[Archived] Is It Time To Question The Jack Walker Trust?

[Guest Rovers4Good]

The Walker Trust was set up after the great man past away. The trust was made up of business people who weren't making a penny from it and decided to sell. The needed a company to be a broker in the deal to sell the club so the hired Kentaro and this is where the dimise of our club started.

Yes The Walker Trust is to blame (very small part)

Yes the brokers are to blame (big part)

Yes Venky's are to blame (very big part)

Venky's are the problem as they know nothing about football and this is where the problem lies and if they continue to be advised badly then the situation is only going to get worse.

[Mike Graham]

PB, The (hypothetical?) premise of the thread is that Venkys may be in breach of the contract they entered into with Venkys.

Agree with you Jisty, I am just wondereing who would bring a Breach of Contract case against the venkys given that the Trust have had no financial nor reputational loss, nor any benefit to be gained from such a case when they have achieved what they want which is getting out and getting paid.

[Kelbo]

who would take action against who????

The Trust have their money so have no interest in revisiting a venture that they are no longer involved or interested in...so who would they sue and why.

The Venkys have no need to take action against anyone.

PB, I do know that Jack Walkers family are shaken by what has happened and from my information they are not simply standing by and watching!!

[Mike Graham]

PB, I do know that Jack Walkers family are shaken by what has happened and from my information they are not simply standing by and watching!!

that's good Kelbo. I hope that they consider backing a future bid then when the fire damage sale takes place.

[jim mk2]

This is only speculation but I would imagine Jack Walker's descendants and family on the Trust are probably most culpable.

They did not have the same emotional ties to the town and the Rovers as Jack Walker and saw the club as a constant drain on their ever-decreasing legacy. As has been stated, they probably wanted out at any price and were grateful to Venky's for taking the club off their hands.

It is right to question the Trust as the thread says but getting any redress for their actions (or their advisers Rothschild's) is probably impossible.

Better to target Venky's IMO where there must be a case for negligence.

PB, I do know that Jack Walkers family are shaken by what has happened and from my information they are not simply standing by and watching!!

So what are they doing ? I find this hard to believe.

[Stuart]

PB, I do know that Jack Walkers family are shaken by what has happened and from my information they are not simply standing by and watching!!

What does that entail Kelbo? Are they seeking financial damages? I don't imagine them for one second wanting to own the club again.

If nothing else, it would be good to hear from them in support of the club and the fans (especially rhis week) but they didn't speak to us when they were here, so I'm not expecting a statement any time soon.

[Slinky]

Takeover document: http://www.rovers.co.uk/staticFiles/13/64/0,,10303~156691,00.pdf

It looks to me like the Trust did put quite a few clauses in there to ensure that the club was well run.

I disagree that it's their fault we're in this mess, but I would say that they should be doing more to make life difficult for the Venkys now that these obligations have been broken.

I also don't think it was unreasonable for them to try and actively find a buyer who could take the club to the next level. After all, the Trust did not have the financial clout to make huge investment in Rovers, just tide them over until a new buyer could be found.

[Kelbo]

Takeover document: http://www.rovers.co.uk/staticFiles/13/64/0,,10303~156691,00.pdf

It looks to me like the Trust did put quite a few clauses in there to ensure that the club was well run.

I disagree that it's their fault we're in this mess, but I would say that they should be doing more to make life difficult for the Venkys now that these obligations have been broken.

I also don't think it was unreasonable for them to try and actively find a buyer who could take the club to the next level. After all, the Trust did not have the financial clout to make huge investment in Rovers, just tide them over until a new buyer could be found.

Yes, I would go along with that, as you say, I do think that the Trust/Walker family should be looking to bring Venkys to task regarding the takeover document!!

[Nelsta]

I'm the same as a few, I dont hold the Walker trust at fault, With all the smoke that was blown up our backsides when they(venkys)took over.

I imagine the same was done to the trust, Venkys seem the kind of people that will say whatever they think people will want to hear in order for them to get what they want.

[Sysagent]

No. For me the Trust are fully culpable for the demise of this club. Had it not been for John Williams/Mark Hughes/Sam Allardyce we would have been relegated a long time ago with those anonymous trustees running the show. They have betrayed Jack Walker's legacy.

Totally and completely in agreement with the above statement and I have been maintaining this stance / opinion since since the disregard The "Trust" have shown Blackburn Rovers in recent years, culminating into the farce we have now found the club in.

Fair enough I appreciate they are business people, but for Christ's sake this is the legacy their father / Chairman entrusted to them to maintain and nurture as he did, if Rover's was anyone's baby it was Jack Walkers' and it was down to the Trust to bring this infant up to full maturity and bestow upon it a healthy long life, instead they sold it to the equivalent of some foreign Child Slave setup, who just wants to get as much as physically possible out of it until it finally perishes and dies an undeserved and painful death, fallen by the roadside to be forgotten.

This is The Trust's legacy, they should hang their heads in shame and when it comes their time to meet their maker I hope Jack is stood there at the Pearly Gates and reminds them of what they have done to his baby.

Shameful it is... Shameful.

[47er]

I'm assuming the Walker family got what they wanted (cash) and won't do anything.

[bestierover]

I was always told, by a solicitor friend of mine, in the absence of a written agreement, a verbal one is legally binding.

If Venkys stated, which they have done, that they will follow certain proceedures, management structure etc and then they do exactly the opposite (especially so early on in the game) suggests to me that the trust would have grounds to claw back the club due to Venkys not doing as they promised and was widely reported at the time with comments from Desai.

Even the people who went to Pune came back with more belief so the Rao family are real sweet talkers, but then never do what they say they will do!!

Verbal is binding, but not well evidenced (unless a land transfer).

Any breach would have to go to the heart of the deal so as to void it. For example, non payment of monies agreed for consideration of the club.

The trust should not be blamed for Venky's mishandling post their influence.

[jim mk2]

Shameful it is... Shameful.

Shameful probably but do they care ?

If the former Trustees really cared surely they would have made a public statement by now condemning Venky's ?

The Trust were never communicative even when they owned Rovers so don't expect to see one.

[Puffsan]

i hope if we get relegated and are stripped of assets and are under administration, that the walkers trust will step up and invest and make sure we don't rot in league 1/2 like what happened to leeds etc. They owe AT LEAST that to uncle jack.

if we do get relegated, all assets are stripped and we are put into administration i hope we as fans with maybe some profiled contributors like wayne wild and the wec can hire lawyers and look into if we can sue venkys for mismanaging a company, sue FA for failing to create a good fit and proper test, and last look into if the trust has broken Jack Walker's will and sue them for that.

[The Prof.]

It's a while since I did company law but I do remember being drilled in the fact that post contract exclusions (terms) are no terms at all and are unenforceable. I suspect the family are a dissapointed as anyone but the trust were caught in a promise to protect all the assets in the trust and having a loss making asset would not be in the best interests of the trust as a whole - hence they got rid and protected the other assets.

Who benefits from the trust?

[DE.]

I imagine the trust are laying low and praying they are forgotten about in this whole sorry mess. Sad that Jack's custodians will have played such a huge part in the demise of BRFC, intentional or not.

[Amo]

If this was a Biblical story, the Venky's would be the Pharisees, and Jerome Anderson would be Pontius Pilate.

That leaves the Trust as Judas Iscariot. Grabbing their thirty pieces of silver and selling us down the river.

[BiggusLaddus]

And in the film version Kean would be Biggus Dickus.

[Puffsan]

It's a while since I did company law but I do remember being drilled in the fact that post contract exclusions (terms) are no terms at all and are unenforceable. I suspect the family are a dissapointed as anyone but the trust were caught in a promise to protect all the assets in the trust and having a loss making asset would not be in the best interests of the trust as a whole - hence they got rid and protected the other assets.

Who benefits from the trust?

I do not know the excact content of walkers will, but a normal trust fund would mean that some of jacks funds were locked or secured to ensure that his interests were ensured after he passed away. if it comes forward in a lawsuit for instance, that the trust has broken his guidelines and/or interests they can potentially lose their position as trustees, and other people will be assigned to make sure that the premises jack walker made in his will are kept.

As i said i don't know the content of his will, but i will assume the trust has made sure they have done everything in the correct order. Uncle jack probably believed they had some of the same passion for rovers as he had, or that they would honor his will for rovers, and did a poor job when he made his will.

I don't blame the trust for selling us, but in hindsight they should have done alot better job ensuring that the club Jack Walker gave to them to protect was in proper hands

[deftangel]

The trust, Rothschilds and JW must bear some responsibility for our current situation. Their due diligence process has been made a mockery of. Shah had no money, Syed is wanted by Interpol and has well and truly screwed Racing Santander and we got left with Venky's.

This should not detract from the many years they took good care of the club in the correct manner but things were left to slide at the death and they were desperate in the end to offload it to someone. The correct condition in hindsight should have been "No sale".

The least they could do for the fans is some PR to back us up and draw attention to how Venky's have not lived up to their promises 12 months ago.

[Exiled in Toronto]

Absolutely agree that a substantial amount of the blame has to lie with the Trust for the state of the club today. Not just for the decision to flog the club to the first serious buyers that came along, but also for their behaviour in the time they were owners between 2004 and 2010.

When Jack Walker died press statements were released in which the Trust promised to continually invest cash from their other business interests into BRFC, and this wasn't a case of Jack saying 'do it if you want to' but more a case of Jack insisting that money from his business empire found its way into his football club, to enable it to thrive for the forseeable future.

For the first 3 or 4 years after his death the trust appeared to do this, sanctioning transfers like Andy Cole and Corrado Grabbi, both of whom cost in the region of 8 million pounds. This enabled us to win promotion back to the Premier League, finish regularly in the top 10 and win the League Cup.

Unfortunately for us their interpretation of 'forseeable future' was '3 years' and they quickly decided they were not going to follow Jack's wishes and that Jack's profits would not be coming our way. Fairly sure this was in breach of the Trust settlement contract that Jack put in place, although others will know more about this than I do.

The result of this was that the club was left to rot, or at least stagnate for a long period of time. Out went Graeme Souness, the man who had masterminded promotion, cup success and a top 6 finish because he was not allowed to reinvest the proceeds of the Duff/Dunn sales. Mark Hughes inherited a side that had lost its best assets and was struggling and had it not been for his remarkable signings in the transfer market of acquiring the likes of Bellamy, Santa Cruz, McCarthy, Savage, Bentley etc. at knockdown prices and getting them to thrive at the club we probably would have been relegated around 2005. As Mark Hughes had us knocking on the door of the top four for a brief time and regularly reaching cup semi-finals what do the trust do? That's right, rather than doing what any other owner would do and give Hughes just a little bit of cash with which to push the club on, they refuse, allowing Hughes to walk out the door without so much as a fight to keep him. There is no doubt in my mind that if they had handed Hughes say £10 million in 2006 anything could have been possible.

As they continued to flog our best players for a hefty profit without reinvesting any of the proceeds, out went Santa Cruz, Bellamy, Bentley, even Friedel had enough. Very little money was given to Paul Ince to put his own stamp on the squad and the same too to Sam Allardyce, who had the likes of Guti and Van Nistelrooy lined up to come in but would not be supported by the owners.

The Walker Trust had and have lots of money, so nobody is telling me they couldn't afford to support the club. They even allowed the club to gather a £20 million debt which is substantial for a club of our size and would have caused all sorts of problems had we been relegated.

Then we move on to the sale of the club to some Indian chicken farmers. OK, so the Trust couldn't have known (even if they cared) about how things were going to turn out. Yet they had many many meetings with the Indians. Surely it must have dawned on them that nobody in the Venky's organisation had the first idea what they were talking about and that Jerome Anderson had an unhealthy role to play in the whole thing?

No. For me the Trust are fully culpable for the demise of this club. Had it not been for John Williams/Mark Hughes/Sam Allardyce we would have been relegated a long time ago with those anonymous trustees running the show. They have betrayed Jack Walker's legacy.

I find it hard to disagree with much of this, though I'm sure others will.

The key points for me are firstly the change in moving from active to passive to no support by the Trust. I don't buy the "if it was your money would you keep pumping it in?" argument. It was Jack's money. Jack bought the club and Jack created the conditions in which we were chronically loss-making by pumping so much money in. Like it or not, part of Jack's legacy was a loss-making club to go along with a 700 million nest-egg. I still don't see how the beneficiaries feel they can cherry-pick the great man's work; it's not like they would notice the difference financially in their tax-free, mega-rich lifestyles.

Secondly, while the sale process was allegedly being conducted by Rothschild's, and our "ITK-ers" were assuring us Jack's will was consulted on a daily basis to cover the most minute decisions, I think all of us were comfortable that the sales process had been designed to protect the best interests of the club. Didn't the Trust, in one of their arare utterances, say they were looking for someone to continue to build Jack's legacy better than they could? Had we known that the biggest spiv in football was working on a finders' bounty and the will was irrelevant or ignored, there would have been a lot less excitement and a lot more concern during the sale process.

The three buyers we know were in the frame (excluding Philipl's alleged other 4) would surely have rung alarm bells with anyone who had the club's interests even slightly at heart. A seemingly earnest but broke Indian chancer; a billionaire with no assets or past; and a chicken farming family who had never seen a football match. You could not have made up a list like that. Add in the fact that said spiv was the eventual buyer's main advisor and it gets even worse.

When the sale was complete I for one was very surprised that the only binding conditions in the sale related to the physical manifestations of Jack: his name on the stand and his statue. I thought at the time this looked like the minimum possible lip-service being paid to his football legacy, but assumed there must be much more out of the public domain. Apparently not. Since then their silence has spoken volumes. Or did they also sign a confidentiality agreement for some financial benefit like all the others who supposedly had our interests, rather than their bank balances, at heart?

If we do a roll call of who has done well out of this tragedy, it makes grim reading:

Walker Trust: +25 million

Anderson: +X million in obscenely inflated fees

Players: +Y million in fatter contracts

Raos: Dunno but they are certainly sitting on a paper profit in event of fire sale

Allardyce/Williams et al: Big fat payoffs for keeping their gobs shut

Kean: Doubled or tripled his pay and got the keys to the kingdom

Fans: shat on

[T4E]

You can "question" the Walker Trust as much as you like, but its a waste of time as we all know they wont make any comment on the matter. They never spoke when they owned the club, why would they do so now?

Just another complete waste of time and effort for no reward.

[Stuart]

Great posts by jehrover and EiT.

[PAFELL]

You can "question" the Walker Trust as much as you like, but its a waste of time as we all know they wont make any comment on the matter. They never spoke when they owned the club, why would they do so now?

Just another complete waste of time and effort for no reward.

Maybe they would respond.if local paper asked.the question on the front page. After all, the answers.are relevant for the whole town as well.Wayne club..Question.need to be asked and answered.

[Stuart]

Maybe they would respond.if local paper asked.the question on the front page. After all, the answers.are relevant for the whole town as well.Wayne club..Question.need to be asked and answered.

Do you wire your posts via telegram