[Archived] Blackburn V Newcastle

[Parsonblue]

Some of you are as deluded as Kean himself.

One flukey win and suddenly people want to take the moral high-ground and pretend they're super-fans because 'they were there the day Steve Kean won a football match'.

A win for Rovers is a win for Kean & Venky's, it's not a win for the fans who are supporting a sinking ship. It's the law of averages that Kean will pick up the odd win here and there. We know for a fact that relegation is an inevitablity under this guy, therefore any result that applies extra pressure to his position and tenure as manager can only be a good thing.

Personally, I've always been happy over the past 50 years when the Rovers win and so it was last night. I will never go to a match wanting Rovers to lose. Sorry, but my love of Rovers is greater than my dislike for Kean. I respect you may see it differently, but I'll be at Norwich on Saturday cheering the team on in the hope we win not lose. These really are strange days when Rovers fans get stick for wanting the Rovers to win.

[Eddie]

Some of you are as deluded as Kean himself.

One flukey win and suddenly people want to take the moral high-ground and pretend they're super-fans because 'they were there the day Steve Kean won a football match'.

A win for Rovers is a win for Kean & Venky's, it's not a win for the fans who are supporting a sinking ship. It's the law of averages that Kean will pick up the odd win here and there. We know for a fact that relegation is an inevitablity under this guy, therefore any result that applies extra pressure to his position and tenure as manager can only be a good thing.

So what's more important to you?

1) Rovers continue to lose and are relegated, but that means that the Raos sell-up and are gone, with Kean going with them.

or

2) Rovers form improves and we stay up, finish in the 12-15 range and go on a decent cup-run or two. The Rao's stay, Kean stays for this season at least.

Which scenario do you honestly prefer? If it is the first then you best join another messageboard and go and support Manchester City. There aren't many on here left who support Kean, I'm not one of them, but I want the team to win. If he can turn this around and turns out to be a good manager then all power to him. I want the best for this club, the best long-term will be finding a better manager, but no one could ever convince me that the best for this club involves losing matches. There are no guarantees that the next man in the job will do any better regardless of his previous track-record or experience, so just hope for wins, that's all that I can say.

I hated Allardyce and wanted him out of the club from day one. I thought his signings were poor, tactics inept and the quality of football was dire, but I never once wanted the team to lose so that I would either look right or so that he would go.

A few on here need to grow up. Our club is beginning to look like a joke from top to bottom. Not only do our owners make headlines for chasing after unrealistic targets and then not spending any money, not only does our manager make baffling team selections and overly-confident statements in press conferences, but now our fans turn up to matches in even fewer numbers, they also spend most of the time at the match sitting in complete silence and then spend all of the time outside of the match saying that we should be losing so that our manager and owners MIGHT leave.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Taking any feelings whatsoever towards Kean, his record is absolutely horrendous and under him, we appear dead certs for relegation this season.

This is my gripe and until the situation is addressed, things won't get better at Ewood.

Ok - at this moment I agree with you - that we look certs for relegation - and nobody can argue that his record is terrible.

However - the performances and results over the last three matches have shown a marked improvement. We drew away at QPR, very unlucky to lose to a very good Tottenham team and beat a Newcastle team on a long unbeaten run. I am not saying we have turned the corner - but I do think that things have improved (which have seemed to coincide with Clement being appointed - though whether anyone can make a difference so quickly - I don't know).

[LeChuck]

However - the performances and results over the last three matches have shown a marked improvement. We drew away at QPR, very unlucky to lose to a very good Tottenham team and beat a Newcastle team on a long unbeaten run. I am not saying we have turned the corner - but I do think that things have improved

Still, we haven't kept a clean sheet since April.

That shows absolutely no signs of improving any time soon. We've conceded six goals in those matches you mention.

We haven't got a chance of staying up whilst we keep conceding goals every single game.

[King Kenny's Magic]

So what's more important to you?

1) Rovers continue to lose and are relegated, but that means that the Raos sell-up and are gone, with Kean going with them.

or

2) Rovers form improves and we stay up, finish in the 12-15 range and go on a decent cup-run or two. The Rao's stay, Kean stays for this season at least.

Which scenario do you honestly prefer? If it is the first then you best join another messageboard and go and support Manchester City. There aren't many on here left who support Kean, I'm not one of them, but I want the team to win. If he can turn this around and turns out to be a good manager then all power to him. I want the best for this club, the best long-term will be finding a better manager, but no one could ever convince me that the best for this club involves losing matches. There are no guarantees that the next man in the job will do any better regardless of his previous track-record or experience, so just hope for wins, that's all that I can say.

I hated Allardyce and wanted him out of the club from day one. I thought his signings were poor, tactics inept and the quality of football was dire, but I never once wanted the team to lose so that I would either look right or so that he would go.

A few on here need to grow up. Our club is beginning to look like a joke from top to bottom. Not only do our owners make headlines for chasing after unrealistic targets and then not spending any money, not only does our manager make baffling team selections and overly-confident statements in press conferences, but now our fans turn up to matches in even fewer numbers, they also spend most of the time at the match sitting in complete silence and then spend all of the time outside of the match saying that we should be losing so that our manager and owners MIGHT leave.

Our form will not improve under Kean. Not a chance Eddie. Also Venky's won't sack him at the moment.

1) To stay away will ultimately hit them in the pocket and hopefully force them to act

2) Only a shed load of losses will force them to sack him. I suppose wanting rovers to lose is a "one step back two forward" mentality.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Still, we haven't kept a clean sheet since April.

That shows absolutely no signs of improving any time soon. We've conceded six goals in those matches you mention.

We haven't got a chance of staying up whilst we keep conceding goals every single game.

I agree we need to start keeping clean sheets - but I am surprised you don't see any improvement - either in our defensive set up or general play. I keep stressing this - I am not saying we have turned the "mythical" corner - just that things have improved.

[rebelmswar]

So what's more important to you?

1) Rovers continue to lose and are relegated, but that means that the Raos sell-up and are gone, with Kean going with them.

or

2) Rovers form improves and we stay up, finish in the 12-15 range and go on a decent cup-run or two. The Rao's stay, Kean stays for this season at least.

Which scenario do you honestly prefer? If it is the first then you best join another message board and go and support Manchester City. There aren't many on here left who support Kean, I'm not one of them, but I want the team to win. If he can turn this around and turns out to be a good manager then all power to him. I want the best for this club, the best long-term will be finding a better manager, but no one could ever convince me that the best for this club involves losing matches. There are no guarantees that the next man in the job will do any better regardless of his previous track-record or experience, so just hope for wins, that's all that I can say.

I hated Allardyce and wanted him out of the club from day one. I thought his signings were poor, tactics inept and the quality of football was dire, but I never once wanted the team to lose so that I would either look right or so that he would go.

A few on here need to grow up. Our club is beginning to look like a joke from top to bottom. Not only do our owners make headlines for chasing after unrealistic targets and then not spending any money, not only does our manager make baffling team selections and overly-confident statements in press conferences, but now our fans turn up to matches in even fewer numbers, they also spend most of the time at the match sitting in complete silence and then spend all of the time outside of the match saying that we should be losing so that our manager and owners MIGHT leave.

It's a hard stance to defend, I grant you that. It is madness for supporters to say "Get In" when Newcastle score, or be uncomfortably numb to a victory by the very thing that has given us joy for so long. You must understand that it is in no way pleasurable for me to feel this way, I am completely devastated that I feel this way, truly.

Let me try and tell a tale that will make it slightly more understandable for those who do not see how some of us can possibly see what happened as a negative.

In 279 BC and 280 BC King Pyrrhus of Epirus fought two very bloody battles against the Romans in at Heraclea and Asculum, while he won the battles he was completely depressed. History recorded by Dionysius, a Greek historian, states that King Pyrrhus, when confronted by a member of his staff who expressed joy at the victory, stated that "one more such victory would utterly undo him" and that he despaired. The cost was too high a price to pay for a fleeting victory.

You see while we have won a great victory in the cup against an unbeaten Newcastle side, it was all for nothing. Manchester City will decimate us, they want to win the cup as much as we do, they have players that are insanely good, and a manager who is a tactical great. We have injured a player we can ill afford to lose, we have tired out many with a grueling slug fest of a match that should have been put to bed while 2-0 up. We have given a beyond sub-par manager a major stick to throw to his dogs in the press, and his superiors. He will trump it up as our finest hour, when in fact it may become our darkest. Let us pray the few of us who feel this way are wrong, and that it is in fact always darkest just before dawn.

Yet we do have a victory to celebrate, a Pyrrhic victory.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

You see while we have won a great victory in the cup against an unbeaten Newcastle side, it was all for nothing. Manchester City will decimate us, they want to win the cup as much as we do, they have players that are insanely good, and a manager who is a tactical great. We have injured a player we can ill afford to lose, we have tired out many with a grueling slug fest of a match that should have been put to bed while 2-0 up. We have given a beyond sub-par manager a major stick to throw to his dogs in the press, and his superiors. He will trump it up as our finest hour, when in fact it may become our darkest. Let us pray the few of us who feel this way are wrong, and that it is in fact always darkest just before dawn.

1. We haven't drawn City yet

2. They would probably stuff us no matter who the manager was (see United 7 Rovers 1 as proof)

3. I agree I am worried that last nights exertions will be felt when we play Norwich - for everyone that wants us to lose to help get rid of Kean, surely they will see that as a positive ?

4. Don't entirely blame Kean for us not seeing out the match in normal time. Both were excellent finishes.

5. I hope you are wrong - as I am not sure that our owners will get rid of Kean quick enough to avoid relegation. Our best hope is that he learns from his mistakes and that Clement is good enough to make up for the deficiences that Kean has.

[glen9mullan]

15 Matches without a clean sheet. with both Sheff Wed and Leyton Orient also penetrating our defence at home.

It was a good result last night where we had lots of luck go our way, in games we have already played this season perhaps we didnt get that luck or we may have more points. I'm a firm believer that you make your won luck and in football it evens itself out.

We all want to win as many games as possible but I think the point some are making is if this win in the league cup gives Steve Kean three more games and he fails to win any of them, then our position becomes even more desperate, so much so it could be unrepairable.

Others are making the point that this win may propel us up the table and send us on a run which see's our league form improve, I think 99.9% od supporters would love that to be the case, because everyone is pro Blackburn Rovers and everyone wants to see the team progress up the table.

My own point of view is I look at FACTS, We have won nearly as many cup games as league games under Steve Kean's reign, which is good that we are winning cup games, but we have gone from top 10 to bottom of the league in the process. Steve Kean has nothing on his CV to suggest after 35 games league and cup to suggest he can stop the slide in the league, all stats and facts outweigh this possibility. No-one wants Rovers to lose, but waht we do want is the best possible chance to survive.

Just 12 months ago I was looking for Rovers to kick on for a European place, 12 months down the line we have gone back 12 years on the pitch, and off the pitch we have broke the mould on how NOT run a football club

[Eddie]

Our form will not improve under Kean. Not a chance Eddie. Also Venky's won't sack him at the moment.

1) To stay away will ultimately hit them in the pocket and hopefully force them to act

2) Only a shed load of losses will force them to sack him. I suppose wanting rovers to lose is a "one step back two forward" mentality.

Rovers continue to lose would see us relegated, there will be no step forward from that. You could bring Walker back from the grave at the point and there would still be no saving us.

Staying away won't hit them in the pocket. They lose money on this anyway and what percentage of our income do you think comes from match day revenue? It must be a tiny percentage and a drop in the ocean compared to the amount that all of these so-called supporters then want them to turn around and spend in January and in the summer.

Staying away will just make them think that they've bought into a sinking ship that they can't save. The club is going through a difficult time, it needs the supporters. The best possible reaction the fans could have would be to turn up at every match, make lots of noise, support the team for the 90 minutes and if they want to then stay behind and protest against Kean afterwards. Not turning up just makes us look like a sh*t club.

[Mattyblue]

Isn't that exactly what we did on Sunday?

[rebelmswar]

1. We haven't drawn City yet

2. They would probably stuff us no matter who the manager was (see United 7 Rovers 1 as proof)

3. I agree I am worried that last nights exertions will be felt when we play Norwich - for everyone that wants us to lose to help get rid of Kean, surely they will see that as a positive ?

4. Don't entirely blame Kean for us not seeing out the match in normal time. Both were excellent finishes.

5. I hope you are wrong - as I am not sure that our owners will get rid of Kean quick enough to avoid relegation. Our best hope is that he learns from his mistakes and that Clement is good enough to make up for the deficiences that Kean has.

1) That must have been a dream then... weird, almost scary as I was so sure that it was so.

2) That is my point.

3) I wanted to lose last night, in a game that was pointless and expendable in regards to our survival.

4) He changed the players and the tactics, so if that was not his fault and he didn't make those decisions, he is as impotent as he clueless.

5) I hope you are right, my hope died when we began the season with him. The only thing I hold onto is that maybe, just maybe, Clement is fantastic and does everything.

[Eddie]

It's a hard stance to defend, I grant you that. It is madness for supporters to say "Get In" when Newcastle score, or be uncomfortably numb to a victory by the very thing that has given us joy for so long. You must understand that it is in no way pleasurable for me to feel this way, I am completely devastated that I feel this way, truly.

Let me try and tell a tale that will make it slightly more understandable for those who do not see how some of us can possibly see what happened as a negative.

....

Yet we do have a victory to celebrate, a Pyrrhic victory.

Thanks for the history lesson, but the analogy is way off.

[rebelmswar]

Thanks for the history lesson, but the analogy is way off.

Really? How so?

[Commondore]

15 Matches without a clean sheet. with both Sheff Wed and Leyton Orient also penetrating our defence at home.

This is an excellent point, and IMO what it all boils down to when you peel off all the Kean and Venkys debate. We have to score four goals to earn a one goal victory, and that's with a fairly decent four back line. You could probably play through ten straight PL seasons and a team with that handicap would be relegated every single time, it's just not sustainable.

[Eddie]

Really? How so?

A Pryyhic victory is one that comes at such a high cost the loss far outweighs the gains, no one could argue that a victory for Rovers in this situation is anything like that. There was no guarantee that Kean would have been sacked had we lost (in fact it was highly unlikely) and it is impossible to argue that the win last night will not have been good for the morale and confidence in the side. Until the draw is made we can also hold out hope that we draw a non-premier league side, giving us a good chance to get into the semi-finals of a cup, which would be good for the fans and the players.

We are at a point in the season where things can either go from bad to worse - where we will be certain to be locked into a relegation battle for the entire year - or where a few points from the upcoming fixtures could put us in a situation where we are looking towards midtable.

There is no guarantee that any new manager will be the 'right man for the job', the choice of the supporters or that he will do a good job, so just make the simple decision and decide to support the club.

[chaddyrovers]

15 Matches without a clean sheet. with both Sheff Wed and Leyton Orient also penetrating our defence at home.

It was a good result last night where we had lots of luck go our way, in games we have already played this season perhaps we didnt get that luck or we may have more points. I'm a firm believer that you make your won luck and in football it evens itself out.

We all want to win as many games as possible but I think the point some are making is if this win in the league cup gives Steve Kean three more games and he fails to win any of them, then our position becomes even more desperate, so much so it could be unrepairable.

Others are making the point that this win may propel us up the table and send us on a run which see's our league form improve, I think 99.9% od supporters would love that to be the case, because everyone is pro Blackburn Rovers and everyone wants to see the team progress up the table.

My own point of view is I look at FACTS, We have won nearly as many cup games as league games under Steve Kean's reign, which is good that we are winning cup games, but we have gone from top 10 to bottom of the league in the process. Steve Kean has nothing on his CV to suggest after 35 games league and cup to suggest he can stop the slide in the league, all stats and facts outweigh this possibility. No-one wants Rovers to lose, but waht we do want is the best possible chance to survive.

Just 12 months ago I was looking for Rovers to kick on for a European place, 12 months down the line we have gone back 12 years on the pitch, and off the pitch we have broke the mould on how NOT run a football club

very good post Glen.

Rovers don't keep clean sheets anymore.

We did have alot of lucky last night, but we haven't had much luck all season so far, so things went our way for once.

Thought Kean shouldn't had change the formation last night with 10 mins bringing on Hanley, because it upset the back line and players didn't where to play. If he was going to bring on Hanley should have play in midfield protecting the back 4 or bought on Robbie Cotton for ten minutes.

But we won and I will take any kind of a win.

Hopefully this will help our league form and start winning PL games which I think are more IMPORTANT than getting to a cup final personally. The PL is where you make your money and sponsorship.

[rebelmswar]

A Pryyhic victory is one that comes at such a high cost the loss far outweighs the gains, no one could argue that a victory for Rovers in this situation is anything like that. There was no guarantee that Kean would have been sacked had we lost (in fact it was highly unlikely) and it is impossible to argue that the win last night will not have been good for the morale and confidence in the side. Until the draw is made we can also hold out hope that we draw a non-premier league side, giving us a good chance to get into the semi-finals of a cup, which would be good for the fans and the players.

We are at a point in the season where things can either go from bad to worse - where we will be certain to be locked into a relegation battle for the entire year - or where a few points from the upcoming fixtures could put us in a situation where we are looking towards midtable.

There is no guarantee that any new manager will be the 'right man for the job', the choice of the supporters or that he will do a good job, so just make the simple decision and decide to support the club.

In my opinion, and that is all that it is, that is what it was. The analogy is apt depending on your point of view. I was trying to explain how some can see a victory as a defeat.

It is your opinion that it was not, and I am in no way qualified, or inclined, to change you from that view. I was simply trying to explain why some of us may feel as we do.

Again, in my opinion, when we are dead last in the league it is a pointless distraction and waste of player stamina. I also must say again that my desire for the team to win in the league is unchanged, of course I want them to win.

Also, in my opinion, there is no guarantee that a new manager would not be the right man for the job. We have history and statistics that may show that the current manager wins games the same way that a person wins a coin toss.

[Steve Moss]

There is no guarantee that any new manager will be the 'right man for the job', the choice of the supporters or that he will do a good job, so just make the simple decision and decide to support the club.

1. We support the club. Which is why Kean must go.

2. If Kean = relegation, then any other manager offers the possibility of salvation. There is no downside in changing course, only in following Kean like a lemming over the edge of the cliff.

[Fraserkirky]

My god, there are some idiots on here.

Great result for the boys last night. Well done Kean and the players, more of the same please.

We have been poor so far in the league, however the schedule hasn't been great either. Home to Wolves(defensive dibocal!) and Everton(the penalty misses) were the worst results so far, as both teams are struggling as well.

I am not a fan of Kean, however I'm willing to chill for right now. Looking at the schedule before Xmas, I think we have a good chance at getting out of the doledrums(sp).

Norwich vs Blackburn-must win

Blackburn vs Chelsea

Wigan vs Blackburn

Stoke vs Blackburn

Blackburn vs Swansea-must win

Sunderland vs Blackburn

Blackburn vs West Brom-must win

Blackburn vs Bolton-must win

Liverpool vs Blackburn

Man Utd vs Blackburn

[rebelmswar]

My god, there are some idiots on here.

Great result for the boys last night. Well done Kean and the players, more of the same please.

We have been poor so far in the league, however the schedule hasn't been great either. Home to Wolves(defensive dibocal!) and Everton(the penalty misses) were the worst results so far, as both teams are struggling as well.

Just to explain why I - this.

Calling people idiots for their feelings is wrong, no matter the stance.

The result last night was positive, but I do not ask for the same again by any means, almost throwing away a game after 2 goal lead is not something I wish to see again.

Wolves game was a shambles, Everton game was the same.

All in my opinion of course.

[Mattyblue]

Compared to say Bolton, we havent had a tough run of fixtures at all.

Considering we have got to play ALL the top 6 away, plus others who are very strong on their own turf, it is only going to get harder and we have not picked up very gettable points.

As den said, only one thing matters, can Kean get us 35 points from 29 games? I don't think he can, however it looks as he'll get the games regardless.

[Amo]

What on earth are you talking about? A win for Kean and Venky's??? Grow up. Rovers won a football match, therefore its a good thing. If you care more about Kean than Rovers then that's your problem. I want Kean to go as much as anyone but Im not going to WANT the team to lose. If we lose to Norwich then yesterday's result will be irrelevant and nobody is saying otherwise. If you hate Kean more than you support Rovers then you might want to get your priorities sorted out.

Just because fans went last night doesn't mean they dont know how bad Venkys are. They went because they support the football club regardless of Venkys/Kean. EVERYONE knows that Venky's have screwed up, EVERY FAN knows that Kean isn't the right man, but that doesn't mean you should refuse to support the team/hope that we lose every week until Kean gets fired. Its pathetic in my opinion that there are fans who get angry when we win.

I don't usually get involved in this "I'm a better fan than you because..." nonsense but this really is a bizarre statement. All I will say is that it's extremely sad that things have come to this where fans think that the team winning is a BAD THING Sounds almost McCarthyite in thinking. And to take your argument to it's logical conclusion, surely you think relegation is a GOOD THING because it will mean Kean is removed for sure? Where does it end?

I went to the game last night and I was delighted that Rovers won. And I'll be delighted if they win on Saturday too. Doesn't make me think Kean is the right manager, and doesn't make me want him removed any less than any of you.

What a sad and twisted way for any fan to look at it... Sometimes I think people on here just WANT to have a bad situation so they can blame their misery on something. A lot of you seem to be thriving off it.

I bet you don't come out with any of this tripe when you're down at Ewood.

Hope you paragons are ready to count how many times we enter Norwich's box on Saturday.

And of course a win for Rovers is a win for Kean & Venky's. It's not our club anymore.

[Fraserkirky]

Just to explain why I - this.

Calling people idiots for their feelings is wrong, no matter the stance.

The result last night was positive, but I do not ask for the same again by any means, almost throwing away a game after 2 goal lead is not something I wish to see again.

Wolves game was a shambles, Everton game was the same.

All in my opinion of course.

Any Rovers fan who wanted us to get beat last night is an IDIOT(In my opinion).

I wanna see more of the same in terms of us actually winning a game, together with the passion and the determination the team showed last night.

[hesfromburn]

Im still buzzing from the win last night they have been so far between!

It was a nice break from the indifference between fans in the bburn end sat in the jw upper eveyone felt united and there was an old school feel about the crowd there, I think it was the first time in ages after givets goal and the final whistle ive been shaken around by fans around me in complete joy/relief of the problems at the club and life.