will start to build.

After careful analysis of the last three games Kean needs to impart some sage and highly technical advice to his players.

STOP GIVING SOFT BLOODY GOALS AWAY! AND JUST STICK THE BALL IN THE BACK OF THE BLOODY NET!

[PAFELL]

Do we ever win, lose or draw a match without it being compared to Allardyce, for the love of god :!: Sam did well but we are in a new chapter of Rovers now.

The takeover and the new owners ideas should have sought to that previous train of thought, still so many people still clingling to the old regime of premiership survival at minimal costs, Steve Keane will continue to play this brand of football and by the sound of him he will rectify the mistakes that come with it which is more than previous managers have done.

Go down or stay up seems to be the one major thing on most fans minds, well if you want to takeover a Premiership club and put your own ideas into it you may have to expect a few losses. Steve Keane has made plenty of mistakes already but he has also identified that our strikeforce is poor, our central midfield is weak and the creativity at Rovers is near zero, something which the fans have known for years but was felt like we were going to be waiting with baited breath. He cant make massive changes in personel and tactics in the time he has had as manager but what he has done he has done reasonably well. He has identified our problem areas and tried to address them within the budget.

Today he was shown up by being naive, I dont expect its a mistake he will make again, you cant go into every match with the same gametype there are too many underlying problems like pitches for one. He seems to learn fast and I dont expect he will be given the boot anytime soon (which is good for promoting our own managers) so we should be behind him instead of clinging to the past.

Fair points raised in my opinion. Kean said in his interview after the match the same problem areas we have all noticed for awhile, soft in the centre and the team not defending as a team. Now he has to work on the team to get get those areas put right.

Olsson should not be at LB, but with Givet out injured there was no choice to put him there. So another area that needs addressing.

Kean does seem to be getting the best out of Hoilet, who is growing in confidence.

But Kean does appear to be a fast learner. But as he is inexperienced he is bound to make a few mistakes. As bad as the result was yesterday, nobody likes losing. Rovers goal difference was increased by ONE goal. They did score 3 away from home. They did try to win and not just sat back and defend (even though they didn't defend very god when they had too)

[Bobby G]

Tactics schmactics, the manager this, the manager that, I'm still not too sure how we managed to lose that game after dominating the first half and going a goal up but yet again it simply boiled down to failing to take straightforward chances at one end and making basic individual defensive errors at the other. By way of contrast Wigan converted a couple of sharp chances for two of their goals.

Until the players put both those aspects right we aren't going to win many games. We've become a soft touch over the last seven days and three games in that practically every time the opposition have gone forward they've scored. At the other end, notwithstanding the fact we scored three today, we aren't being clinical enough with the chances we create.

Yesterday we just seemed to have a mad twenty minutes or so after half time where we just weren't at the races which isn't good enough.

Certainly not time to press the panic button just yet. I think I'd be more worried if we weren't creating anything. However another couple of bad results and obviously the pressure will start to build.

After careful analysis of the last three games Kean needs to impart some sage and highly technical advice to his players.

STOP GIVING SOFT BLOODY GOALS AWAY! AND JUST STICK THE BALL IN THE BACK OF THE BLOODY NET!

Despite popular belief, Wigan had more of the ball in the first half and also in the second half. Other than the first 20 minutes and possibly a 15-20 period in the second half, they were on top. Soft goals are costing us but its a product of having midfielders that dont press or close down, leaving JJ as the only defensive-minded player ahead of our defence and that's giving free runs at us.

We have certain types of players and we need to play to their strengths. Im not saying long balls. Not at all. But 4-2-3-1 or the diamond is not working. Its exposing the defence big-time. If we want to play 4-2-3-1 then there should be two defensive midfielders sitting ahead of the defence especially when the full backs are bombing on.