[Archived] Why all the Portugese players?

[perthblue02]

Just a theory but whenever our company does recruitment we try and get candidates through the cheapest channels possible to keep agency fees down (or eliminate fees altogether). Might seem tight but it does save on expensive agency fees.

I suspect that's what's happening here. They'll have struck a deal with agent(s) to recruit on the cheap. Hence the influx all from one place.

Official reason? Portugal is an untapped market. There's got to be another Cronaldo in there somewhere!

The last 18 months don't seem to play out that way, but may be a new way of thinking

[67splitscreen]

Here's another angle, Shabby would have come across Henrique during his time In Asia as a Pundit, He's employed by Venkys as youth development or what ever his title was, comes across his old mate again, Shabby doesn't rate Kean, Henrique I signed him as a player....... later Shabby contacts him ..... can your son help us with players ........ I'm sure we can as I have history with Steve, so maybe it is all just coincidence.

[Veevs]

You just never know with these clowns.. maybe its some weird tactic to try and entice some past it Brazilian player.. "look we have 7 portuguese speaking players.."

[K-Hod]

I wouldn't pin your hopes on one of the footballing governing bodies getting involved lad,

They have proved so far, they do not give a ###### about Blackburn Rovers, its town or its Fans.

I'm not 'lad'. But when it comes to handing out punishments for wrongdoing, they've shown they're not shy in dishing out points deductions- ask Portsmouth.....

[perthblue02]

I'm not 'lad'. But when it comes to handing out punishments for wrongdoing, they've shown they're not shy in dishing out points deductions- ask Portsmouth.....

But would they have done the same if any of the Portsmouth takeovers had been helped along by one of the FA's business partners whilst one of the board members of the club and also a FA committee member appeared to keep quiet? or would they have dragged their feet until a group of supporters handed them documents

Unfortunately Rovers situation is slightly different than Portsmouth as there are factors which involve the FA organisation no matter how slight .

[Nobert]

I hope this is put in 'the dossier', and handed to government, the FA et al. The many layers of corruption that seem to engulf football, and especially our club needs to be taken at the highest levels. If the FA are incapable or unwilling of the job, then they should be dissolved by the government, and balls to any FIFA/UEFA ban on our teams. They might be a bunch of crooks too.

Hope that isn't to libellous Glenn.

[yeti-dog]

I really wanted one of these portugese guys to look like they might just cut the mustard. Unfortunately, on the basis of how they performed last night, they all look like they're going to be as useful to us as a one-legged bloke in a ar$e kicking competition.

[arbitro]

I hope this is put in 'the dossier', and handed to government, the FA et al. The many layers of corruption that seem to engulf football, and especially our club needs to be taken at the highest levels. If the FA are incapable or unwilling of the job, then they should be dissolved by the government, and balls to any FIFA/UEFA ban on our teams. They might be a bunch of crooks too.

Hope that isn't to libellous Glenn.

The FA really don't like getting involved. The week before last the odious David Sullivan went on record as sayiing (almost bragging) that West Ham still owed Sheffield United £10m in compensation for Tevezgate. Last week they sign a second rate footballer from Wolves for £10m. Why haven't the FA insisted they pay their debts to another football club first? Sheffield United could potentially have got promoted last season with some new investment on the playing side.

They don't like getting involved unless it is forced on them.

[Nobert]

Exactly. They're complete and utter ____s who just like the wages, free match tickets and blazers. They couldn't run a bath. If I was the sports secretary for the government, I'd just get rid of all of them, and ring David Brailsford and offer him the Chief Exec of the FA, with the brief of setting it up to actually work. Stuff Brooking, he's a polite, ineffectual man with no ideas, get rid of the committee stiffs who represent the amateur game in Rutland and start again. Such a move will mean we'll be banned from the world cup, but who cares? It's not like we will win it, or that we have any power within FIFA.

[Mullionvagrant]

I wasn't aware until now that according to the Wiki link below third party ownership is allowed in Portugal

i would be interested to know based upon reading this article if anybody has third party ownership of our Portuguese players??? (Or links/shares in companies with third party ownership).. (i am particularly interested to know if Henrich is owned by a third party because if signed he will have only stayed a short while at FC Braga. Nuno Gomes was at Braga before ending up at Rovers ).

The involvement of investors in the 'ownership' of players is a common practice in football, particularly in Brazil and Argentina and Portugal.

"As third parties ownership is allowed in Portugal" http://en.wikipedia....iation_football

The article raises a few questions.

[perthblue02]

I know the Premier League have rules against 3rd part ownership of players but do the football league?

[Mullionvagrant]

I know the Premier League have rules against 3rd part ownership of players but do the football league?

I was asking myself the same. I was also wondering if we were promoted (big IF) would this pose a problem/would we as a result meet the criteria to be accepted back into the Premiership if any of the players were owned by a third party.

[perthblue02]

It sure raises a few hypothetical questions doesn't it,

If people involved in an hypothetical club were also involved with third parties who own players , would they play with the clubs future by getting relegated to a league that as no rules on third party ownership to bring players in?

As well as legally being able to hold a 5% stake in a football club could a manager of a club also hold a stake in players via third party ownership?

Would that manager play a particular player possibly third party owned ahead of a better player?

Could that manager bring third party owned players into a club just to put them in the shop window and move them on at a loss to the club?

Sure there's loads more hypothetical situations that could crop up at any club in this situation

[Mullionvagrant]

If people involved in an hypothetical club were also involved with third parties who own players , would they play with the clubs future by getting relegated to a league that as no rules on third party ownership to bring players in?

Hypothetically it could be possible, although i do not know the championships rules on 3rd party ownership-can anybody clear this up. can this be legitimate/possible?- It was widely reported that Rovers when in the Premiership had issues with the governing body accepting the Formica transfer due to complications with third party ownership. This it was reported delayed his signing and concerned John Williams (letter).

[McClarky]

I hear that in Brazil it is quite common to set up a football club with the sole intention of bringing in young players and selling them on at a profit. In this model the actual team's performance is peripheral and in some cases there isn't actually a first team at all. You wonder whether the main aim of the people behind the Rovers isn't to set something like this up and when you think about it there are several things in favour of this theory:

1) Why not try and stave off relegation from the league in which they probably couldn't operate this model?

2) Why keep a manager who is plainly no good but has been involved in bringing through youngsters and is willing to toe the party line at all cost?

3) Why bring in the most obscure players available despite the availability of far more appropriate players if you want to get out of this league?

4) Why bring in several untried youngsters from the same country with an older mentor to help in their development, especially when they are totally unsuitable for the type of football the first team will need to play?

5) Why invest heavily, or claim to be investing heavily, in youth facilities when there doesn't seem to be enough money to spend on anything else?

6) Why not do anything about dwindling crowds and lack of sponsorship in contradiction to how every other football club is or has been run?

There is definitely something going on at our club and although it's now been going on for nearly 2 years we are still none the wiser and every month the situation gets worse.

[JBiz]

This is indeed a can of worms.

Summarising; An ex manager of Academica amongst many other portuguese teams, was a spokesman for Venkys before the takeover. He was the vietnamese coach at the time. The same manager had Steve Kean as a player in 1988. Tenuous link?

The coach; Henrique Callisto has a son who is the owner of TGC sports management (agency)

3rd party ownership is possible in the markets used in previous deals. Also, one deal (formica) was mentioned in the JW letter. Rules in different competitions could explain the lack of his participation in the first half season. It could also be speculated this was the same reason Bruno did not play (having looked a decent full back in his first 2 appearances).

Dig dig dig....

[Baz]

With Formica, newells bought out the 3rd party, then we signed him from them. It's not uncommon with south American players. The link between the Vietnam manager and Kean is intriguing though.

[philipl]

Apropros nothing in particular, the first time I looked at Venky's web site (remember the old mom and pop one?), which was before the Trust had sold, I saw that Vietnamese subsidiary and immediately thought of that country's reputation for illegal gambling and the like....

[Mullionvagrant]

Back to previous questions:-

i) Does anybody know the football leagues rules on 3rd party ownership-is this a possibility legitimately?

ii) If players are purchased whilst in the championship 3rd party can they subsequently play on return to the premiership legitimately or does this compromise return??

[Baz]

Back to previous questions:-

i) Does anybody know the football leagues rules on 3rd party ownership-is this a possibility legitimately?

ii) If players are purchased whilst in the championship 3rd party can they subsequently play on return to the premiership legitimately or does this compromise return??

3rd party ownership isn't legal in the Uk game.

There is ways around this (see prev. Post re Formica)

There is nothing on here to substantiate any 3rd party ownership claims.

[philipl]

For a giggle, I told a lady accountant the individual bits of information I know that is in the hands of the football authorities but changing all the names involved (she knows nothing about football anyway) and said it was a horse stud.

At the end, I asked so do Voodoo Hags own Basket Rash or does Jasper Asp own Basket Rash?

She unhesitatingly said Jasper Asp.

[Mullionvagrant]

3rd party ownership isn't legal in the Uk game.

There is ways around this (see prev. Post re Formica)

There is nothing on here to substantiate any 3rd party ownership claims.

Thanks Baz-thats as i thought, and yes i agree there is nothing at all that i have been made aware of to substantiate any 3rd party claims this is purely hypothetical based upon reading the wiki article and the questions it raised. No direct relation to rovers just seeing if it could be possible.

[The Prof.]

I think 3rd party ownership is only NOT allowed in England and France (possibly Germany, not sure). I am not a conspiracy theorist but as we keep sinking lower and the oddities keep on coming I am beginning to wonder now.

Our squad is made up of very few reliable 'stars' now but is very big. It consists of a few elderly pensioners (Dunn, Murphy, MGP, Gomez, even Etuhu is 30), and lot of very raw untried people. We have sold or are selling all the quality players (I include MGP, Olsson but 'we don't want to sell him,' Nzonzi, Petrovitch, and I supect Vukovic and in this, and I don't rate Robbo much as a keeper but a great guy). We seem to have lots of Portuguese players from second rate clubs with no track records of playing games, and from above their ownership is questionable - are we renting them?

This leaves us with a poor squad in my opinion, a less than useless manager, no commercial management and no sponsorship to speak of, oh, and very odd owners. Every time I think it's bottomed out it gets worse.

Now these Portuguese players are just 'appearing.' Do we pay for them? rent them? are they free? do we get to keep them? The Venky's must have lawyers checking this out surely.

Or are we now just a sort of transit station for agents to move players in and out of the league? I'm completely bewildered now.

[Baz]

Thanks Baz-thats as i thought, and yes i agree there is nothing at all that i have been made aware of to substantiate any 3rd party claims this is purely hypothetical based upon reading the wiki article and the questions it raised. No direct relation to rovers just seeing if it could be possible.

I think the more interesting link is that Kean has a previous working relationship with a manager who worked with Venkys pre-takeover, and who's son is a portugese football agent. That doesn't make me think at all of 3rd party ownership, more who may be involved with our new crop of players.

[Nobert]

http://tgc-globalmanagement.com/en/

The TCG site. It doesn't state that it is part of the Kentaro empire, but it seems to hint it is cosy with the Portuguese authorities to some extent, and even represents a Vietnamese based player or two. Has links to marketing companies (see link below, which is entirely in Portuguese so I can't read it), and a sports psychologist/hypnotist guy called Ricardo Medoza, which may explain some things!

http://www.marketinghbusiness.com/inicio.html