[Archived] Fans Forum Statement

[PAFELL]

If the FF only talk about pies, the price of ale and such like, why do they need 'dialogue with the owners' at all? Shouldn't chatting with Paul Hunt et al suffice? Or have they got ideas above their station?

I stand to be corrected. But when the FF was first started, it was about price of beer, pies etc. But it was venkys who invited them over to Pune. The FF did not appraoch venkys requesting an invite. The FF were invited. Both parties in my view should and need to continue what was briefly started. It is possible that because the FF have been to Pune that is where venkys will re-start communication with fans. For the simple reason they have met them as individuals.

I do not think it fair to say the FF elevated themselves. But it could be said that venkys, by inviting them over to Pune, elevated the FF. Venkys, like others may even have misunderstood what the FF was set up for in the first place. which was why they invited them to Pune.

It is strange for years nobody had issues with the FF until venkys came along and the pune trip. Now they get abused as a forum.

[Silittl]

Fernhurst Rover I would take a look back at the tweet the other night we have opened up to everyone to offer alternative ideas. One of which you offered and in my eyes the god cop bad cop idea was aimed at derailing BRAG.

However I do see the benefits of a unified approach it just seems that the FF want to go it alone until speaking with otjhr FF members whilst other forums and websites have joined together as one voice on the main issues and what needs to happen.

Some form of action needs to take place one the that is inclusive of every fan.

What that is we have some ideas but we also require more ideas from every corner.

A weak statement by the FF trying not to Upset the Rao family is disgraceful.

[PAFELL]

Fernhurst Rover I would take a look back at the tweet the other night we have opened up to everyone to offer alternative ideas. One of which you offered and in my eyes the god cop bad cop idea was aimed at derailing BRAG.

However I do see the benefits of a unified approach it just seems that the FF want to go it alone until speaking with otjhr FF members whilst other forums and websites have joined together as one voice on the main issues and what needs to happen.

Some form of action needs to take place one the that is inclusive of every fan.

What that is we have some ideas but we also require more ideas from every corner.

A weak statement by the FF trying not to Upset the Rao family is disgraceful.

When will you understand the more you antagonise them the more they will dig their heals in. Yes it is daft of them, but that is how they do things. As can be seen ever since they have been at rovers.

[yoda]

When will you understand the more you antagonise them the more they will dig their heals in. Yes it is daft of them, but that is how they do things. As can be seen ever since they have been at rovers.

I thought they were business people, disgusting attitude,

Its like saying our customers don't like us so we will not give them what they want

[OscarRaven]

OscarRaven - do you know any of the FF personally?

No I don't - why would I 'understand' them better if I did?

I'm aware of some of them as thier profile was blown up as a result of them being seen as representitives of the fans and quite frankly I'm amazed that the sensible ones stick by those who's 'Venky romance' has clearly distorted thier judgement!

I'm afraid when the local Newspaper & MP stand up and be counted (historically neutral parties) and yet this group of so called group of supporters representatives can't even sign up to a politely worded statement of discontent.

I've no axe to grind and all this leaving the door open bull is ridiculous, keep quiet if thats what you want. Dont't dilute what should be a clear message.

They no longer have a mandate, no longer have credibilty and no longer have a role, they should no longer be entertained at the club.

[PAFELL]

I thought they were business people, disgusting attitude,

Its like saying our customers don't like us so we will not give them what they want

Yes it maybe a very very strange way of doing things. Yes in my opinion daft also. But they hold all the cards. They have remained silent, no matter who says anything to them or about them. Everybody else is fustrated about the situation, yet by their silence, they seem unflustered.

Bascially they are saying to everybody, it is their business and they will run it as they want to do so. Which is what they are doing.

[Ste B]

Ste B I am fully aware of the agreement and could not attend for personal reasons. However the constitution will be sorted tonight hopefully at the first committee meeting.

In addition neither should our constitution hold up a process that is very much needed and quickly.

Unity is required but so is open and honest dialogue between all groups and forums! As above I have openly aired my views on the FF and in person to certain members!

I am not trying create divide but be honest. BRAG have made mistakes and we will openly admit that. However we are still evolving as a group.

I apologise if my posts seem aggressive but I am someone who says what I think.

I am happy to meet or discuss anything with any group. But as fans we need to create one voice and become more inclusive in any action that is taken at the VILLA game. If any is taken at all.

I dont agree obviously, but appreciate your candour here. Fact is that when all is going on at the club then emotions run high. Theres always more than one way to achieve something, IMHO taking an aggressive approach to the owners will only serve to keep them away. We ALL need them back to the table.

[ABBEY]

When will you understand the more you antagonise them the more they will dig their heals in. Yes it is daft of them, but that is how they do things. As can be seen ever since they have been at rovers.

and can you prove this statement or is it just your view? or just more look at me im here typing again?

[OscarRaven]

and can you prove this statement or is it just your view? or just more look at me im here typing again?

How ironic a post.

[ABBEY]

Yes it maybe a very very strange way of doing things. Yes in my opinion daft also. But they hold all the cards. They have remained silent, no matter who says anything to them or about them. Everybody else is fustrated about the situation, yet by their silence, they seem unflustered.

Bascially they are saying to everybody, it is their business and they will run it as they want to do so. Which is what they are doing.

JHC when noone was on their case and they did go in the papers alls they talked was bollux anyway.ie.champions league ,beckham,riquelme,ronny,maradonna ,top 8 and this season to win a cup.

Which way do you want lets all ignore them and let em talk crap and do nowt or try and stir em and still do nowt.

THEY ARE SCUM AND KILLING OUR CLUB AND WHY IN GODS NAME SHOULD WE LET THEM KILL IT SLOWLY?

[PAFELL]

and can you prove this statement or is it just your view? or just more look at me im here typing again?

Yes I can. Have venkys up to now done anything the protestors have asked for - NO

There is the evidence. No chairman, no manager change, no communication. All requested and demanded by those protesting. Venkys have not given in to any of the demands. That is the proof for all to see.

I have said over and over, there is reason to protest. But venkys will not give in to demands - which is what protests are. Therefore another approach is needed.

[ABBEY]

I dont agree obviously, but appreciate your candour here. Fact is that when all is going on at the club then emotions run high. Theres always more than one way to achieve something, IMHO taking an aggressive approach to the owners will only serve to keep them away. We ALL need them back to the table.

STE ,THEY AINT COMING BACK..if they was they would have done something after the bolton game or the sevener.They dont give a crap.

Yes I can. Have venkys up to now done anything the protestors have asked for - NO

There is the evidence. No chairman, no manager change, no communication. All requested and demanded by those protesting. Venkys have not given in to any of the demands. That is the proof for all to see.

I have said over and over, there is reason to protest. But venkys will not give in to demands - which is what protests are. Therefore another approach is needed.

GO ON NAME THE APPROACH NEEDED THEN SEEING AS YOU KNOW EVERYTHING...WHAT DID THEY DO BEFORE THE PROTESTS TO HELP US??????????

[Ste B]

STE ,THEY AINT COMING BACK..if they was they would have done something after the bolton game or the sevener.They dont give a crap.

You may be right. They certainly wont be at this moment given the atmosphere around the place (and I'm absolutely not blaming BRAG for this, the Wigan and Bolton stuff would have happened whatever).

[ABBEY]

but the atmoshere is all down to them tho.Theyve ruined us.

[SAS]

Think the people calling the statement a disgrace are going a bit OTT.

We need to remember these people are the only ones to have had communication with the Rao's, and the only ones to tell them in person what was (HAS) happened.

They forewarned the current situation.

[Tom]

Think the people calling the statement a disgrace are going a bit OTT.

We need to remember these people are the only ones to have had communication with the Rao's, and the only ones to tell them in person what was (HAS) happened.

They forewarned the current situation.

That we did, I can say that 100% because I said the words to Balaji Rao that if action wasnt taken the anger would turn on them. It had 0 effect evidently.

The problem is because we couldn't have it minuted people had to take our word for is and there is a lack of trust everywhere around the club at the minute so its understandable people are cautious about it.

[sentient]

Fans forum is now so irrelevant that there isn't any point in further debate. Totally impotent is a good description.

They may as well have posted an image of a mars bar wrapper for all the impact that statement will make.

Keep up the good work lads! Tom, when you quitting?

[Glenn]

I do wish some people would actually have a little faith that we actually have the club's fan's best interests at heart and can see a bigger picture. There are many ways to approach the resolution of our current situation, BRAG are taking one, the FF another, other groups a different one altogether. Ultimately it doesn't matter which one works as one of them does, but given the state we're in, I'd rather cover every angle.

I'm as angry as everyone else, but if dialogue with the owners can be resumed, then until a better option comes along (or somebody can talk them into a better option that may already be in the shadows), then that just compliments every other group's attempts to bring about a resolution. It's not a bloody competition, we all want the same thing, it's just different ways of skinning the same cat.

Frankly, I'm actually impressed that some of my FF colleagues convinced me to face the inevitable backlash in the hope that if other attempts to resolve things fail, at least this one has been explored. Frankly, personally, it would have been a lot lot easier to say "sod it, I'm going to vent my true feelings from the rooftops", but realistically, the only person that could possibly benefit from that is me.

I do have one question for BRAG though now. I wasn't at the meeting, but the reports I got back were you wanted to see an umbrella group to unite all the fans under (something worthy that I've tried to do myself on a few occasions) and you saw the Supporters Trust has the way to do this. Is this no longer the case and you now see BRAG as the one true voice? I have to put my cards on the table, as after hearing about the need for a uniting group (and after learning I couldn't stand for a post within BRAG) I set wheels in motion to get BRST moving forwards a little quicker. This seems pointless if we become competition to BRAG rather than working with them?

[Tom]

Keep up the good work lads! Tom, when you quitting?

I was on the brink of leaving recently and never hid that, after talking with a few people including the secretary of the FF, one of the main men in BRAG and Paul Hunt (who expressed a strong desire to want to work with the FF) I decided to give it one more meeting to see if it's still something I want to be involved with and I feel worthwhile.

I was one of the people vying for a stronger approach and if I had my way we would have possibly steamed in, cut all ties with the club and ended up no better off anyway, it may have made a few of us feel better but with no tangible results.

Not sure why the need to target me for answers directly on a public forum though Sentient.

[Paul]

Given the FF remit and the wide diversity of opinion in the group I don't see anything to object to in the statement.

What is needed as a matter of real urgency is a body which the support can unite behind. We don't appear to have one at present?

[sentient]

Not sure why the need to target me for answers directly on a public forum though Sentient.

Fair point.

I mentioned your name because you seemed to be the one "taking the flak / providing the pr" previously and disageements on this matter have been with yourself in the main. There is nothing personal in it. As you know I have posted previously that I think you were trying to square the circle of FF rep with wanting to do something more substantive.

I understand the purported reasons for ff actions since the pune trip. I just happen to disagree and think a much more robust and united approach to this matter from the start would have yielded much better results. As a result, I have been robust in my approach on here - it is the club we love after all and "by all means possible" comes to mind.

As it is now I believe the ff is an irrelevance, and has been ever since the pune trip. But if the ff believe different fine. However, perhaps they would have been better served remaining silent until they have something concrete to talk about?

[Tom]

Thanks for the response and for explaining it all, anytime I have been seemingly providing PR or being a mouthpiece its only because I tend to be on a lot not because I have been appointed to do so.

I think Glenn made a fair point when he said people are only doing what they think is right, everyone has a right to criticise the decisions and direction but one or two comments I think to be a bit more personal and uncalled for IMO.

[Ste B]

However, perhaps they would have been better served remaining silent until they have something concrete to talk about?

Also a fair point, but then given that people are asking the FF what their position is then something had to come out.

That doesnt mean that the people on the FF are pro venkys or anything ridiculous like that.

[47er]

Personally the statement is factually incorrect as the FF claim to represent the fans. How can a group so out of touch with the fans, not elected democratically by fans claim to represent the view of the fans.

Secondly this statement is not only very weak but in my opinion but far to soft and full of desperation and sucking up to Mrs D. If the FF had taken a stronger stance earlier, signed the joint statement they may have got far more respect. In addition there would have been no need for new groups like the BRFC Action Group to start. Though if my memory serves me correctly it was a was someone on the here who encouraged the Glen Mullan to start the protests in the first instance and given advice by other memebers of BRFCS.

So in short we in the Action Group get slated for protesting but it was people on involved in this forum who encouraged it to start. In addition it is our work and communication with Local MP's that assisted in Graham Jones MP's statement in Parliment. So those who criticise us for not getting anywhere. At least we are keeping the plight in the public eye. Unlike the FF who have sat on there backsides doing nothing and when they do it is about as much use as a chocolate fire guard.(with the exception of a couple in the FF who have tried to take a stance but got told to keep quiet)

Significantly, when members of the Fans Forum went to Pune, we were told by them, in no uncertain terms, that they were not representing the fans, they were invited as individuals and representing only themselves.

The statement reads like one of those Commonwealth Conference communiques where no agreement was reached but they have to put something out anyway. Not impressed.

[ruggles1995]

dont know if this has been mentioned but heres a thought -

Mr Wild and co want to try and sort a fans buyout from the venkys. The venkys will not be selling due to stubboness. So why not propose to take %51 of the club over leaving the venkys with %49 of the club taking a backseat like there doing now, this leaves us running the club with the proper fit directors, chairman etc, and venkys keep their named brand as part of this football club. Has any1 thought about this kind of proposal to the venkys?? or has it all been sell sell sell and clear off. I would say this is probably the only way thats got maybe any chance of happening.

(I dont know whether this was the right thread to post this on so sorry if it isnt)