[Archived] Afghanistan

[Jeru tha Damaja]

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Sure as I am that a blog entitled Creeping Sharia can be trusted to give an unbiased view of any incident that involves Muslims, I might be inclined towards further investigation.

Issues that would usually be minor are becoming problematic in Egypt, because the country is still being run by a military council who unilaterally decided that, despite having held elections, they aren't ready for a proper government yet. That has left many people deeply unhappy, especially given the similarities between the military chiefs and Mubarak, so demonstrations and violence are still everyday occurrences and tensions are running high.

Western influences have historically caused major issues in the region, and with the recent turmoil the Muslims who actually live by the rules of their religion rather than merely paying lip service to it are as keen as any group to hold on to their identity. If that means they are sometimes over-zealous then it should be put viewed with a little perspective, not hyperbolised to stoke up anti-Islamic sentiment.

[thenodrog]

Western influences have historically caused major issues in the region, and with the recent turmoil the Muslims who actually live by the rules of their religion rather than merely paying lip service to it are as keen as any group to hold on to their identity. If that means they are sometimes over-zealous then it should be put viewed with a little perspective, not hyperbolised to stoke up anti-Islamic sentiment.

On the contrary, I always view such examples with lots of perspective Jeru.

btw are you still here or have you finally managed to shake the dust of this nation off your boots as you frequently stated you were eager to do in the past?

[Jeru tha Damaja]

I wasn't even thinking about you when I stressed the need for context. Good to see you're feeling defensive though.

I'm in Britain again temporarily. Emmigrating isn't a quick process. I am, however, delighted to report that I've found several countries where bigotry, nationalist arrogance and the worship of money is way less prevalent than the UK and US.

[jim mk2]

I am, however, delighted to report that I've found several countries where bigotry, nationalist arrogance and the worship of money is way less prevalent than the UK and US.

Such as ?

[ABBEY]

I wasn't even thinking about you when I stressed the need for context. Good to see you're feeling defensive though.

I'm in Britain again temporarily. Emmigrating isn't a quick process. I am, however, delighted to report that I've found several countries where bigotry, nationalist arrogance and the worship of money is way less prevalent than the UK and US.

Where?

Such as ?

Posted that without seeing your reply.

[colin]

Such as ?

I can't speak for anyone else but in my limited experiance I'd like to suggest New Zealand; Australia; The Netherlands; Greece and Spain where there is a far more relaxed mentality than in the UK. Those countries seem (to me at least) to not have a money-grabbing attitude quite as prevelant as here in the UK. Neither do they seem to have some kind of superiority complex that epitomises much of the UK's population to its relationship with the rest of the world.

But that's just my opinion. Anyone else's is probably just as valid.

Cheers

Colin

[thenodrog]

I can't speak for anyone else but in my limited experiance I'd like to suggest New Zealand; Australia; The Netherlands; Greece and Spain where there is a far more relaxed mentality than in the UK. Those countries seem (to me at least) to not have a money-grabbing attitude quite as prevelant as here in the UK. Neither do they seem to have some kind of superiority complex that epitomises much of the UK's population to its relationship with the rest of the world.

But that's just my opinion. Anyone else's is probably just as valid.

Cheers

Colin

My opinion is that the Dutch are so 'relaxed' that they are currently in the process of abandoning multiculturalism and reverting to adopting priorities to protect the values of the Dutch people http://www.stonegateinstitute.org/2219/netherlands-abandons-multiculturalism, two of them hold similar values to the UK of 50 years ago except that they positively discourage immigration from 3rd world countries whilst two of them are absolutely borassic and dependent on eu hand outs and can't afford the luxury of a superiority complex.

[colin]

My opinion is that the Dutch are so 'relaxed' that they are currently in the process of abandoning multiculturalism and reverting to adopting priorities to protect the values of the Dutch people http://www.stonegateinstitute.org/2219/netherlands-abandons-multiculturalism, two of them hold similar values to the UK of 50 years ago except that they positively discourage immigration from 3rd world countries whilst two of them are absolutely borassic and dependent on eu hand outs and can't afford the luxury of a superiority complex.

That's as maybe, but it's rather dragging the discussion away from the original post which was about our prescence in Afghanistan. Looks like you've spotted a flaw in one of the five countries I gave as an example. Well spotted.

Love the word "borassic"

[pg]

Re : Australian attitudes. There is small but highly vocal minority of brain-dead morons who allow themselves to whipped up into a state of xenophobic fury by the Murdoch Press and talkback radio into believing that

a) All asylum seekers are suicide bombers

All asylum seekers are living in state-funded mansions for years while hardworking taxpayers are doing it tough

c) Sharia law is imminent

I don't think its that much difference to the UK quite frankly.

Re : The 'Arab Spring' of the past 24 months. It has not been caused by a rise in Islamic fundamentalism. All the uprisings and revolutions are fundamentally different to what happened in Iran in 1979. The uprisings were caused by two things:

1) Global Warming

2) Wikileaks

Point 1) meant that the price of grain (and food) became so high that in the Arab World (and Tunisia) that many protests were focused on this particular issue. Grain shortages were severe in 2010 due to the Russian heatwave and the Australian floods. In several Arab countries the central government is in charge of food production and distribution.

Point 2) highlighted to the citizens of the Arab World (and in particular Tunisia) the extent of corruption within their ruling families, as well as the US attitudes to it (i.e. we will not support the current administration). This emboldened the protesters who realised that their rulers would not withstand sustained protests.

[thenodrog]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24870699

After the Taliban had recently festooned limbs and body parts of dead colleagues from nearby trees during the dead of night to mock the troops the only crime committed was by the @#/? who took the video. He is the one who should be locked up. Wars cannot be fought according to rules made by lawyers in sharp suits and woolly liberals and clergymen in the comfort of a courtroom unless both sides are prepared to play by them.

[Paul]

While I doubt many troops have the Geneva Convention at the front of their minds in battle there surely have to be different circumstances outside of the battlefield?

Media reporting, and we have no other method forming an opinion, tells us a jury is satisfied Marine A committed murder. You frequently subscribe to the view the Taliban, Islam as a whole and other similar societies or cultures are backward, barbaric, Stone Age or words to that effect. If British troops are permitted to behave in a similar fashion it places at least some sections of our society, if not the whole, at the same level.

If we abhor terrorist atrocities in London, Nairobi or Afghanistan how can we as a society behave in a similar manner?

Perhaps we should publicly behead those guilty of terrorist killings? It's no different from shooting an injured prisoner in cold blood. Though if we give terrorists a trial first I guess that's one ahead of the terrorist? Perhaps their heads could be placed on spikes outside the Tower.

The reality of war is such atrocities will happen it's how we accept or reject them which defines us.

I have no doubt those who created the Geneva Convention have a far greater understanding of the reality than you or I.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

It's obviously just the tip of the ice-berg in my opinion. They were just the ones that were stupid enough to get caught. The other two were extremely lucky to get off with it. If that scenario had been played out with three guys on the Main Street of your local town the other two would have gone down for a long time as well

You cannot instil standards in places like Afghanistan if you abandon them yourself.

[Guest Norbert]

Look at the history books, you cannot turn somewhere like Afghanistan into a Swedish social democracy, the natives are crazy. The best thing to do is cut a deal whereby the Taliban can have Afghanistan if they leave Pakistan alone, do not shelter international terrorists and eradicate the opium trade. If they don't behave themselves, we will nuke every settlement there.

It is a mad, inbred, dusty crap hole down there and if they want to rape their sisters or shoot people for flying a kite it is none of our business.

[thenodrog]

Look at the history books, you cannot turn somewhere like Afghanistan into a Swedish social democracy, the natives are crazy. The best thing to do is cut a deal whereby the Taliban can have Afghanistan if they leave Pakistan alone, do not shelter international terrorists and eradicate the opium trade. If they don't behave themselves, we will nuke every settlement there.

It is a mad, inbred, dusty crap hole down there and if they want to rape their sisters or shoot people for flying a kite it is none of our business.

A bullet through the brains of every other Taliban nut job they come across seems tame by comparison Norbert.

[Guest Norbert]

At least make it clear they had better behave themselves and not endanger us civilised people. Just politely point out that we do have the weapons, so none of that 9/11 sort of thing. On the domestic front, people who want Sharia Law etc. and bang on about it should be offered a 1 way ticket to this Islamic paradise, once it is set up. Obviously we will provide them in a basic understanding in Pashtun, but once they arrive at their adopted village they're on there own.

So we'll have our area, and the crazy types of Muslim can have theirs. If we agree to leave each other alone, they can shoot as many schoolgirls in the head as they like.

[Baz]

Look at the history books, you cannot turn somewhere like Afghanistan into a Swedish social democracy, the natives are crazy. The best thing to do is cut a deal whereby the Taliban can have Afghanistan if they leave Pakistan alone, do not shelter international terrorists and eradicate the opium trade. If they don't behave themselves, we will nuke every settlement there.

It is a mad, inbred, dusty crap hole down there and if they want to rape their sisters or shoot people for flying a kite it is none of our business.

Im appalled by your comments.

[J*B]

The more they resist, the more they fight, the longer it lasts, the happier the Americans will be. The Americans blew up their own World Trade Centre to get the money in Iraq/Afganistan, they want to milk that cash for as long as they can regardless of who gets hurt.

[Guest Norbert]

I can see arms companies making money, and of course the oil companies, but the wars have plunged the country into a spiral of debt, which has meant the USA are a shadow of their former self. Iraq was all about the oil, Afghanistan was about Bin Laden, with the possibility of an oil pipeline from other central Asian tyrannies, but 9/11 was most likely if not absolutely certain to be the work of a bunch of Saudi loons.

[Amo]

I can see arms companies making money, and of course the oil companies, but the wars have plunged the country into a spiral of debt, which has meant the USA are a shadow of their former self. Iraq was all about the oil, Afghanistan was about Bin Laden, with the possibility of an oil pipeline from other central Asian tyrannies, but 9/11 was most likely if not absolutely certain to be the work of a bunch of Saudi loons.

The smoking gun about that day is WTC 7. A few pocket fires caused an entire building to collapse? Even if the debris from WTC 1 had been enough to cause structural failure, would it have collapsed in such a neat and tidy fashion? How come none of the smaller builders like WTC 4, 5 & 6 which were also hit by debris, didn't collapse under the fire? There's no way 'they' could have collapsed WTC 7 without knowing the Twin Towers were going to go down in the first place.

[Guest Norbert]

So it is about the way the building fell then? I thought the force of the plane chopped that top section off and then that top section squashed the rest of it. But then again, I am no civil engineer or architect, and I believe there was a real moon landing, and the Nazis started the Reichstag fire.

Who are 'they' in this theory? The US government? Freemasons?

[Amo]

So it is about the way the building fell then? I thought the force of the plane chopped that top section off and then that top section squashed the rest of it. But then again, I am no civil engineer or architect, and I believe there was a real moon landing, and the Nazis started the Reichstag fire.

For your viewing:

Remember, this building wasn't hit by a plane, but struck by some falling debris when WTC 1 fell. If you didn't know what day this was, you would easily "mistake" it for a demolition job. It's the only known steel-framed skyscraper in history to collapse from an internal, localized fire. And again, buildings 4, 5, 6 were directly pelted by debris from the Twin Towers and burned with the same intensity as WTC 7 for hours and never collapsed.

Who are 'they' in this theory? The US government? Freemasons?

Those who stood to gain the most from it. Connect the dots and you'll get there.

[Paul]

Never seen or heard about that before but yes under other circumstances I'd say that was a straightforward demolition job.

I'm not going for conspiracy theories though.

[Stuart]

For your viewing:

Remember, this building wasn't hit by a plane, but struck by some falling debris when WTC 1 fell. If you didn't know what day this was, you would easily "mistake" it for a demolition job. It's the only known steel-framed skyscraper in history to collapse from an internal, localized fire. And again, buildings 4, 5, 6 were directly pelted by debris from the Twin Towers and burned with the same intensity as WTC 7 for hours and never collapsed.

Those who stood to gain the most from it. Connect the dots and you'll get there.

If any of that were true, then you and your tin-foil hatted mates should be very, very afraid...

[Guest Norbert]

It all sounds a bit tinfoil hat to me.

And Baz, I'm sorry, but Afghanistan is one of those wild lawless places that will never be anything other than a bunch of tribal nutters doing beastly things to their women, so let's leave them to live in their dusty dilapidated towns, and mud huts, and leave them alone. And don't give them infidel science and technology like modern sanitation, broadband and medicine. They can make their own since we're so evil. If they don't bother us, we shouldn't bother them.

[Amo]

It all sounds a bit tinfoil hat to me.

And 19 Arabs with boxcutters fooling the most advanced air defence system in the world isn't, I suppose?