Summer 2011 Transfer Window - Part 3.

[brian_gallagher85]

Some people labelling Venkys liars need a reality check. They haven't stated publicly stated who they're going to buy let alone refusing to buy. The only names mentioned are from Nicko et al who are reporting what they've heard from certain sources in and around the club. Nothing official has happened either way as of yet and pre season hasn't even begun.

I'm not saying that we're going to qualify for the Champions League but for the love of god wait until we actually kick a ball in anger before coming out with the same old retoric.

[howzat]

ive said it before if the manager is'nt in charge of transfers he should resign. and i wish people would stop saying how hard it is to sign world class players, Cisse,Piatti,miranda,Rondon,Witsel none of these are world class players and all of them are playing for small clubs at the moment.

[bluebruce]

exactly, what world do these idiots live in? theres no other reason why a top player would come here apart from wages, i dont buy into these 'we dont want to bankrupt the club' baloney, that wont happen,

Will it not?!? Do we have some sort of special immunity to bankruptcy that none of knows about? Some of our fans need to be more realistic and accept that the Portsmouth or Leeds scenario is very possible if financial prudence isn't exercised. Maybe then they'll have a bit more patience with our transfer dealings. It can't just be "Me me, I want, I want, now!". There are dire consequences to overspending, and similar consequences come from misspending over time.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

I would imagine that our owners are getting used to the reality of modern football. The current problem has to be wages - we were already operating at an unhealthy wages to income ratio - without the Venky's plan to grow our income gaining traction (lack of a shirt sponsor would seem to indicate this) they have some difficult decisions to make. Just possibly they are starting to realise that, despite their good intentions, increasing Rovers income isn't as easy as they thought - without that growth in income they would be daft to saddle Rovers with players being paid 70-80k a week (no matter how good). Having a transfer kitty is one thing - but a £10m player on 80k per week - actually costs twice in much in wages (over a 5 year contract) than his fee.

Though we may miss out on our number 1 targets - far better to make the agents sweat and get the salaries down to something more manageable in the medium to long term.

[imy9]

Nicko- 2 questions:

Are we any nearer to appointing a DOF or Chairman?

Are we any nearer to a new sponsor?

Both will affect the money we have coming in and how we use it.

[philipl]

The most telling Nicko comment for me is

nicko, on 03 July 2011 - 11:53 AM, said:

You have money to spend for the first time in years and have no great idea of how to spend it. Of course, the market is hard. But if you had experts in the field on your side you would have a better chance.

.. But I thought Kentaro are supposed to be our expert advisors and on our side.. ?

This post has been edited by Veevs: A minute ago

Think about the position of the "expert" which is the role Kentaro were asked to be.

The expert negotiated his terms of engagement and agreed what he is expected to do. He gave his expert advice in a collegiate setting and on agreement of the expert's plan then got invited to turn great ideas into reality.

Suppose then the client changed his mind and several bunches of experts appear just as the first expert is at maximum exposure of using his expertise and contacts.

The only side the first expert is on from that point onwards is his own in protecting his contractual position, his contacts and his reputation. Whether the client's business (Rovers) gets what it needs is incidental at this point.

The client (Venky's) might not yet know it but he has hung himself and totally compromised his business (Rovers).

The client (Venky's) is unaware that he has hung himself but there is a huge difference in consequences between having expert people who are employed and therefore usually have the best interests of the Rovers business at heart (these are the people Venky's systematically lost through their own naivete) and having contract experts to do mission critical work whom the client thinks can be treated as casually as they treated their employees.

Right now Venky's have got themselves the worst of all worlds and the football business notoriously doesn't take prisoners when fools step in. This last week will no doubt have been a horribly expensive experience for the Venky's and whilst there might be lots of money available for the Rovers, none of it has yet been spent for the benefit of Rovers as a football club.

The downwards slide from the top half finish under Allardyce/ Williams/ Walker Trust continues AT THE TIME OF WRITING.

Over to Mrs D to sort it out. She has at least has some family cash to throw at the problem but she has lost all her best people including I suspect her relationship with Huber.

[John]

I would imagine that our owners are getting used to the reality of modern football. The current problem has to be wages - we were already operating at an unhealthy wages to income ratio - without the Venky's plan to grow our income gaining traction (lack of a shirt sponsor would seem to indicate this) they have some difficult decisions to make. Just possibly they are starting to realise that, despite their good intentions, increasing Rovers income isn't as easy as they thought - without that growth in income they would be daft to saddle Rovers with players being paid 70-80k a week (no matter how good). Having a transfer kitty is one thing - but a £10m player on 80k per week - actually costs twice in much in wages (over a 5 year contract) than his fee.

Though we may miss out on our number 1 targets - far better to make the agents sweat and get the salaries down to something more manageable in the medium to long term.

Good post and correct.

[PAFELL]

Fees, wages and agent's fees are proving very troublesome. I think the owners are finding that out.

Nothing is ever simple, straightforward or cheap in the transfer market.

So whatever sum of money you may have set aside can be very quickly wiped out...

Significant times ahead here.

Venkys must now realise that owning a football club costs more than they originally thought. They could also be confused about the wages a footballer gets and the wages in India.

It would not surprise me if Venkys chose to find a buyer for the club. But at the moment they are running around like headless chickens.

[John]

Venkys must now realise that owning a football club costs more than they originally thought. They could also be confused about the wages a footballer gets and the wages in India.

It would not surprise me if Venkys chose to find a buyer for the club. But at the moment they are running around like headless chickens.

In terms of the clubs finances, I think someone may be appointed (internally) to help oversee this function.

[47er]

Venkys must now realise that owning a football club costs more than they originally thought. They could also be confused about the wages a footballer gets and the wages in India.

It would not surprise me if Venkys chose to find a buyer for the club. But at the moment they are running around like headless chickens.

Venkys and Mrs Desai in particular do not strike me as the kind who give up easily. I live in hope that they will get a grip on the situation before too long. They have much to learn.

However they said they were here for the long haul and I believe them.

[PAFELL]

In terms of the clubs finances, I think someone may be appointed (internally) to help oversee this function.

Can you clarify this?

Venkys and Mrs Desai in particular do not strike me as the kind who give up easily. I live in hope that they will get a grip on the situation before too long. They have much to learn.

However they said they were here for the long haul and I believe them.

Sadly so do I

[47er]

Some people labelling Venkys liars need a reality check. They haven't stated publicly stated who they're going to buy let alone refusing to buy. The only names mentioned are from Nicko et al who are reporting what they've heard from certain sources in and around the club. Nothing official has happened either way as of yet and pre season hasn't even begun.

I'm not saying that we're going to qualify for the Champions League but for the love of god wait until we actually kick a ball in anger before coming out with the same old retoric.

I see the deadline for judging is being pushed back further and further!

[Exiled in Toronto]

They could also be confused about the wages a footballer gets and the wages in India.

Words fail me

[philipl]

In terms of the clubs finances, I think someone may be appointed (internally) to help oversee this function.

There is a perfectly good main board Director of Finance in Martin Goodman at the club already.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

nicko your saying money is a major issue, do you meen the wages and how much players are costing is way more than venkys expected

????????? Do we have 50 million to spend or 50 pounds ???????????

[Exiled in Toronto]

I see the deadline for judging is being pushed back further and further!

Since the only thing that matters is not getting relegated, I can see little point in judging them now, tomorrow or much before the fulltime whistle of the last 'must win' game of next season.

[Hughesy]

There is a perfectly good main board Director of Finance in Martin Goodman at the club already.

Not for much longer. Wasnt he supposed to be on the way out too?

[Parsonblue]

There is a perfectly good main board Director of Finance in Martin Goodman at the club already.

Rumour has it that Venky's are bringing in someone from one of their other companies to run the finances. It will be interesting to see if the rumour proves correct or not but at the moment Martin Goodman is the last man standing in terms of the old executive board.

[Iceman]

not much investment, in the last few years anyway. Im not bothered, if we sign freebies and cheap players. I'm very much use to it.

[Black Burn]

Alan Nixon said the club is in a mess, and that people need to make the decisions. He did not single out anyone or identify anyone, and almost everyone here jumped into conclusion and started blaming Venkys and the Rao brothers.

Yes, Alan Nixon said they found the players expensive and are reluctant to sign them. But he never said why - was it wages? Transfer fees? Or did they feel the risk was not worth it for an untested player in the Premiership? No, people here start assuming it's because of transfer kitty (we have 16 million from Jones! Why can't we just buy 16 million worth of players). Please realize that things are in actuality not as simple as people here make them out to be.

And Alan Nixon has never said the indecision was due to the Rao brothers jumping in and wanting their own players. So why are people assuming that's the case and already passing out judgement on the two brothers? What's with the Venkys out mentality now? We don't know what's exactly going on behind the scenes, even if Alan Nixon said it was bad, but to jump around pointing fingers and driving out the owners is premature and immature. We do not know who the culprit is, let's not point fingers and making judgements.

If fans can change owners as they wish, we will never be able to find new owners because they'll be ###### off at the unreasonable demands of fans. It sounds like most of you here are saying "hey, it doesn't look like we're going to get this player" or "hey, it doesn't look like we're going to get any transfers despite having 2 months left" and so "it's definitely Venkys' fault - Venkys out NOW!" Come on, look at what you're saying before posting it. You sound like kids not getting what you want from a candy store and then demanding that the store owner get out and stop selling candy.

And it's premature to call Venkys liars when there's 2 months left. So if they do buy a player in the next 2 weeks or in August, who becomes the liar?

Think before condemning people next time.

[Fife Rover]

We are Blackburn Rovers for Christ's sake not Barcelona. If we want good players to come here we have to pay a premium, at least for the first one or two until the world realises that the Venkys are serious. If they are not prepared to pay that premium we will not get the players.

That is a fact.

That is a fact Al; a very sad one but nevertheless a fact of todays football conditions. If the owners can't get used to that fact then they might as well sell-up and go back whence they came. That is another sad fact that gives me no pleasure to even contemplate, but we cannot ignore or escape from the truth.

[philipl]

Alan Nixon said the club is in a mess, and that people need to make the decisions. He did not single out anyone or identify anyone, and almost everyone here jumped into conclusion and started blaming Venkys and the Rao brothers.

Yes, Alan Nixon said they found the players expensive and are reluctant to sign them. But he never said why - was it wages? Transfer fees? Or did they feel the risk was not worth it for an untested player in the Premiership? No, people here start assuming it's because of transfer kitty (we have 16 million from Jones! Why can't we just buy 16 million worth of players). Please realize that things are in actuality not as simple as people here make them out to be.

And Alan Nixon has never said the indecision was due to the Rao brothers jumping in and wanting their own players. So why are people assuming that's the case and already passing out judgement on the two brothers? What's with the Venkys out mentality now? We don't know what's exactly going on behind the scenes, even if Alan Nixon said it was bad, but to jump around pointing fingers and driving out the owners is premature and immature. We do not know who the culprit is, let's not point fingers and making judgements.

If fans can change owners as they wish, we will never be able to find new owners because they'll be ###### off at the unreasonable demands of fans. It sounds like most of you here are saying "hey, it doesn't look like we're going to get this player" or "hey, it doesn't look like we're going to get any transfers despite having 2 months left" and so "it's definitely Venkys' fault - Venkys out NOW!" Come on, look at what you're saying before posting it. You sound like kids not getting what you want from a candy store and then demanding that the store owner get out and stop selling candy.

And it's premature to call Venkys liars when there's 2 months left. So if they do buy a player in the next 2 weeks or in August, who becomes the liar?

Think before condemning people next time.

I think you need to re-read Nicko's comments from last Tuesday again.

[tonyoz]

The most telling Nicko comment for me is

nicko, on 03 July 2011 - 11:53 AM, said:

You have money to spend for the first time in years and have no great idea of how to spend it. Of course, the market is hard. But if you had experts in the field on your side you would have a better chance.

.. But I thought Kentaro are supposed to be our expert advisors and on our side.. ?

This post has been edited by Veevs: A minute ago

Think about the position of the "expert" which is the role Kentaro were asked to be.

The expert negotiated his terms of engagement and agreed what he is expected to do. He gave his expert advice in a collegiate setting and on agreement of the expert's plan then got invited to turn great ideas into reality.

Suppose then the client changed his mind and several bunches of experts appear just as the first expert is at maximum exposure of using his expertise and contacts.

The only side the first expert is on from that point onwards is his own in protecting his contractual position, his contacts and his reputation. Whether the client's business (Rovers) gets what it needs is incidental at this point.

The client (Venky's) might not yet know it but he has hung himself and totally compromised his business (Rovers).

The client (Venky's) is unaware that he has hung himself but there is a huge difference in consequences between having expert people who are employed and therefore usually have the best interests of the Rovers business at heart (these are the people Venky's systematically lost through their own naivete) and having contract experts to do mission critical work whom the client thinks can be treated as casually as they treated their employees.

Right now Venky's have got themselves the worst of all worlds and the football business notoriously doesn't take prisoners when fools step in. This last week will no doubt have been a horribly expensive experience for the Venky's and whilst there might be lots of money available for the Rovers, none of it has yet been spent for the benefit of Rovers as a football club.

The downwards slide from the top half finish under Allardyce/ Williams/ Walker Trust continues AT THE TIME OF WRITING.

Over to Mrs D to sort it out. She has at least has some family cash to throw at the problem but she has lost all her best people including I suspect her relationship with Huber.

Philipl I reckon you are wasted in your current profession. Now that J K Rowling has moved on there is a gap in the fantasy fiction niche. You could make a real killing I think.

[Andy]

The most telling Nicko comment for me is

nicko, on 03 July 2011 - 11:53 AM, said:

You have money to spend for the first time in years and have no great idea of how to spend it. Of course, the market is hard. But if you had experts in the field on your side you would have a better chance.

.. But I thought Kentaro are supposed to be our expert advisors and on our side.. ?

This post has been edited by Veevs: A minute ago

Think about the position of the "expert" which is the role Kentaro were asked to be.

The expert negotiated his terms of engagement and agreed what he is expected to do. He gave his expert advice in a collegiate setting and on agreement of the expert's plan then got invited to turn great ideas into reality.

Suppose then the client changed his mind and several bunches of experts appear just as the first expert is at maximum exposure of using his expertise and contacts.

The only side the first expert is on from that point onwards is his own in protecting his contractual position, his contacts and his reputation. Whether the client's business (Rovers) gets what it needs is incidental at this point.

The client (Venky's) might not yet know it but he has hung himself and totally compromised his business (Rovers).

The client (Venky's) is unaware that he has hung himself but there is a huge difference in consequences between having expert people who are employed and therefore usually have the best interests of the Rovers business at heart (these are the people Venky's systematically lost through their own naivete) and having contract experts to do mission critical work whom the client thinks can be treated as casually as they treated their employees.

Right now Venky's have got themselves the worst of all worlds and the football business notoriously doesn't take prisoners when fools step in. This last week will no doubt have been a horribly expensive experience for the Venky's and whilst there might be lots of money available for the Rovers, none of it has yet been spent for the benefit of Rovers as a football club.

The downwards slide from the top half finish under Allardyce/ Williams/ Walker Trust continues AT THE TIME OF WRITING.

Over to Mrs D to sort it out. She has at least has some family cash to throw at the problem but she has lost all her best people including I suspect her relationship with Huber.

Thanks, makes sense and is quite clear - getting sick of all this crypic and non-committal stuff.

[Black Burn]

I think you need to re-read Nicko's comments from last Tuesday again.

I did and I did not see the word "Rao brothers" in there at all.

He said committee. He didn't specifically mention Venkys, but I guess we can all infer that it's Venkys since he said it is not possible for a club to be run from India.

But did he in any way mention the Rao brothers at all?

Alan Nixon also said we've been linked to many players and that no bids have been made for them. But did he say the Venkys promise to bid for those specific players? Have the Venkys themselves stepped out to declare that they are bidding for these players? If they didn't, how does that make them liars?

I will admit that maybe Venkys are to be blamed for the mess. But I stand by my opinion that it's premature to start pointing fingers and wanting them out because we don't know the EXACT nature of the problem. I'm pretty sure Alan Nixon did not elaborate to us the exact nature nor did he specifically single out anybody.

Alan Nixon also didn't mention Kean at all - and people are assuming Kean isn't in charge of the transfers or won't get his targets approved. He only mentioned how it took forever and would go in circles if decisions are just going to be passed around the committee and go through endless discussions - I don't remember him mentioning how powerless Kean supposedly is.

If I'm mistaken, please let me know.