[Archived] John Williams Leaves

[Pete1981]

Samba fears for Rovers headline in the Daily star, says JW was a rock and all the players could go to him with problems, he was Samba says a big figure at the club and hopes he has now made the right decision in signing!!

He basically says all that here except for the hopes he has now made the right choice

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/blackburnrovers/news/8835017.Samba__Blackburn_Rovers_will_miss_Williams/

[ada2020]

Pete1981 beat me to that one.

[Miker]

I've been on both ends and, rightly or wrongly, a lot of key managers of the taken over entity were soon out of the door, either because they didn't like the new culture, or costs had to be saved, or it was felt that they didn't 'fit in'. 'FIFO' was a phrase I heard used quite often (fit in or **** off).

I think that's the point people are trying to make. Right or wrong, fans feel themselves to be part of the club, not just spectators, but part-owners. If 'FIFO' is their policy, then clearly they are alienating a huge number of fans, fans who have identified with John and his values for years. I've been getting a bit more optimistic about the new regime, but the way they've dealt with Sam and John, as well as the media comments they had released after these decisions have left a foul taste in my mouth and I can't say my opinion of the owners is very positive.

[Majiball]

For me it was when Robinson left for Spurs and Samba for Arsenal that I started to realise how accurate Philipl had been with his information.

Williams going is a shame. But we have new owners with new ambitions. You had to be fairly naive not to see this occurring. JW stayed when it looked like things were falling off the rails and he's now left the club in relative stability.

With the investment in this transfer window and the backing of Steve Kean I'm not particularly concerned about Venky's. They've put money in and clearly have ambition without promising the earth. JW leaving is sad but he was there when we needed him. We have entered a different era.

That's odd because I remember hearing about 2 players wanting out after Sam was sacked and then a couple of days later the Samba story broke.

I'd say that was pretty accurate at the time, but obviously you struggle with things like context.

[chaddyrovers]

LT interview with Mrs D about why JW left

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/blackburnrovers/news/8835527.Mrs_Desai__Why_John_Williams_left_Blackburn_Rovers/

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

That's odd because I remember hearing about 2 players wanting out after Sam was sacked and then a couple of days later the Samba story broke.

I'd say that was pretty accurate at the time, but obviously you struggle with things like context.

Context? The story that Samba wanted out was confirmed by numerous sources. That was not the issue. The issue I had was the certainty with which certain members of the messageboard posted that Samba would leave due to the new ownership (nicko stated that Samba had wanted out way before Venky's emerged), how there was a players' 'mutiny' (several have now signed new deals) and also that there was concrete interest in Robinson from Spurs.

Iam in no doubt that members have 'inside knowledge' regarding Venky's and the parties behind the scenes but some people have clearly decided which side they're batting for and enjoy exaggerating many of the concerns which many Rovers fans justifiably hold, to create a greater sense of paranoia. JW leaving is just one example. The Samba leaving story could be viewed as another.

[47er]

Iam in no doubt that members have 'inside knowledge' regarding Venky's and the parties behind the scenes but some people have clearly decided which side they're batting for and enjoy exaggerating many of the concerns which many Rovers fans justifiably hold, to create a greater sense of paranoia. JW leaving is just one example.

or do you mean "to create a greater sense of self-importance"?

[Bobby G]

Very interesting and maybe naive choice of words.

[Miker]

Context? The story that Samba wanted out was confirmed by numerous sources. That was not the issue. The issue I had was the certainty with which certain members of the messageboard posted that Samba would leave due to the new ownership (nicko stated that Samba had wanted out way before Venky's emerged), how there was a players' 'mutiny' (several have now signed new deals) and also that there was concrete interest in Robinson from Spurs.

Iam in no doubt that members have 'inside knowledge' regarding Venky's and the parties behind the scenes but some people have clearly decided which side they're batting for and enjoy exaggerating many of the concerns which many Rovers fans justifiably hold, to create a greater sense of paranoia. JW leaving is just one example. The Samba leaving story could be viewed as another.

If Samba wanted out before Venky's took over, then he'd be gone by now, instead he has signed a new contract. The fact that players first came out and publically spoke out against Venky's decision making, then went out and stated they were all happy to stay, before announcements that they had signed new, better contracts speaks volumes of what exactly went on behind the scenes.

[47er]

Context? The story that Samba wanted out was confirmed by numerous sources. That was not the issue. The issue I had was the certainty with which certain members of the messageboard posted that Samba would leave due to the new ownership (nicko stated that Samba had wanted out way before Venky's emerged), how there was a players' 'mutiny' (several have now signed new deals) and also that there was concrete interest in Robinson from Spurs.

Iam in no doubt that members have 'inside knowledge' regarding Venky's and the parties behind the scenes but some people have clearly decided which side they're batting for and enjoy exaggerating many of the concerns which many Rovers fans justifiably hold, to create a greater sense of paranoia. JW leaving is just one example. The Samba leaving story could be viewed as another.

I think "to create a greater sense of self-importance" might be the key. I've laughed myself silly at some of the crap that's been posted on here. It was obvious to anyone that JW wasn't going to be around for long. The idea that a select group on here worked day and night to save him and came within a hairs-breadth of doing it is gloriously loopy.

Venkys paid 54M for the privilege of doing what they liked and they will do it. Just as well for us too because there was nowhere else to go. We can seek seek to influence them here and there perhaps but they have a purpose and a strategy and they are going through with it.

Just got to hope they get more right than wrong.

[Majiball]

I'd like to use that interview with Mrs D, to highlight a point/issue that worries me about our new owners.

Steve Kean and JW didn't get on, and yet Steve Kean openly said he got on well with JW when he was a coach. Mmmmm seriously our owners need to get up to speed on how/what to say to the press. They got on fine before, Sam got sacked, and then they didn't get on, you could have field day with that one line.

JW lost interest, well having met him I don't believe that for one second. Not 2 months ago he was more than happy to stay for at least 12 months, what changed? I don't know if circumstances have changed but I'm not convinced the lost interest line would have been used if they had as it completely sends the wrong message. The next part that I really don't like is that it says JW has declined to give interviews, why? He's been with us for 14 years and no press conference saying thanks, saying goodbye to the fans publicly. JW was all about the fans, he gave us cheap season tickets, he met anyone who had issue with the club face to face. Gagged? if so why?

John Williams didn't approve of Jerome's role at the club. Well if is role was purely on submitting lists of potential suitors with no influence why would JW have issue with his role? We employ scouts left right and centre and that's basically what he would be, unless of course he had a more influential role? It's funny how the term diminish is used and the timing as well, Sam gone JW gone, Jerome no longer required, perhaps they've learnt all they can, perhaps they've seen the light, perhaps it's job done???

One part that really worries me now is the complete lack of experience we now have in key roles and whilst experience isn't the be all and end all, it's always nice when your finding your feet to have some to rely one, regardless of capacity. Yes it could all turn out rosy and we fly off into the sunset sipping margarita's, but more fledglings fail in the premier league than fly.

People can say new owners, new era, new dawn all they like the goals are the same regardless. Make the club perennial challengers for Europe, well I'm fairly sure JW knows a thing or two about building a club up to do just that, given Hughes era. Our owners have been in the game for 2 months and Kean who has been around for a long time has never been part of a team that has challenged for europe (I think I'm right on that one).

That article can basically be used in so many ways to confirm/add weight to some of the titbits that have been posted on here. Direct quotes from the chairperson as well and so I come back to the first point, seriously Venky's get a PR man on board. However if the LET are just publishing certain points to fuel the fire, then shame on you as with such inexperienced hands in all the key roles undermining them will not help the cause. I'm not trying to beat them and realise that most on here will take it that way as they haven't yet managed to figure out you can mix white and black to make grey, but I would have hoped to see an improvement in their media handling by now and it concerns me that we haven't.

Most would agree that Venky's media handling so far hasn't been great, they've been inconsistent said a number of things that perhaps they shouldn't like top four, we will support the current regime etc etc. So why still 2 months in are we still seeing interviews from themselves that simply add weight to the side they are not on or can be twisted so easily to fit the rumours that have been flying round.

Now I know there's one or two teachers on here and I'm sure they too have seen plenty of children/people grow, learn and develop through whatever means. But one method especially in the bright ones that I have seen is that when they realise they have made a mistake they ensure it doesn't happen again. So why don't I see this happening in the interviews being given. With such inexperience in our key roles now added in alongside this I can't say it fills me with confidence. As for me we will need both Venky's and Kean to turn out to be as good as sliced bread for this to work out IMO.

[Blue blood]

Very disappointing news. Felt Williams was the link with the club, fans, heritage and premier league that Venkeys needed if they weren't to go blundering about. Am worried what his loss will mean.

Sure every new owner wants their own people in, but whenever you start a new job or get a new business you want to learn the ropes/get to know the situation from those who have the experience and track record who are already there. I don't think Venkeys were really at the point where that familiarisation process had been completed, thus loosing Williams is a very big blow indeed.

[Kelbo]

Very disappointing news. Felt Williams was the link with the club, fans, heritage and premier league that Venkeys needed if they weren't to go blundering about. Am worried what his loss will mean.

Sure every new owner wants their own people in, but whenever you start a new job or get a new business you want to learn the ropes/get to know the situation from those who have the experience and track record who are already there. I don't think Venkeys were really at the point where that familiarisation process had been completed, thus loosing Williams is a very big blow indeed.

Exactly, a silly move.

[Kelbo]

I'd like to use that interview with Mrs D, to highlight a point/issue that worries me about our new owners.

Steve Kean and JW didn't get on, and yet Steve Kean openly said he got on well with JW when he was a coach. Mmmmm seriously our owners need to get up to speed on how/what to say to the press. They got on fine before, Sam got sacked, and then they didn't get on, you could have field day with that one line.

JW lost interest, well having met him I don't believe that for one second. Not 2 months ago he was more than happy to stay for at least 12 months, what changed? I don't know if circumstances have changed but I'm not convinced the lost interest line would have been used if they had as it completely sends the wrong message. The next part that I really don't like is that it says JW has declined to give interviews, why? He's been with us for 14 years and no press conference saying thanks, saying goodbye to the fans publicly. JW was all about the fans, he gave us cheap season tickets, he met anyone who had issue with the club face to face. Gagged? if so why?

John Williams didn't approve of Jerome's role at the club. Well if is role was purely on submitting lists of potential suitors with no influence why would JW have issue with his role? We employ scouts left right and centre and that's basically what he would be, unless of course he had a more influential role? It's funny how the term diminish is used and the timing as well, Sam gone JW gone, Jerome no longer required, perhaps they've learnt all they can, perhaps they've seen the light, perhaps it's job done???

One part that really worries me now is the complete lack of experience we now have in key roles and whilst experience isn't the be all and end all, it's always nice when your finding your feet to have some to rely one, regardless of capacity. Yes it could all turn out rosy and we fly off into the sunset sipping margarita's, but more fledglings fail in the premier league than fly.

People can say new owners, new era, new dawn all they like the goals are the same regardless. Make the club perennial challengers for Europe, well I'm fairly sure JW knows a thing or two about building a club up to do just that, given Hughes era. Our owners have been in the game for 2 months and Kean who has been around for a long time has never been part of a team that has challenged for europe (I think I'm right on that one).

That article can basically be used in so many ways to confirm/add weight to some of the titbits that have been posted on here. Direct quotes from the chairperson as well and so I come back to the first point, seriously Venky's get a PR man on board. However if the LET are just publishing certain points to fuel the fire, then shame on you as with such inexperienced hands in all the key roles undermining them will not help the cause. I'm not trying to beat them and realise that most on here will take it that way as they haven't yet managed to figure out you can mix white and black to make grey, but I would have hoped to see an improvement in their media handling by now and it concerns me that we haven't.

Most would agree that Venky's media handling so far hasn't been great, they've been inconsistent said a number of things that perhaps they shouldn't like top four, we will support the current regime etc etc. So why still 2 months in are we still seeing interviews from themselves that simply add weight to the side they are not on or can be twisted so easily to fit the rumours that have been flying round.

Now I know there's one or two teachers on here and I'm sure they too have seen plenty of children/people grow, learn and develop through whatever means. But one method especially in the bright ones that I have seen is that when they realise they have made a mistake they ensure it doesn't happen again. So why don't I see this happening in the interviews being given. With such inexperience in our key roles now added in alongside this I can't say it fills me with confidence. As for me we will need both Venky's and Kean to turn out to be as good as sliced bread for this to work out IMO.

Brilliant Maji, exactly as it is, Venkys have had this badly thought out and come accross as amatuers, it doesnt auger well at the moment but as you say, they really will have to be good to succeed, especially with the lack of experience throughout the club.

[RevidgeBlue]

Quite a few posts on here over night which include a lot of speculation which I know to be inaccurate.

Given Venky's read the message board I am not going to go further other than to say that much of what is on the last two or three pages is wide of the mark.

What absolute drivel philip.

"I'm right and everyone else is wrong but I'm not going to specify what my viewpoint actually is then no-one can ever say whether I was right or wrong. But I'll throw in a snide innuendo implying Venky's are at fault along the way just for good measure."

Btw according to today's LT Mrs. Desai arrived in London on Monday before flying to Manchester ahead of Wednesday night's game. She then apparently visited Brockhall on Thursday before flying back to India yesterday.

So unless the LT are making all that up you would appear to be similarly "wide of the mark" with your previous assertion that the Venky's delegation cut short their stay.

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

What absolute drivel philip.

"I'm right and everyone else is wrong but I'm not going to specify what my viewpoint actually is then no-one can ever say whether I was right or wrong. But I'll throw in a snide innuendo implying Venky's are at fault along the way just for good measure."

Btw according to today's LT Mrs. Desai arrived in London on Monday before flying to Manchester ahead of Wednesday night's game. She then apparently visited Brockhall on Thursday before flying back to India yesterday.

So unless the LT are making all that up you would appear to be similarly "wide of the mark" with your previous assertion that the Venky's delegation cut short their stay.

Nail on the head.

[PAFELL]

What absolute drivel philip.

"I'm right and everyone else is wrong but I'm not going to specify what my viewpoint actually is then no-one can ever say whether I was right or wrong. But I'll throw in a snide innuendo implying Venky's are at fault along the way just for good measure."

Btw according to today's LT Mrs. Desai arrived in London on Monday before flying to Manchester ahead of Wednesday night's game. She then apparently visited Brockhall on Thursday before flying back to India yesterday.

So unless the LT are making all that up you would appear to be similarly "wide of the mark" with your previous assertion that the Venky's delegation cut short their stay.

Even if they did leave earlier than they planned. Their choice to do so. There could be a number of reasons for doing so. Other business concerns, home situation. Or even the weather being to cold for them. I therefore do not think we can read anything into it.

Quite a few posts on here over night which include a lot of speculation which I know to be inaccurate.

Given Venky's read the message board I am not going to go further other than to say that much of what is on the last two or three pages is wide of the mark.

Well if the Venky's read this board, maybe they will be happy for you to share with us, why we are wide of the mark. If you have truthful information, there is no fear of legal action. Only if it is false can there be problems.

So if you have truthful imfo, please share it with us.

[CrazyIvan]

Reading that interview, it seems pretty clear JW negotiated his way out as in it was HIS choice rather than being pushed as has been suggested by some. It puts a completely different spin on things. I think that would be the most likely scenario given what little we know. If JW ever writes his memoirs, I for one would read them and think they'd make interesting reading...

Currently sat in Powerhouse Sports bar near DW stadium.

[philipl]

It depends who you believe doesn't it. Why would you trust Mrs D's version given the track record to date?

[CrazyIvan]

It depends who you believe doesn't it. Why would you trust Mrs D's version given the track record to date?

Because both parties have said the same thing. You're the one saying differently not JW...

[artemorethanlabore]

It depends who you believe doesn't it. Why would you trust Mrs D's version given the track record to date?

But what is the other version? As far as I know, this is the only version of what happened available. Unless I've overlooked an interview somewhere giving another account? Are there any basis for the 'J Williams-was-fired' line?

[Exiled in Toronto]

I think that's the point people are trying to make. Right or wrong, fans feel themselves to be part of the club, not just spectators, but part-owners. If 'FIFO' is their policy, then clearly they are alienating a huge number of fans, fans who have identified with John and his values for years. I've been getting a bit more optimistic about the new regime, but the way they've dealt with Sam and John, as well as the media comments they had released after these decisions have left a foul taste in my mouth and I can't say my opinion of the owners is very positive.

Older fans on here will remember more than once angry mobs trying to kick in the glass block windows to the Nuttall St stand chanting "Sack the board". We're all still here though.

[deftangel]

It depends who you believe doesn't it. Why would you trust Mrs D's version given the track record to date?

We could ask the same question of you. Where's Maradona?

As you clearly love the club, you should consider whether continually crying wolf and running away is actually detrimental to the interests of Rovers fans and the genuine concerns they will likely have about our brave new world. It's new and it's scary but you're doing an awful lot to make it less so. Think about it.

I don't buy this "lost interest" line for a second and IMO, JW's departure has been badly handled, undoing some of their good work (in largely keeping quiet). It strikes me as a flawed attempt to absolve themselves from blame in a possibly acrimonious departure. A clash of ideas and approaches isn't really anybodies fault, it happens but generally speaking, both parties can agree it's no longer in their best interests to work together a little more gracefully than Venky's have managed.

[The Prof.]

It's all or nothing on here again isn't it.

I met John Williams and thought he was a great guy. But think bigger.

Had a long chat with Rick Parry at Liverpool about a week before he went and he told me how he had re-negotiated all the commercial deals at Liverpool in his first few month and the commercial revenue from the club increased by £60m every YEAR. And he got sacked.

Cuddly old John brought some revenue improvements but not much - we have to reduce our wages to revenue ratio and to do that you must reduce the overall wage bill - this means fewer or less well paid players, or increase income. JW had not shown he was able to increase income enough and hence the wages-income problem.

We are a premiership club playing in front of 25,000 people and can't fill up the bill boards and sponsorship spaces. £59 for a corporate package over Christmas is no good.

JW was old school and what would he know about signings anyway - we have Grella! He appointed Ince! It ain't that great folks.

We do need a much more commercially oriented Chairman who can access innovative sources of income and improve the contracts we have. Apart from me there are few around.

Thanks for a great job and fitting in with homely old Blackburn John - he made you a cup o' tea eh? Says it all.

But I'm worried okay. I've worked for Indians and everyone is expendable.

But it might just work out.

I agree 100% with that Neil, the Rao's might well want to bring someone in from the outside to look at things with a fresh eye, but as I've previously opined the ideal successor to John Williams is already at the Club imo in the shape of the admirable Tom Finn.

I'm surprised people haven't picked up rather more on the fact that Tom issued the official statement paying tribute to John. This indicates to me :

1) Tom must be viewed favourably by the new owners.

2) Tom must not be too unhappy either with the fact of John's departure or the manner in which John was treated or he'd presumably have been offski himself.

No! Tom is here for now - see above - everyone is expendable and the increase in revenue will need to be very quick - or he won't be very soon.

[Exiled in Toronto]

If I was Tom Finn, I would be highly offended by all the comments along the lines of, 'we now have a completely inexperienced people at the helm'. This is a good opportunity for him to grow in his role after many yrears of JW being the mouthpiece for everything going on at the club.

Anyway, the person I feel most sorry for is Andy Cryer who has lost his one and only source!