Pune trip

[dcbrfc]

There have been recent attempts to get Birdy involved with the Fans Forum, but sadly it's not happened yet. I agree that Birdy undoubtedly is the organiser of a significant group of fans (I'm reluctant to say "representative" given some of the comments above) and is therefore somebody it makes sense to have on the fans forums, if he's willing (and I believe he now is).

Had Birdy on the phone today about my column in the paper and he said he's tried to get on the FF but not been allowed ...

[XLM]

Simply put IT WOULD BE FAIRER.

Your array of weak points are insignificant.

It might take a few days to get the group together but they would represent the whole of the season ticket holders and have far more chance of asking the questions that the rank and file want answered. It's not rocket science.

9 random people represent the whole 15,000. Alright then, I'll bite. What's to say that all the 9 wouldn't be pro Venkys, pro Kean? Or that they all wouldn't give one and would just go for a free trip to India? Or they could be satanic Neo-Nazi baby eaters.

And I would say it's fairer to reward people for doing the club a service. Plus they will also be season ticket holders.

A vote is fair, drawing lots isn't.

[rogerjonesgloves]

Simply put IT WOULD BE FAIRER.

Your array of weak points are insignificant.

It might take a few days to get the group together but they would represent the whole of the season ticket holders and have far more chance of asking the questions that the rank and file want answered. It's not rocket science.

Would it?

Are They?

Have they?

It's not rocket science it's common sense.

[Al]

Sorry can't take part in any more discussions at the moment. Got to get ready to go to the match. I hope the rest of you with opinions are going too.

[dcbrfc]

See you there pal :-)

[XLM]

Sorry can't take part in any more discussions at the moment. Got to get ready to go to the match. I hope the rest of you with opinions are going too.

Yes, but it won't change my opinion on whether a vote is more fair.

[yeti-dog]

You all loose credibility for accepting a holiday as a bribe.

It can't be seen in any other light.

Anyway that my last on the whole sordid affair.

You completely prove the point I was making earlier which Den saw fit to undermine by having a dig at me rather than respond to the issue I was raising.

For the likes of you nothing will ever be good enough. You see the worst in this straightaway and seem unable to see there might be anything remotely positive to come out of this.

Your 'sordid' comment is risible.

[trs]

Re TimmyJimmy's post at the top of the page:

Can one of the "9" print it out and take it with them please.

I'm in serious agreement with the above

[yeti-dog]

Like anything else this would always bring a mixed reaction and its a very sensitive subject.

8 of the 9 are BRFCS Members which is good for this site, but not IMO good for the bigger picture as it puts that exclusivity tag to both the FF and Site, a culture i'm not comfortable with, as are others who I spoke with last night.

That being said, Some of the people I'm aware of on here who are going (We dont know everyone) Have expressed themselves really well especially Tom who I'm thrilled is going as he comes across very level headed and humble to have been given an opportunity to go, I dnt think Tom will mind me saying but he has had concerns too which the 1% Minority have has and i'm hopeful that he will ask the questions openly and without prejudice, and be allowed to do so in the best interest of the supporters of Blackburn Rovers Football Club. There is very little point swerving the issue's that the 1% have, because if Venkys are serious business people the they should no, its vitally important to address fans/customers with worries/complaints more, so that they can go about rectifying it. Every person is unique and has their own opinions, its the ability to openly express them with reasoning and facts which gets the job done.

Whilst Others who are going have not expressed themselves too well on here, after reading this thread. They have got their backs up, instead of welcoming the objection and have come across with nose up attitude which is a pity, This is my opinion and I really dnt think people shpuld argue with people's opinions, Welcoming the objection and showing empathy is a trait not all seem to have.

It would also be nice for a full list of people who are going to be put on here as 8 are BRFCS members and then all can gauge what type of opinions are going to Pune.

Actually,I'm pretty happy with everyone who's held their hands up to going..if they've got their backs up a bit tough..so would I if I'd been accused of being elitist,along for a jolly and,most disgracefully have been 'bribed'.

You choose your approach at the weekend,I'm expecting/hoping that the Pune 9 will be a little more measured in the way they do things.

[den]

I mentioned earlier that I worked in south east India, which is possibly the poorest part. Without exageration - a few memories:-

Never been as terrified in my life, as when we were driven 50 miles at nightime, in the dark, back from Madras, where the Vehicles were driven mainly down centre of dirt track road, having to guess which way they would swerve. On the way to Madras knocking two people off their bikes and running over one dog. Swarms of Toads in "Hotel" grounds, could hardly move without stepping on one. Snake fell of top of room door when opened. Twists of sugar for the "tea" crawling with ants. No-one used any kind of utensil for eating food. Our personal washing [best shirts etc] was done in the local river, by women bashing it against a stone. Hotel complimentary barbecue consisting of fish, still with all the insides in. Hotel complimentary magic show consisting of a cobra jumping out of a sack, approx 4 feet away. Going to work with toilett rolls in pocket for ease and quickness of access. Having the runs for three and a half weeks. Needing medical tests on return home. Ate boiled eggs every day at work for the only lunch we could stomach. Rajiv Ghandi being assassinated in Madras, by a young Tamil Tiger girl with a bomb in a bouquette of flowers, on the same evening that we were there. Not being able to get to work for three days after that, because the locals were standing by the roadside throwing stones at any traffic that moved. Eventually needing armed guard to get into work. Nearly drowned in the bay of Bengal, learning later that a Russian man actually had drowned there two days earlier. Cows absolutely everywhere.

However, on the plus side, the Indian people, who in that part of India had absolutely nothing to their name - and I mean nothing - were some of the happiest people I've ever met.

So, you wanted some tips on what to expect. Well don't do it, don't go!

Only kidding, but all that above is perfectly true.

.

[only2garners]

I too have been to Madras, or Chennai as it was when I went almost three years ago. I've also been around Kerala, including a homestay in a small rural farm deep in the Wayanad so I have a fair idea of what we are in for and have been trying to convey it to the others. It's a fantastic place and I had a wonderful time but it is certainly a culture shock. Although perhaps not as much as China was in the early 80s. Monkey brain soup anyone?

[Tom]

Just a point Tony Gales Mic the idea to rename the Blackburn End was entirely the idea of Balaji

[tony gale's mic]

I mentioned earlier that I worked in south east India, which is possibly the poorest part. Without exageration - a few memories:-

Never been as terrified in my life, as when we were driven 50 miles at nightime, in the dark, back from Madras, where the Vehicles were driven mainly down centre of dirt track road, having to guess which way they would swerve. On the way to Madras knocking two people off their bikes and running over one dog. Swarms of Toads in "Hotel" grounds, could hardly move without stepping on one. Snake fell of top of room door when opened. Twists of sugar for the "tea" crawling with ants. No-one used any kind of utensil for eating food. Our washing was done in the local river, by women bashing it against a stone. Hotel complimentary barbecue consisting of fish, still with all the insides in. Hotel complimentary magic show consisting of a cobra jumping out of a sack, approx 4 feet away. Going to work with toilett rolls in pocket for ease and quickness of access. Having the runs for three and a half weeks. Needing medical tests on return home. Ate boiled eggs every day at work for the only lunch we could stomach. Rajiv Ghandi being assassinated in Madras, by a young Tamil Tiger girl with a bomb in a bouquette of flowers, on the same evening that we were there. Not being able to get to work for three days after that, because the locals were standing by the roadside throwing stones at any traffic that moved. Eventually needing armed guard to get into work. Nearly drowned in the bay of Bengal, learning later that a Russian man actually had drowned there two days earlier. Cows absolutely everywhere.

However, on the plus side, the Indian people, who in that part of India had absolutely nothing to their name - and I mean nothing - were some of the happiest people I've ever met.

So, you wanted some tips on what to expect. Well don't do it, don't go!

Only kidding, but that's all true.

To be fair, India has changed a lot since you worked there (it sounds like it was some time ago?) and the South in general is now one of the richest parts of the country due to the IT businesses. However Pune isnt exactly known as a tourist destination and some of what you wrote will probably be around now in some form.

[BuckyRover]

To be fair, India has changed a lot since you worked there (it sounds like it was some time ago?) and the South in general is now one of the richest parts of the country due to the IT businesses. However Pune isnt exactly known as a tourist destination and some of what you wrote will probably be around now in some form.

I was in Bangalore in the south and although I wouldn't have described it in den's terms there were definitely many parallels with what he said.

I still had a great time and I am looking forward to going again.

It was humbling to see how many billions of people live basically hand to mouth. It resonated even more with me because as I was seeing this I was getting news of looters rampaging across Britain.

[den]

To be fair, India has changed a lot since you worked there (it sounds like it was some time ago?) and the South in general is now one of the richest parts of the country due to the IT businesses. However Pune isnt exactly known as a tourist destination and some of what you wrote will probably be around now in some form.

I doubt it's changed at all where we were TGM. We were based 50 miles south of Madras where there was absolutely nothing apart from a couple of hotels. No shops, no businesses, only a Russian built nuclear reactor, which fed Electricity to Madras.

It was humbling to see how many billions of people live basically hand to mouth. It resonated even more with me because as I was seeing this I was getting news of looters rampaging across Britain.

Saw women who must have been in their 90's lieing in the streets, with no-one taking any notice. People just walking by. Unbelievable.

[thenodrog]

Ages old tactic to Divide and Conquer.

Just an attempt at flannelling imo. To 'curry' favour even. FF members are being openly seduced and they don't appear to see it. Trip of a lifetime and all that. Personally if I was asked I wouldn't go but I'd certainly offer to meet them here. Would make much more sense too...

1. cos physically there are less of em to fly over and they are here now and again anyway.

2. Politically because our lot would be on home ground.

3. Intellectually because with the best will in the world there will be an element of ingratiation and servitude. Who remembers the excellent TV comedy Brass "now lads to all look at the ground shuffle your feet and rememnber to wring yer cap when Mr Hardacre Venkey speaks to you" .

I wouldn't be at all suprised to find the letters 'AN 1/11' carved into the woodwork somewhere from when he too was subverted. Just make sure you ask how much they have paid out in agents fee's in total on Day 1 cos it won't seem to matter quite as much the longer you are there.

I'm tempted to ask who will be waving the piece of white paper as they step of the plane home but that would be churlish. So have a nice time guys remember your cossies and don't forget the following jabs ......

Diphtheria,

Hepatitis A (infectious hepatitis)

Tetanus

Yellow fever

and

Malaria

enjoy

Just as an aside 2 questions.....

A. Of the 9 do we have 4 for's, 4 againsts and 1 undecided? If so it's all very equal and all that but certainly not representative of the supporters in general.

B. Most important... What exactly do we think will be achieved by this?

[BuckyRover]

I didn't need Malaria in Bangalore. Not sure about Pune though. I don't know how far away it is.

[thenodrog]

And I think the allegations that Glenn and others of the Pune 9's credibility is in question due to their accepting the trip is way off base. If all it took was a plane ticket and a few nights in an Indian hotel to sway their opinion, they'd be pretty poor human beings. Who really believes this to be the case? I certainly don't.

.

err...isn't it rather obvious? The Venkey mob of course Steve.

[yoda]

I didn't need Malaria in Bangalore. Not sure about Pune though. I don't know how far away it is.

Malaria tablets are recomended for Maharastra,

Pune is predominantly a large industrial (Tata group etc) and service industry city, with lots of new infrastructure,

I would advise staying at the Vivanta Blue Diamond Taj hotel if staying in Pune, or if staying in Mumbai the Leela Kempinsky

[BuckyRover]

I stayed at Kempinsky Leela Palace.

Tip top

[mark1875]

Whilst going through the thread i first wish to point out i have no problem with the 9 being from the fans forum, as these people have experience in dealing with the club hierarchy and doing so in the interest of the fans.

however i do wish to pick out on a few things...

If we go over there shouting and screaming I feel they wouldn't want to discuss anything further in the future.

whilst nobody expects you to go "shouting and screaming" i would like assurances that you will not be agreeing just for the sake of future discussions, i would personally expect you as a representative of us supporters to be going over and questioning them about the concerns of supporters. regardless of whether the owners want this or not, is this not the point and purpose of this trip?

Remember, these people are ready and willing (and already have) put a great deal of money into the club.

will you therefore be questioning on behalf of the majority of the supporters as to why they have made a transfer profit out of the club? despite big promises of personal budgets and marquee signings? regarding transfers they have still to this day made a profit!! its what the majority of fans you represent would like to know

You are correct, I haven't tried and to be quite frank I'm not going to waste my time either. As for the questions I'll be asking (if/when I get the opportunity), there won't be anything as searching as that...

that is an arrogant response, and after reading a few of your posts in relation to this thread, i am disappointed that you are one of our representatives to be frank.

As said above the fans forum have a great contribution in acting on behalf of us fans, on things other people could not be bothered about. Yet as a collective group i have 2 questions to pose

1) on a day where this site, the largest rovers fans forum available ran a poll at 85-90% in favor of a managerial change. why then did Mr Venkatesh Rao say in his interview that listening to the fans was vital just to follow it up by saying our wishes would be ignored because steve kean was going nowhere. I feel questions on this topic MUST be raised as it is the subject which raises a difference of opinion between the fans and owners

2) this is not meant to be a question to pick at those who have been selected, however out of interest how many of the 9 on official invite attended fulham? will be attending Newcastle? and following the trip will attend Q.P.R and Norwich? this is a genuine question

Had Birdy on the phone today about my column in the paper and he said he's tried to get on the FF but not been allowed ...

not the only person to hear this from Birdy this evening then

[Roaming Rover]

A few suggestions.

Firstly we have a meet and greet with those who are going. That way no one can complain they have never met their 'representatives'.

Secondly they send us all a postcard and thirdly everyone submits a question for them to ask and we all vote. Top five get asked....enjoy guys and girls, think it's an interesting idea and potentially a good one. If we get nothing from it then we really are in no worse position than now.

Also by 'coming out' they know the mixed views on the trip and themselves as representative of BRFC fans so the group know something positive has to come from this otherwise the 'free holiday' and publicity stunt sceptics will have a field day. I think those I know through here will do us proud.

I also think that to be fair to the 9, to accept this trip then face acusations like they have before they have even recived their visas is pretty poor. Yes ask them what queations they will ask and their view points, but to be sarcastic about the type Tea they will drink is pretty poor.

Good luck and enjoy!

[PAFELL]

I really cannot believe some of the attitudes from people on here. The 9 selected people going all have differing opinions on things in relation to the club / Kean etc. Which is right, as they therefore are able to represent many supporters who share those same views.

There are some who are for Kean and some who are not. Even though I disagree with the those who are in favour of Kean and we have, for want of a better description, clashed a few times, they are entitled to their view. I am happy that there are some who are infavour of Kean, as they must be allowed to put their points over as well. I am also aware that some of the 9 are also not in favour of Kean, therefore those will be able to put the other side of the debate over.

You only have to read some of the posts from these people to understand there 'position' on some subjects. Those for venky's, and those opposed to venky's, for kean, against Kean. So each side of the debates are represented.

With regards to Kean, in some ways Kean is right. We only know the views of about 1% on the Rovers supporters. After all 99% of the supporters do not come onto this site. Others may share the views on subjects on this site - but we on here do not know that - because they are not on it. Neither do most supporters know about the supporters forum at the club.

I recall when I was younger and living in Lancashire, that there used to be rovers supporters clubs in various towns and villages. They would meet in pubs and community halls etc - I remember once we marched around the pitch at ewood for some reason, prior to a match. If I remember this was during the times when there was lots of violence at matches. If I remember correctly you had to be a memebr of a rovers supporters branch, to get to away matches. But these do not seem to happen anymore, which is down to the supporters and not the club. Or maybe this site has replaced them.

I sincerely hope the nine folk going to India, first enjoy the trip, secondly are able to have a constructive meeting / meetings with the owners. Thirdly and most importantly, get home safely.

[perthblue02]

Had Birdy on the phone today about my column in the paper and he said he's tried to get on the FF but not been allowed ...

Perhaps it's better if he doesn't go , when they hear his nickname they will have him spiced up and in a deep fat fryer in no time

[PAFELL]

I'm 58. At what age does weary cynicism set in?

Oh about 58. I am 50 this year and I seem to be getting it early !!!!!!!!

My my what a strange turn of events.

My only thought is that it would have been more beneficial to supporters and the Venky's if they had a session with 50 or 100 season tickets holders down at Ewood.

Too many to make a constructive meeting possible. You only have to read the threads on this site to realise that.