[Archived] The underlying problems

[den]

So Venky's are good business people are they? Well, leaving their chicken business to one side - because we have no idea how they manage that, let's have a look at how they manage Rovers.

How were we set up under the trust? Well, we had owners who weren't based in Lancashire and had no idea about football. That's exactly the same format as we have now. It worked brilliantly then, so there's no reason why it can't work now. To me, there is simply no need for Venky's to be based in this country. If they were it would help, but it can still work as it is.

Now, how should owners of any business approach that business? They have to get the structure right and they have to appoint the right people. That has to be the foundation of any business and of the club. Previously we had the owners based in Jersey on the top rung of the ladder, a strong middle management structure that oversaw almost everything at Ewood [based at Ewood Park], on the middle rung, then on the third rung we had the football management and staff. There was also the link between the owners in Jersey and the management at Ewood, which was David Brown, who was on the board and was in regular contact with the trustees. How did it work? Well the team manager would be based in Blackburn and focus entirely on team affairs. His first stop would be the middle management [JW as it was then]. JW could deal with almost every situation that concerned the team manager. The team manager would virtually never need to liase with the owners. I imagine Mark Hughes hardly knew the trustees, or needed to know them. So we were strong throughout the structure.

Now then, Venky's come along and immediately bypass the second rung of management and do their managing of BRFC through one person - JA, someone who isn't even an employee of BRFC. Within weeks they are managing the club through two people, JA and Steve Kean. Kean and A are soon bypassing JW and the rest of the Ewood based management and talking directly to the Raos. Kean is already flying out to Pune on a regular basis. Since when has Kean been qualified to take up this kind of position or responsibility? Is it any wonder that JW and the whole of that second rung left Ewood?

The current structure is the whole reason why we're in the position that we currently are. If the Raos had continued with the structure as it was, it would be simple for them to go to JW and the rest of the board and ask a straight question - "is Steve Kean the man to get us out of the current situation, yes, or no?" We wouldn't be in this mess now, I'm certain.

We are now, seemingly in the position of Steve Kean being the secong rung, with a mishmash of oddities [Hunt, Venny Rao etc, - people who seem to be contributing little to the real problems] below him. It's akin to Paul Egerton Vernon of the trustees, running the football side of things, along with Paul Ince.

Getting rid of Kean needs to be done, but the real worries surround how Venky's are managing their business. A change of manager might make a difference short term, but I don't see the foundations to build the club on. Problem is, if we go down this season, the lack of income in the Championship would likely mean that the desired structure wouldn't be affordable. How would we recover from that?

So, Roversmum [and this isn't a dig], said the other day that the Raos are "getting there". To me, they are nowhere near getting there. They're as far away at the moment from "getting there", as they possibly could be.

One more point about this situation. Kean, or any manager who is as close as they are to the owners have one basic aim - self preservation. They might not reaslise that, but it's a natural tendency. That's what we're seeing now.

Comments anyone?

[Paul]

Says it all den. Nothing to add.

[Mattyblue]

Agree 100%

Venky's are putting in as much as their own money as the Trust did post 2006, however they wish to micromanage the club and disregard a succesfull corporate structure.

For me it was pretty simple. JW ran a club with a negative transfer budget/high wage bill model, therefore he was the perfect man to continue as Venky's have not deviated from such an approach.

The Rao's should have said from day one:

'Ok, we know little of English football, but you do, it is business as usual. Unfortunately, we will not be able to provide x amount of millions for players, but any money from sales can be reinvested in players.

However we want to promote the Venky brand- we want our logo on the shirts, advertising campaigns, tours of India- but the football, we'll leave to the experts.'

Alas, the naivety of the Rao's ensured that all sense went out the window when they got into bed with Anderson and an effective business has been wrecked.

[m1st]

Excellent post, den.

As someone who's only a fan [i've no behind-the-scenes connections with Ewood or Brockall], I've never understood why it was Kean who went flying off to Pune; nor why it needed to happen so often. You don't see Mancini jetting off on an Etihad flight to the Gulf every month or so to tell the Sheikh how well the team is doing, do you? If it did need monthly feedback to the owners, then until JW left, that was surely his responsibility as Chairman of what, since the take-over has, to all intents and purposes, been the Blackburn Rovers Division of Venky's business empire.

I'd go one stage further and say I feel sure that a man of JW's integrity [and experience in steering the ship], could have been relied upon to tell the owners [as presumably he had to with the Trust when we got rid of Ince], without waiting for them to ask him if he felt that Kean wasn't up to the job.

It's a very sad situation in which we find ourselves.

[Neil Weaver]

Spot on Den, the only things I can cling to are

1 - replacing Kean will give us the short term boost to muddle through THIS SEASON

2 - seeing their narrow escape, Venky's do something about appointing the 'competent Ewood layer'.

I'm sceptical they'll do either though.

[Amo]

Good post, Den.

I take it Venky's have never had to be cut-throat in HR before? Because there's no excuse for keeping Kean in the job when he's running the business into the ground.

[bob fleming]

Alas, the naivety of the Rao's ensured that all sense went out the window when they got into bed with Anderson and an effective business has been wrecked.

I refuse to believe that it’s all down to naivety now.

The continued presence of Anderson at the club especially grates. We have been told, indirectly, on two previous occasions that Venky’s have severed ties with him and his group, only for him to resurface (Mrs Desai went ballistic on one occasion I seem to recall). Last time out was when he was seen in the Directors box at Ewood. Intelligent business people learn from their mistakes, why is he still involved? What could it possibly be? Why pay over the odds on Agents fees?

We found out about the Rochina deal in the Daily Mail (it was newsworthy therefore – but deemed a non story by JA as in reality he’s a £4m (or whatever it was) player). I dread to think about any of the other transfers and what we have paid to Agents. This was all funded from the Phil Jones and Kalinic money by the way lest we forget. What has been paid and to whom?

The article published earlier today on India Today is utter garbage. We have ex players, and current players, in the main, telling us in the LT that Kean needs more time. Andy Cryer was scathing in his match report in the paper following the City game and yet there is a distinct lack of criticism from the LT of the current regime. The wrong people in place, the wrong “advisors”, a frankly laughable transfer window, badly timed tours, seemingly no one in charge at Ewood, deluded comments from the manager (e.g. let’s not judge him on results), a criminally poor record on the pitch since January and still the LT – the local paper - won’t ask the tough questions on behalf of its patrons. Get under their skin. What would Peter White have said?

Fortunately the National press are starting to wake up (I doubt that will last, it only needs Rooney to breaks a toe nail or something)

As den points out so eloquently, none of it makes any sense.

City fans sing “We’re not really here” – that’s exactly how it feels right now to be a Rovers fan.

[jim mk2]

Are fans being unfair on Kean and has he too much on his plate trying to run the team and get results and liaise with the owners on all other aspects of running the club ? Would a director of football help him and allow him to concentrate on the what really matters - getting the team right on the pitch ? It's clear the structure at present is not working and one would hope Kean is discussing this with the owners in India at present. My guess however is that Kean is happy with the current arrangement because he has the trust of the owners and as long as he has that trust he has absolute power at the club. In other words he is virtually unsackable and we will continue to limp along with the current mess on and off the field.

[Hi Mack]

Are fans being unfair on Kean and has he too much on his plate trying to run the team and get results and liaise with the owners on all other aspects of running the club ? Would a director of football help him and allow him to concentrate on the what really matters - getting the team right on the pitch ? It's clear the structure at present is not working and one would hope Kean is discussing this with the owners in India at present. My guess however is that Kean is happy with the current arrangement because he has the trust of the owners and as long as he has that trust he has absolute power at the club. In other words he is virtually unsackable and we will continue to limp along with the current mess on and off the field.

The owners dont see all the negative press, they just hear Keans nonsense. He loves

going over there.....My hatred grows by the day for this incompetent idiot!

If this carries on Venkys will my next target!

[philipl]

The frightening thing is that ten months in, Venky's mistakes are just getting bigger.

There is no indication that they have learnt anything.

The most basic instinct- that of survival is as finely honed as the Dodo's was.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Great post Den, and the horrible truth I think most of us don't want to think about. When I think about the forcing out of Williams, Finn and the rest of our phenomenal management structure it almost makes me want to cry with frustration and grief at the value of what we've lost. For a decade this "second rung" of management have proven themselves to be the Man Utd of that aspect of football, helping to sustain a club losing £4m of players per season on average. Not only helping to sustain it, helping it to thrive. To have that replaced by Jerome Anderson and later a mish-mash of ineffective nobodies is an absolutely heinous crime. How could Venkys be so stupid? I was appalled at the sacking of Allardyce, but this is far worse and as you rightly say something we might not recover from for a long time.

[grinder]

Excellent post that in many respects hits the nail

The current disaffectation is directed at the hapless (hopeless) Kean but may be the emphasis should be shifting to the owners who lets face it appointed him, sacked Allardyce in the middle of the season and have cavorted some dubious characters.

They clearly like positive publicity as anyone watching the T20 champions league can't help but notice - adverse publicity directed at them from Rovers supporters may focus their minds. It worries me that even if we get rid of Kean that they know so little of the game and are so poorly advised that the replacement would be equally unsuitable.

[PLJPB]

I refuse to believe that it’s all down to naivety now.

Absolutely. I now believe that they have known exactly what they wanted to do since day one. I dread to think what their final objective is.

[chris]

Absolutely. I now believe that they have known exactly what they wanted to do since day one. I dread to think what their final objective is.

Then the Rao brother deserves an oscar for his acting.

[yoda]

The underlying problem is they are Lying

[PLJPB]

Then the Rao brother deserves an oscar for his acting.

Maybe he's got the same teacher as Kean? How to lie convincingly.

[Paul Mellelieu]

The underlying problem is they are Lying

Please explain.

PS. Agree with Den, Bob et al. of course.

[percy]

I'm finding it harder to believe they genuinely have good intentions with every press release and interview that, unsurprisingly, turn out to be lies.

I'm coming to the conclusion that they're either completely stupid and have absolutely no clue what's going on OR they're on this to run the club into the ground.

Either way, we're screwed - smiles and alleged good intentions or not.......

Each media release adds to the ongoing problems, be it by them or their useless manager.

Not sure an academy abroad or good publicity in India will help when the team's speeding towards relegation / self implosion.

Kean out is an absolute necessity if this club is to try and survive this season. That said, the people in charge have given no indication whatsoever that they're capable of making good, effective decisions.

Very sad time to be a rover at the moment. So much hard work by the previous board being tossed away by media hungry timewasters......

[yoda]

Please explain.

PS. Agree with Den, Bob et al. of course.

Do you want me to give you a list of all the things that the Venky's and Kean have said that are not true because frankly this MB is full of it, how you can ask for an explanation is mind boggling

[percy]

Probably easier to make a list of promises they've managed to keep..................err.....

[bob fleming]

Probably easier to make a list of promises they've managed to keep..................err.....

Well they did say last season that they wouldn't sack Kean. How's that for a kick in the head from the law of averages?

[percy]

What a mess.

Worst. Promise. Ever.

[yoda]

Probably easier to make a list of promises they've managed to keep..................err.....

that didn't take long

[greco]

excellent points Den.

Just made a post in the kean thread, which probably should have been posted here.

Its actually quite simple. Multimillion pound business: check, competing in multibillion Pound market: check, Being managed by a complete novice: check.

For a women who proudly claims to be an expert in decision making, that is insane.

as someone stated, its not just a matter of being naive anymore. They chose from the start to remove sound and reasonable enplyees and replaced them with garbage. Its utter stupidity, no way around it. I imagine a Burnley fan couldnt have scripted it better. The amount of weird/unintelligent decisions on their part, are at a level thats hard to comprehend.

Might i just add, it was their father who established the chicken company. So they inherited a sound business from the old man and were lucky to do so,in a blooming asian market. I have no evidence that suggest they are bright or brilliant when it comes to business.

[Paul Mellelieu]

Do you want me to give you a list of all the things that the Venky's and Kean have said that are not true because frankly this MB is full of it, how you can ask for an explanation is mind boggling

Calm down.

I thought you were referring to something new.