[Archived] Bin Laden dead

[adopted scouser]

Gazza turned up at the compound with a fishing rod, a chicken sandwich and a four pack of Stella

[RibbleValleyRover]

of course it safer ,its one less evil @#/? on planet earth.Why isnt it going to be safer?(do ya know something doc?).Of course someone else takes over and runs the scum machine,but if ,a big if , he is dead its one less scum bag.He is responsible for the death of thousands.

Not really Abbey. From all reports Al-Qaeda has a pretty flexible structure with cells operating independently and with a great deal of autonomy. Bin Laden was the mastermind behind the 9/11 attacks and the attacks before it (USS Cole, various embassy attacks around the world) but he had taken a back seat role since 9/11 and the invasion of Afghanistan.

It's great news that one of their key figures has been killed but the group isn't dead, far from it. The war on terror still continues.

[DE.]

This is a very complex problem. Killing Bin Laden is symbolic but it will have very little effect on the terror networks, other than increase the threat of another attack, these networks have evolved and they are not directly controlled by people like Bin Laden, the Al Qaeda ideology has been passed on to the other groups, if he had been caught in the late 90's then yes it would stopped the ideology from spreading.

We may have cut of the snakes head but the snake is most certainly not dead.

Killing Bin Laden and dumping his body in the sea will just reinforces his martyrdom within the nutters who follow his ideology and most like be used as a tool to recruit others.

Spot on.

Seems very strange to me that he was "buried at sea" so quickly, though.

An evil man, yes, but in recent years somewhat of a 'phantom menace' and his death now is only significant in a symbolic sense. It'll be good for Obama's popularity, that's for sure. The President who killed Bin Laden.

[Guest roverite1991]

Hope his grave DOES become a shrine so we can drown a few more.

[tony gale's mic]

I think when the dust settles there'll be some very serious questions raised about the role of Pakistan in this. They had the Mumbai perpetrators on their soil and now the world's most wanted man has been found a mile from one of their military academies. It's hard to believe that authorities weren't complicit in this, but whether this was on an individual level or an institutional level is something that remains to be seen.

[modes98]

This would have made a difference if it was done in the late 90s. Not now.

It is symbolic to the americans and also offers Obama a timely boost in the polls.

[SouthAussieRover]

It is symbolic to the americans and also offers Obama a timely boost in the polls.

I see what you did there.

I think the risks would outweigh the benefits though.

[AlanK]

This isn't really good news though, is it?

Bin Laden was an evil, evil man who obviously deserved everything that was coming to him and then some.

But this isn't going to make the world a safer place, it's going to do the exact opposite.

Got to disagree there.

Thats a bit like saying don`t hit back in a fight in case your opponent gets more wound up and fights back.

Don`t just stand around being a victim. Hit back and hit them harder.

[Rover Down Under]

I think he might be saying that because you can imagine this will have upset his followers, many of whom will now be looking to seek revenge?

That is also why we probably won't see any pictures of the body for a while, would rile up the nutters more. Pictures would also probably reveal the likely truth - that he shot himself before the Yanks did. We will never know the full story anyway, I'm pretty sure that MI6 would have had some part in the intelligence side, Cameron made a very subtle hint at this in his statement and 'American' and 'Intelligence' are an oxymoron.

And what is it with the U.S Special Forces, covert ops and helicopters?

I recall telling an American friend years ago that he was in the Northern Pakistan tribal region, probably right under the noses of the Pakistani Government in the last place anyone would look for him. Imagine my surprise when he turned up in the Northern Pakistan tribal region, right under the noses of the Pakistani Government in the last place anyone would look for him.

What are the odds on a Hollywood movie?

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Well,at least someone remembered to take the Bin out on a Bank holiday!

One looney gone,another 10 waiting to take his place...round and round we go.

[adopted scouser]

Well,at least someone remembered to take the Bin out on a Bank holiday!

Their having a minute's silence at Turf Moor

[Paul]

Surely it would have been far better for this man to stand trial, though it was never going to happen. I have to say I find the "celebratory" TV pictures quite disturbing.

[thenodrog]

Surely it would have been far better for this man to stand trial, though it was never going to happen. I have to say I find the "celebratory" TV pictures quite disturbing.

No way. What on earth would be the purpose of any trial? He was guilty of many atrocities and many many innocent deaths! You do have a strong but misguided sense of justice Paul. Any delay would simply have left the world open to all manner of terrorist actions, atrocities and blackmail carried out to influence the outcome. You saw how quickly the Spanish selected reverse gear after the Madrid bombing, how would that work out with other weak governments around the world if it were to be conducted on a much wider scale? Which country would want to stage any trial either? Best thing to do with any sworn enemy once you have the upper hand is to slit his throat. I doubt we'll hear any more about it but even the burial at sea doesn't carry a ring of truth but so what? He's dead and he wont care one way or the other how he has been disposed of?

btw I saw some celebrations in and around Blackburn on the evening of 9/11 that were equally disturbing too.

[tony gale's mic]

Got to disagree there.

Thats a bit like saying don`t hit back in a fight in case your opponent gets more wound up and fights back.

Don`t just stand around being a victim. Hit back and hit them harder.

But if you're in a fight and you hit your opponent hard enough, he's going to be injured some way. There's a very good chance it'll result in them not hitting you back. It's worth doing for that reason.

In this case, it's going to make absolutely no difference to the jihadist movement. There's arguably going to be some kind of reprisal. Who knows on what scale it'll be, people are speculating that immediate reprisals are likely (and there's certainly a lot precedence for this), but a bigger danger is that this could mobilise their forces for a much bigger scale attack.

Does this killing make the world safer? No - all reports in the years before his death indicated he'd become something of a peripheral figure and his presence was more symbolic than anything else. London, Madrid, Bali etc were all things he knew about but wasn't directly involved in the planning of.

Does this killing mean that some more good, innocent people will lose their lives? Almost certainly - Bin Laden will be seen as a martyr in the jihadi movement and reprisals are certain to occur. Whether it'll be dozens, hundreds or thousands depend on the size and scale of the reprisal(s). Certainly the bigger scale ones we won't know about for a while.

And that isn't, IMO, something to really celebrate.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Surely it would have been far better for this man to stand trial, though it was never going to happen. I have to say I find the "celebratory" TV pictures quite disturbing.

The immediate death of Bin Laden at the hands of the US will make him 'martyr' to the Islamic radicals. If he had instead been captured, put on trial in the US and executed that would have also made him a 'martyr' to the Islamic radicals.

Whatever action was taken you would see the same end result.

[thenodrog]

And that isn't, IMO, something to really celebrate.

A chap (poor bugger) on the radio today whose daughter was killed on 7/7 says he is happy Bin Laden is dead and will definitely be celebrating with a bottle of champagne tonight accompanied by quiet reflection on his daughters life and times. I'd not deny him a drop of that fizz.

[AlanK]

But if you're in a fight and you hit your opponent hard enough, he's going to be injured some way. There's a very good chance it'll result in them not hitting you back. It's worth doing for that reason.

In this case, it's going to make absolutely no difference to the jihadist movement. There's arguably going to be some kind of reprisal. Who knows on what scale it'll be, people are speculating that immediate reprisals are likely (and there's certainly a lot precedence for this), but a bigger danger is that this could mobilise their forces for a much bigger scale attack.

Does this killing make the world safer? No - all reports in the years before his death indicated he'd become something of a peripheral figure and his presence was more symbolic than anything else. London, Madrid, Bali etc were all things he knew about but wasn't directly involved in the planning of.

Does this killing mean that some more good, innocent people will lose their lives? Almost certainly - Bin Laden will be seen as a martyr in the jihadi movement and reprisals are certain to occur. Whether it'll be dozens, hundreds or thousands depend on the size and scale of the reprisal(s). Certainly the bigger scale ones we won't know about for a while.

And that isn't, IMO, something to really celebrate.

I know where you`re coming from but we can`t let them walk all over us without retailiation for fear of reprisals.

[tony gale's mic]

A chap (poor bugger) on the radio today whose daughter was killed on 7/7 says he is happy Bin Laden is dead and will definitely be celebrating with a bottle of champagne tonight accompanied by quiet reflection on his daughters life and times. I'd not deny him a drop of that fizz.

He's using it to celebrate his daughter's life as much as anything. He has a big personal attachment to what the man did which gives him a totally different perspective to the rest of us. I wouldn't deny him that either.

But for the rest of us, his daughter's life is worth as much as anyone else who might die at the hands of jihadists, or indeed is worth as much as the hundreds of thousands who have died as a result of the war in Iraq.

[Paul]

No way. What on earth would be the purpose of any trial? He was guilty of many atrocities and many many innocent deaths! You do have a strong but misguided sense of justice Paul. Any delay would simply have left the world open to all manner of terrorist actions, atrocities and blackmail carried out to influence the outcome. You saw how quickly the Spanish selected reverse gear after the Madrid bombing, how would that work out with other weak governments around the world if it were to be conducted on a much wider scale? Which country would want to stage any trial either? Best thing to do with any sworn enemy once you have the upper hand is to slit his throat. I doubt we'll hear any more about it but even the burial at sea doesn't carry a ring of truth but so what? He's dead and he wont care one way or the other how he has been disposed of?

btw I saw some celebrations in and around Blackburn on the evening of 9/11 that were equally disturbing too.

Precisely the view I would expect from an individual who both approves of and has used violence against others.

I'm not sure I have a strong sense of justice but I know you have a very misguided one.

The point about putting him on trial, please note I stated it would never have happened obviously for the reasons you state, is it raises the West above those we accuse of terrorism. Entering a foreign country to execute an individual is a magnificent example of democracy and freedom at it's best.

[Cheeky Sidders]

Well I'm glad he's dead, even though there will now be reprisals. He was a worthless piece of siht who deliberately targeted civilians and inspired many others to do the same. At the end of the day, he had it coming and I can't help but feel he was despatched a little too cleanly. Was it really a surprise to anyone that he was living a comfortable life in Pakistan? I think it's telling that the Americans went ahead with the operation without telling the Pakistani government what they were going to do (clearly didn't trust them not to tip him off) and there seems to be an air of resignation and shoulder shrugging from the Pakistani government that he was living on their doorstep.

If his body has indeed ben dumped at sea my only wish is it was close to the outflow of untreated sewage.

[JAL]

How long have the Pakistani's been looking after him for ?

[AlanK]

Precisely the view I would expect from an individual who both approves of and has used violence against others.

I'm not sure I have a strong sense of justice but I know you have a very misguided one.

The point about putting him on trial, please note I stated it would never have happened obviously for the reasons you state, is it raises the West above those we accuse of terrorism. Entering a foreign country to execute an individual is a magnificent example of democracy and freedom at it's best.

Paul, I agree with your posts 99.9% of the time. However, on this occasion I disagree. These are people you just can not reason with. They are willing to blow themselves up. Setting a western example would make no difference with these folk. Infact they would probably class it as weak if they even noticed our way at all.

Good riddance

[roverandout]

nothing is going to change, most extremist muslims, around here and the world over, will still be intent on world domination. They are hatred filled people who, despite living in the west, hate everything that the west stands for. I am talking about the extremists here not the peace loving muslims, so no offence intended if any muslims are reading this.

[rebelmswar]

I hope the #### went out in a world of pain.

Sadly a double tap to the mellon ( as everything else was hiding behind a wife) is pretty painless.

[tashor]

The world - the popular uprisings in northern africa and the middle east - has moved on and started to make the movement inspired by bin laden an unpleasant but irrelevant historical episode.............

We will continue to have to deal with the clean-up operation and many lives have still to be lost but the question that arises tonight and over the near future is to pakistan and the likes of saudia arabia..........

Are you going to remain part of the problem or to evolve and join the civilised world ???