[Archived] Steve Kean

[tony gale's mic]

Lets be honest he is not likely to say the opposite to that. He is also the only manager of Rovers - in modern times to have suffered a 7 1 defeat to man u. That is also on his record.

Yeah. It's one result. It's barely relevant. It certainly has naff all to do with the point he was making.

Mourinho is probably the only Real manager in recent times to have a 5-0 loss to Barca on his record. Considering the strength of his team, that was a much, much worse result.

[John]

Lets be honest he is not likely to say the opposite to that.

No he would not say the opposite, why would he, he is a very good/proven manager?

He is completely correct in his comments, as I said they were pretty obvious ones to make.

[47er]

The bonus with a manager like Rafa is that you know someone like him would not come unless we were prepared to spend some serious money.

but the downside is you know he's going to waste it.

(sorry Gumboots-saw your post after I'd posted

[Mattyblue]

Lets be honest he is not likely to say the opposite to that. He is also the only manager of Rovers - in modern times to have suffered a 7 1 defeat to man u. That is also on his record.

What's that got to do with owt? Every decent manager has a good hiding or two on his record, that's football.

[deryck guyler's spoon]

Yeah. It's one result. It's barely relevant. It certainly has naff all to do with the point he was making.

Mourinho is probably the only Real manager in recent times to have a 5-0 loss to Barca on his record. Considering the strength of his team, that was a much, much worse result.

To be fair, and I'm no Allardyce hater, we did have a habit of humilating capitulations at the hands of "big clubs" under the ex boss.

[Kelbo]

The bonus with a manager like Rafa is that you know someone like him would not come unless we were prepared to spend some serious money.

Agreed, it is something I was thinking also, he is not a muppet and only a couple of players moving on (Mascharino and Alonso especially gave them huge problems at Liverpool.

At Rovers he would be following a poor manager and thats how you get more success normally, follow a good one and its backs to the wall!

[tony gale's mic]

To be fair, and I'm no Allardyce hater, we did have a habit of humilating capitulations at the hands of "big clubs" under the ex boss.

Still doesn't change his point - we would have easily stayed up with him in charge. Allardyce has never been so much as remotely involved in a relegation fight in this league apart from the first season after he got Bolton promoted, and the time when he took over from Ince.

And while the Man U loss was a terrible result which Allardyce deserved to shoulder a lot of the blame for, there were also other signs - Arsenal home last season where we won and this season where we played well but lost, that we were competing in some of these games now. Definitely a weak point but most managers have them.

[tony gale's mic]

Agreed, it is something I was thinking also, he is not a muppet and only a couple of players moving on (Mascharino and Alonso especially gave them huge problems at Liverpool.

At Rovers he would be following a poor manager and thats how you get more success normally, follow a good one and its backs to the wall!

Have to say I don't for the life of me see why people say they don't want Rafa managing Rovers.

Look at where we are, and look at everything Rafa has achieved in his career.

Won La Liga twice with Valencia, hardly any small feat, and the UEFA Cup once. Took Liverpool who regularly finished in UEFA Cup places under Houllier and turned them into one of the established top 4, came second one season and won the Champions League and the FA Cup.

Yes he was never as good as Ferguson, Mourinho etc, he sure made some dubious signings but he was still an very good manager and, more importantly, one who would be capable of attracting big names to Ewood. Inter didn't go so well, but which better managers could we possibly wish to attract?

O'Neill? The man who spent £130 million at Villa, recouped just £40 million and never looked like getting into the Champions League?

If Rafa wants to come to Ewood we should roll out the red carpet for him.

[Gav]

TGM, you and i have had our disagreements in the past. However, its water under the bridge now. I try to reply to you in a civil and respectful manner which i hope was demonstrated by my post directed at you yesterday. It is clear my footballing ethos is not shared by yourself and visa versa. No problem with that whatsoever. I guess that is what this message board is all about.

You are clearly a well educated sort who can defend and argue any particular view pont. However, debate is not your strong point. You lose credibility when you throw childish insults at people, dismiss their opinions and claim your own opinions to be factual and beyond reproach. I mean this absolutley sincerely, you need to calm yourself down. If you are dismayed by "the stupidity of some of the posts on here" then you are giving this place far too much room and importance in your life. Take a wee break and try to relax because i think you may be doing lasting harm to yourself by getting so wound up. Save the angst for Saturdays my friend.

I’d give up on that one if I was you patrickvalery, he’s the same with everyone on the site, and is completely incapable of accepting people may have a different view point to his, he'd make a great doctor.

[PAFELL]

Have to say I don't for the life of me see why people say they don't want Rafa managing Rovers.

Look at where we are, and look at everything Rafa has achieved in his career.

Won La Liga twice with Valencia, hardly any small feat, and the UEFA Cup once. Took Liverpool who regularly finished in UEFA Cup places under Houllier and turned them into one of the established top 4, came second one season and won the Champions League and the FA Cup.

Yes he was never as good as Ferguson, Mourinho etc, he sure made some dubious signings but he was still an very good manager and, more importantly, one who would be capable of attracting big names to Ewood. Inter didn't go so well, but which better managers could we possibly wish to attract?

O'Neill? The man who spent £130 million at Villa, recouped just £40 million and never looked like getting into the Champions League?

If Rafa wants to come to Ewood we should roll out the red carpet for him.

Has he not also needed a big transfer kitty? do Venky's have the amount of money needed? Yes he has had his achievements, but needed mega funds to implement.

What's that got to do with owt? Every decent manager has a good hiding or two on his record, that's football.

In my view it wasn't just the score line, but the lack of even trying to get a decent result. The not trying to win against certain teams. I am not an alaydice hater, he is good at what he does. But if Rovers are to lose against the top 4 sides, I would rather they did it by trying to win the match - not giving up before the ball is kicked. It was at that point I started to question Sam's appointment at Rovers.

[LeChuck]

In my view it wasn't just the score line, but the lack of even trying to get a decent result.

That is just incredibly unfair. The line-up for that game was more attacking than the team we played against Arsenal.

You really think we didn't try to get a decent result? The game plan went out of the window after 2 minutes when Berbatov scored. After they scored another we capitulated. It was just an awful performance (like other teams have done). Why does it have to have some deeper philosophy just because Sam was the manager? Didn't we give Man Utd a really good game at their place the season before?

[tony gale's mic]

Has he not also needed a big transfer kitty? do Venky's have the amount of money needed? Yes he has had his achievements, but needed mega funds to implement.

Big deal. How many managers have won the Champions' League, La Liga and finished second in the Premier League without spending big money?!

Who else would you rather have than Rafa? We wouldnt be asking to win the Champions League or the Premier League so it's not like he'd need the same kind of money.

In my view it wasn't just the score line, but the lack of even trying to get a decent result. The not trying to win against certain teams. I am not an alaydice hater, he is good at what he does. But if Rovers are to lose against the top 4 sides, I would rather they did it by trying to win the match - not giving up before the ball is kicked. It was at that point I started to question Sam's appointment at Rovers.

The vast majority of bottom half managers have gone to top 4 sides on numerous occasions and played for the draw. Plus there were some notable exceptions. Everyone talks about our 6-2 loss at Arsenal but forgets for half of that game we were very much in the game and were 2-2 at half time. We beat Arsenal last season. We got a very creditable draw at the City of Manchester Stadium. We were very unlucky to lose at OT the season before and could have easily won that game.

That's not to say that Allardyce's record against the big teams wasn't an issue, but if a few games over the course of the season made you question his position, over our excellent home record which kept the vast majority of our paying spectators happy and which propelled us to a top 10 position, then the problem lies with you and not our former manager. The idea that Sam just rolled over in games against the big teams is another total myth as I've shown.

[deryck guyler's spoon]

That is just incredibly unfair. The line-up for that game was more attacking than the team we played against Arsenal.

You really think we didn't try to get a decent result? The game plan went out of the window after 2 minutes when Berbatov scored. After they scored another we capitulated. It was just an awful performance (like other teams have done). Why does it have to have some deeper philosophy just because Sam was the manager? Didn't we give Man Utd a really good game at their place the season before?

Not unfair at all really. It wasn't just the pathetic show at Utd, there were others. The performance at Anfield was a million miles away from what could be regarded as in any way acceptable.

[tony gale's mic]

Not unfair at all really. It wasn't just the pathetic show at Utd, there were others. The performance at Anfield was a million miles away from what could be regarded as in any way acceptable.

Team with minimal amounts of money spent on it performs poorly at teams with hundreds of millions spent on it.

Big story.

But as I've said before, there were notable exceptions which everyone seems to forget.

[onlyonejackwalker]

That is just incredibly unfair. The line-up for that game was more attacking than the team we played against Arsenal.

You really think we didn't try to get a decent result? The game plan went out of the window after 2 minutes when Berbatov scored. After they scored another we capitulated. It was just an awful performance (like other teams have done). Why does it have to have some deeper philosophy just because Sam was the manager? Didn't we give Man Utd a really good game at their place the season before?

Well said, but common sense does not wash with the Sam haters. Of course we did not set out to lose the game so badly.

Sunderland have just been beaten by 5 at City. Did they do it on purpose? When Wigan let in 9 at Spurs did they do it on purpose? When we were one of the best and put 7 past Norwich did they do it on purpose? Forest away scoring 5? United scored 9 against Ipswich. Did Ipswich mean to lose by that score? How many did Villa let in at Newcastle this year? Did United put 6 past Roma in the Champions League? How embarrassing for a club like Roma.

I could go on an on, it has ALWAYS been this way, but instead of people using their brains, people harp on about SA losing some aways games to the big clubs badly, like it has NEVER happened before and claim he gave up before we even got off the team bus.

Did any of the above clubs sack their managers based on one terrible result?

It is hugely boring to read people mentioning the United game like it had an relevance at all. It didn't. It was just a bad day for our club, will be repeated in the future by us or others as the divide between the very best and the rest is such, that on any given day teams can get hammered. Hugely disrespectful to all concerned in the above matches to believe they did not try.

I am amazed that people quote the United game to argue any point at all. I would imagine that most would know enough about football to understand that such results will happen in the PL every year!

For example, we let in 6 at Arsenal last year. I was there. We went 1-0 and 2-1 up. Nzonzi and Dunn. We had a sure fire penalty turned down at 3-2 down. It finished 6-2 to Arsenal and some people will argue it was embarrassing and we played to lose. Far from it, we gave an excellent account of ourselves for 65 minutes, but it still looked poor at the final score.

[otto man]

I’d give up on that one if I was you patrickvalery, he’s the same with everyone on the site, and is completely incapable of accepting people may have a different view point to his, he'd make a great doctor.

[Roverite28]

Still doesn't change his point - we would have easily stayed up with him in charge.

Based on what? Because he says so?

Sorry but if some on here are that good at predicting whats going to happen in games do me a 10 game accy for this weekend, i could do with a few quid.

[Majiball]

Agreed, it is something I was thinking also, he is not a muppet and only a couple of players moving on (Mascharino and Alonso especially gave them huge problems at Liverpool.

At Rovers he would be following a poor manager and thats how you get more success normally, follow a good one and its backs to the wall!

My major concern with someone like Rafa, would be how much control would he want? He changed everything at Liverpool from top to toe and if being honest what happened at the acdemy was not good and they didn't produce during his tenure. If Rovers vision is one of producing and nuturing kids, then for me we shouldn't let Rafa have free hand intially. Bowyer et al should be allowed to get on with it as the turn around from the acdemy has been good since he took over.

[thenodrog]

The bloke clearly needs support. Those who cant support should, imo, hold their tongues for the short term sake of the club.

Like the last few minutes when 3-0 up against Wolves?

[tony gale's mic]

Based on what? Because he says so?

Sorry but if some on here are that good at predicting whats going to happen in games do me a 10 game accy for this weekend, i could do with a few quid.

Based on the fact that he never got remotely near a relegation scrap since the first season after Bolton got promoted, apart from when he took over from Ince.

While you're down the bookies put a bet on that Alex Ferguson will get United into the top 4 next season.

[K-Hod]

There was me thinking the Allardce vs Kean debate had been put to bed.......

[Mattyblue]

In my view it wasn't just the score line, but the lack of even trying to get a decent result. The not trying to win against certain teams. I am not an alaydice hater, he is good at what he does. But if Rovers are to lose against the top 4 sides, I would rather they did it by trying to win the match - not giving up before the ball is kicked. It was at that point I started to question Sam's appointment at Rovers.

We'd had three years of progress on a shoestring, plus a cup semi, but because we got spanked at OT you questioned his appointment?

How's that work?

[blue_and_white]

Well said, but common sense does not wash with the Sam haters. Of course we did not set out to lose the game so badly.

Sunderland have just been beaten by 5 at City. Did they do it on purpose? When Wigan let in 9 at Spurs did they do it on purpose? When we were one of the best and put 7 past Norwich did they do it on purpose? Forest away scoring 5? United scored 9 against Ipswich. Did Ipswich mean to lose by that score? How many did Villa let in at Newcastle this year? Did United put 6 past Roma in the Champions League? How embarrassing for a club like Roma.

I could go on an on, it has ALWAYS been this way, but instead of people using their brains, people harp on about SA losing some aways games to the big clubs badly, like it has NEVER happened before and claim he gave up before we even got off the team bus.

Did any of the above clubs sack their managers based on one terrible result?

It is hugely boring to read people mentioning the United game like it had an relevance at all. It didn't. It was just a bad day for our club, will be repeated in the future by us or others as the divide between the very best and the rest is such, that on any given day teams can get hammered. Hugely disrespectful to all concerned in the above matches to believe they did not try.

I am amazed that people quote the United game to argue any point at all. I would imagine that most would know enough about football to understand that such results will happen in the PL every year!

For example, we let in 6 at Arsenal last year. I was there. We went 1-0 and 2-1 up. Nzonzi and Dunn. We had a sure fire penalty turned down at 3-2 down. It finished 6-2 to Arsenal and some people will argue it was embarrassing and we played to lose. Far from it, we gave an excellent account of ourselves for 65 minutes, but it still looked poor at the final score.

Great post. Although Allardyce is fat you know, so I think general rule because of that is to multiply every minor failing by 100. One insignificant, expected defeat at a ground we never pick up points from = decent reason for the sack.

[Roverite28]

Based on the fact that he never got remotely near a relegation scrap since the first season after Bolton got promoted, apart from when he took over from Ince.

While you're down the bookies put a bet on that Alex Ferguson will get United into the top 4 next season.

Again where is the 'fact' that we wouldnt have gone a terrible run of form? After all its happened under SA before? Thanks for the tip by the way mystic meg.

[thenodrog]

What do Venkt's know about different styles of football?

Well apparently the plonker with the pony tail is a self confessed Barca fan and and expert on their style of football and he thinks we should model our footballing style on them.