[Archived] Protest March 17.09.11

[chris]

I am glad Oztheman phoned Steve, because I it was good for Kean to face that.

Have to say he gave you a dam good answer too.

"you say my tactics are bad, I put Olssen on against Arsenal, game won".

Best question was still the target budget one.

[RovertheHill]

People dislike Kean because of his results first and foremost. Everything else takes a distant second.

Whilst there are many who fit this profile (myself included) there are also many for which this is simply not true, and if Rovers were to win the next 10 matches in a row they would still dislike/hate him.

[47er]

'Us' and 'Me'..thanks for that toogs surprising how the context of something can change so much in one simple word..

Excuse me. If he said that, that's wrong too! 100% of fans were behind the team whether they protested against Kean or not! That's the bit he doesn't get. As I said earlier he thinks he and Rovers are one and the same.

[braddock]

Excuse me. If he said that, that's wrong too! 100% of fans were behind the team whether they protested against Kean or not! That's the bit he doesn't get. As I said earlier he thinks he and Rovers are one and the same.

I knew of people who wanted a defeat so Kean would get sacked and they could 'get their Rovers back'.

[47er]

I knew of people who wanted a defeat so Kean would get sacked and they could 'get their Rovers back'.

I cant vouch for who you know. Personally although I can think this in theory, come Saturday I only want 1 result. One person on here promoted the view you've suggested and one only. Personally I don't know anyone who thought that way.

Lets not avoid the central point though. Kean cannot see that people can support the team and not him.

[dubdubdub]

I knew of people who wanted a defeat so Kean would get sacked and they could 'get their Rovers back'.

Fans claim they're behind the team but they're not. They're just behind the erection they get when they think of Kean getting stripped of his post. A lot of people on this board would rather lose and lose Kean I believe. Results aren't going to turn it round for some people.

[tony gale's mic]

I was and am still delighted at the win over Arsenal. That said, I worry that the net effect the win will have could well cancel out the three points and might even prove to our detriment. I'm not sure how close he would have been to the sack even if we lost heavily, but I have a feeling this win will give him ten or so more games.

I still don't think he's good enough (but if results improve over a sustained, prolonged period of time - not just four games - I will start to revise this view) and I feel we'll lose points with him in charge as opposed to a competent Premier League manager.

Ultimately, the primal joy of seeing my side beat Arsenal overrides any of those thoughts, and the other factors such as them having 16 pts from their last 16 games, the various bits of luck we got and our poor first half will seem smaller and smaller as time goes by. However I can't help worry about the ramifications of the extra time this will have given him.

[super_arran]

Don't know if it's been posted.

But the people who are saying the Arsenal result is only papering over the crack and they stil want Kean out; will there be a protest at the next home match?

I'm guessing not.

[glen9mullan]

Don't know if it's been posted.

But the people who are saying the Arsenal result is only papering over the crack and they stil want Kean out; will there be a protest at the next home match?

I'm guessing not.

I would'nt rule it out, As the majority who protested have not changed their minds, and other things are being looked at.

Its going to take a lot more than 1 result against Arsenal and the passing of the Olympic torch from one Tv studio to another for general opinion to change

I guess its watch this space

[thenodrog]

I would'nt rule it out, As the majority who protested have not changed their minds, and other things are being looked at.

I guess its watch this space

I'd just major on publicising the lies and the embarrassing headlines that we have been subjected to in the past 9 months by owners and manager alike. T shirts bumper stickers etc with them on would be a start.

[chris]

I would'nt rule it out, As the majority who protested have not changed their minds, and other things are being looked at.

I guess its watch this space

I wouldn't encourage a protest again, I did/do do admire you for being one of the few fans that has some balls.

I am actually very please with the interview yesterday with Kean. My biggest problem was I always felt he was insulting the fans intelligence, but actually take open phone calls live and answer really tough questions.

Massive respect to him for that.

It was never just results for me, I hated how he talked, his crazy comments, because I always thought he talked knowing he would not have to answer to the fans, trying to fool the media, but he even took on Oztheman live on radio.

I really hope Kean turns it around, however if it gets so bad some fans want to protest I will respect it, but all I would say, is don;t do it in the morning again.

If we had lost to Arsenal and badly you would have got 3000 - 4000 fans marching after the game I'm sure.

As fate has it a Kean signing was a star (Yakubu), every player gave everything (and they could have buried him) and we won (jumping 6 places).

[Plastic Head]

Don't know if it's been posted.

But the people who are saying the Arsenal result is only papering over the crack and they stil want Kean out; will there be a protest at the next home match?

I'm guessing not.

Let's see what happens when the sixth goes in....

[dave birch]

I'll add my little bit:

Well done Glen and all those that marched. You wore your heart on your sleeve, and stood up for something that you believed in.

Those that deride you probably wouldn't have the wherewithall to organise anything they supported or objected to.

It's easier to do nothing. Apathy rules.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Interesting viewpoint and one that's been aired on here before.

Qustions arising from that could be along the lines of, did the poster just sit back and accept everything Jim Iley and Brian Kidd did at Rovers? I guess the answer would have been yes.

If Kean has more idea of how to organise a football team than any fan, then why has he continually left Givet and Salgado out to dry? Every fan on this site can see that particular problem.

Why did Kean play against Newcastle with not one player on the right said of midfield? The fans who went to the game could see that was a huge problem.

Why are his substitutions regularly weakening the team? We can see that they have done.

Why did Souness think it a great idea to sign an Italian second division player for £7.5m, when the average fan thought it was a huge risk?

To say that a football manager always knows more about the way to set a team up, than any fan is patently not true.

Depends what you mean by accept, Iley was before my time but I wasn't at all happy about Kidd and wasn't at all happy about Kean last season. However as a fan I wouldn't try to personally enforce a change, I see that as the job of the chairman/board/owners. Don't get me wrong, I've a lot of sympathy with the anti-Kean marchers who believe Venkys don't know what they're doing (for which there's no little evidence) and need instruction from the fans. I just support the other view more, that fans should almost always be behind the club in actions if not words.

Define left Salgado and Givet out to dry? The emerging pattern seems to be that the full-back behind Hoilett is being left exposed. Kean's quandry is does he sacrifice our attacking potency by shackling our best forward player to tighten up the defence? Tough call in my opinion. Pointing out other specific mistakes Kean has made is a bit unfair in my opinion, every manager makes them, and every fan would make more.

Italian football was still half-decent in 2001 so signing Grabbi from Serie B was like signing the top scorer in the Championship. English equivalents in recent years have been the likes of Shane Long, Andy Carroll, Kevin Doyle, who have all gone for big money. Yeah it turned out badly but it wasn't such a barmy signing/fee at the time.

I agree a manager doesn't always know better than fans, as I said most of the time a manager knows better. To me that means stopping short of trying to force Rovers to change something I'm not personally happy with. Thats just my opinion anyway, have said in other posts I admired the marchers for the effort they put into what they saw as trying to help the club, for keeping the protest clean(ish) and for getting behind the lads in the ground. Just wouldn't have done it myself and liked the general ethos of tonygreenbank's initial post.

[yeti-dog]

Wouldn't describe it as rabid, wasn't one of the protestors outside the B'Burn End. Yeah the situation of Kean's record between February-April (PL 11, W 0, D 4, L 7) or Venkys sacking Williams, Finn and Allardyce was something of a nightmare. But at that point things were 10 times worse than they were pre-Arsenal. Since the dark days of last season, Kean's record has improved significantly and Venkys have spent money, kept hold of Samba and made more of an effort to improve their image at the club (including keeping our great ticket prices). I've always been perfectly willing to accept when I'm wrong, changing your opinion based on changing facts seems a logical attitude to me.

Excellent post. I like to see someone prepared to look at things and change opinion where necessary.

You're being rather Stalinist at the minute Matty challenging anyone who seems to have moved from a position which mirrored your own...

[yeti-dog]

I would'nt rule it out, As the majority who protested have not changed their minds, and other things are being looked at.

Its going to take a lot more than 1 result against Arsenal and the passing of the Olympic torch from one Tv studio to another for general opinion to change

I guess its watch this space

Each time you do it the the impact will reduce accordingly. You've made your point, move on ffs.

[tony gale's mic]

Excellent post. I like to see someone prepared to look at things and change opinion where necessary.

You're being rather Stalinist at the minute Matty challenging anyone who seems to have moved from a position which mirrored your own...

Most people are like that, however most people can also see that it takes a lot more than two matches unbeaten against two teams in shocking form for our manager to suddenly go from incompetent to competent.

[yeti-dog]

Most people are like that, however most people can also see that it takes a lot more than two matches unbeaten against two teams in shocking form for our manager to suddenly go from incompetent to competent.

I see this argument a lot. Do you think the history books put an addendum next to results stating that people need to bear in mind that the teams who got beat were in freefall??

We won and drew,that's all that matters.

[mark1875]

I see this argument a lot. Do you think the history books put an addendum next to results stating that people need to bear in mind that the teams who got beat were in freefall??

We won and drew,that's all that matters.

Before the Arsenal game we had lost 3 and drawn 1, would the history books state our performances were good?

we lost 3 from 4 and won none that's all that mattered, yet the protesters were told it was not just about the results?

yet now it becomes just about the results because we won and drew?

[Mattyblue]

I just find it odd that certain posters can move from one camp to another game by game.

Now, I am no Kean fan, but I appreciate he isnt going anywhere, so I am getting behind the side, doesn't change my opinion on his managerial ability. A sustained run of results? Well it might just.

And I see you still seem to put little of your own opinion on the matters in hand yeti.

[tony gale's mic]

I see this argument a lot. Do you think the history books put an addendum next to results stating that people need to bear in mind that the teams who got beat were in freefall??

We won and drew,that's all that matters.

If you're willing to be so short sighted that's all that matters for sure.

If you want judging future prospects under Kean, then the circumstances under which we got those results are very, very relevant.

Having said that, even if we had beaten an in form Arsenal side, that would just be an individual result and IMO would be ludicrous to change your opinion based on that, when he's had 26 league games in charge.

[Amo]

I see this argument a lot. Do you think the history books put an addendum next to results stating that people need to bear in mind that the teams who got beat were in freefall??

We won and drew,that's all that matters.

It's a ridiculous argument and the same crap we heard when we beat Liverpool under Kean. People seem to forget that we're supposedly a team in free fall, too. We were the weaker side on paper in both of those games and yet still won.

I don't think the Arsenal result papers over any cracks, as such. You make your own luck in this game and we deservedly won for taking our chances. Does it whitewash Kean's tenure, so far? Of course not. But I don't know why people are so determined to take the shine off a well-fought victory.

[den]

It's a ridiculous argument and the same crap we heard when we beat Liverpool under Kean.

It's not ridiculous to look at the teams you've played and look at where they're at.

Without doubt Arsenal have a lot of very good players, but at the moment, they're not a very good team. Exactly as Liverpool were, when we played them last season. That's just the reality of the situation. Ignore it if you wish, but it is the truth.

.

[tony gale's mic]

It's not ridiculous to look at the teams you've played and look at where they're at.

Without doubt Arsenal have a lot of very good players, but at the moment, they're not a very good team. Exactly as Liverpool were, when we played them last season. That's just the reality of the situation. Ignore it if you wish, but it is the truth.

.

Yeah, quite clearly it doesn't have the same shine as if we'd done this to Arsenal a couple of years ago.

It's a great result and in the second half I thought we were really good, but it's hard to argue with the fact we were playing an Arsenal team much weaker than usual.

[BuckyRover]

But still a lot stronger than us