[Archived] The School that went on Strike

[FourLaneBlue]

It appears that teachers at Darwen Vale High have become the first in the country to ever go on strike regarding the behaviour of their pupils. Bring back the birch and all that?

Drugs, knives and a head who believes pupils have more rights than teachers: Inside the school that went on strikel

[gumboots]

It appears that teachers at Darwen Vale High have become the first in the country to ever go on strike regarding the behaviour of their pupils. Bring back the birch and all that?

Drugs, knives and a head who believes pupils have more rights than teachers: Inside the school that went on strikel

Heard of a teacher who was threatened with a knife the other day at Moorhead too. the kid only got a detention. Whenever I moan about the kids at school I have to remind myself how lucky I am to work in a school where the kids are by and large great and the senior staff deal with most problems fairly quickly. I even had one dad say to me at parents' evening - If he gives you any trouble at all Miss you give him a good belting. I wouldn't sue you;I'd give him another one when he got home. I did tell him that of course I would do no such thing, but the support was there, and it isn't in many schools.

[Hannah]

I think it is the support of the head that is crucial with this. I work in a challenging school. By no means as challenging as I think some secondary schools are but certainly have some children with big behaviour problems. Our head though is fantastic when it comes to behaviour. He supports us no matter what and will not tolerate children being rude or aggressive.

I was hit and kicked by a child and he immediately suspended him. A child screamed at our Year 6 teacher and again immediate suspension. He puts support in for the children when they return to school to address these problems but he is very strict with them.

If I have understood it correctly these teachers are putting up with crap from the children day in day out and then having the head tell them that actually they aren't handling it very well so it is really their own fault. I wouldn't put up with being treated like that and behaviour will continue going down hill whilst she doesn't support the staff.

[Hughesy]

Agree with the staff for doing it....what else can they do if they feel no support from their boss?

Allegations made quite alot about the teachers can be dangerous, and with no support it could end up ruining someones career....get the little scroats to behave!

[DE.]

I'd hate to be at high school nowadays.

I left high school in 2003, but still keep in contact with a couple of the teachers who ran the 6th form I went to afterwards. It's staggering how much things have changed even in the brief amount of time since I left - both in terms of pupil behaviour and overall school etiquette. Not in a positive way, either, and the high school I went to is far from a "bad" school. I genuinely dread to think what it must be like for teachers at those types of schools... don't think I could handle it, especially with their hands tied the way they are now.

[Beta Ray Bill]

The support for teachers is something that has always been a bone of contention.

In the 80s, my dad was an area rep for NAS/UWT for Chorley/Leyland and they were very close to going on strike after a couple of incidents were Lancashire Education Authority over ruled expulsions for physical attacks. LEA ultimately backed down.

Interestingly, the more militant NUT didn't support the proposed action, but did end up striking several times over pay...

[thenodrog]

The widely held view formulated by much foresight that Darwen Grammar School would go into a tailspin post 72 when it was turned into Darwen Vale Comprensive has been proved totally correct.

The comprehensive experiment has been successful only in hampering the education of the more intelligent children. Holding back children with the ability to learn is one of the most damaging features of our education system. No child benefits from a disruptive element in the class and if the teachers are not supported in rooting out the rotten apples in the barrel then everybody loses. The headmistress is nothing but a fool and a more damaging element than even the most badly behaved adolescent.

Unfortunately now that we have little employment and lots of labour saving machines the old secondary moderns have no place either. We must restore Grammar type education but what to do then with the ranks of the less intellectually gifted and less motivated children is a massive problem. No one can teach a kid with two left feet to play professional football no matter how good the intentions are just as no one can teach children with less intellectual capacity to pass exams. Do we choose to ignore the problem by continuing to dumb down academic standards and cross our fingers hoping that it will become the problem of then next govt and then the one after that, or do we wait until the achievers tire of paying ever more in taxation to support the non achievers and either force change or leave the country in brain drain fashion?

[JAL]

The teachers strike is an embarrassment for the government of this country, the local council, the leaders of education in this town, the school governors and the head teacher as well as Darwen itself.

How much money would these so called professional people above be earning, whilst failing to do their jobs on so many levels ?

Shame on them all !

[FourLaneBlue]

Dunno, JAL, you tell us. What is the going rate these days for being headbutted while trying to do your work?

[HemelRover]

Dunno, JAL, you tell us. What is the going rate these days for being headbutted while trying to do your work?

I had to read through Jals comment a second time to make sure I got it right(Shows I went to a Comp doesnt it!)

I dont think that Jal was aiming anything at the actual teachers, more at the people in the postitions above them(Goveners, Local Education Management and the School Head)

[ABBEY]

where the mrs works nearly every day,spit ,head butts ,kicks,knifes thrown and bodily mess as well.

[FourLaneBlue]

I had to read through Jals comment a second time to make sure I got it right(Shows I went to a Comp doesnt it!)

I dont think that Jal was aiming anything at the actual teachers, more at the people in the postitions above them(Goveners, Local Education Management and the School Head)

Ah, yes, i think so as well.

It does show how many people are involved in education and yet the result is anarchy for the kids and teachers alike.

[JAL]

I had to read through Jals comment a second time to make sure I got it right(Shows I went to a Comp doesnt it!)

I dont think that Jal was aiming anything at the actual teachers, more at the people in the postitions above them(Goveners, Local Education Management and the School Head)

Precisely, intervention from the above mentioned should have come way before we got to this stage, by supporting the head, the teachers in instilling or improving on the current code of discipline for which the pupils have to adhere to.

Whilst the head of this school will take full responsibility for this, it shouldnt in any way deflect criticism from all of the above mentioned in their seemingly blase acceptance that allowed this situation to get to this unacceptable stage.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Sad to hear of the apparent demise of my ex school,always had a decent reputation.The teachers do need backing to root out the bad apples but society's gone soft.

Sadly, a sign of the times.

[colin]

Theno,

The widely held view formulated by much foresight that Darwen Grammar School would go into a tailspin post 72 when it was turned into Darwen Vale Comprensive has been proved totally correct.

39 years later, that's some foresight!

[broadsword]

I wouldn't be a teacher, not for all the tea in China.

[Majiball]

I wouldn't be a teacher, not for all the tea in China.

You have to admire anyone who does it.

I most certainly couldn't as I remember all the crap we used to get up and get caught doing by the fun patrol.

[Miker]

Unfortunately now that we have little employment and lots of labour saving machines the old secondary moderns have no place either. We must restore Grammar type education but what to do then with the ranks of the less intellectually gifted and less motivated children is a massive problem. No one can teach a kid with two left feet to play professional football no matter how good the intentions are just as no one can teach children with less intellectual capacity to pass exams. Do we choose to ignore the problem by continuing to dumb down academic standards and cross our fingers hoping that it will become the problem of then next govt and then the one after that, or do we wait until the achievers tire of paying ever more in taxation to support the non achievers and either force change or leave the country in brain drain fashion?

Education standards seem to have dropped severely, in fact I'm not sure they've ever been that high (here in Australia, at least). There's too much emphasis on achieving a passing grade. The sad thing is that over here, even 40% is a passing grade in a lot of situations.

The whole education system needs to be revolutionised, not just here, but all over the world. Kids need to get more engaged with their study, but it's becoming increasingly hard because there's too many fun things to do out there for kids to bother with school. At the moment I'm working on an IT project for a primary school that is focusing on "self-reporting" teaching. The idea is to guide students in the right direction, but let them take control of their own study. All kids need to feel like their study is meaningful to their lives, not just being forced upon them by their parents or the education system.

A great movie about the education system is the Hindi film, "3 Idiots", which is by far one of the most brilliant movies I've ever seen. It describes perfectly the problems we're facing in terms of education and suggests ways in which these can be solved.

[gumboots]

I wouldn't be a teacher, not for all the tea in China.

Why not? It's a great job in a decent school with kids who mostly know how to behave and want to learn. I'm not taalking a private school here but one with a mix of about 70% Asian heritage kids to 30% white. My school takes in kids from some of the most deprived housing in Blackburn but still does a good job, and when our kids come back and tell us they're at Uni studying to be a doctor or a lawyer or just that they are doing well for themselves in life, it's fantastic. Yes, it's hard. You can't have an off day as you are performing from 8.20 in the morning till 3.00 in the afternoon and it's like being on stage with a load of extras and no script, but it is rewarding. However, you need backing by your senior management and your governors. Even then there are numpties in local government who try to overturn decisions when Heads and governors exclude pupils but the majority of times, if you've built a decent reputation as we have, that doesn't happen.

[thenodrog]

Why not? It's a great job in a decent school with kids who mostly know how to behave and want to learn. I'm not taalking a private school here but one with a mix of about 70% Asian heritage kids to 30% white. My school takes in kids from some of the most deprived housing in Blackburn but still does a good job, and when our kids come back and tell us they're at Uni studying to be a doctor or a lawyer or just that they are doing well for themselves in life, it's fantastic. Yes, it's hard. You can't have an off day as you are performing from 8.20 in the morning till 3.00 in the afternoon and it's like being on stage with a load of extras and no script, but it is rewarding. However, you need backing by your senior management and your governors. Even then there are numpties in local government who try to overturn decisions when Heads and governors exclude pupils but the majority of times, if you've built a decent reputation as we have, that doesn't happen.

Yes and with only about 2 hours off for lunch and T breaks and at least 3 months holiday a year! Gumboots I admire your dedication.

btw Pleckgate?

[dave birch]

Yes and with only about 2 hours off for lunch and T breaks and at least 3 months holiday a year! Gumboots I admire your dedication.

btw Pleckgate?

Goodness me, you are naive if you beleive that teachers start and stop on the sroke of the school day.

I'd hazzard a guess that many put in hours way beyond yours (given the amount of time you put in here)

[joey_big_nose]

If it was that easy TND there wouldn't be the shortage of staff there is at the moment.

The Grammar versus Comp system is such a difficult question. On the one hand it does seem perverse that intelligent dedicated kids do not get as high a standard of teaching (particularly in terms of protection from class room disruption) as they did previously.

However the problem is complicated as if you reintroduced grammars the places would be dominated by kids from wealthy stable families while the majority from poorer unstable families would be ghettoised into the poorer schools. With the wealth gap increasing to worrying levels I'm not sure this is a desirable a course of action.

My personal sympathy would be have a two tier system where access to the top tier was determined not by an exam paper but by an unblemished disciplinary record. Disciplinary issues would see the pupil shifted into the lower tier. That way less intellgient kids who were well behaved would not be penalised.

The issue with this though is you still get the ghettoisation of kids who are acting up, perhaps because of family issues or psychological problems. It's a no win situation really. Which ever way you organise it some people are going to be penalised. Currently - to massively generalise - it is the cleverer kids who are. The grammar system - to also over generalise - saw the poorer kids suffer.

[gumboots]

Yes and with only about 2 hours off for lunch and T breaks and at least 3 months holiday a year! Gumboots I admire your dedication.

btw Pleckgate?

yes and btw it's less than an hour for lunch and you're expected to teach extra classes then and 4 breaks a week of 15 mins. The other break is duty. that's without detention duty,CPD time, after school clubs etc plus the time you are meant to work after official class end without what you do at home. why I said performing for that length of time is your that's your official contact with kids time. I don't work as hard as many young teachers do as I've been teaching long enough now to know what works with most classes and to be able to think on my feet if something's not working but if you saw the amount of effort our young staff put in you'd never again wonder why staff and kids need holidays. Yes, we get 13 weeks but if we didn't there'd probably be even more problems in schools. The kids get shattered after about 6 weeks and need a break to get outside and let off steam like kids do. And before anyone tells me I shouldn't rise to the bait, I wouldn't but one of the things that really annoys me is people suggesting that teachers don't work hard. If you're so sure it's easy, I'll organise a work placement for you and you can come and try it yourself.

[thenodrog]

However the problem is complicated as if you reintroduced grammars the places would be dominated by kids from wealthy stable families while the majority from poorer unstable families would be ghettoised into the poorer schools. With the wealth gap increasing to worrying levels I'm not sure this is a desirable a course of action.

Joey

1. How so? The 11 Plus didn't involve a means test.

2. two wrongs do not make a right. Entire classes should not be held back by a few disruptive elements. That is the initial and most pressing priority.

[gumboots]

You're right;it didn't. The problem is that testing at 11 might disadvantage some of our kids who don't yet have good English skills because of their ethnic background. I went to grammar school myself despite my background being largely working class although my dad was what would now be termed upwardly mobile. Many in my class had parents who were manual workers in the steel works or the chemical industry. However, then education was a thing to aspire to whereas now it's treated with contempt by large sections of society.