[Archived] Champions League 2012/13

[den]

Watched by? Half the world is watched by big clubs these days. Rhodes was watched by United, but a lot of people feel that we overpaid when we stumped up £8m. Did we overpay for a player who was being watched by United?

Watched by and wanted by Eddie. You forgot the main bit. The argument that we got the best possible fee for him is simply negated by the fact that Liverpool bid £22m. We didn't get the right fee because other clubs were prepared to pay more than we got - that's a fact. As for Ferdinand being worth more because he had more games under his belt - what has that got to do with anything - is quality judged by how many games someone's played for west ham? Of course not. Ferguson saw that Ferdinand was a superb player and was willing to pay the money. He saw Jones was a superb player but only needed to pay the get out clause fee.

[Amo]

Glad to see Bayern pissing over Arsenal and ITV's biased commentary.

[thenodrog]

Watched by and wanted by Eddie. You forgot the main bit. The argument that we got the best possible fee for him is simply negated by the fact that Liverpool bid £22m. We didn't get the right fee because other clubs were prepared to pay more than we got - that's a fact. As for Ferdinand being worth more because he had more games under his belt - what has that got to do with anything - is quality judged by how many games someone's played for west ham? Of course not. Ferguson saw that Ferdinand was a superb player and was willing to pay the money. He saw Jones was a superb player but only needed to pay the get out clause fee.

Give it up Den. You are wasting your time, as I've said frequently eddie doesn't understand football.

[Guest Norbert]

How big were the boos? And did the Bayern manager hand Arsene his new buttocks back in the form of a hat (we gave him the same gift on Saturday)?

[roverandout]

time for wenger to go

[DE.]

How big were the boos? And did the Bayern manager hand Arsene his new buttocks back in the form of a hat (we gave him the same gift on Saturday)?

A fair few at the end of the first half... end of the game there were some scattered boos, but mostly resgination from the Arsenal fans. They know they just aren't in Bayern's league (both literally and figuratively!).

[Guest Norbert]

If Bale stays a bit longer, they'll not be in Spurs' league, let alone the two Manchester clubs.

[thenodrog]

If Bale stays a bit longer, they'll not be in Spurs' league, let alone the two Manchester clubs.

Bit of a poor do that Norbert. I realise everybody ahnd everything has a shelf life but as far as I can see Wenger has done a remarkable job in his 16 years. They have had more success than ever before or at least until way back to the 30's. He's kept Arsenal financially viable whilst MU and Lpool have sunk into major debt and Man City and Chelsea have had unrecoverable and potentially (God willing) fatal amounts of money chucked in front of them. Given a level playing field financially they would still be top dogs imo.

furthermore I'm sure most people prefer to watch Arsenal's brand of pass and move football before that of any other English club. I find it quite ironic that there is a percentage of particularly 'noisy' fans turning against Wenger reminiscent of the situation at ewood with Allardyce. I can only echo the advice of Alan Sugar to the supporters fawning eagerly over the Venkymob when they first turned up "Blackburn fans need to be careful what they wish for" .... ditto Arsenal's.

Only thing Wenger has done wrong is not find replacements of similar quality for the likes of Adams, Vierra, Bergkamp, Henry and RVP. Impossible task really cos all those players likely for that have been snapped up by the massive remunerations paid by the suicide squad of clubs in the above paragraph. No matter how good Walcott thinks he just isn't in their league is he?

[Baz]

Bit of a poor do that Norbert. I realise everybody ahnd everything has a shelf life but as far as I can see Wenger has done a remarkable job in his 16 years. They have had more success than ever before or at least until way back to the 30's. He's kept Arsenal financially viable whilst MU and Lpool have sunk into major debt and Man City and Chelsea have had unrecoverable and potentially (God willing) fatal amounts of money chucked in front of them. Given a level playing field financially they would still be top dogs imo.

furthermore I'm sure most people prefer to watch Arsenal's brand of pass and move football before that of any other English club. I find it quite ironic that there is a percentage of particularly 'noisy' fans turning against Wenger reminiscent of the situation at ewood with Allardyce. I can only echo the advice of Alan Sugar to the supporters fawning eagerly over the Venkymob when they first turned up "Blackburn fans need to be careful what they wish for" .... ditto Arsenal's.

Only thing Wenger has done wrong is not find replacements of similar quality for the likes of Adams, Vierra, Bergkamp, Henry and RVP. Impossible task really cos all those players likely for that have been snapped up by the massive remunerations paid by the suicide squad of clubs in the above paragraph. No matter how good Walcott thinks he just isn't in their league is he?

I think that after picking up Petit, Henry, Fabregas & RVP etc for relative peanuts, he now has far more competition, Newcastle for instance are recruiting from France whereby 15 years ago, most clubs only had 1 or 2 non british or irish.. He also seems to regularly lose his better players, but not replace them. I dont know if that is his fault or the board / owners though.

[Amo]

Whatever way you slice it, eight years without a trophy is unacceptable for a club of Arsenal's size, especially when they're being knocked out by lower league opposition. People keep postulating that Wenger is the better devil they know, but who's to say another manager couldn't come in and assemble a team that is less flattering on the eye but capable of winning trophies?

[Baz]

Whatever way you slice it, eight years without a trophy is unacceptable for a club of Arsenal's size, especially when they're being knocked out by lower league opposition. People keep postulating that Wenger is the better devil they know, but who's to say another manager couldn't come in and assemble a team that is less flattering on the eye but capable of winning trophies?

If theres one failing, its his continuation to play reserve sides at even the more advanced stages of cup competitions.

[Oklahoma]

Jermaine Jones scored for Schalke before half time. 1-1 now.

And to think he played for Rovers a few years ago...

[Guest Norbert]

The Barcelona-AC Milan result proves that you cannot expect to just turn up and win without decent defenders or goalie. Even if you have such talent like Messi, Fabregas, Xavi.......For the past few years Barcelona have been arrogant sticking defensive midfielders in the middle of defence and just assuming their skill and creativity will always win out. Chelsea did a brilliant job on them last season and now Milan have too. They should forget about signing Bale, and concentrate on brining a defender in the mould of Vidic or Terry, and bring in a better keeper than the average Valdes.

[Audax]

Interesting, AC Milan is only 4th place in the Italian League: http://int.soccerway.com/national/italy/serie-a/20122013/regular-season/

and Juventus, first, defeated Celtic the other day, think last week. I'm seeing the AC MIlan match right now, Milan got a real good attack just in the 16th minute. Looks like a good game.

[Daniel Louis Grabko (Dan)]

Interesting, AC Milan is only 4th place in the Italian League: http://int.soccerway.com/national/italy/serie-a/20122013/regular-season/

and Juventus, first, defeated Celtic the other day, think last week. I'm seeing the AC MIlan match right now, Milan got a real good attack just in the 16th minute. Looks like a good game.

Two former Portsmouth players scoring for Milan to beat Barcelona 2-0. Prince-Boetang and Muntari.

[BrisRover]

Interesting, AC Milan is only 4th place in the Italian League: http://int.soccerway.com/national/italy/serie-a/20122013/regular-season/

and Juventus, first, defeated Celtic the other day, think last week. I'm seeing the AC MIlan match right now, Milan got a real good attack just in the 16th minute. Looks like a good game.

Milan started the Serie A season badly but that was due to losing the likes of Ibrahimovic, Thiago Silva, Nesta, Gattusso, Inzaghi, Cassano, Van Bommel, Seedorf, Zambrotta and have since also lost Pato and Emmanuelson. There a a couple of others that escapre me at the minute but if you lose that amount of talent in such a short period of time it is going to affect you. The plus side is that Milan have now got a much more youthful side and they have been surging up the table. Stephen El Shaarawy is a real talent and will be a big name in coming years. Their main weakness at the moment has been their central defence. The main reason why they kept Barca scoreless is they defended as a unit with the likes of El Shaarawy tireless tracking back to help out. I've been an AC Milan supporter since i was around 5 (I'm now 31) and this is the weakest Milan side i think i have ever seen on paper but as they say you don't win games on paper and that performance was outstanding!

[K-Hod]

Milan started the Serie A season badly but that was due to losing the likes of Ibrahimovic, Thiago Silva, Nesta, Gattusso, Inzaghi, Cassano, Van Bommel, Seedorf, Zambrotta and have since also lost Pato and Emmanuelson. There a a couple of others that escapre me at the minute but if you lose that amount of talent in such a short period of time it is going to affect you. The plus side is that Milan have now got a much more youthful side and they have been surging up the table. Stephen El Shaarawy is a real talent and will be a big name in coming years. Their main weakness at the moment has been their central defence. The main reason why they kept Barca scoreless is they defended as a unit with the likes of El Shaarawy tireless tracking back to help out. I've been an AC Milan supporter since i was around 5 (I'm now 31) and this is the weakest Milan side i think i have ever seen on paper but as they say you don't win games on paper and that performance was outstanding!

Good point about the loss of players- BUT, the highlighted player is on loan at Fulham at the minute!!!

[speeeeeeedie]

Barring an Arsenal miracle the "Best League in the world" will have no teams particiapting in the last 8 of the Champions' League.

My money is on a German team winning it all.

[Amo]

My money is on a German team winning it all.

Hope so. Have a lot of respect for ze German game.

[speeeeeeedie]

Barcelona murdered Milan tonight. However, it could have be so much different. Barcelona's dodgy defending kept it interesting until the last minute.

[Salgado Is A Hero]

One team misses a glorious chance and the other goes up the other end and scores. It's surprising how often that happens.

Fair play to Alba for making that lung-busting run in the dying seconds.

A Barca vs Dortmund/Bayern final would probably be a great spectacle.

[Audax]

If Barcelona win their 5th Champions League Title, does that mean they get to take the Trophy home??? Actually, same question for Bayern too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Champions_League (List of winners)

------------

You see, a few years ago, I think I saw t-shirts for sale, bragging for Liverpool, poking fun at Manchester United and those shirts said something like "After you win the Champions League for the 5th time, you can put the Trophy in your cabinet". Whatever.

[DE.]

I thought Milan became overawed by the occasion last night. They struggled to keep control of the ball and seemed genuinely stunned by how ferocious Barca were at regaining possession when they didn't have it. Barcelona definitely have flaws - defensively they're suspect and if Messi got injured they'd lose a huge source of goals and creativity - but I think it's between them, Bayern and Madrid for the Champs League this year.

[T4E]

Barça have two main issues. Lack of cover at CB is the biggest - Mascherano is horrendous there. He frequently gets under the ball, his positioning is terrible. He got away with another huge ricket last night.

The other is the inability to attack at pace. They have the ability to retain the ball throughout a game which is counter productive sometimes, as the opposition don't press and there's little scope to counter attack. The 4th last night was an example of what usually Real Madrid do far better than Barça - that "blitzkrieg" counter attack that is all pace and power and nigh on impossible to stop when the opposition have over committed forward. The likes of Alexis, Tello, Pedro, Messi, Alves and Alba are all capable, but it's a tactic they don't use as it involves initially surrendering possession. It only happened last night as Milan were chasing the game. If they can strike a better balance they will be even harder to stop.

[cn174]

Barça have two main issues. Lack of cover at CB is the biggest - Mascherano is horrendous there. He frequently gets under the ball, his positioning is terrible. He got away with another huge ricket last night.

The other is the inability to attack at pace. They have the ability to retain the ball throughout a game which is counter productive sometimes, as the opposition don't press and there's little scope to counter attack. The 4th last night was an example of what usually Real Madrid do far better than Barça - that "blitzkrieg" counter attack that is all pace and power and nigh on impossible to stop when the opposition have over committed forward. The likes of Alexis, Tello, Pedro, Messi, Alves and Alba are all capable, but it's a tactic they don't use as it involves initially surrendering possession. It only happened last night as Milan were chasing the game. If they can strike a better balance they will be even harder to stop.

Not the worst couple of issues to have though!! I'll swap them their inability to lack at pace for our inability to pass the ball twice in a row, see how we both get on