[Archived] Steve Kean

[92er]

Didn't I read somewhere that Anderson tried to persuade Mrs D to keep Sam (until the summer?).

I think Nicko speculated that was the case.

[tony gale's mic]

McCarthyism creeping out again tgm...

...because you don't agree with me you'e loopy..Braddock is entitled to his opinion without being ridiculed.

I think you should read up on McCarthyism.

That's not what it was about at all...

[rebelmswar]

I understand why you might say they don't count,however it's unarguable that neither had any management experience whatsoever...

Doesn't leadership in the hardest league in the world and international stage count towards an ability to man manage?

[braddock]

Doesn't leadership in the hardest league in the world and international stage count towards an ability to man manage?

Not necessarily.

[tony gale's mic]

I don't think he's done much wrong on the whole, we are playing better football under him, he's had an injury crisis and no support from the fans. With some fairer decisions from the refs and some of the Allardyce luck from earlier in the season I think people would like him more. I like the way he talks about football too, from when I've heard him. At times he has been overly positive in his interviews, but he has to. Confidence is huge right now. But he knows football, anyone who listens to him can see that.

It's hardly been the perfect start but the amount of hate levelled towards him is unwarranted in my eyes. He's got a long way to go to prove himself, but people should give him the chance to do it rather than revelling in everything that goes wrong.

:lol:

In the entire footballing universe, only in the heads of a few stubborn folk on the BRFCS messageboard does the 19th place football of Steve Kean qualify as better football than the 9th place football of Sam Allardyce.

[rebelmswar]

I think you should read up on McCarthyism.

That's not what it was about at all...

If you substitute communism for insanity it works quite well. You do call a lot of people insane to some degree, or just stupid.

Strange that both are one and the same however.

Not necessarily.

But it is experience. No?

I mean more experiance with this type of player, game, etc.

The biggest club Kean was a player for was Celtic, for a year, right?

[patrickvalery]

I must be the only person who likes Kean and think he might be able to cut it at this level.

That's bravery right there! His appointment might have stunk, but i haven't lost all faith in him just yet.

Having said that, this isn't the path i'd have chosen. Especially with Sam's contract due to expire in the summer. The perfect scenario for all parties would have revolved around that event.

[yeti-dog]

I think you should read up on McCarthyism.

That's not what it was about at all...

I understand McCarthyism thanks...the anti Venky/Kean mob on here have sailed close to it often recently.

[tony gale's mic]

If you substitute communism for insanity it works quite well. You do call a lot of people insane to some degree, or just stupid.

Strange that both are one and the same however.

Well, McCarthyism called people "card carrying communists", an accusation which can be proved or disproved factually, whereas my opinions on certain members is just that.

[braddock]

:lol:

In the entire footballing universe, only in the heads of a few stubborn folk on the BRFCS messageboard does the 19th place football of Steve Kean qualify as better football than the 9th place football of Sam Allardyce.

We play hoofball as plan B, not plan A, and we utilise wingers.

[rebelmswar]

Well, McCarthyism called people "card carrying communists", an accusation which can be proved or disproved factually, whereas my opinions on certain members is just that.

Wasn't that a turn of phrase?

Like calling someone who can actually use a computer an idiot. A real idiot would not know how to write nevermind type.

[yeti-dog]

Well, McCarthyism called people "card carrying communists", an accusation which can be proved or disproved factually, whereas my opinions on certain members is just that.

I believe when McCarthyism was at it's peak..just the suggestion was all it took. Having to prove anything was,in all honesty superfluous.

[Jimmy612]

I don't think he's done much wrong on the whole, we are playing better football under him, he's had an injury crisis and no support from the fans. With some fairer decisions from the refs and some of the Allardyce luck from earlier in the season I think people would like him more. I like the way he talks about football too, from when I've heard him. At times he has been overly positive in his interviews, but he has to. Confidence is huge right now. But he knows football, anyone who listens to him can see that.

It's hardly been the perfect start but the amount of hate levelled towards him is unwarranted in my eyes. He's got a long way to go to prove himself, but people should give him the chance to do it rather than revelling in everything that goes wrong.

You're a trawler pal

[tony gale's mic]

We play hoofball as plan B, not plan A, and we utilise wingers.

Here's a newsflash, braddock. Football is as much about tackling, grit, and being direct as it is about playing pretty triangles.

There's no such thing as "hoofball", it's a ridiculous term which people on here have coined. It is all football.

The only wrong way of playing football is playing a system of football which is not suited to you.

That's why Barcelona playing long ball would be so obscene, not because it's ugly but because it would be the worst way of utilising their team packed full of flair players, creative players and brilliant passers of the ball.

For exactly the same reason Sam set us up a certain way, because it best utilised our strengths of having tall, strong players who were tough in the tackle. If Kean was getting Sam's results or anything near with a more expansive style, then and only then could you make a claim for saying he was playing better football.

I'll tell you what braddock, imagine if I got the Stoke managers' job. And I told the team to play all along the ground and to play into Kenwyne Jones' feet. If I then lost all 38 games that season, would people say I was playing better football than Tony Pulis?

Or does that concept only exist in the heads of a few people on here?

[blue_and_white]

I'm not sure I could honestly say I 'like' him,but if he keeps us up I feel he'd deserve a full pre-season to bed 'his' team in and try to show us he deserves to stay as manager.

Having said that,although I was never a big Sam basher, I don't really care that he's gone..the re-writing of history by some on here depicting him as some kind of messiah is risible...

This "rewriting of history" that people keep going on about is simply Allardyce's supporters doubling in size now the previously indifferent fans have realised what a good job he was actually doing. Those of us who were fully behind him from the start haven't changed our tune in the slightest. Avoiding relegation with games to spare when we were 5 points behind 18th at christmas was amazing, finishing 10th was amazing, getting to a cup semi and before a Samba sending off being on the way to Wembley was amazing and doing all this with negative transfer funds (we sold off more than we bought) was doubly amazing.

The view that his excellent record has somehow been rewritten to (oh wait) look excellent and the frequent ridiculing of Allardyce by sarcastically calling him the "messiah" is what I find extremely risible. He saved us from what looked like certain relegation at a time when nobody wanted to buy the club. Do you really realise what would have happened if we'd been relegated in 2009 with no hope of future investment? Most likely 1970-90 all over again, with most of being close to retirement age the next time we got to see our club in the top flight. I don't find Messiah to be an inappropriate name for him at all if people wanted to call him that.

[Jimmy612]

Doesn't leadership in the hardest league in the world and international stage count towards an ability to man manage?

Obviously not when you continue to galvanize upon your teams main strengths, and so wrecklessly ignore an attractive style similar to the likes of the top 6

[yeti-dog]

This "rewriting of history" that people keep going on about is simply Allardyce's supporters doubling in size now the previously indifferent fans have realised what a good job he was actually doing. Those of us who were fully behind him from the start haven't changed our tune in the slightest. Avoiding relegation with games to spare when we were 5 points behind 18th at christmas was amazing, finishing 10th was amazing, getting to a cup semi and before a Samba sending off being on the way to Wembley was amazing and doing all this with negative transfer funds (we sold off more than we bought) was doubly amazing.

The view that his excellent record has somehow been rewritten to (oh wait) look excellent and the frequent ridiculing of Allardyce by sarcastically calling him the "messiah" is what I find extremely risible. He saved us from what looked like certain relegation at a time when nobody wanted to buy the club. Do you really realise what would have happened if we'd been relegated in 2009 with no hope of future investment? Most likely 1970-90 all over again, with most of being close to retirement age the next time we got to see our club in the top flight. I don't find Messiah to be an inappropriate name for him at all if people wanted to call him that.

Each to their own..I'll always be grateful for his resue act but he never engendered passion and excitement in me. If he was a car he'd undoubtedly be a Volvo..

[tony gale's mic]

Each to their own..I'll always be grateful for his resue act but he never engendered passion and excitement in me. If he was a car he'd undoubtedly be a Volvo..

That's largely because you and many others got complacent and took our place in this league for granted.

I think the reign of Kean will engender passion, but only because he's put our very place in this league at risk.

[rebelmswar]

Each to their own..I'll always be grateful for his resue act but he never engendered passion and excitement in me. If he was a car he'd undoubtedly be a Volvo..

Id have that over a chop shopped, pimped out Fiesta fae Glasgow.

It also has a great sound system according to some. CD player is stuck on repeat however and the only gear it seems to have is reverse.

[yeti-dog]

Id have that over a chop shopped, pimped out Fiesta from Glasgow.

Ok..if he was a biscuit he's be a Rich Tea..try that one.

[braddock]

I'm doing the Bolton preview.

I wonder how it will be received.

[thenodrog]

2 "Coach of the year" titles in Holland

2 Dutch Cup victories

2 Premier League fifth places with Tottenham

1 Fifth place in the Bundesliga with Hamburg

Shhhteve Maclaren won the Dutch league for goodness sake. It's about as tough as the Scottish Prem!

From t'internet....

"Bolton reached the League Cup final in 2004, but lost to Middlesbrough. Nevertheless, Bolton finished eighth in the league, at the time their highest finish in their Premiership history. In 2005 Bolton finished sixth in the league, thus earning qualification for the UEFA Cup for the first time in their history. The following season, they reached the last 32 but were eliminated by French team Marseille as they lost 21 on aggregate. In April 2007, towards the end of 200607 season, manager Allardyce resigned.[18] In his final four seasons at Bolton, Allardyce had recorded consecutive top ten finishes, a record of consistency bettered only by the big four of Chelsea, Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal."

Look commondore Allardyce is no Arsene Wenger but for a Prem club of very limited resources he is the safest pair of hands around. Who do you think the Rovers most resemble in size stature and finance Bolton or Spurs?

[yeti-dog]

I'm doing the Bolton preview.

I wonder how it will be received.

You'll be ok Braddock. To quote Roy Walker of Catchphrase fame....just 'say what you see' rather than worrying what some anonymous keyboard warriors think.

Good luck.

[patrickvalery]

TGM, i completely agree about our style of play. Pulis is a good example. However, it's important to remember that football is a form of entertainment. Unfortunatey Kean tried to change the system too quickly. This can't really be disputed. However some of the other claims aimed at the man (not by yourself) have been obscene. If nothing else he seems to have the dressing room. Thats a big plus.

Pulis has boxed clever this year. There was a distinct shift in style with the players he signed. He soon realised a) he was out of his depth or b ) the league was going to be pretty tight. Either way, his 'footballers' left the club and Stoke reverted to type.

I don't mind Kean. But his biggest mistake has been changing our style to quickly. If he had been clever (assuming he knew he'd get the job full time) he should have kept our usual direct game and ensured say 40 pounts before making us more expansive. Thus giving him circa 5-6 months to bed in a new style and new faces.

[tony gale's mic]

TGM, i completely agree about our style of play. Pulis is a good example. However, it's important to remember that football is a form of entertainment. Unfortunatey Kean tried to change the system too quickly. This can't really be disputed. However some of the other claims aimed at the man (not by yourself) have been obscene. If nothing else he seems to have the dressing room. Thats a big plus.

Pulis has boxed clever this year. There was a distinct shift in style with the players he signed. He soon realised a) he was out of his depth or the league was going to be pretty tight. Either way, his 'footballers' left the club an Stoke reverted yo type.

I don't mind Kean. But his biggest mistake has been changing our style to quickly. If he had been clever (assuming he knew he'd get the job full time) he should have kept our usual direct game and ensured say 40 pounts before making us more expansive. Thus giving him circa 5-6 months to bed in a new style and new faces.

But every manager has their style. The style that Kean tries to instil into Rovers might be the one he knows best, or it might be ideologically driven and down to commands from on high (I think it's probably both) but with this team of players, an expansive style of play will never be the best fit.

Apart from a small minority (who IMO aren't being entirely truthful), football fans will always be more entertained by seeing their side win games. Obviously winning whilst playing like Arsenal will always be more entertaining than winning the way we did under Sam, but both will be more entertaining than losing whilst trying but failing to play pretty football.

If my team was spending £20m plus per season on transfer fees, finishing mid table and playing unattractive football, I would be one of the first people to either demand nicer football, or to want an improvement in results so we were at least challenging for Europe. But that's not the case and never was under Sam in terms of finances. Similarly unless we spend large amounts of money on our midfield, changing the style will be detrimental to our results; though a proper manager would at least have us further away from trouble.