[Archived] US Presidential Election 2012

[BuckyRover]

For what purpose exactly? Lots of heterosexual people don't feel any need to marry do they?

btw I do like to be accurate whenever possible ...... http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/normal?q=normal

So because some straight people don't want to marry, gay people should be prevented from doing so.

You are such a troll

[Rovermatt]

Good to see Obama get back in. A perfect repudiation of the lunatic bent that has gripped the American conservative movement.

For what purpose exactly? Lots of heterosexual people don't feel any need to marry do they?

But heterosexual people are able to marry.

Not that gays being able to marry makes any difference to their straight counterparts. As James Carville once said: "I was against gay marriage until I realized I didn't have to get one."

[Amo]

Come on, Drogster, say what you really think. It's not like you to skirt the issue.

[philipl]

http://yougov.co.uk/news/2012/11/07/how-obama-won/

Some very striking statistics there as well as monumental egg on face wrong predictions.

Romney's vote came from the old, the uneducated and the white male.

A particularly stunning vote was amongst American Jews- they went 70-30 for Obama.

[Mike E]

Anyway, glad to see Obama stay in office. Not because he's awesome, but because he's better than a Mormon nut-job who believes in magic pants.

Obama - Berg

Romney - Kean

Valid comparison ofc

[speeeeeeedie]

Poor Steve really fell for it.

I can't watch Fox News, but I did for 5 minutes last night and it looked like they were reporting on a funeral.

It was obvious to many in the media on the day, and more so after 8pm that Obama had won, but they all kept churning out rubbish to keep people tuning in. Watching live feeds of Obama's victory party v. Romney's victory party would have told you everything you needed to know without the need for talking heads and fancy graphics.

The Republicans need to devise a new strategy or they could be on the outside for a while. America's population is becoming more ethnically diverse, their party is not.

They will continue to do well in US House elections as local electoral districts allow for it, but they will be left behind in statewide and national ballots if they let the nutters (Palin for one) continue to be regarded as the top echelon.

As they still hold the house, expect a lot of what Dave said; little legislative movement as Boehner and his crew (Paul Ryan among them) lick their wounds and try their best to stop any progress.

[jim mk2]

Romney's vote came from the old, the uneducated and the white male.

Talking of which, where's Steve Moss ?

The Republican party is like the Conservatives in 1997, out of touch, in danger of becoming sidelined and likely to be out of office for many years. The US demographic has shifted and the traditional white Republican voter will soon be in a minority compared to the growing Hispanic population who traditionally vote Democrat. Can the GOP reinvent itself and embrace all elements of US society like Dave's One Nation Tories ? Doubtful.

[DE.]

Obama isn't perfect but Romney would have been a disaster. The Americans ultimately picked the best of two pretty lame candidates from two pretty lame parties.

[Amo]

Seems much a case of keeping out Romney rather than electing Obama. Even if the latter did fail to deliver on all his golden promises.

[philipl]

From conservative blogger Andrew Sullivan:

What About Benghazi?

Last night, Fox News couldn't stop talking about how Libya should have doomed Obama. It was surreal - just a glimpse into the crazy that now defines the Ailes-Rove right. Marc Lynch provides a reality check:

In retrospect, I suspect that the intense focus on Benghazi hurt Romney more than Obama. I suspect that most voters quickly recognized Benghazi for the Republican pseud0-scandal it always was, and received it at roughy the same wavelength as Donald Trump demanding a birth certificate. The prospect of a hammer blow to bring down the incumbent enemy may have thrilled the base, but the very fact of its identification with Fox News and the right wing bubble limited its ability to travel farther. So did the fact that it fairly clearly was not a "scandal" of any significance. Yes, the tragic deaths revealed serious, relatively low-level, issues with inter-agency coordination and communication, and more major issues about intelligence and the changing nature of al-Qaeda's strategy and organization. But it was never the scandal which Republicans so desperately wanted it to be, nor Libya the failure so many believe it to be. Hopefully the real issues can now be addressed outside of the partisan frenzy.

The real story about Benghazi is a collision of three tragically screwed up ideas:

1) Republicans blocking a request for adequate funding for protecting smaller American diplomatic missions overseas meant there was no money for routine additional security.

2) A CIA/State Depsrtment assumption that visible armed protection of the American diplomatic presences in Libya would be counter-productive despite there being visible armed protection of American Embassies in places like London (where the public gets nervous at the rare site of publicly carried arms) and the Libyan people being for the most part passionately pro-American and understanding of the situation of the Americans.

3) That the American Ambassador was needed personally to support US commercial interests which were being supported by clandestine American agents operating as protection for US oil executives in the very oil-rich province around Benghazi. The desire to hide the extent to which CIA operatives are in effect working alongside Halliburton, Exxon and other American private big oil interests triggered a "run for cover and hide my identity" reaction by so many US Government employees in a critically ill-judged first reaction to the militants attacking the Benghazi compound. There was easily enough US Government manpower and firepower in Benghazi to have avoided the four deaths quite apart from the 100+ Blackwater types hanging around or the British and French who were asking if they could go in to rescue the mission but someone in the Pentagon preferred a "we are not there" denial of reality.

Very messy but this gets as close to fingering Dick Cheney's mates as it does Obama for leaving the tragic Ambassador and his colleagues under-protected.

[thenodrog]

So because some straight people don't want to marry, gay people should be prevented from doing so.

You are such a troll

'gay? That doesn't read quite right bucky. Given that you describe normal people as 'straight' shouldn't you by the same token use the term 'bent' when referring to homosexuals?

[thenodrog]

Anyway, glad to see Obama stay in office. Not because he's awesome, but because he's better than a Mormon nut-job who believes in magic pants.

Obama - Berg

Romney - Kean

Valid comparison ofc

Typical Sun story. As far as we can see that is just a common or garden vest. This is much more responsible reporting..... http://www.101greatg...ing-the-rounds/

I must say it's mighty odd and perplexing to see a nation effectively vote overwhelmingly to be taxed higher.

[Rovermatt]

Seems much a case of keeping out Romney rather than electing Obama. Even if the latter did fail to deliver on all his golden promises.

Obama only enjoyed a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate for a short time. Aside from his own shortcomings, the guy has faced an unprecedented level of opposition and obstruction from the GOP. I can't imagine why that is...

It's little wonder he couldn't get some of his agenda through. That said, he's hardly been sitting around twiddling his thumbs. The keany, right-wing healthcare plan was one of a number of big legislative achievements.

Typical Sun story. As far as we can see that is just a common or garden vest.

I must say it's mighty odd and perplexing to see a nation effectively vote overwhelmingly to be taxed higher.

Obama's tax plan raises taxes for people with lots of money. The majority of the people who voted for him won't be affected by the tax hikes he proposes (which bring levels of taxation up to where they were under Clinton).

[dave birch]

The market has just about got it right with a 2% fall, not because Obama got bank in, but because of the impass over the fiscal cliff.

The US lawmakers have got two months to get their act together, otherwise we'll have another collapse.

[BuckyRover]

Edit

[jim mk2]

I must say it's mighty odd and perplexing to see a nation effectively vote overwhelmingly to be taxed higher.

And here we have Tory Britain in all its splendour.........

Perhaps the US is a nation that can see past the ends of its noses rather than selfish individuals.

[BuckyRover]

http://melaniephillips.com/america-goes-into-the-darkness

She hasn't taken it well

[Mike E]

And here we have Tory Britain in all its splendour.........

Perhaps the US is a nation that can see past the ends of its noses rather than selfish individuals.

Yeah, cos new labour weren't selfish at all when they stole money from pensioners. The Tories are arseholes but they're doing a decent job (imo) of raising us from the ashes of Labour's cock-ups.

UKIP for me, are the way forward. Sort ourselves out by gettin out of the EU and, for now, stopping immigration until we're financially stable again.

[Steve Moss]

Talking of which, where's Steve Moss ?

Here I am.

Poor Steve really fell for it.

I did. And I'm still in a state of shock.

Though I freely admit that I was wrong and that posters like SydneyRover were right.

Still confident Steve?

No. But I'm confident that America has made a mistake and things will get worse.

Steve, one of the things I've learnt over the years is not put all my eggs in one basket.

This is wise but I'm unlikely to learn.

Hard luck Steve Moss, you did your best.

Thanks. I did my bit going door to door, etc. And he won Arizona and Mohave County (no surprise as it is deep red) so my state did its part.

And sorry about the delay getting back on. I was wiped out. I've been running my own campaign for Mohave County District 5 Supervisor and its time consuming. And while its bad news Romney lost, there is a small silver lining in that both I and my brother (who ran for the school board) won our elections locally: http://www.mohavedailynews.com/articles/2012/11/08/news/local/doc509b5b84821d6271237288.txt

[jim mk2]

Bad news Romney lost,

Bad news for Republicans maybe but most of the US and rest of the world is celebrating .

[koi]

Bitter sweet for me Steve. The thought of Romney being President filled me with dread so I'm pleased Obama won but I did want Hilary to win District 5, shame..

[Steve Moss]

Bitter sweet for me Steve. The thought of Romney being President filled me with dread so I'm pleased Obama won but I did want Hilary to win District 5, shame..

Hillary Williams was a lady. I like her a lot and she is very sensible (despite being a Democrat). As she correctly commented during our frequent debates, she and I have far more in common that we have apart.

But in Mohave County the real battle is the Republican Primary. We started with 9 cadidates and concluded with 5, and I won that. At the general election the odds heavily favored me as most of the independents are conservatives, not moderates. Which is why I won, for the most part, all the Republican votes and about 80% of the independent vote. Provisional final tallies were:

Steven Moss ® 8,055, 64.85%

Hilary Williams (D) 3,156, 25.41%

Chuck Denney (I) 1,194, 9.61%

So though Hillary ran a good campaign, its hard for a Democrat to win in Mohave County.

By the way, do you live in Arizona that you were familiar with the contest between Hillary and I?

[speeeeeeedie]

Steve, fair play for coming back on and facing the music. You hve to understand that, as Jim says, Obama would be considered on the right of the British political spectrum - a la Cameron. To support for soemone who tried to show how far right he could be will be met with a lot of derision. More people outside the US borders are happy Obama won as George Bush Jr. is living long in people's memories.

The country will get worse if the governemt can't agree on anything.

The recession is over, house prices are now rising, and jobs are slowly coming back. There is still plenty to do as always.

[Steve Moss]

The recession is over, house prices are now rising, and jobs are slowly coming back. There is still plenty to do as always.

I hope you are right. The pessimist in me sees a lot of money sitting on the sideline and I don't think things will get better anytime soon. In election years things always improve a bit (as the government primes the pump to ensure better odds) but then they go south within a few months afterwards. So I suspect we've not seen the worse, yet.

Then again my prediction on the national election was way off base, so my track record is not good and it may be simply sour grapes coloring my perception (as I obviously don't have my biases under control to the extent that I believed). So we'll see.

[dave birch]

Steve, fair play to you for getting out there and standing for office.

Whilst I wouldn't agree with your politics, it's always heartening to see someone wanting to do something for the community. It explains many of your posts on this thread.

It puts those that "say" a lot but do nothing into perspective, particularly those that have a vote but don't use it.