[Archived] HOW MUCH MORE

[rovers11]

Again, I think you're wrong on the consumer side.

I don't think complete removal of all fan spending would even raise the eyebrow of the Venky's company accountant. Even with zero fan based income, it would cost a comparative small percentage of their reserves to keep us out of administration (but tumbling down the leagues) and I believe they see that as preferable to the shame of admitting they got it wrong, or were bad advised or gave into the fans demands.

That seems nuts to us, but it's chicken feed to them (pun intended).

I wish I knew what the answer was. But if they won't sell, they won't spend, they won't talk and we're unable to influence them ..... I really don't see that we have any move left.

I'm not so sure it's quite as simple as that. They bought the club for a reason and that was publicity and to grow their brand globally. Here is a good analysis of why Indian companies, including Venky's, have invested invested big in recent years: http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/india/article.cfm?articleid=4656

Financially, they probably do have enough personal wealth to hold onto the club and let it rot. However, in other ways, such as shareholder reaction and growing their company, they simply can't afford to hold on to the club. They will never be able to expand their business in Europe whilst they own Blackburn rovers. A particular extract in the article that caught my eye was:

'One big challenge is funding. "If a [business owner] is funding a deal with his own personal wealth, then it is nobody's business," PwC's Krishnan points out. "If not, the shareholders will hound him." Koushik Chatterjee, group chief financial officer of Tata Steel adds, "Nobody can do trophy deals, because at the end of the day you have to create shareholder value."

Venky's funded the purchase of rovers with a bank loan. Secondly, is Venky's ownership of rovers creating shareholder value? Absolute not. The opposite in fact. If they are as good a business people as they have shown in the past, they will be out like a shot in the summer.

[Stuart]

I'm not so sure it's quite as simple as that. They bought the club for a reason and that was publicity and to grow their brand globally. Here is a good analysis of why Indian companies, including Venky's, have invested invested big in recent years: http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/india/article.cfm?articleid=4656

Financially, they probably do have enough personal wealth to hold onto the club and let it rot. However, in other ways, such as shareholder reaction and growing their company, they simply can't afford to hold on to the club. They will never be able to expand their business in Europe whilst they own Blackburn rovers. A particular extract in the article that caught my eye was:

'One big challenge is funding. "If a [business owner] is funding a deal with his own personal wealth, then it is nobody's business," PwC's Krishnan points out. "If not, the shareholders will hound him." Koushik Chatterjee, group chief financial officer of Tata Steel adds, "Nobody can do trophy deals, because at the end of the day you have to create shareholder value."

Venky's funded the purchase of rovers with a bank loan. Secondly, is Venky's ownership of rovers creating shareholder value? Absolute not. The opposite in fact. If they are as good a business people as they have shown in the past, they will be out like a shot in the summer.

Good find, r11. I was feeling quite optimistic until your last sentence!

[Steve Moss]

A pitch invasion is a bad idea, as is any other criminal activity.

I recommend voting with your wallets. When the stadium is half empty, and that is being broadcast around the world, other football fans regardless of continent will know what is going on. And eventually the word will spread even into India.

[jim mk2]

A pitch invasion is a bad idea, as is any other criminal activity.

I recommend voting with your wallets. When the stadium is half empty, and that is being broadcast around the world, other football fans regardless of continent will know what is going on. And eventually the word will spread even into India.

What makes you think the "world" cares about little old BRFC ? More likely the world will yawn with indifference as a small-town north of England club slips into oblivion.

A strong and meaningful protest however might make the world sit up and take notice.

[Stuart]

What makes you think the "world" cares about little old BRFC ? More likely the world will yawn with indifference as a small-town north of England club slips into oblivion.

A strong and meaningful protest however might make the world sit up and take notice.

I think you contradict yourself there Jim.

It's been said many times - but I'll say it again. Our problem is that we aren't dealing with a normal situation.

It was originally thought that - after a long run of patience ran out - that a concerted effort would see the manager removed. Yet he hasn't been. And won't. He has no shame and won't walk. ANY other club in the country would have said "thank you and goodbye" to a manager with Kean's record (or even better) long before now. The situation beggars belief and as frustrations have mounted that nothing has been done, this has been seen by the wider world as thousands of Rovers fans bullying one man. If Spurs had kept Christian Gross for the length of time Kean has been at Rovers, the exact same thing would have happened - although the press would not have come down on the side of Gross - for the time he was here, he was ridiculed out of town.

We have already had protests - traditional (banners and marches) and innovative (flyovers and writing to the Indian Business media) - although these were aimed at Kean. The football world and the Indian business world know that Rovers fans are very unhappy with Venkys and want them out but still they persevere. I can only think of 37 million reasons why that might be.

Perhaps another plane with "Venkys killed our club" on it? But again, would anyone care? And what would, could anyone do about it? Nothing.

The only thing that can save us (if it isn't already too late) is proof of some infringements of the rules in the purchase or running of the club - and there isn't any. There are no rules that prevent the wilful destruction of the heart and soul of a club, the deliberate weakening of its playing staff or the support of a manager who is not capable of carrying out the job.

Is there?

We're absolutely snookered. I just hope Roversmum is making a pot of tea for Mrs D, as we speak, convincing her to do the honourable thing...!

[jim mk2]

I think you contradict yourself there Jim.

It was originally thought that - after a long run of patience ran out - that a concerted effort would see the manager removed. Yet he hasn't been. And won't. He has no shame and won't walk.

Where is the contradiction ?

If Rovers are relegated and crowds drfit away over time to below 10,000 (quite likely) why should the rest of the "world" be bothered as the previous poster claimed ?

The problem with the protests is that they were not strong enough and they were not sustained - it took a concerted campaign over a few years by Liverpool fans to get their owners out but ours seem to have given up.

[Exiled in Toronto]

The problem with the protests is that they were not strong enough and they were not sustained

They were also completely unfocused, switching from one message to the next: Kean out, Anderson out, 77 demands, better communication, Venky's out, Venky's and Kean out. Liverpool's was 100% focused on the owners and also on a workable solution, ie the bank forcing a sale. Liverpool's was also much more professionally presented.

Unfortunately I think the protest ship has sailed unless and until the owners do something massively illegal

[JAL]

Pitch invasion is definitely not the thing to do.

As a show of contempt towards everyone thats currently screwing Blackburn Rovers football, club how about a supporters strip instead.

Clothes off !

They strip us bare!

[Mattyblue]

It was always going to be easier for LFC fans, enormous fanbase, profile and a sympathetic ear in the media.

However, you're right EiT, the protest movement hit the wrong target, I'm not blameless as I went marching on a Kean out ticket.

[thenodrog]

They were also completely unfocused, switching from one message to the next: Kean out, Anderson out, 77 demands, better communication, Venky's out, Venky's and Kean out. Liverpool's was 100% focused on the owners and also on a workable solution, ie the bank forcing a sale. Liverpool's was also much more professionally presented.

Can't argue with that at all.

[Stuart]

Where is the contradiction ?

If Rovers are relegated and crowds drfit away over time to below 10,000 (quite likely) why should the rest of the "world" be bothered as the previous poster claimed ?

The problem with the protests is that they were not strong enough and they were not sustained - it took a concerted campaign over a few years by Liverpool fans to get their owners out but ours seem to have given up.

The contradition was that you said "the world doesn't care about little old BRFC" followed by "protests would make the world sit up and take notice".

[jim mk2]

The contradition was that you said "the world doesn't care about little old BRFC" followed by "protests would make the world sit up and take notice".

Bloomin 'eck, the poster said the world would sit up and take notice if our ground was empty and I said the world couldn't care less about our ground being empty or our club for that matter but they might take notice if the mob took over. This is hard work.

[Waggy76]

Boycott the games , return season ticket renewal packs with REFUSED and please return to sender written on them, do not buy season tickets ...

A mass boycott of home games should have taken place in Oct,Nov and December, also it was a big mistake to tone down the demos in the new year . I understand it is difficult not to go , when it is part of your life and always as been ..

I have thought this for a while the worst result of the season was beating Arsenal at home ...The pressure was mounting , it rained hard and Arsenal somehow capitulated ..Kean was given a lifeline he did not deserve ..To rub salt into the wound the Swansea and Man U victories were timely (for kean ) excursions from the norm ......

Kean is now running out of time , relegation is nearly upon and his job SHOULD be unteneable but with these crazy owners you never know ...

Both Kean and Venkys must go for BRFC to move forward again , which division we will be in when they finally go , only time will tell..My gut feeling is when we get relegated next month , they will all disappear rather quickly , wishful thinking it could be !

I have seen BRFC in the 3rd division in 2 different spells and I am quite willing to see them there again if it means the club are rid of these parasites ...

[thenodrog]

Boycott the games , return season ticket renewal packs with REFUSED and please return to sender written on them, do not buy season tickets ...

A mass boycott of home games should have taken place in Oct,Nov and December, also it was a big mistake to tone down the demos in the new year . I understand it is difficult not to go , when it is part of your life and always as been ..

I chose not to renew last May and it was a wrench but trust me it gets easier and easier. I can't even be bothered finding a stream on the internet now. In a nutshell that is the massive danger to the future of the club, people will move on and not return. An est 3000 have done it already apparently and this close season will see a massive fall away of support whatever happens. It took a generation and near bankruptcy to get over the effects of the 1960 cup final debacle .... and that (crap though the team played and behaved) was a Cup Final which we had knocked Burnley's best ever team out of on the way!!!!

[Stuart]

Bloomin 'eck, the poster said the world would sit up and take notice if our ground was empty and I said the world couldn't care less about our ground being empty or our club for that matter but they might take notice if the mob took over. This is hard work.

Alright fella, don't spit your teeth out. It was an observation that you asked me to explain, not a personal attack.

[jim mk2]

I chose not to renew last May and it was a wrench but trust me it gets easier and easier. I can't even be bothered finding a stream on the internet now. In a nutshell that is the massive danger to the future of the club, people will move on and not return. An est 3000 have done it already apparently and this close season will see a massive fall away of support whatever happens. It took a generation and near bankruptcy to get over the effects of the 1960 cup final debacle .... and that (crap though the team played and behaved) was a Cup Final which we had knocked Burnley's best ever team out of on the way!!!!

Hence the reason why the situation should not be allowed to drift and calls for a boycott of a club such as Rovers with a small fanbase are wrong and damaging in the long term. A sharp jolt is needed to prompt action in Pune..........

[Plastic Head]

WILL IT TAKE FOR NON PROTESTERS TO GROW A PAIR AND SHOW THE NATION THAT KEAN IS HATED AND SO ARE THE VENKYSCUM??????

waiting to not renew isnt protesting ..IT WILL BE TOO LATE THEN!!!!

I have never agreed so completely with a post as I agree with this.

I decided not to go again before the Utd game because, a ) I didn't actually care whether we won or lost, if I don't care about that game what is the point, and b ) I refuse to sit making a dick of myself whilst all around people sit on their hands in silence while the club slowly dies.

I won't be going again while venkean are in charge, unless there are some meaningful protests, we need to disrupt the game in some way at the very least and Tuesday one of the last chances while TV are at Ewood.

The real protest will be next season when there are 7000 on, but yes it will be too late.

[Fife Rover]

Boycott the games , return season ticket renewal packs with REFUSED and please return to sender written on them, do not buy season tickets ...

A mass boycott of home games should have taken place in Oct,Nov and December, also it was a big mistake to tone down the demos in the new year . I understand it is difficult not to go , when it is part of your life and always as been ..

I have thought this for a while the worst result of the season was beating Arsenal at home ...The pressure was mounting , it rained hard and Arsenal somehow capitulated ..Kean was given a lifeline he did not deserve ..To rub salt into the wound the Swansea and Man U victories were timely (for kean ) excursions from the norm ......

Kean is now running out of time , relegation is nearly upon and his job SHOULD be unteneable but with these crazy owners you never know ...

Both Kean and Venkys must go for BRFC to move forward again , which division we will be in when they finally go , only time will tell..My gut feeling is when we get relegated next month , they will all disappear rather quickly , wishful thinking it could be !

I have seen BRFC in the 3rd division in 2 different spells and I am quite willing to see them there again if it means the club are rid of these parasites ...

Absolutely spot-on in all respects Waggy76. Exactly how I feel too, and have acted on since the Everton home match in August.

I will most definitely not be re-newing my ST either. And this will remain my stance until they are all gone and Venkys Rovers ceases to exist. Then (and only then) Blackburn Rovers can rise again from the ruins that this evil mob have left us with.

[jim mk2]

I have never agreed so completely with a post as I agree with this.

I decided not to go again before the Utd game because, a ) I didn't actually care whether we won or lost, if I don't care about that game what is the point, and b ) I refuse to sit making a dick of myself whilst all around people sit on their hands in silence while the club slowly dies.

I won't be going again while venkean are in charge, unless there are some meaningful protests, we need to disrupt the game in some way at the very least and Tuesday one of the last chances while TV are at Ewood.

The real protest will be next season when there are 7000 on, but yes it will be too late.

Quite right but what's that sound I hear...... is it the Schutzstaffel approaching ?

[Waggy76]

I have never agreed so completely with a post as I agree with this.

I decided not to go again before the Utd game because, a ) I didn't actually care whether we won or lost, if I don't care about that game what is the point, and b ) I refuse to sit making a dick of myself whilst all around people sit on their hands in silence while the club slowly dies.

I won't be going again while venkean are in charge, unless there are some meaningful protests, we need to disrupt the game in some way at the very least and Tuesday one of the last chances while TV are at Ewood.

The real protest will be next season when there are 7000 on, but yes it will be too late.

Join the club , I was heckled and told to shut up for shouting abuse at Kean on the opening game of the season against Wolves...

I won't be going tomorrow not been since Bolton away that was enough for me ..I have been on protests ,sit ins boycotted games in Nov and Dec .Nobody at the club is bothered , we cannot invade the pitch the CCTV will pick us out and we will be banned for a couple of years and fined ...Nothing short of a Bin Laden navy seal type raid on Pune, kidnap the Venkys and parade them on Ewood Park will do, we are powerless...

[Jock]

A pitch invasion is a bad idea, as is any other criminal activity.

I recommend voting with your wallets. When the stadium is half empty, and that is being broadcast around the world, other football fans regardless of continent will know what is going on. And eventually the word will spread even into India.

The media are interested in Rovers fans, theyre interested in kicking us in the balls. We have to ignore the media, we cant win them over. All effort should be us 'Taking Ewood Back'.

[Steve Moss]

Bloomin 'eck, the poster said the world would sit up and take notice if our ground was empty and I said the world couldn't care less about our ground being empty or our club for that matter but they might take notice if the mob took over. This is hard work.

Hi Jim,

I think I'm the poster being referred to. Let me know if I am wrong.

I think a LOT of empty seats in Blackburn would cause sections of the world to take notice. Would the English media, FA or PL care? No.

But games are broadcast in Asia. If the Asian world were to notice the Raos had a virtually empty Ewood Park during games, questions would be asked.

[EwoodDawn]

Hi Jim,

I think I'm the poster being referred to. Let me know if I am wrong.

I think a LOT of empty seats in Blackburn would cause sections of the world to take notice. Would the English media, FA or PL care? No.

But games are broadcast in Asia. If the Asian world were to notice the Raos had a virtually empty Ewood Park during games, questions would be asked.

But as we say over here, might it not be the next day's (metaphorical) 'chip paper'. Once a few chuckles had been let loose and a few questions asked, would anything really happen? Did anything happen when the majorly embarrassing article appeared in the Indian version of the FT? Unfortunately, no. I hate to read this back to myself being so despondent but if any of you could give me the hope back, please feel free...

[DE.]

I don't think having an empty stadium would really have any massive effect. It would just prompt some more of the old "Blackburn don't deserve to have a premiership team" type comments that you hear so often in the media when they mock our small away followings.

[Jock]

I don't think having an empty stadium would really have any massive effect. It would just prompt some more of the old "Blackburn don't deserve to have a premiership team" type comments that you hear so often in the media when they mock our small away followings.

+1

Exactly. They blame us for not supporting the team and the Snake will join in.

On the pitch when Wigan score