[Archived] Please can the Fans Forum take action? - Personal plea from Sentient

[47er]

You seem intent on the FF resigning / disbanding / shooting itself dead - that's your shout.

Two things though. Today, Rovers main commercial partner (and a local one at that) has gone to unprecedented lengths to express in public what most of us are thinking. In the commercial world of Premier League football, Wayne Wild's drastic action carries far more weight than anything a volunteer Fans Forum could ever do. In fact had any two statements happened on the same day, I doubt that the FF would have got a single column inch for it against such an important commercial partner. Money talks.

Secondly, the Fans Forum has existed for 13 years and although sometimes ridiculed, has done important and valued work during that time. That's 13 years of grind which is not going to be binned off in a fit of pique at the current ownership, by taking a publicity stunt action which would be forgotten this time next week. There is far more value in hanging in there, and trying to deliver our messages whenever we can and to whoever BRFC and these and future owners put in front of us.

Like the blue and white shirts and the club itself, the Fans Forum should be here to stay for as long as there's a team playing on Ewood Park. The owners have done enough damage without killing this off as well.

"publicity stunt"-----you referring to the Pune visit?

[Amo]

Users should be able to create their own polls, to be honest. Don't know why that has to be an elitist thing.

[Tris]

"publicity stunt"-----you referring to the Pune visit?

I know there are a number of people on this MB and elsewhere who will moan about the Pune visit until the end of time.

However - even after 6 weeks of lobbying by the WEC Group - the Pune visit remains the only recorded contact between fans (or sponsors) and owners in 12 months. And the Fans Forum had been requesting some communication with the owners since last November.

In the light of people on here talking about selling cars to raise the cash to get out to India, thousands of emails being sent, protests, a fly-past and now WEC going public, I would only say this -

What on earth would the reaction have been if - having finally been made aware (back in August) of this opportunity to actually take a message to Venkys - the Fans Forum had turned around to them and said no - we don't want to talk to you. Cut off the only chance of dialogue at source. That would have been a ridiculous course of action.

So we'll take the few jealous jibes on the chin, because we know that we did the right thing by going and opening a dialogue. We're as desperate as everyone else to progress it, including Wayne Wild ... personally I welcome his intervention today and hope it moves things forward.

[Al]

The fans forum resigning is not the answer. If they do the last vestiges of contact with the club would be lost. They may not be elected but the ones that I have met have the supporters views at heart. Support them because they are all that we have. They are there in the Blues Bar after every match. Go and talk to them. I will be on holiday at the next home match but will be there next time I can.

KEAN AND VENKYS OUT.

[Paul]

Just as an aside during the FF Pune trip Birdy met Balaji who paid his travel expenses to India. Balaji also said he would visit Birdy's house the next time he came over. So do we know if this happened this weekend?

[patrickvalery]

Just as an aside during the FF Pune trip Birdy met Balaji who paid his travel expenses to India. Balaji also said he would visit Birdy's house the next time he came over. So do we know if this happened this weekend?

If i were a betting man i know where my money would go.

[Stuart]

What do you think Paul?

One thing I wanted to add to this debate (and I can see both sides - particularly good post by Tris in the wee hours this morning).

How would the FF members feel if, following the relationship breakdown with the fans and likely backlash from news of Kean's new contract, Venkys decided to stop the 'in club' discussion with the FF - effectively folding the committee?

Would there be any regret that more direct action hadn't been taken? Or will you be happy to take the moral high ground having waited?

[Paul]

What do you think Paul?

Other people promised action as a result of the Pune trip, in particular Ian Currie and Ian Battersby, have yet to hear from the Rao family.

I'd guess Birdy has been forgotten along with the rest.

[47er]

I know there are a number of people on this MB and elsewhere who will moan about the Pune visit until the end of time.

However - even after 6 weeks of lobbying by the WEC Group - the Pune visit remains the only recorded contact between fans (or sponsors) and owners in 12 months. And the Fans Forum had been requesting some communication with the owners since last November.

In the light of people on here talking about selling cars to raise the cash to get out to India, thousands of emails being sent, protests, a fly-past and now WEC going public, I would only say this -

What on earth would the reaction have been if - having finally been made aware (back in August) of this opportunity to actually take a message to Venkys - the Fans Forum had turned around to them and said no - we don't want to talk to you. Cut off the only chance of dialogue at source. That would have been a ridiculous course of action.

So we'll take the few jealous jibes on the chin, because we know that we did the right thing by going and opening a dialogue. We're as desperate as everyone else to progress it, including Wayne Wild ... personally I welcome his intervention today and hope it moves things forward.

Well I can understand you being a bit touchy about the Pune trip but I have never criticised those who went. (Use the search facility if you doubt me!) On the contrary I said anyone in your position would accept the invitation and I specifically wished you all a good time.

BUT--based on what you say you told them and based on what Venkys have done since, you would have to conclude that you were all part of a publicity stunt wouldn't you?

Thats as arranged by Venkys, not impugning your good selves at all (with the exception of one particular individual).

[Stuart]

Other people promised action as a result of the Pune trip, in particular Ian Currie and Ian Battersby, have yet to hear from the Rao family.

I'd guess Birdy has been forgotten along with the rest.

Disappointing about the Ians but not really a surprise.

I think of all things to have happened, and despite Glenn, Tom et al having done their best, the fact they appear to have 'bare-faced' the FF in a behind closed doors situation feels the most insulting.

[sentient]

Secondly, the Fans Forum has existed for 13 years and although sometimes ridiculed, has done important and valued work during that time. That's 13 years of grind which is not going to be binned off in a fit of pique at the current ownership, by taking a publicity stunt action which would be forgotten this time next week. There is far more value in hanging in there, and trying to deliver our messages whenever we can and to whoever BRFC and these and future owners put in front of us.

Like the blue and white shirts and the club itself, the Fans Forum should be here to stay for as long as there's a team playing on Ewood Park. The owners have done enough damage without killing this off as well.

Well Tris. Anopther week and I come back to the thought. WHAT ARE THE FANS FORUM DOING TO INFLUENCE THINGS? We are in chaos and you just think that the fans forum should be here as long as the club? What sort of arrogance is that?

There is a quote from FLB on another thread where he says that some uber-fans are more interested in their own status than the plight of the club. The ff certainly comes across as a set of people who would rather the club implodes than they admit they have made a mistake. Seems that your trip to india has infected you with the "saving face" virus. Well maybe you should realise that we are going down the drain and your precious ff is not relevant. Use the opportunity to press for the Qatari bid.

Has anyone from the ff actually said that the pune trip was a mistake?

Secondly, the Fans Forum has existed for 13 years and although sometimes ridiculed, has done important and valued work during that time. That's 13 years of grind which is not going to be binned off in a fit of pique at the current ownership, by taking a publicity stunt action which would be forgotten this time next week. There is far more value in hanging in there, and trying to deliver our messages whenever we can and to whoever BRFC and these and future owners put in front of us.

Like the blue and white shirts and the club itself, the Fans Forum should be here to stay for as long as there's a team playing on Ewood Park. The owners have done enough damage without killing this off as well.

Well Tris. Anopther week and I come back to the thought. WHAT ARE THE FANS FORUM DOING TO INFLUENCE THINGS? We are in chaos and you just think that the fans forum should be here as long as the club? What sort of arrogance is that?

There is a quote from FLB on another thread where he says that some uber-fans are more interested in their own status than the plight of the club. The ff certainly comes across as a set of people who would rather the club implodes than they admit they have made a mistake. Seems that your trip to india has infected you with the "saving face" virus. Well maybe you should realise that we are going down the drain and your precious ff is not relevant. Use the opportunity to press for the Qatari bid.

Has anyone from the ff actually said that the pune trip was a mistake?

[ebenrocks]

oh shut your trap sentient... Why dont YOU start making a difference by not turning on other BRFC fans, and focusing your anger on the people who can actually make a difference. Have you ever read any of the minutes from the Fans Forum meetings? Obviously not, because if you had then you would realise that just about the only thing they have influence over is the price of pies... they do not dictate how the club should be run or managed.

What good would the FF resigning do anyway, with all due respect, it wouldn't even make the most local of local news. No-one would care because they have such minuscule influence. the only reason they were picked for the Pune trip is because they were the only recognised body of fans who the club knew could be reasonably trusted not to go over to India and kick off at Venky's. How else were the club supposed to pick fans? Go down the pub and choose 9 at random?

[sentient]

oh shut your trap sentient... Why dont YOU start making a difference by not turning on other BRFC fans, and focusing your anger on the people who can actually make a difference. Have you ever read any of the minutes from the Fans Forum meetings? Obviously not, because if you had then you would realise that just about the only thing they have influence over is the price of pies... they do not dictate how the club should be run or managed.

What good would the FF resigning do anyway, with all due respect, it wouldn't even make the most local of local news. No-one would care because they have such minuscule influence. the only reason they were picked for the Pune trip is because they were the only recognised body of fans who the club knew could be reasonably trusted not to go over to India and kick off at Venky's. How else were the club supposed to pick fans? Go down the pub and choose 9 at random?

so little vision. do you even have an imagination?

[ebenrocks]

enough of one to realise that the fans forum is absolutely powerless and that focusing any aggression on them is counter productive and ridiculous.

[sentient]

enough of one to realise that the fans forum is absolutely powerless and that focusing any aggression on them is counter productive and ridiculous.

no agression but I agree they are powerless - except in one respect. They can resign en masse and issue a carefully worded, calculated press statement explaining the dismay that we have with the owners, their actions, their representatives, their manager, their £100m mortgagae, their apparent asset stripping, their MD summoned to court in india for environmental crimes, their general idiocy and dodginess. OR the fans forum members can carry on with their superfan-hubris giving the middle finger to the rest of us!

[ebenrocks]

I guarantee no-one would give a damn if the FF resigned. In the grand scheme of things they are a very small number of fans who meet up every now and again with a couple of (now seemingly equally as powerless) executives and discuss minor issues about the club. That is it. They were taken to India because they were an already organised body of fans the club could trust to be responsible over there, not because the club or owners really cared about their opinions. They met one of the raos for a short amount of time, that was it. Does it, therefore, sound like they were taken over there so the owners could hear their concerns? no, of course not, if the owners gave a shiny sh*te about their concerns they would have been locked in discussions with them from the moment they arrived till the moment they left. It was an absolutely shameless way for Venky's to look like they cared about the fans, that is it.

I promise you, if the FF resigned tomorrow it would not even make local news. Statement or no statement.

Lets move on and start focusing on the people who do have power within the club. Because calling for the FF to resign would be about as effective at sorting out the issues at the club as calling for the tea lady to jump ship would be.

[Tom]

Has anyone from the ff actually said that the pune trip was a mistake?

Why would we say thay? As far as I know none of us think it was a mistake.

A big success? Not at all due to the lack of action from the owners

A mistake? Again no, you have to try these things, nothing negative has come from it in my opinion (obviously yours differs)

This superfan stuff is nonsense, none of us claim to be nor ever have from what I have seen, it's just another stick you have crafted to try and beat us with.

Funnily enough I just bumped into the current chairman of the FF in Morrisons less than an hour ago and raised this exact topic as he avoids all forums and social media, he agreed that it wouldn't even cause a ripple and if anything would deny the fans a platform for some of the minor issues (which still affect people) to be resolved.

Your passion with this particular topic is bizarre to me to say the least, ever since the Pune invite you have come accross as spiteful towards a group you have never shown any interest in before.

[FourLaneBlue]

Well Tris. Anopther week and I come back to the thought. WHAT ARE THE FANS FORUM DOING TO INFLUENCE THINGS? We are in chaos and you just think that the fans forum should be here as long as the club? What sort of arrogance is that?

There is a quote from FLB on another thread where he says that some uber-fans are more interested in their own status than the plight of the club. The ff certainly comes across as a set of people who would rather the club implodes than they admit they have made a mistake. Seems that your trip to india has infected you with the "saving face" virus. Well maybe you should realise that we are going down the drain and your precious ff is not relevant. Use the opportunity to press for the Qatari bid.

Has anyone from the ff actually said that the pune trip was a mistake?

Hang on, that quote of mine was directed at the type of fans who physically attacked Glen Mullan, verbally threatened protestors and generally tried to stop the rights of those protesting to express their opinion in a supposedly free society. It wasn't anything to do with the Fans Forum.

Regarding the idea, there would be no point in the FF resigning as

1. The Fans Forum doesn't represent Rovers fans in any way. They represent themselves as Rovers fans. So, not a lot of point in a small bunch of fans trying to make such a moral stance.

2. They are the only hope of communication between the club and any fans. However, now that Venky's have got what they wanted from them I doubt there will be much more communication in the future.

3. It will be a minor news story at best and forgotten about in a week. The majority of Rovers supporters probably don't even know the FF exists.

So...what would be the point? There might well be a case for the FF publishing a list of questions they would like the owners to answer, but to actually resign en masse would be just shooting themselves in the foot.

Oh, and if ever there was a time for BRISA to be formed, it is RIGHT HERE, RIGHT NOW. Trust me, no way would it be anything like last time. I think that goes without saying, but...well, I said it anyway.

[Tom]

That's shocking to be fair, they had no reason to pay it but once they offered they should see it through.

[Gav]

Uber fan John Pittard has asked me to point out he hasn't seen a penny off Venkys despite the promise, reported here by FF travellers, that his trip would be paid for by them

Speaks volumes doesn't it.

Absolutely disgusting.

[Emge]

Uber fan John Pittard has asked me to point out he hasn't seen a penny off Venkys despite the promise, reported here by FF travellers, that his trip would be paid for by them

Not surprised at all. These people are liars, along with Steve Kean. They are dishonest people who dont give a s*** about anything else than f**** chickens!!!

[beerwins]

Uber fan John Pittard has asked me to point out he hasn't seen a penny off Venkys despite the promise, reported here by FF travellers, that his trip would be paid for by them

Here is the true Slumdog Millionaires in all their splender.

[EwoodDawn]

Speaks volumes doesn't it.

Absolutely disgusting.

I take it that Birdy hasn't been recompensed, either. Add to that Bilaji reneging on the promise to go to his house. There is steam coming out of my ears, I'm so cross that an institution like Birdy has been lied to so blithely.

Andy Cryer or any LT researchers reading this post, could you please publish in your paper how the Venkys have broken their promise (given in person) and left genuine Rovers fans significantly out of pocket (I'm guessing nearer thousands rather than hundreds of pounds)?

[Stuart]

Uber fan John Pittard has asked me to point out he hasn't seen a penny off Venkys despite the promise, reported here by FF travellers, that his trip would be paid for by them

This and the Ians stuff is the reason that the meeting(s) with the FF should have been minuted and released. This could have been whipped out as documentary evidence of any false promises. Wasn't there also an instance with a young lad who was made a false promise early on in their 'reign' (although I think they were eventually shamed into following through).

Seems like they just tell people what they want to hear without thinking about how they'll go about doing. Is this a cultural thing?

[Tom]

I don't think we were ever told about them paying they told them directly which makes it worse