[Archived] Supporter Safety Put At Risk

[Hughesy]

So why did Newsham get the boot??? Did he leak this info??

Also was it not caused by a flare??

Not sure why the club should clear the stand, it happens at many other stadiums & they never empty the stands - infact had they cleared it then Im sure we could all guess what would have been said about it.

[mark1875]

So why did Newsham get the boot??? Did he leak this info??

Also was it not caused by a flare??

Not sure why the club should clear the stand, it happens at many other stadiums & they never empty the stands - infact had they cleared it then Im sure we could all guess what would have been said about it.

No it was not leaked by John, it was told to us by an active fire fighter on duty that night, others have since come forward and confirmed the incident happened as described. Following Johns departure, when questioned by us he made "no comment"

Yes in the end it did turn out that it was not severe, however people were treated at the scene and panic was caused, the experts present called for an evacuation, this was ignored.

Richard Scudamore, upon seeing these letters first hand advised us to go to the police with them, we offered the club the chance to respond first and they chose not to.

[WaKKo-]

If this was such a major issue why has it taken 2 months to "Release" this info? What do the Stadium offical records state? How many Stewards have you spoken too? According to the article one person has come forward which could be raised as a disgruntled member due to not being a Steward next season.

[Ben-2000]

Strangely, there was also a number of smoke bombs set off in the lower tier that night... they didn't cause quite as much smoke as whatever it was in the upper, but they were bad enough so god knows what it was like up there!

[Pedro]

So, either send people slowly exiting through acrid smoke or keep them safe and breathing in the open air...if there wasn't a developing fire what exactly is the issue here?

[47er]

So, either send people slowly exiting through acrid smoke or keep them safe and breathing in the open air...if there wasn't a developing fire what exactly is the issue here?

Exactly! There's no issue, just the usual anti-Venkys mob stirring up trouble.

Is that how you see it?

[Pedro]

Exactly! There's no issue, just the usual anti-Venkys mob stirring up trouble.

Is that how you see it?

I see a very petty point scoring process going on and on and on...it very much reminds me of seperated parents bickering, pissing and moaning...constantly...over anything.

So many dreamers, amateur sleuths, amateur financial experts, amateur health and safety execs etc. It is beyond tedious and I'm just well and truly bored to tears of it all now.

[47er]

I see a very petty point scoring process going on and on and on...it very much reminds me of seperated parents bickering, pissing and moaning...constantly...over anything.

So many dreamers, amateur sleuths, amateur financial experts, amateur health and safety execs etc. It is beyond tedious and I'm just well and truly bored to tears of it all now.

There's not plenty to moan about then?

[Pedro]

There's not plenty to moan about then?

Depends on your outlook. Ask yourself if you genuinely believe that all of this whining on about the more tedious issues at Ewood really has any substance, or whether it is going to amount to anything. I believe it doesn't and won't.

I also believe every time there is a purposeful focus on something petty, it discredits and devalues those who originally had a very credible arguement about the bigger picture.

[Miker]

Sounds like some people at the club are going to lose their jobs over this. Not sure how this helps?

[JAL]

With this incident and the change in personnel at the club you'd think there might be a lot more attention placed on Rovers pre season from the local authorities, the insurance company, and HSE themselves aswell as all the emergency services.

[Mattyblue]

So, was there an actual fire or just the smoke from smoke bombs and/or flares being set off?

If it was the former, yep we might have a pretty big issue here, if it's the latter, people really expect a stand to be evacuated, on a relegation night, live on Sky?

[47er]

Depends on your outlook. Ask yourself if you genuinely believe that all of this whining on about the more tedious issues at Ewood really has any substance, or whether it is going to amount to anything. I believe it doesn't and won't.

I also believe every time there is a purposeful focus on something petty, it discredits and devalues those who originally had a very credible arguement about the bigger picture.

Most people on here can see the big picture------indeed the only picture-------Kean/his cronies/Venkys collectively. Till they are removed or leave we can't move forward as a club------neither in terms of results nor in terms of re-engaging with the fans.

Calling other fans views "tedious" may make you feel more clever and discerning but does nothing else.

[den]

Sounds like some people at the club are going to lose their jobs over this. Not sure how this helps?

Really? Well maybe next time the fire authorities call for the evacuation of a stand the club will take it seriously.

[PAFELL]

Really? Well maybe next time the fire authorities call for the evacuation of a stand the club will take it seriously.

I think it is normal procedure when fire crews attend an incident to call for an evacuation - this is normally done whilst they are on the way to the scene. But they will also ask if there is a danger to life. If told no, they will hold off the evacuation. But on arrrival at the scene they reassess the situation.

[thebigguy]

Do not care about peoples spins on this but the main point should be the fact there was smoke and people always assume smoke = fire = panic.

So if there was a fire there should have been a excavation of the stadium(or even a partial). This is because of the unseen damage that can happen to the frame structure. Also the fact you do not know what toxic fumes are within the smoke

Most frames are fire protected but vary in time scale from 30minutes to 4 hours by applying a i

ntumescent paint/concrete encased/fire boarding to the steelwork.This is because steelwork losses strength once super heated

http://fire-research.group.shef.ac.uk/steelinfire/downloads/RRS_2012.pdf

[Kelbo]

I think it is normal procedure when fire crews attend an incident to call for an evacuation - this is normally done whilst they are on the way to the scene. But they will also ask if there is a danger to life. If told no, they will hold off the evacuation. But on arrrival at the scene they reassess the situation.

Waiting for confirmation from my son in law but he understands that once a firecrew has been called out, they are in full control of the situation and they would ask for evacuation until they can assess the safety issues, Rovers would have no say in the matter once a crew had been called.

[Riversider48]

I doubt whether the club would have had much of a say in this matter. If 'active senior fire officials ' wanted an evacuation,surely this would be done in with co-ordination with the senior Police commander on duty and if there had been any interference by the club it would have been a very serious matter which the fire brigade would then have had to report.

[Wolverine]

Do not care about peoples spins on this but the main point should be the fact there was smoke and people always assume smoke = fire = panic.

So if there was a fire there should have been a excavation of the stadium(or even a partial). This is because of the unseen damage that can happen to the frame structure. Also the fact you do not know what toxic fumes are within the smoke

Most frames are fire protected but vary in time scale from 30minutes to 4 hours by applying a i

ntumescent paint/concrete encased/fire boarding to the steelwork.This is because steelwork losses strength once super heated

http://fire-research.group.shef.ac.uk/steelinfire/downloads/RRS_2012.pdf

Very good post.

At this stage rather than discussing should they shouldn't they, it would be more beneficial to identify what people saw first hand. A quick check on Wigan forums shows some of their fans were treated at the scene.

[glen9mullan]

We recieved a full statement and the qualifications from he individual who has made these allegations, and he without doubt has the required knowledge/experience to be able to make a clear distinction to the seriousness of this particular incident.

That evening I was in the Darwen End and I must admit I was not aware of anything going on, although people in the Blackburn End after the game asked me if I saw it, and said it was bellowing out and people were on the roof.

I looked at the amateur video and it showed people burning what appeared to be garments in the lower tier which caused a little smoke but not anything spectacular, in part 2 of the video it shows clearly the smoke coming from the upper tier but the cause of such to anyone who was in the ground would of been unclear.

What the person alledges is that no-one actually knew where or what had caused the smoke and because of this the code word used for evacuation was deployed , at this stage it was over-ruled despite no-one knowing the cause. This is a brave call to make, when you dont actually know what has happened. In the end it turned out to be flares which had been set off by away supporters and medical attention was given at the scene to around 10 supporters. So no fire, no deaths and no evacuation. However stewards as they have been all season were under strict instruction to remove things like banners, and prevent protest, whilst something like this which could have been serious was not given the same attention.

Any sort of evacuation is a major thing to do, but when those who have the required expertise call for it then , they do so for good reason. If this incident had turned out to be more serious then a potential stadium disaster could have occurred.

Since recieving this account of events, we have spoken to a number of people who were also working that evening, and the whole story has been verified by them. We have yet to speak to an employee who says contrary to what has been alledged.

Some will say a mountain is being made from a mole hill, especially as we all know now what the cause of the smoke was, however at the time no-one did know. Silencing supporters has become something of a statement from the club over the last 10 months, and if those efforts to silence supporters put other people at risk then a complete re-think is needed IMO. The stewards were under strict instruction to remove any banners as they have all season and prevent protest, this was more important on the evening in question thane things going on elsewhere in the ground

In addition with the club now requiring a new Stadium Manager and Health and safety Manager (Must add here that this had nothing to do with John Newshams departure, of whom I have spoken to regarding this particular incident) and the club indicating to us this week that they have no intention of facilatating any form of peaceful protest this season. Then perhaps by this being in the public domain (We did a lot of trying to get these claims verfied before even putting it out) it may just give them a kick up the back-side that silencing supporters is not as important as peoples general safety.

[chaddyrovers]

What did John Newsham say about this incident???

Who at the club say that they would be no pre arrange protest allow in the ground?

[Baz]

If the club don't allow pre-arranged protests then they'll get unarranged protests, which are likely to be less safe for everyone.

[Beta Ray Bill]

If the person who has relayed the story was working for the Fire Services, then the Club could not overrule any order to evacuate. If the individual was working for the club, then the decision could well have gone up the line. Consideration would have included the actual evacuation route and risk assessment on that, including via the pitch. If there was even a suspicion of a serious incident noone would have hesitated.

Did the Fire Services attend, as I understand their deployment to sites is usually public record.

[glen9mullan]

An update , more information has come to light this afternoon of official complaints being issued at Ewood by supporters who were effected at the time including their children who recieved medical attention.

We have been passed dialogue between the club and these supporters which can e described as nothing be completely un-professional, and are littered with excuses. The FSF are also on the case and have contacted me this afternoon, as they was made aware of this by victims prior to the release of yesterdays article.

In addition we have also been made aware that Derik Shaw has been today contacted regarding this

[Brfcrule1]

Having read this it is totally disgusting peoples lives were put in danger.

To think they are now thinking of putting Kean's bodyguard in charge of stadium safety god help us if this happens next time this could be even worse.

Surely this jobs for unqualified oafs needs investigating and the authorities should come down hard on Venkys and make sure they have the necessary qualified people in such important roles.