[Archived] BRST Meeting with Supporters Direct

[mark1875]

In response to the original question posted by Andy Neil, My reasons for attending today's meeting was due to the fact, Duncan invited representation from the Action Group, albeit that we had to push for this once this meeting became public knowledge. I do not believe I need a reason to attend meetings of a group (a group which your unelected secretary claims "will do me proud"). My initial thoughts following this meeting are that the group's public intentions differ from those they share behind closed doors. To quote your secretary "Lots of hard work for BRST in the next three weeks but I promise we will be as open and transparent as possible, From now until then all our efforts will be placed on advertising, leaflets, website construction and more importantly drawing up our mission statement etc.", I propose the question that as you have been trying to form this over a period of 18 months why has a mission statement and the direction of the group not been decided as of yet, despite the fact you have been meeting on an 'every other week' basis in the last 3 months.

Blackburn Rovers football club is to some of us a seven day a week job, it appeared to me that your lack of pro-activeness is a massive part in why people had forgotten you exist, If the leadership of the trust were those sat around the table today, then the supporters trust will never be nothing more than a name. It was even mentioned by those present the need for people such as Glen Mullan, to be on board to lead the group forward, so at least it acknowledged that the lack of effort from those involved will not see the group progress.

When asked about your plans for your forthcoming launch party, you all looked clueless. It appeared to me that when the supporters direct lady spoke with suggestions of your groups remit, she was speaking to 6 nodding dogs, it was very apparent that those probable committee members at the table, lacked leadership, inspiration, direction and organisation. In the last 10 months since your last transparent meeting (which I attend), our club has fallen to pieces whilst you have held meetings to secretly elect a committee, when this was questioned last week it was suggested this was an interim committee until the group became endorsed. It was today confirmed, (something you have as yet have failed to disclose) that your unelected interim committee will sit on behalf of the supporters for a minimum of 6 months.

Transparency when represented is key, Transparency over the last ten months have been lacking. I have been very interested over the last 10 days to read your public backing of the B.R.S.I.T initiatives, backing which I today witnessed you do not share behind closed doors. The BRFC Action Group and the people involved in the B.R.S.I.T initiative will never be placed "on a lead" as was suggested today. These are two groups which have pro-actively promoted change for the better of Blackburn Rovers Football Club, whilst you have suggested they remain silent behind closed doors, as were evident today.

Backing something publicly then ridiculing it behind closed doors and Forming a group, then later forming a plan are the 2 main reasons why the Supporters Trust will never work. I today found out, due to my concern that the BRST's intentions are to own upto a 20% share in Blackburn Rovers football club. This to my knowledge has never been shared amongst the general supporter, however it was spoken about today like it had been the pipeline from day one.

The most horrific part of the meeting for me was to see 6 people nodding in agreement when the supporter’s direct representative said "relegation would be great for the supporters trust". Whilst I acknowledge that any group who opposes Venkys would be justified in the event of relegation, it is difficult to witness members of these groups, personally thinking relegation would be a good thing.

I was so disgusted I refused to stay behind once the meeting had finished to even listen to people justify the comments they made. Today further justified to myself personally the reasons I joined the Action Group as oppose to waiting for a group who are clearly out of touch with the supporters they are funded to represent.

The lack of professionalism was even noted by the lady from Supporters Direct when the legal documentation was handed over, having been filled in RED PEN, this was cringeworthy and embarrassing but sadly it set the tone for the remainder of the meeting.

[Stuart]

Mark, I'm sure you had your reasons for posting that but I wish you'd have slept on it first.

This is like Simon's thread all over again.

If you had the time to stay up and post this on here, I wish you could have stayed behind and had it out in private instead of angrily stomping off home.

This is not building bridges or trying to unite the groups together. You are going to come across people you don't feel meet you exacting standards and you have to find a way to swallow your pride and work with them - for the sake of the thing you care do passionately about - BRFC.

Claiming to represent the action group and being so critical of the trust by mocking them in public is a backward step.

Did last week just not happen??.

[Majiball]

Given GM's and other members of the action groups calls for unity and peace, one could quite easily apply a number of your comments to yourself.

[Tom]

I think the original post came from Facebook as a response to one of the BRST members asking how he found the meeting. For me it would have all been better discussed privately.

I have to agree though not sure why it's here as again it could be looked at as BRAG trying to discredit another group. I was slightly concerned with the rationale behind recording the meeting on your phone unless it was at the request of the BRST member it seems a little dishonest somehow to me (although like I said maybe it was an agreed thing with everyone at the meeting)

Having said all that you possibly have some valid concerns and I'm sure on of the BRST members will come on and hopefully respond.

[dcbrfc]

I'm getting sick and tired of all this. I don't have the time to help set up a supporters trust only for it to be slagged off all the time as if there is some sort of hidden agenda. What possible reason could I have for wanting to get this off the ground, apart from to help the fans of the club?

My main annoyance is the questions: "Why is there no agenda?" and "Why is there an unelected committee?" ... The unelected committee is temporary and only to get the trust off the ground. Once it is up and running, we recruit members, and once there are enough members, there is an election.

Surely then it would be best to set the agenda. When the board is fully democratically elected. Who am I, and the rest of our small group, to decide what our agenda will be?

My personal agenda right now is simple. To help get the trust to exist as an established entity and to give it as much press publicity as possible in a bid to gather members.

[AndyNeil]

I put the original post on facebook as a genuine question, given the "lets all work together" drum being banged by BRAG since the unfortunate posting by Simon recently, so thought I'd gague the feedback. What I wasn't expecting was to read that the meeting had been recorded on a mobile phone, as Mark did not at any time during the meeting either ask or say that he was recording it on his mobile.

I have to say that I am very disapppointed with this revelation, not because the BRST have anything to hide but with the underhand tactics employed by either a member or members of the BRAG committee to discredit a proposed legal entity which has the best interests of rovers at heart.

[Mattyblue]

Sad, sad, sad.

Why should brfcs even host such pointless mudslinging?

What a palava.

[SouthAussieRover]

It's like a willy waving competition on here.

Grow a pair and unite.

[Alex Rover]

Excuse me. Are you the Judean People's Front?

F*%$ off! We're the People's Front of Judea

[Biddy]

It's about time people realised that there is no chance of any unity as all groups have their own agendas and all think they are the most important.

It's just a sad state of affairs that a small town club now have so many different groups when the only one that I am concerned about if BRFC itself.

[he6rt6gr6m]

You shook our hands, recorded the get-together, shook our hands again, then "left in disgust"?

Wow man. Just, wow...

[J*B]

Nothing works with a committee.

[Brad]

Absolutely amazing.. I read Marks report and I'm all about telling and hearing the the truth.. Was tought that at a young age!!

[Stuart]

Some questions for Mark/BRAG:

Did you surreptitiously record the meeting?

Was the decision to surreptitiously record the meeting taken by you or by BRAG?

Why did you / they feel the need to do so?

What did you plan to do with the recording?

There is a good chance that the damage (loss of trust, ironically) caused by this to the chances of uniting the groups is terminal - and right ahead of the plan for large scale protests.

I'd just like to understand the reasons.

[K-Hod]

In response to the original question posted by Andy Neil, My reasons for attending today's meeting was due to the fact, Duncan invited representation from the Action Group, albeit that we had to push for this once this meeting became public knowledge. I do not believe I need a reason to attend meetings of a group (a group which your unelected secretary claims "will do me proud"). My initial thoughts following this meeting are that the group's public intentions differ from those they share behind closed doors. To quote your secretary "Lots of hard work for BRST in the next three weeks but I promise we will be as open and transparent as possible, From now until then all our efforts will be placed on advertising, leaflets, website construction and more importantly drawing up our mission statement etc.", I propose the question that as you have been trying to form this over a period of 18 months why has a mission statement and the direction of the group not been decided as of yet, despite the fact you have been meeting on an 'every other week' basis in the last 3 months.

Blackburn Rovers football club is to some of us a seven day a week job, it appeared to me that your lack of pro-activeness is a massive part in why people had forgotten you exist, If the leadership of the trust were those sat around the table today, then the supporters trust will never be nothing more than a name. It was even mentioned by those present the need for people such as Glen Mullan, to be on board to lead the group forward, so at least it acknowledged that the lack of effort from those involved will not see the group progress.

When asked about your plans for your forthcoming launch party, you all looked clueless. It appeared to me that when the supporters direct lady spoke with suggestions of your groups remit, she was speaking to 6 nodding dogs, it was very apparent that those probable committee members at the table, lacked leadership, inspiration, direction and organisation. In the last 10 months since your last transparent meeting (which I attend), our club has fallen to pieces whilst you have held meetings to secretly elect a committee, when this was questioned last week it was suggested this was an interim committee until the group became endorsed. It was today confirmed, (something you have as yet have failed to disclose) that your unelected interim committee will sit on behalf of the supporters for a minimum of 6 months.

Transparency when represented is key, Transparency over the last ten months have been lacking. I have been very interested over the last 10 days to read your public backing of the B.R.S.I.T initiatives, backing which I today witnessed you do not share behind closed doors. The BRFC Action Group and the people involved in the B.R.S.I.T initiative will never be placed "on a lead" as was suggested today. These are two groups which have pro-actively promoted change for the better of Blackburn Rovers Football Club, whilst you have suggested they remain silent behind closed doors, as were evident today.

Backing something publicly then ridiculing it behind closed doors and Forming a group, then later forming a plan are the 2 main reasons why the Supporters Trust will never work. I today found out, due to my concern that the BRST's intentions are to own upto a 20% share in Blackburn Rovers football club. This to my knowledge has never been shared amongst the general supporter, however it was spoken about today like it had been the pipeline from day one.

The most horrific part of the meeting for me was to see 6 people nodding in agreement when the supporter’s direct representative said "relegation would be great for the supporters trust". Whilst I acknowledge that any group who opposes Venkys would be justified in the event of relegation, it is difficult to witness members of these groups, personally thinking relegation would be a good thing.

I was so disgusted I refused to stay behind once the meeting had finished to even listen to people justify the comments they made. Today further justified to myself personally the reasons I joined the Action Group as oppose to waiting for a group who are clearly out of touch with the supporters they are funded to represent.

The lack of professionalism was even noted by the lady from Supporters Direct when the legal documentation was handed over, having been filled in RED PEN, this was cringeworthy and embarrassing but sadly it set the tone for the remainder of the meeting.

You've not helped yourself, BRAG, or the situation. What a clown.

[Andy]

Interesting.

[Brad]

Wow, not speaking on Marks behalf or BRAG, but it's good to know what a "supporters trust" agendas is all about..

[stuwilky]

Are you associated with BRAG? Who is Simon Littler? Is he associated with BRAG?

Why do we need so many posts slagging off so many people? Is it achieving anything?

[mark1875]

Some questions for Mark/BRAG:

Did you surreptitiously record the meeting?

i did not record the meeting, it was a as most people know a joke.

Until Andy asked the questions on Facebook with no other obvious purpose than to allow the group to believe i attended secretly i was not even going to pass comment

Once the question was asked i had to give it an honest response.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Nothing works with a committee.

I second that motion

[Plastic Head]

In response to the original question posted by Andy Neil, My reasons for attending today's meeting was due to the fact, Duncan invited representation from the Action Group, albeit that we had to push for this once this meeting became public knowledge. I do not believe I need a reason to attend meetings of a group (a group which your unelected secretary claims "will do me proud"). My initial thoughts following this meeting are that the group's public intentions differ from those they share behind closed doors. To quote your secretary "Lots of hard work for BRST in the next three weeks but I promise we will be as open and transparent as possible, From now until then all our efforts will be placed on advertising, leaflets, website construction and more importantly drawing up our mission statement etc.", I propose the question that as you have been trying to form this over a period of 18 months why has a mission statement and the direction of the group not been decided as of yet, despite the fact you have been meeting on an 'every other week' basis in the last 3 months.

Blackburn Rovers football club is to some of us a seven day a week job, it appeared to me that your lack of pro-activeness is a massive part in why people had forgotten you exist, If the leadership of the trust were those sat around the table today, then the supporters trust will never be nothing more than a name. It was even mentioned by those present the need for people such as Glen Mullan, to be on board to lead the group forward, so at least it acknowledged that the lack of effort from those involved will not see the group progress.

When asked about your plans for your forthcoming launch party, you all looked clueless. It appeared to me that when the supporters direct lady spoke with suggestions of your groups remit, she was speaking to 6 nodding dogs, it was very apparent that those probable committee members at the table, lacked leadership, inspiration, direction and organisation. In the last 10 months since your last transparent meeting (which I attend), our club has fallen to pieces whilst you have held meetings to secretly elect a committee, when this was questioned last week it was suggested this was an interim committee until the group became endorsed. It was today confirmed, (something you have as yet have failed to disclose) that your unelected interim committee will sit on behalf of the supporters for a minimum of 6 months.

Transparency when represented is key, Transparency over the last ten months have been lacking. I have been very interested over the last 10 days to read your public backing of the B.R.S.I.T initiatives, backing which I today witnessed you do not share behind closed doors. The BRFC Action Group and the people involved in the B.R.S.I.T initiative will never be placed "on a lead" as was suggested today. These are two groups which have pro-actively promoted change for the better of Blackburn Rovers Football Club, whilst you have suggested they remain silent behind closed doors, as were evident today.

Backing something publicly then ridiculing it behind closed doors and Forming a group, then later forming a plan are the 2 main reasons why the Supporters Trust will never work. I today found out, due to my concern that the BRST's intentions are to own upto a 20% share in Blackburn Rovers football club. This to my knowledge has never been shared amongst the general supporter, however it was spoken about today like it had been the pipeline from day one.

The most horrific part of the meeting for me was to see 6 people nodding in agreement when the supporter’s direct representative said "relegation would be great for the supporters trust". Whilst I acknowledge that any group who opposes Venkys would be justified in the event of relegation, it is difficult to witness members of these groups, personally thinking relegation would be a good thing.

I was so disgusted I refused to stay behind once the meeting had finished to even listen to people justify the comments they made. Today further justified to myself personally the reasons I joined the Action Group as oppose to waiting for a group who are clearly out of touch with the supporters they are funded to represent.

The lack of professionalism was even noted by the lady from Supporters Direct when the legal documentation was handed over, having been filled in RED PEN, this was cringeworthy and embarrassing but sadly it set the tone for the remainder of the meeting.

This is a hard read due to poor syntax and punctuation.

It's a long piece to write after midnight.

[Tom]

I'm not sure I follow the logic here.

A long post criticising the trust is made in facebook followed by a comment along the lines of:

'Do you want to invite the trust onto a podcast or use the recording I took on my phone'

You later say this is a joke when questioned on it.

If it actually was a joke what was the purpose of it? Was it to try and worry the BRST members? I just can't see a reason to pretend you recorded it if you didn't.

For a group trying to criticise one group about trust etc there have been some odd ways of going about gaining trust yourself as an entity.

Someone made a valid comment on the BRAG facebook page last night, I couldn't care less about any group all i care about in this instance is the club itself but it seems it's getting far too political for my liking.

All sides say 'let's work together' but it's clear that nobody can resist a sly dig the other way and it appears people are either threatened by other groups or just don't want them on the scene for whatever reason.

[Paul]

I'm not sure I follow the logic here.

A long post criticising the trust is made in facebook followed by a comment along the lines of:

'Do you want to invite the trust onto a podcast or use the recording I took on my phone'

You later say this is a joke when questioned on it.

This is not the first time BRAG have used the "it's a joke" response to answer criticism. It is also not the first time BRAG has attempted to discredit others or directly pressurise critical individuals into silence.

One should look very carefully at the activity here, it's the only democratically elected dictatorship I know.

As for the recent behaviour of BRAG members it appears the organisation preaches one approach while practising another.

[mark1875]

If it actually was a joke what was the purpose of it? Was it to try and worry the BRST members? I just can't see a reason to pretend you recorded it if you didn't.

All sides say 'let's work together' but it's clear that nobody can resist a sly dig the other way and it appears people are either threatened by other groups or just don't want them on the scene for whatever reason.

The joke was a comment in reply to Glen, which he was well aware of as i had already spoken to him, i had no reason to record it on my phone, like i said i wasn't even going to pass comment on the meeting at all until the attempt to cause a scene by bringing it up in public give me no alternative but to share my feelings on the meeting with the group.

The 'let's work together' attitude is fine in theory and i attended the meeting to find out what the trusts intentions where and the progress and plans it had made over the last 18 months, i was personally disappointed to find this was practically nothing, that said working together could have still been an option in my mind and Duncan was aware of my thoughts on the matter.

If working together is to consist of the Action Group (the group who has led from the front whilst our club is being ripped apart) "being placed on a lead" then it will categorically not be happening

[Mattyblue]

Just listen to yourself mark.

For christ sake, the club is on the verge of relegation and god knows what else and we all have to read page after page of this crap.

If I remember rightly when Glen started organising protests, I remember him saying that 'these are fan protests, not mine' and 'I/we are not leaders, we just help facilitate protests for the fans'.

Now it's 'we won't be kept on a leash', 'BRAG have led from the front', seems to me that the publicity and fancy job titles and committees have gone to your heads.

There should be ONE group representing the fans. Why can't the BRAG faction of a new united group organise protests, the BRSIT faction help get the share issue off the ground, the BRST section get an offical affilated trust off the ground, even the FF faction keeping contact with the club.

If you REALLY cared more about the future of BRFC than building these little Empires, you would merge under one umbrella.

Over to you.