[Archived] Phil Jones

[imy9]

Jones starting in central midfield today, away at Liverpool. That means he's played centre half, full back and central midfield. Oh and for England.

He's not that good though eh?

Question for anyone. If another top club came in for Jones now - and he wanted to leave, how much would United ask/get for him?

Rovers can ask as much as anyone else Tom.

How's about £40m ish?

Not bad for someone you lads don't rate!

19 years old imy.

They would ask a penny less.

Pique, who's talking about Pique imy? If United had to sell Jones do you think Ferguson would look at your Pique valuation?

In case you didn't realise it, I asked how much he would go for if United had to sell him. You think Ferguson would let him go for the £16m + add ons that he paid for him?

Go think again.

Correct me if I'm wrong but the point that you are making is that Phil Jones is a top class player and is worth more than the £16.5 million+ add ons that Blackburn got for him?

IF United had to sell ANY player then that player would be worth more because they played for United in comparison to Blackburn. So yes United would ask for £40 million, but is he worth that? NO. Why did I mention Pique? I mentioned him because he is a £40 million pound player, is the complete package and is worth more than Jones.

I could name at least half a dozen young defenders who are as good/better than Jones and did not cost as much. The point that I am making (without beating around the bush is that we got a fair price for him, the biggest fee for a defender of his age. Both parties got a fair deal.

[Mattyblue]

Completely off topic, but can you pleae not refer to us as 'Blackburn'. A couple of people on here do it and it grates every time.

[imy9]

Sorry Matty IPhone reads Robers when I try! Will have to type slower I guess.

[bobsterbrfc]

Completely off topic, but can you pleae not refer to us as 'Blackburn'. A couple of people on here do it and it grates every time.

Agreed! It's 'Blackburn Rovers', or 'Rovers'.

[chris]

I prefer Blackburn or Rovers, I rarely write Blackburn Rovers

Tottenham Hotspur refer to themselves as Spurs or Tottemham

[den]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the point that you are making is that Phil Jones is a top class player and is worth more than the £16.5 million+ add ons that Blackburn got for him?

My point imy, is that you and a few others said he wasn't good enough to get into United's team and we did well to get the price we did for him. Hell some of you said he only got into our team because of injuries. My other point is that £16m +add ons is an absolute gift in the market United deal in.

As for the argument rovers players are never worth as much as United's, history shows that rovers have got huge fees for their players starting with pickering, England, Hird, Bailey, Shearer to name a few off the top of my head.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

My point imy, is that you and a few others said he wasn't good enough to get into United's team and we did well to get the price we did for him. Hell some of you said he only got into our team because of injuries. My other point is that £16m +add ons is an absolute gift in the market United deal in.

As for the argument rovers players are never worth as much as United's, history shows that rovers have got huge fees for their players starting with pickering, England, Hird, Bailey, Shearer to name a few off the top of my head.

Den - I think Imy has a point - United have sold some dross for far more money than Rovers ever could.

Not taking anything away from him - but Jones only got in the team ahead of Hanley as he was injured at the time. Having said that - he took his chance and hasn't looked back (Hanley on the other hand ).

As for £16+m being a gift - undoubtably - especially as we would probably be safely in mid-table if he hadn't have left (even with Kean in charge).

[Baz]

I could name at least half a dozen young defenders who are as good/better than Jones and did not cost as much.

Go on then, name the 6.

As for you love-in with Pique, he's 5 years older than Jones (24 vs 19), at 19 Pique was sent out on loan by United to gain experience.

[RibbleValleyRover]

If you look at both players when they were 19 years old Jones looks a far better player than Pique was at the same age.

[imy9]

Go on then, name the 6.

As for you love-in with Pique, he's 5 years older than Jones (24 vs 19), at 19 Pique was sent out on loan by United to gain experience.

The point I was making was that the money that we received was the highest ever for a player in his position and age, (potentially he is a top player) but with Rovers he played 35 league games and never played for England or played in Europe (and had a serious career threatening injury)- this IMO means that we got a very good price and Man Utd got themselves a player with huge potential. (this is crux of the point that I am making)

IF everyone is fit then he will be on the bench, Rio and Vidic are first choice and Evans, next. He has shown that he is a liability at RB and he looked lost in midfield in his last game.

To the answer the above, IMO.

1. Simon Kjaer

2. Pique

3. David Luiz

4. Matts Hummels

5. Neven Subotic

6. Sebastian Coates

All the above are better/equal to Jones ATM, Den said his worth £40 million now so my point was that these guys would cost less than that so its a no brainer. Also defenders reach their peak at around 30 so 19-24 makes little difference in price.

Pique at the same age as Jones was playing in the top flight in Spain- and impressing.

[philipl]

Obviously have to beg to differ.

Phil Jones is the outstanding young talent in the PL and my bet to get Young Player of the Year this season.

[imy9]

Obviously have to beg to differ.

Phil Jones is the outstanding young talent in the PL and my bet to get Young Player of the Year this season.

I agree with you Phil, but then I think the PL is over rated and most of the players I mentioned play in other leagues.

[Billy Castell]

Ah, but is Jones likely to be banging the likes of Shakira when he is 24 after winning the Champions league for the 2nd time?

[den]

All the above are better/equal to Jones ATM, Den said his worth £40 million

No I didn't. I asked you how much he would be worth now if United had to sell him. I put the £40m as a suggestion.

How much do you think United would get for him now? I think any honest answer would illustrate what I - and others - have been saying. To United he was a snip. They would pay £16+ much more, for the best young English talent any day of the week.

....I should explain imy. It was only when I was watching the United Liverpool game and I saw that Jones was starting central midfield, his third position in the first team, coupled with him starting almost every game - and only 19 years old to boot - that I thought about some of the comments on this thread. I had a quick look back and your post just happened to be the one I replied to. It might have appeared that I picked you out to have a go at, but really, I was replying to the general comments from some fans that reckoned that Jones was only displaying potential and not even proven in the PL yet.

[den]

Den - I think Imy has a point - United have sold some dross for far more money than Rovers ever could.

So have we - RSC for £18m?

That isn't the discussion though DMTP. The argument that United get more for their players when they sell them, than rovers get is arguable to say the least. Over the last 50 years we've sold players for record sums on more than one occassion.

There is no real reason why United can ask more for a player than anyone else can. They get more for players like Ronaldo because he's one of the best in the world, not because he's at OT. We sold Shearer for a British transfer record, as we did England and Pickering {I think], all those years ago.

[LDRover]

Ah, but is Jones likely to be banging the likes of Shakira when he is 24 after winning the Champions league for the 2nd time?

Now that is the most relevant question asked on this thread so far.

[greco]

The point I was making was that the money that we received was the highest ever for a player in his position and age, (potentially he is a top player) but with Rovers he played 35 league games and never played for England or played in Europe (and had a serious career threatening injury)- this IMO means that we got a very good price and Man Utd got themselves a player with huge potential. (this is crux of the point that I am making)

IF everyone is fit then he will be on the bench, Rio and Vidic are first choice and Evans, next. He has shown that he is a liability at RB and he looked lost in midfield in his last game.

To the answer the above, IMO.

1. Simon Kjaer

2. Pique

3. David Luiz

4. Matts Hummels

5. Neven Subotic

6. Sebastian Coates

All the above are better/equal to Jones ATM, Den said his worth £40 million now so my point was that these guys would cost less than that so its a no brainer. Also defenders reach their peak at around 30 so 19-24 makes little difference in price.

Pique at the same age as Jones was playing in the top flight in Spain- and impressing.

He might have a career ending injury, how does that come into the equation.? Is this something you consider, on the basis of wanting to defend the club at all costs, or do you consider a career ending injury in every transfer that happens.?

as a dane, i see kjaer on a regular basis. Hyped up beyond belief. If you want to mention a cheap player, with good mental traits and better suited for english football, a player like anders bjelland would be a better choice.

Kjaer or bjelland for that matter, arent on jones level ans Its not even close.

Imo jones is a special talent, his drive, determination and physique are great. He reads the game well and has the ability to perform centrally from defence to midfield. He does so with an authority, which ia rarely seen in young players or perhaps players in generel.

The "boy" is without a doubt, a thoroughbred.

[BRFC1995]

To the answer the above, IMO.

1. Simon Kjaer

2. Pique

3. David Luiz

4. Matts Hummels

5. Neven Subotic

6. Sebastian Coates

All the above are better/equal to Jones ATM, Den said his worth £40 million now so my point was that these guys would cost less than that so its a no brainer. Also defenders reach their peak at around 30 so 19-24 makes little difference in price.

Pique at the same age as Jones was playing in the top flight in Spain- and impressing.

Coates must be seriously crap if he can't get skirtel out of the pool side, not a clue on the others but Jones is undeniable class

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

So have we - RSC for £18m?

That isn't the discussion though DMTP. The argument that United get more for their players when they sell them, than rovers get is arguable to say the least. Over the last 50 years we've sold players for record sums on more than one occassion.

There is no real reason why United can ask more for a player than anyone else can. They get more for players like Ronaldo because he's one of the best in the world, not because he's at OT. We sold Shearer for a British transfer record, as we did England and Pickering {I think], all those years ago.

There is a very sad side to this equation - players don't leave United to further their careers as much as they do at Rover's. Players leave Rovers as they approach their prime - at United it tends to be towards the end of their careers (with the odd exception like Ronaldo and Beckham).

I would argue that Shearer was as valuable a player as Ronaldo at the time each were sold - even allowing for the relative increase in transfer fees over time - United got far more than Rovers.

The other thing that will always mean that United get more for their star players when they sell them - is the profile of the club - playing in Champions League etc - in turn increases the players value as they are sold as more proven players than they could be at Rovers.

[den]

He looked out of his depth at RB for England, will not play RB for United if Smalling is fit and won't play CB either if Vidic and Rio are fit, not seen anything to change my mind about that of I'm honest. The big difference is that playing for United means that the media have hyped him up already, 20 million plus add ons was an excellent deal for both parties.

Starting for United in the CL tonight.

[philipl]

And made the first goal too.

[imy9]

Starting for United in the CL tonight.

Re read what I have said look at the starting 11, what I said still stands.

Looking good at RB vs a team fit to be in the English championship...

[Paul]

£16m - pocket money!!!!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/8882765/England-v-Spain-Phil-Jones-driven-by-painful-memory.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/8882540/Versatile-Phil-Jones-will-be-captain-of-England-declares-mentor-Sam-Allardyce.html

[John]

Any news on Gary Neville's house?

[Stuart]

It's amazing listening to commentators talk about Jones. Rovers will never get any credit for scouting him, teaching him, nurturing him and giving him his big chance.

Yet he didn't do anything until this season's community shield.

Football Out!