[Archived] Steve Kean Thread (Poll reset after Stoke game)

[Mercer]

Yes I agree with this. The only stronger area this season is the flair side but that is it.

Really ?

And what has that flair delivered ?

[Hekla]

Really ?

And what has that flair delivered ?

It hasn't delivered anything, I was pointing out that we have more flair players in the side compared to last season, so it is an improvement in some ways.

[onlyonejackwalker]

"To sack a Manager after 4 games is just stupid, especially after letting him spend all our money on his signings."

The problem with your arithmatic being that you have forgotten about last season for some strange reason. How is it that those advocating 'give him more time' think it is perfectly acceptable to write off all the dross served up last season under Kean? Amazing how much support this no-mark still has amongst our fans.

Agreed to sack a manager after just 4 games is stupid. But forgetting all his other matches is also plain stupid.

Sacking a manager after 25 PL league games means all and sundry have had time to properly assess relevant abilities. The proof is in the pudding. Ince was given 17 games only, lest you forget.

As for the comment regarding the new signings. Give me strength! For the last time, these are not world beaters, just average journeymen at this level. Sorry to pee on anyone's bonfire, but these new signings are not going to frighten other teams, nor make a huge difference to our points tally. Our squad has been improved, but our first team does not look any stronger to me than last time round.

We need to be organised, committed, confident, resilient and playing fully as a team. We need a manager who can get the best out of the players at their disposal. That man ain't Kean.

Get shut of the lying idiot and at last unite the fans.

[matty1875]

.....which works out to be 20 points over a 38 game season. And that's you twisting the facts to make them sound better!!!

I did not say I was twisting the facts to sound better, that is still a terrible record but certain people talk about his record by the a certain 19 games snapshot of his time in charge to back up their arguement. All I think is that he needs to be given a certain amount of time this season to work it out. 7 games is fair, if after that we are still rock bottom or in the bottom 3 then it is time to get rid. This is just my opinion. As I mentioned before I am not a Kean fan and I think he should not have got the job in the first place. However he is our manager like it or not, just spent our transfer budget, trying to play good football, brought in some good players so based on that he deserves a bit more time. Is he a good enough manager? Honestly I doubt it but sacking him after 4 games makes no sense and throws the club into more uncertainty.

[LeChuck]

Don't see the risk in changing managers, I have to say.

The easiest analogy I can think of is playing a game of dice. We rolled a 1 when we appointed Steve Kean. If we get chance to roll again then what have we got to lose?

[Guest Rovers4Good]

I have been reading the many posts about Steve Kean and I must say that I am one of those who voted to give him more time. Now I am one of quite a few Rovers fans who also agree to give him more time (For a start all my family, people I sit with at the games think he should be given a bit more time). I would say most of these are the more older and conservative Rovers fans, 50+ year olds who have been going down Ewood since the 60's and who do not have access to this message board; the wise and intelligent people some would say but that is a matter of opinion. They have not been fed the jargon that some posters have put on here on what he has allegedly done or not, which agent is involved, who spoke to who, who did this and that. I am not interested on how he got the job, what has been said behind the scenes, if he is a drunk or not, etc.

I am looking at the facts on the pitch. To sack a Manager after 4 games is just stupid, especially after letting him spend all our money on his signings. The press would laugh at us and pundits would also call it a joke. At least give him time to work with his new buys. Let’s take the last 4 results of last season, 8 points and at a time when we needed those most which shows he can work under pressure. Also I was at the Wolves game, was that not the best half of football by Rovers in recent times?? I thought we were exceptional. Some of the stuff we are trying to play is exciting and I now actually look forward to going to games as I think we have the potential to be excellent, back to the days of Duff, Dunn and Jansen or before that the Dalglish era. If we could take a penalty then we would have 4 points from 4, if we had a fit defender for the Wolves game we would have drawn if not won that.

That said I do have issues with Kean, why did we have any fit defenders for the Wolves game? Why does he seem to be ultra positive after performances when we are not that good? Yes praise us when we are great but after Fulham, bar 20 minutes in the first half, come on that was average. Also letting Emerton go was puzzling, at least wait till January so we could replace him, timing did seem strange. Some of substitutions are not the best, Fitness is questionable (Goodwillie having cramp in his hamstrings, how unfit must that kid be, you would not see that down Sunday League from men who have been out on the lash the night before). I personally think he needs to be more honest with the fans, be more straight talking, tells us when we are rubbish, we all know when we are. The lack of a midfield general is a worry, but we say that year on year about Rovers, light in central midfield.

From an outsider looking in it would be a joke to sack him now but we must see an improvement on the pitch in terms of both results and performance. I would give him the next two games. If we lose the next two then he would have to go based on its then City at home and we will struggle to get anything out of that. At the moment he seems to be very unlucky manager but there is only a certain amount of time you can be unlucky for until it is time to get the chop. I don't like Steve Kean, but I can see what he is trying to do footballing wise, now is not the time to march but if results continue then I will have to agree with the sack Kean mob.

Matty you are very much allowed an opinion and yes there are some fans who say give him more time and like i've said in so many other posts about Kean, he really doesn't seem to have the grasp that other top flight managers have. Yes there are plenty of them who try and BS you into thinking everythings great but let's look at the facts, Keans record speaks for itself and he's lost more games than he's won and drawn, he nearly took us down last season from a top half position we were in when he took over and the squad is still very bear even after the transfer window which rings alarm bells. He is still making us play negative football and relies on players that are now well past their sell by date or are not good enough to cut it at the top level.

Lastly, when your manager comes out after a game that you got absolutely battered and says that he thoguht we played well then the man needs a personality transplant.

I agree that sacking him could come at a better time like before the transfer window but if we wait any longer then come Xmas and at the bottom of the league i really don't Kean is the man who could turn that around.

[booth]

Can any of the "give him more time" fans answer the following question with a straight yes or no?

Do you think Steve Kean is the man to take us forward?

Before you answer, do consider that he would need to turn our poor form around. He would need to be able to deliver consistently good results to keep us in the league. He will need to bring in quality signings to compete with the rest of the Premier League. He would also need to have the savvy to develop the club for the future as previous managers have done.

[philipl]

OK to the give Kean a chance posters, how many points away from safety before the sack?

[jim mk2]

As Lawence said "I don't see why they sacked Allardyce in the first place.

If / when Rovers are relegated the departure of Sam Allardyce will be seen as the principal cause and its effects similar to the sacking of Alan Curbishley at Charlton some years before. The south London club have never recovered since. In view of subsequent events at Ewood I defy anyone to justify Sam's departure.

[Neal]

I don't understand the "give him more time" argument... Why? So he can potentially go from doing very bad job to a passable job?

I wouldn't mind if it was someone worthy of the fans patience such as Shearer or Hughes but Kean has no connection with the club and is not there on merit.

These people voting to give him more time, deep down, either are avoiding the problem or are just as delusional as Steve Kean. YOU/WE deserve better.

[matty1875]

OK to the give Kean a chance posters, how many points away from safety before the sack?

Simple, give him 7 games, 5th of a season, in the bottom 3 then sack, if not keep. Look again after the next 5 games with the same theory. This gives time for the board to line up a replacement if we need to sack him.

[Guest Rovers4Good]

OK to the give Kean a chance posters, how many points away from safety before the sack?

40

[A cup of beans]

That's because it's a totally meaningless question. There's no point to it.

All these negative posters get me down.

.

meaningless question ? how ? realistic replacements ?

curbishley ? seriously ? come on!

[booth]

I don't understand the "give him more time" argument... Why? So he can potentially go from doing very bad job to a passable job?

If I understand it correctly it is because they don't believe that Venkys will put anyone better in charge.

Or they fancy him.

meaningless question ? how ? realistic replacements ?

curbishley ? seriously ? come on!

You don't believe Curbishley would be better or you don't believe he would come here.

I can't believe it's the first so considering Curbishley was very close to taking the Burnley job, you must not think much of the club.

[DE.]

meaningless question ? how ? realistic replacements ?

curbishley ? seriously ? come on!

???

Curbishley is an actual manager with a proven track record, Kean is not. He'd be a HUGE improvement. Not saying he'd be anything close to my first choice, but if it's between him and Kean then he's obviously a superior manager.

[jim mk2]

If I understand it correctly it is because they don't believe that Venkys will put anyone better in charge.

There's always the new manager "bounce" - remember the false dawn of Kean's first few games in charge ? Even Ince won his first game. Teams without managers also often do well after the departure of a failed boss. The point is, we need a win desperately and soon to get our season going or like West Ham we could be stuck near the bottom for the rest of the season. After 1 point out 12 against some of the PL's lesser teams do you see Kean as the man to lead the revival ? I certainly don't.

[philipl]

Simple, give him 7 games, 5th of a season, in the bottom 3 then sack, if not keep. Look again after the next 5 games with the same theory. This gives time for the board to line up a replacement if we need to sack him.

So relegation doesn't come into your calculation and the amount of catch-up the next manager needs to do is irrelevant?

We have had the easiest starting set of PL fixtures ever yet are sitting a point and a goal from safety.

Mick McCarthy, Eck, Moyes and Jol have destroyed Kean tactically and the next four at Ewood are Wenger, Mancini, Redknapp and Villas-Boas. Seriously, three points, six points, ten points behind 17th- how big a relegation deficit before you get rid?

Or to put it another way, I accept given equal managerial talent, this Rovers squad is not the worst in the PL. But are they at least say 6 points over 26 games better than the three worst squads if you give Kean 12 games before he is inevitably sacked? If you cannot uncontestably answer they are definitely better than all three worse squad/managerial combinations by that margin, giving Kean a chance has got us relegated.

Frankly, nobody has the right to take that risk with our club which is why Kean has already totally out-stayed his welcome. Every minute he is in post is a minute of potential Premier League survival time wasted.

[jim mk2]

You don't believe Curbishley would be better or you don't believe he would come here.

I can't believe it's the first so considering Curbishley was very close to taking the Burnley job, you must not think much of the club.

Curbishley has been out of the game for a long time - does he want or need to return ? He's also London - and I'm not sure he's desperate enough to manage a struggling nawvern club.

[BPF]

So relegation doesn't come into your calculation and the amount of catch-up the next manager needs to do is irrelevant?

We have had the easiest starting set of PL fixtures ever yet are sitting a point and a goal from safety.

Mick McCarthy, Eck, Moyes and Jol have destroyed Kean tactically and the next four at Ewood are Wenger, Mancini, Redknapp and Villas-Boas. Seriously, three points, six points, ten points behind 17th- how big a relegation deficit before you get rid?

Or to put it another way, I accept given equal managerial talent, this Rovers squad is not the worst in the PL. But are they at least say 6 points over 26 games better than the three worst squads if you give Kean 12 games before he is inevitably sacked? If you cannot uncontestably answer they are definitely better than all three worse squad/managerial combinations by that margin, giving Kean a chance has got us relegated.

Frankly, nobody has the right to take that risk with our club which is why Kean has already totally out-stayed his welcome. Every minute he is in post is a minute of potential Premier League survival time wasted.

This should be framed and nailed onto the Blackburn End.

[booth]

There's always the new manager "bounce" - remember the false dawn of Kean's first few games in charge ? Even Ince won his first game. Teams without managers also often do well after the departure of a failed boss. The point is, we need a win desperately and soon to get our season going or like West Ham we could be stuck near the bottom for the rest of the season. After 1 point out 12 against some of the PL's lesser teams do you see Kean as the man to lead the revival ? I certainly don't.

You're preaching to the converted, I totally agree. Even if he managed to win a few matches it doesn't mean for the rest of the season we aren't in desperate trouble. As I said earlier, do the "give him more time" fans really believe he's the man to take us forward?

Curbishley has been out of the game for a long time - does he want or need to return ? He's also London - and I'm not sure he's desperate enough to manage a struggling nawvern club.

That is true but I was just responding to Zac's ambiguous (damn auto correct) post that seemed to suggest he either wasn't good enough or wouldn't come here. I have it on good authority that when Coyle left he was close to signing for Burnley then did a complete U-turn. And he's certainly better than Kean, even though he wouldn't be on my list personally.

[philipl]

If I understand it correctly it is because they don't believe that Venkys will put anyone better in charge.

There is plenty of chat that Zahavi is already looking for Rovers' new manager.

Grant would be a huge risk but better than Kean. Virtually anybody else Zahavi brings in would be a massive improvement.

Don't know whether Zahavi is simply following his football nose or is acting on request.

Nothing unusual in this- Kean is comfortably favourite to get shotfirst at the bookies so quite a few agents will be lining up their offerings this early in the season.

Give it another say five games and at least 3 points plus GD away from safety and those same agents will not be lining up good managers for a relegation pass. Instead some pretty hefty staying up bonuses will be demanded for poorer managers.

Sadly, Raos are massochists who enjoy learning the hard expensive and painful way.

[Miker]

I did not say I was twisting the facts to sound better, that is still a terrible record but certain people talk about his record by the a certain 19 games snapshot of his time in charge to back up their arguement. All I think is that he needs to be given a certain amount of time this season to work it out. 7 games is fair, if after that we are still rock bottom or in the bottom 3 then it is time to get rid. This is just my opinion. As I mentioned before I am not a Kean fan and I think he should not have got the job in the first place. However he is our manager like it or not, just spent our transfer budget, trying to play good football, brought in some good players so based on that he deserves a bit more time. Is he a good enough manager? Honestly I doubt it but sacking him after 4 games makes no sense and throws the club into more uncertainty.

Fact is, there's a large number of fans who have been watching games week in, week out and we're seeing the same tactical problems every time. For every 10 minutes we play good football, we play 35 minutes of rubbish. It doesn't make sense to me to say that we're playing good football now, so he should be given a chance. Blackpool played great football, but they were still relegated, it's not enough. John Williams wrote in his last directors' report for the club that our biggest threat is relegation. We simply can't take that risk with Kean because he has shown his inability to set up the team correctly from day one.

I couldn't care less that he's had to deal with injuries or team gelling. He had a full pre-season to prepare, and if he was unable to get the team fit and ready then the blame lies with him unfortunately. Sam had to deal with the same problems when he was manager, but he still managed to grind out results and made do by putting players into positions they hadn't played before. He threw Samba up front, Jones in midfield, moved Olsson to the wing, played Pedersen in the middle and so on. I could go on and on, but I can't be bothered. Kean simply doesn't have the qualities that make a great manager and there's no point of persisting with him.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Curbishley has been out of the game for a long time - does he want or need to return ? He's also London - and I'm not sure he's desperate enough to manage a struggling nawvern club.

If I recall Curbishley did apply and may have even been interviewed for the Rovers job in the past. From what I gather he wants to get back into management, true he has been out of the game for a while but that could have been due to the legal battle and payoff he received when he left West Ham.

Any managerial appointment is a gamble but he has a track record of being able to manage in this league, he's led two clubs to survival and had one pushing for Europe on a small budget.

He ticks pretty much all the boxes, as would Hughes though he would never come back.

Of course he might turn us down but I don't see the harm in asking Curbs if he is interested if the job suddenly becomes available.

[Miker]

I would definitely take Curbishley. He wouldn't be on my wish list, but he is leaps and bounds better than Kean.

[booth]

There is plenty of chat that Zahavi is already looking for Rovers' new manager.

Grant would be a huge risk but better than Kean. Virtually anybody else Zahavi brings in would be a massive improvement.

Don't know whether Zahavi is simply following his football nose or is acting on request.

Nothing unusual in this- Kean is comfortably favourite to get shotfirst at the bookies so quite a few agents will be lining up their offerings this early in the season.

Give it another say five games and at least 3 points plus GD away from safety and those same agents will not be lining up good managers for a relegation pass. Instead some pretty hefty staying up bonuses will be demanded for poorer managers.

Sadly, Raos are massochists who enjoy learning the hard expensive and painful way.

Some fans don't understand that agents will be regularly sending faxes to clubs with struggling managers. They also simply don't understand how lucrative PL contracts are. I had an argument with a guy in a pub convinced that Allardyce wasn't on much - he believed that right up till he got sacked and the details came out. £1.5 million for getting sacked.

How many managers could pass up a multi-million pound offer to manage a club? And that's whether you're successful or not.