[Archived] Sam Allardyce Messiah or simply a good manager?

[Gav]

Sam had plenty of fans on his side - the ones who know and understand football.

Souness was a good manager for a few seasons and then gave up - he was as dangerous to the club's future then as Kean is now.

Sam was never anything less than a very safe pair of hands - and who wouldn't want that right now ?

Can't really argue with that Jim.

[Mayfield]

Supporters keep saying that Sam wont be coming back.

Well, an awful lot can happen between now and August.

Will Venkys really get on there hands and knees to beg him to come back? I wish they would but can't see it happening, not without a proper chairman anyway.

[thenodrog]

enjoyed some of them.. under kean. wigan, fulham, spring to mind.

the anticipation is certainly bigger, because every game is do or die.

did you enjoy the big sam trips ?

I don't go to away matches cos I don't like the company all that much but I was treated to a spot of corporate hospitality at Bolton (Sam's last game in charge) and I did enjoy that. We were desperately unlucky to lose after outplaying and outpassing Coyle's 'attractive' Wanderers for most of the match.

Still don't let the facts get in the way of your increasingly stupid arguments zaccaius.

[thenodrog]

Ask our fans who they look back on most fondly.

Anyway, what was the point of that post? Allardyce isn't coming back. Get used to it.

Really? Is Souness?

Don't want to be disparaging toward the younger supporters but a blind man on a galloping horse can see that our Blackburn Enders know nowt.

[Parsonblue]

I believe the comparisons between different managers is a pretty pointless exercise. During the past decade we have been fortunate to have three men, Souness, Hughes and Allardyce who all arrived at the club at the right time and fulfilled different roles. Souness was given the task of taking us back into the Premier League and establishing us at the higher level once again. This he did and more with the Worthington Cup win. He may have started to lose it during his last 18 months at the club but that shouldn't detract from the excellent work he did.

Hughes was given the task of keeping the club in the Premier League and building on the foundations that Souness had left. Again, he went beyond the original remit and took us into Europe on two occasions. Travelling around Europe watching the Rovers was a fantastic experience and Hughes was able to cement our position as a top ten Premier League club.

Allardyce was asked to rescue the club when relegation looked a certainty. This he did and, of course, last season we had a tenth place finish and reached a semi-final.

All three were very good managers in their own right. All three approached the job differently, all three had weaknesses, but all three were good for Blackburn Rovers. More importantly, all three men remain head and shoulders above Kean when it comes to the management of a football team.

[Mercer]

Will Venkys really get on there hands and knees to beg him to come back? I wish they would but can't see it happening, not without a proper chairman anyway.

The clue may well be in "have a long and hard think about that one".

[Steve Moss]

Sam's not the Messiah (obviously) but he is a good manager, something we are desperately lacking.

If Venkys rehired Sam, even if only to get us out of this mess or for next season, I would begin to think more positively of them. Ditto if they hired any manager who has a track record of getting results on a limited budget at the top level of play.

[tony gale's mic]

I'll look at what they've achieved at my club.

Souness

- Promotion, exciting football, memorable results, league cup success, European qualification.

Allardyce

- Survival, Mid-table finish, Snore-inducing football.

Yeah, but looking at what they did at your club is being extremely selective when you're comparing them as managers surely?

Are you going to forget Souness bringing Liverpool to its knees, or Sam achieving everything he did with Bolton?

I'll tell you what, I'll use your logic and compare Michael Ricketts and Robbie Fowler as strikers. I think I'll use the season where Fowler scored 8 in 27 league games, and for Ricketts I'll use the season where he scored 15 league goals. Ricketts was better than Fowler! I'm just going to ignore the other bits of their careers.

Still, let's compare their Rovers circumstances. You look at things in such a simple way, I really hope for your sake you don't go through life looking at everything else in such a simple way. Oh well..

Souness took over a side which easily had the quality to get promoted and then some. Players like Duff, Dunn and Jansen were a different class entirely and more importantly had pace and creativity in abundance, and were better than any players Sam inherited even with us as a Premier League side. Comfortably. Got us promoted. Got us into Europe one season, but in a totally different Premier League to the one Sam operated in. Where City and Villa had no money. Where Moyes was in his first season with Everton and hadnt built the team he did, and where Spurs were also rans. That pretty much accounts for the difference between the 6th place Souness achieved and the 10th place Sam achieved. League Cup win was great though.

Played exciting football because we had exciting players which Sam never got to inherit. Had much more money to spend than Sam. Some great signings (Friedel, Tugay) but some absolutely diabolical ones too.

However, when he left Rovers were in the relegation zone. He didn't get sacked, but he would've fully deserved to have got sacked if only Newcastle weren't so stupid to come in for him. When Allardyce left Rovers he was on course to possibly better last seasons finish (we'd be 9th right now), in a considerably tougher league with Rovers far poorer compared to the rest of the league.

Rovers fans were happy to see Souness leave, though most of us recognised his reign had been good for the club. The majority weren't happy to see Sam leave.

How's that funny?

It's funny because you're basically telling people to stop going on about Sam, and yet you're coming into a thread specifically about him and constantly entertaining us with your ludicrous opinions on football.

[Mercer]

I believe the comparisons between different managers is a pretty pointless exercise. During the past decade we have been fortunate to have three men, Souness, Hughes and Allardyce who all arrived at the club at the right time and fulfilled different roles. Souness was given the task of taking us back into the Premier League and establishing us at the higher level once again. This he did and more with the Worthington Cup win. He may have started to lose it during his last 18 months at the club but that shouldn't detract from the excellent work he did.

Hughes was given the task of keeping the club in the Premier League and building on the foundations that Souness had left. Again, he went beyond the original remit and took us into Europe on two occasions. Travelling around Europe watching the Rovers was a fantastic experience and Hughes was able to cement our position as a top ten Premier League club.

Allardyce was asked to rescue the club when relegation looked a certainty. This he did and, of course, last season we had a tenth place finish and reached a semi-final.

All three were very good managers in their own right. All three approached the job differently, all three had weaknesses, but all three were good for Blackburn Rovers. More importantly, all three men remain head and shoulders above Kean when it comes to the management of a football team.

A very good post.

[thenodrog]

Souness had the fans on his side and won the League cup, Allardyce did neither.

I think the polls on here and the LT after Allardyces sacking prove your opinion to be not worth a light. Why don't you accept them? Is it down to the half dozen numpties who sat around you last season?

[Amo]

Yeah, but looking at what they did at your club is being extremely selective when you're comparing them as managers surely?

Are you going to forget Souness bringing Liverpool to its knees, or Sam achieving everything he did with Bolton?

I'll tell you what, I'll use your logic and compare Michael Ricketts and Robbie Fowler as strikers. I think I'll use the season where Fowler scored 8 in 27 league games, and for Ricketts I'll use the season where he scored 15 league goals. Ricketts was better than Fowler! I'm just going to ignore the other bits of their careers.

Still, let's compare their Rovers circumstances. You look at things in such a simple way, I really hope for your sake you don't go through life looking at everything else in such a simple way. Oh well..

Souness took over a side which easily had the quality to get promoted and then some. Players like Duff, Dunn and Jansen were a different class entirely and more importantly had pace and creativity in abundance, and were better than any players Sam inherited even with us as a Premier League side. Comfortably. Got us promoted. Got us into Europe one season, but in a totally different Premier League to the one Sam operated in. Where City and Villa had no money. Where Moyes was in his first season with Everton and hadnt built the team he did, and where Spurs were also rans. That pretty much accounts for the difference between the 6th place Souness achieved and the 10th place Sam achieved. League Cup win was great though.

Played exciting football because we had exciting players which Sam never got to inherit. Had much more money to spend than Sam. Some great signings (Friedel, Tugay) but some absolutely diabolical ones too.

However, when he left Rovers were in the relegation zone. He didn't get sacked, but he would've fully deserved to have got sacked if only Newcastle weren't so stupid to come in for him. When Allardyce left Rovers he was on course to possibly better last seasons finish (we'd be 9th right now), in a considerably tougher league with Rovers far poorer compared to the rest of the league.

Rovers fans were happy to see Souness leave, though most of us recognised his reign had been good for the club. The majority weren't happy to see Sam leave.

You have too much time on your hands.

I'm not getting drawn into your pointless, tl;dr debates.

It's funny because you're basically telling people to stop going on about Sam, and yet you're coming into a thread specifically about him and constantly entertaining us with your ludicrous opinions on football.

Theno's post had no relevancy. So what if Allardyce is a better manager than Souey. There's a slim chance Souey could come back here. Could you say the same for Allardyce?

[Mercer]

You have too much time on your hands.

I'm not getting drawn into your pointless, tl;dr debates.

Theno's post had no relevancy. So what if Allardyce is a better manager than Souey. There's a slim chance Souey could come back here. Could you say the same for Allardyce?

Yes - you need to think about the bigger picture.

[tony gale's mic]

You have too much time on your hands.

I'm not getting drawn into your pointless, tl;dr debates.

:lol: That post took about 10 minutes to write. Your posts probably take longer to write, but for entirely different reasons.

Not sure what a tl;dr debate is.

[Mayfield]

The clue may well be in "have a long and hard think about that one".

hmmmm i see

[Mercer]

hmmmm i see

Hmmm - could have been put better !

[Mayfield]

Hmmm - could have been put better !

hmmm as in I should of read your post properly, although i'm still struggling to think of ways to get Sam back, can only come up with a grovelling apology and a good wage

[RibbleValleyRover]

Don't see Sam coming back and he really isn't the solution at all. How many managers have come back to a club and bettered what they achieved? Not many, that's why clubs don't go back.

I would personally place Hughes and Souey both ahead of Sam if i was to rank the three of them and their job as a Rovers manager.

Overall though this whole thread is pointless, what's done is done and there is no going back.

[tony gale's mic]

Once Duff left, Souness' reign died with it.

[Mayfield]

Don't see Sam coming back and he really isn't the solution at all. How many managers have come back to a club and bettered what they achieved? Not many, that's why clubs don't go back.

I would personally place Hughes and Souey both ahead of Sam if i was to rank the three of them and their job as a Rovers manager.

Overall though this whole thread is pointless, what's done is done and there is no going back.

Both left on there own terms, Sam had plans and has unfinished business plus most of his squad are still here

[tony gale's mic]

Both left on there own terms, Sam had plans and has unfinished business plus most of his squad are still here

Souey would have got sacked very soon after that. Our form that season was part of a downward spiral since Duff had left over a year previously.

[Gav]

I would personally place Hughes and Souey both ahead of Sam if i was to rank the three of them and their job as a Rovers manager.

By a country mile.

[tony gale's mic]

Souness was the only three of those managers who would have got us relegated.

[Mercer]

By a country mile.

If I invited you to a small function with Sam as 'the guest', would you come ?

[Mayfield]

Souness was the only three of those managers who would have got us relegated.

Souness had a tough job though with Duff leaving and Jansen's accident, Emerton was his replacement for Duff and was supposed to be the best thing since sliced bread but......

Still don't think we would have been relegated with him in charge, he was never afraid to give the team a kick up the backside when needed (Dwight Yorke training ground tackle springs to mind) but overall Big Sam was the man to guarantee safety year in year out on a small budget.

[tony gale's mic]

Souness had a tough job though with Duff leaving and Jansen's accident, Emerton was his replacement for Duff and was supposed to be the best thing since sliced bread but......

Still don't think we would have been relegated with him in charge, he was never afraid to give the team a kick up the backside when needed (Dwight Yorke training ground tackle springs to mind) but overall Big Sam was the man to guarantee safety year in year out on a small budget.

Souness was a very good manager for Rovers while we had Duff. But once that spark and that inspiration left, we struggled massively. He brought Grabbi and Ferguson in for £12 million combined who obviously didnt help much at all. It's not even like he had limited funds.

And I think we wouldve been relegated with Souness in charge, you only need to look at the rest of his career to see his time with Rovers while things were going well was a rare purple patch in his career. The slide we were in wasn't just that season, it had been going on for the previous season too.