[Archived] Where is John Williams?

[Wendal]

I expect JW won't want to breach any agreements or even confidences. No way will I question his integrity.

However, a message of support for a Blackburn Rovers fan base, with no previous for the current scenes, would go a long way - especially with the fans themselves. A very carefully worded statement could surely be drafted and published via the LT?

I would be very surprised if JW isn't extremely disappointed that all of those years of toil he spent, preventing exactly this kind of scenario, have been blown away in little over a year.

Maybe John feels as betrayed by The Trust as we do?

This is exactly my point.

I appreciate some agreement may have been signed but surely that wouldn't cover those things which hadn't yet come to pass.

I don't see what kind of agreement JW could sign that would prevent him from making broad comments on goings on at the club since his departure.

His intervention via some sort of a statement would make a huge difference.

If he is feeling let down by the trust/Venkys then apathy is not the best way to deal with it.

'all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing'

The Rovers fans certainly aren't sitting back so what about JW and co, it's time to step up.

[Hughesy]

Will be bound by a NDA - end of topic

[blackburnblue]

I am not trying to stir the pot but I genuinely don't know the answer to the following question.

Did anything ever come of the Givet £250,000 to a driver scandal?

I pressume it was sorted on Givet's side as he is still at the club but were there any wider investigations?

It was all over the papers the week we played Wolves but it seems to have fizzled out and I have not heard a lot about it since.

It is a major issue and whilst I am in no way saying Williams was involved the plain fact is that it happened on his watch and I have never really heard any explanation about it.

I too viewed Williams as a saint up to that point but there are too many unanswered questions for me now.

[sam_rovers]

It would be unprofessional to say anything. He found another job, and I for one don't blame him. All the best to him

[Kamy100]

I am not trying to stir the pot but I genuinely don't know the answer to the following question.

Did anything ever come of the Givet £250,000 to a driver scandal?

I pressume it was sorted on Givet's side as he is still at the club but were there any wider investigations?

It was all over the papers the week we played Wolves but it seems to have fizzled out and I have not heard a lot about it since.

It is a major issue and whilst I am in no way saying Williams was involved the plain fact is that it happened on his watch and I have never really heard any explanation about it.

I too viewed Williams as a saint up to that point but there are too many unanswered questions for me now.

If there was anything dodgy about it then the FA would have launched a formal investigation, they looked into it but didn't take it any further.

[blackburnblue]

If there was anything dodgy about it then the FA would have launched a formal investigation, they looked into it but didn't take it any further.

Is that what happened? Givet seemed pretty convinced that something wrong had happened. I read about it in some detail the week leading up to the Wolves game and I am somewhat surprised it has just been brushed under the carpet.

[Amo]

Why do people seem intent on trying to pass the blame on to others. JW did an amazing job for the club. He was forced out by Anderson and Venkys seeking to undermine his skills and ability.

Sorry, Modes, I don't see where anyone has blamed JW for this mess. People would just appreciate him speaking out at the current state of our club. Yet that won't happen because he sold his silence to Venky's. JW was a brilliant chairman for the club but people have put him on a ridiculous pedestal. No more so than when several members paid tribute to him with their avatars.

If we were to demand comments from anyone I would think a collective statement from the Walker Trust on the breaking of the terms of sale would be in order. However I doubt that is likely until Venkys have run us into the ground and then either the Trust or someone else can scoop us up at a fraction of the price and rebuild us. Probably with JW returning.

That's cause The Trust are an illuminati who people know little about and barely said a word during their time in charge of the club. Hoping for any answers from them is like chasing rainbows.

[Kamy100]

Is that what happened? Givet seemed pretty convinced that something wrong had happened. I read about it in some detail the week leading up to the Wolves game and I am somewhat surprised it has just been brushed under the carpet.

Givet being convinced about wrong doing and the reality are two completely different things. Fact is FA looked at it and decided no case to answer, there is no way it would've been brushed under the carpet if there was evidence of wrong doing. In public all you have heard is Givet's version of events.

[ewoodeagle]

Will be bound by a NDA - end of topic

amen to that.... a true gent of the game.

I believe he is in some advising capacity at Man City I thought he would of got the CEO job when Gary Cook left but nothing official yet.

on another subject Tom Finn, the other Musketeer is still a regular visitor to Ewood Park. Can only think they are still in contact and have their own views about how years of hard work by them both have been undone and ruined by Venkys, SEM and Jerome Anderson in 12 months.

Just had a look at the LET report on Mrs D’s reason for John’s departure “he didn't get on with Steve Kean” not surprised he knew what a rat he was in getting Sam the sack “lost interest in the role” what role was that?? Ordering the team’s training kit. Venkys (and this has been said by many before and will be said many more times again) are a complete JOKE. They had everything going for them when they took over this place.

A premiership club with minimal debts

A management team both on and off the pitch capable of top ten finishes and with moderate investment could push on for cup and Europa League qualifying finishes.

OK I didn't like Sam’s way of football but he has never in any job he has been in been given time and money to try and put things right, he’s had to scrimp and rely on frees and loans and favours. Favours of which we are unlikely to get with Kean and Anderson running the show.

Sorry this has turned into a rant but I just feel that these idiots from Pune had the makings and the opportunity to take the club forward whilst realising their own marketing dreams for their companies.

If only there was someone who could have spelled it out to them in simple terms. You provide the money and the backing and we’ll provide the success and coverage you want for Venkys.

a horrible sorry mess

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Something seriously rotten is going on in football and it is difficult not to think everyone has their nose in the trough.

Sadly, I dont think you are too far from the truth there blackburnblue.

[Rover_Shaun]

JW like Sam sold his silence for cash. End of worship!

[imy9]

I have been critical of a few things that JW has done in the past but no question he did an excellent job for Rovers and no one should question his integrity by labelling him 'bent' with no proof.

[Steve Moss]

JW like Sam sold his silence for cash. End of worship!

First, don't worship another human being. It's unseemly.

Second, JW agreeing to hold his silence for a small time (1 year if Sam is anything to go by) is not disreputable. It gives the new owners a chance to get things rolling to their liking without having to fear verbal sniping from prior management. It was the gentlemanly thing to do.

Third, JW was the chairman. He's in a fiduciary relationship to the stockholders. He is required to keep quite as to the inner workings in order to safeguard their interests.

Finally, taking cash and honoring a contract to do what a gentleman would do in any event is a no brainer. I'd certainly give them a year to clean up their act before commenting.

[Amo]

Second, JW agreeing to hold his silence for a small time (1 year if Sam is anything to go by) is not disreputable. It gives the new owners a chance to get things rolling to their liking without having to fear verbal sniping from prior management. It was the gentlemanly thing to do.

If that was the case, he could've kept his opinion to himself without being paid for it.

[ewoodeagle]

JW like Sam sold his silence for cash. End of worship!

what was else he supposed to do though...... just sit there and push pencils whilst all of the decision making regarding club affairs was shifted to Pune and Kentaro/SEM.

youre the chairman and the football manager/coach doesn't answer to you anymore, you no longer have control or conduct in contracts. your told to sack a manager you brought in to steady the ship on the pitch (and i am not talking about Benni McCarthy)

you can't accept a paid football agent is doing most of your work for you and leaving you totally in the dark about things happening within the club.

so at the end youve no power anymore, you are gently squeezed out, no trips to Pune to discuss strategy, transfer budgets & commercial direction in which new owners want to take the club.

No board meetings to discuss above topics and to air opinions because the fat Swiss agent has his feet firmly under the table next to Mrs Desai whispering sweet nothings in her ear whilst his new favoured bald client sits there and takes lessons in positive spin classes from the clubs now hammered PR department.

What's a guy to do eh..... say you want to leave because you no longer have a role... you are offered a severance package and more or less placed on gardening leave and made to sign a NDA easy thing to do... with a heavy heart...

I don't worship JW but I at least respect the fact that he was more or less pushed out by certain people

[Amo]

I have no problem with Allardyce being paid off. He was only a manager, a mercenary like all the rest. Can't blame him for wanting to take the cash and put the sorry affair behind him. But JW was at the club for 13 years and considered 'Mr. Blackburn'. It was disgusting how Venky's forced him out of the club, especially when they had no intention of replacing him, but you'd think a man of JW's supposed integrity wouldn't be bought off. You'd think he'd want the first available opportunity to decry what Venky's have done to the club. This doesn't surprise me in the least, but hopefully it'll wake up his fanclub.

[PAFELL]

This is exactly my point.

I appreciate some agreement may have been signed but surely that wouldn't cover those things which hadn't yet come to pass.

I don't see what kind of agreement JW could sign that would prevent him from making broad comments on goings on at the club since his departure.

His intervention via some sort of a statement would make a huge difference.

If he is feeling let down by the trust/Venkys then apathy is not the best way to deal with it.

'all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing'

The Rovers fans certainly aren't sitting back so what about JW and co, it's time to step up.

Maybe the agreement is he won't say anything bad about venkys, kean.

Well as there is nothing good to say about the owners or kean.

JW has nothing to say.

[den]

I have no problem with Allardyce being paid off. He was only a manager, a mercenary like all the rest. Can't blame him for wanting to take the cash and put the sorry affair behind him. But JW was at the club for 13 years and considered 'Mr. Blackburn'. It was disgusting how Venky's forced him out of the club, especially when they had no intention of replacing him, but you'd think a man of JW's supposed integrity wouldn't be bought off. You'd think he'd want the first available opportunity to decry what Venky's have done to the club. This doesn't surprise me in the least, but hopefully it'll wake up his fanclub.

I guess he could have declined a clause tieing him to his silence [if that is what he's actually done Topman. We don't know whether he has, or hasn't do we?].

All that would have done was cost him a heck of a lot of money, just so he could have told the fans and media what we found out pretty damn quick anyway.

Would you have turned that down? I wouldn't.

[trueblueroversiloveu]

I guess he could have declined a clause tieing him to his silence [if that is what he's actually done Topman. We don't know whether he has, or hasn't do we?].

All that would have done was cost him a heck of a lot of money, just so he could have told the fans and media what we found out pretty damn quick anyway.

Would you have turned that down? I wouldn't.

He would of been well within his rights to decline a clause, i know it's pretty much standard procedure nowadays, but surely he would of still got his payoff? John Williams however great a job he did sold the club down the river imo. The whole walker trust couldn't give a toss and wanted out as fast as possible, i bet williams got a fair amount of cash for the sale and any reservations he had where put to one side? I ain't saying that any of the above could have saw whats happening, BUT they all lined their pockets and not said a WORD since

[xtp]

He would of been well within his rights to decline a clause, i know it's pretty much standard procedure nowadays, but surely he would of still got his payoff? John Williams however great a job he did sold the club down the river imo. The whole walker trust couldn't give a toss and wanted out as fast as possible, i bet williams got a fair amount of cash for the sale and any reservations he had where put to one side? I ain't saying that any of the above could have saw whats happening, BUT they all lined their pockets and not said a WORD since

Considering it was John Williams who wanted to leave, he wouldn't have had any right to a payoff whatsoever (unless he wanted to take it to court and make a case for constructive dismissal, which would have been very difficult to prove and extremely messy for the club). I'm not sure what people expect Williams to have done. Become voluntarily unemployed with no guaranteed income or security at all, just so he could fill one back column with a pop at Venky's that would have been fish and chip paper within 24 hours?

Instead, he entered into negotations and agreed a deal that he will have thought was in the best interests of both parties. It's quite understandable that new adminsistrators wouldn't want old adminstrators commenting on their every decision. I work as a teacher and one of the hardest things you have to do is come into a new job and pick up a class who've been taught by a teacher who was brilliant and respected. If that teacher popped his head round the door and gave his opinion on my teaching every two seconds, it would be next to impossible. In short, there are sound human and business reasons why these clauses are standard procedure and John Williams had no idea how badly things would go wrong when he signed the clause.

As far as I'm concerned, John Williams was brilliant in his role, but did drop the odd clanger. Unfortunately, unlike the error with bringing in Paul Ince, there's nothing he can do to correct the error of selling to Venky's. Despite that, I respect him a lot. For me, John Williams did as much for this club as a Shearer or a Friedel. He kept us up against the odds for a very long time. And I will always be grateful for that.

Edited: From what Kamy's said, the non-disclosure clause seems to be an agreement to avoid commenting on the club for a set period of time. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[stuwilky]

He would of been well within his rights to decline a clause, i know it's pretty much standard procedure nowadays, but surely he would of still got his payoff? John Williams however great a job he did sold the club down the river imo. The whole walker trust couldn't give a toss and wanted out as fast as possible, i bet williams got a fair amount of cash for the sale and any reservations he had where put to one side? I ain't saying that any of the above could have saw whats happening, BUT they all lined their pockets and not said a WORD since

What evidence on any level is there that Mr Williams received any money from the sale of the club? Is he a beneficiary of the trust? Was he a shareholder?

What a ridiculous thing to say.

As for the NDA - I suspect that it is likely that it was an inbuilt part of his contract of employment from the outset of his employment.

[gumboots]

JW was not a saint. which of us is? He made wrong decisions in his time at Rovers, but he got a heck of a lot more right than wrong, kept us as a well-run PL team and worked hard at relations with fans and all those connected with Rovers. I'd take him back in a heartbeat to run our club properly for us though I doubt there is much chance of his ever wanting to come back. The Raos have ruined the job he did in record time and it must be heartbreaking for him to sit back and watch it happen. To criticise him for not speaking out seems churlish in the extreme. What is he meant to do or say? Noting he can do to make it any better so best he does and says nothing.

[blackburnblue]

JW was not a saint. which of us is? He made wrong decisions in his time at Rovers, but he got a heck of a lot more right than wrong, kept us as a well-run PL team and worked hard at relations with fans and all those connected with Rovers. I'd take him back in a heartbeat to run our club properly for us though I doubt there is much chance of his ever wanting to come back. The Raos have ruined the job he did in record time and it must be heartbreaking for him to sit back and watch it happen. To criticise him for not speaking out seems churlish in the extreme. What is he meant to do or say? Noting he can do to make it any better so best he does and says nothing.

Is it impossible to believe that the Givet £250,000 to a driver story was purposely leaked to warn the old guard those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones?

I am racking my brains but I really can't think of any other reason John Williams doesn't pass comment on Venky's and Steve Kean.

[trueblueroversiloveu]

Considering it was John Williams who wanted to leave, he wouldn't have had any right to a payoff whatsoever (unless he wanted to take it to court and make a case for constructive dismissal, which would have been very difficult to prove and extremely messy for the club). I'm not sure what people expect Williams to have done. Become voluntarily unemployed with no guaranteed income or security at all, just so he could fill one back column with a pop at Venky's that would have been fish and chip paper within 24 hours?

Instead, he entered into negotations and agreed a deal that he will have thought was in the best interests of both parties. It's quite understandable that new adminsistrators wouldn't want old adminstrators commenting on their every decision. I work as a teacher and one of the hardest things you have to do is come into a new job and pick up a class who've been taught by a teacher who was brilliant and respected. If that teacher popped his head round the door and gave his opinion on my teaching every two seconds, it would be next to impossible. In short, there are sound human and business reasons why these clauses are standard procedure and John Williams had no idea how badly things would go wrong when he signed the clause.

As far as I'm concerned, John Williams was brilliant in his role, but did drop the odd clanger. Unfortunately, unlike the error with bringing in Paul Ince, there's nothing he can do to correct the error of selling to Venky's. Despite that, I respect him a lot. For me, John Williams did as much for this club as a Shearer or a Friedel. He kept us up against the odds for a very long time. And I will always be grateful for that.

Edited: From what Kamy's said, the non-disclosure clause seems to be an agreement to avoid commenting on the club for a set period of time. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Well put, didn't realise John Williams WASN'T sacked it was a "mutual" thing, still believe he recieved handsome £££'s for the sale (may be wrong but wasn't he an advisor to the walker trust?)

[The Prof.]

What an odd post. Forget NDA's, silencing orders, gags.

If JW blabbed he would never work in football again.

If he got money to keep his mouth shut - which he would have done anyway - the good for him. Ay least someone has managed to screw ove the Pune loones.

Well done JW. A true gent.