[Archived] Patience

[bluebruce]

I agree about SOME fans needing to be more patient at times. However, what you (the OP) said about Pedersen and Tugay I have to disagree with (Andrews, I do feel, was poor to average, but did get an unfair amount of stick, and far more than Peds or Toogs ever did).

Tugay WAS a liability for a long time during Souness' reign, his 'invisible friend' patch. When he got his act together, he became fantastic again and the legend we all know and love, but that doesn't mask the fact that at times he was dallying far too long on the ball before that, and gifting possession away. He should have been dropped. There were many games he should have been dropped, as he hadn't been playing well enough for a long time. It went on for so long that my family had a running joke about how Souey must be bumming him. He turned out to really get it together and become amazing, but players should be picked on their form not their reputation. Sometimes you even have to drop a player to get them performing again. I also don't remember anyone ever booing him.

Pedersen gave us about two great seasons followed by what, six or seven seasons of dross interspersed with occasional flashes of brilliance. Sometimes extremely occasional. He is another player who should have been dropped many more times than he was. He also should have been sold at numerous points, and is still a player I don't relish seeing on our team sheet even in the Championship. He seems like a really nice bloke, and I'd never boo him (never heard anyone else actually boo him either, though a lot of people shout out remarks when he bollockses it up). There is no need to be loyal to somebody who has been so poor for so long- in fact the club as a whole have repaid his 'loyalty' many times over with repeated and lucrative deals far beyond what he should be earning. We owe him NOTHING. He owes us A LOT.

And what you said about Murphy...his crime isn't taking the best offer he got, his crime has been his horrendous showings on the pitch to 'repay' that lucrative contract. He is someone else who needs dropping. Maybe it will light a fire up his ass and he will come back with his kean together. In the meantime he is a serious liability.

I have never and will never boo the players. But it doesn't mean I'm going to close my eyes to what I can see on the pitch and who is or isn't up to scratch. It's half the bloody point of watching football.

[Black Burn]

Then they have the brass neck to send us a comedian from a place where football is as relevant as snow, and expect us to swallow his confused and random ranting as them making things better. Well screw you, anyone with an ounce of sense saw through him in five seconds.

As much as I understand you dislike Shebby Singh, I take offence at your comment about Malaysia being a "place where football is as relevant as snow". Sure, maybe the teams in Southeast Asia suck when compared to European giants who partcipate in evey World Cup, but I assure you football here is as relevant to us as it is in Europe. People do live, breathe and talk football as much as you do, even if they aren't great at it. They buy football franchise, subscribe to cable television to watch every match of their beloved team, attend matches of their national team (even if it isn't playing well), etc. and here you are saying it is relevant to us as snow (and there is no snow in Southeast Asia).

Your discrimination against people from other countries is astounding.

[dave birch]

As much as I understand you dislike Shebby Singh, I take offence at your comment about Malaysia being a "place where football is as relevant as snow". Sure, maybe the teams in Southeast Asia suck when compared to European giants who partcipate in evey World Cup, but I assure you football here is as relevant to us as it is in Europe. People do live, breathe and talk football as much as you do, even if they aren't great at it. They buy football franchise, subscribe to cable television to watch every match of their beloved team, attend matches of their national team (even if it isn't playing well), etc. and here you are saying it is relevant to us as snow (and there is no snow in Southeast Asia).

Your discrimination against people from other countries is astounding.

Black Burn, I can understand your concerns, however, remember that many posters have been brought up with administrators such as John Williams etc. All they have ever known is a stable, well run club, one that was the envy of 90% of the clubs in the UK. To replace him with some pundit from (quite frankly, a second rate football country), with no administrative background is bound to upset people.

So, I would suggest that Plastic Head is posting out of frustration rather than being discriminatory towards those from other countries.

[Athlete]

Black Burn, I can understand your concerns, however, remember that many posters have been brought up with administrators such as John Williams etc. All they have ever known is a stable, well run club, one that was the envy of 90% of the clubs in the UK. To replace him with some pundit from (quite frankly, a second rate football country), with no administrative background is bound to upset people.

So, I would suggest that Plastic Head is posting out of frustration rather than being discriminatory towards those from other countries.

it would be like a pundit from England given carte blanche running of say AC Milan the Milanese would be very frustrated and upset

[greco]

probably a cultural thing. I´ve always, as an outsider/foreigenr, seen british football as tempo, pace, strenght and brutes tackling each other to death. Likewise i´ve always seen the british spectators as the type who appreciate exactly that type of football. A bone breaking tackling often seems to get more applause, then the more technical parts of the game. That rend is slowly changing though, with the import of very good and technical foreigners.

Personally i prefer a mix between fast counters and a patient build up. The difference between the good and lesser teams, is the timing and decision making of the players and as DE4life eloquently put it, our players apparently lack the intelligence to make the right decisions and at the right time. Without structure and someone who emphasises on structure and organisation, they just wont perform. The luxury of freedom, should only be given to one or 2 players and thats the ones with some quality.

To dare and try to dominate a game, a team must be well balanced, that means a mix of players who can do the creative part and some who do the hard work and can dominate through physical presence/dominance. Our squad is so terrible un-physical and unbalanced in favour of lightweights and that means we wont be sound defensively = we´ll have a hard time getting the ball and therefore wont be able to dominate a game through possession. If we are physically inferior, its important that the smaller players are organised, so they can back each other up. We wont be able to play or press teams like barca, but they do show how smaller and quick players, are able to close down areas. As stated, we wont be able to do exactly what they do, but the principles remain the same.

[bluebruce]

As much as I understand you dislike Shebby Singh, I take offence at your comment about Malaysia being a "place where football is as relevant as snow". Sure, maybe the teams in Southeast Asia suck when compared to European giants who partcipate in evey World Cup, but I assure you football here is as relevant to us as it is in Europe. People do live, breathe and talk football as much as you do, even if they aren't great at it. They buy football franchise, subscribe to cable television to watch every match of their beloved team, attend matches of their national team (even if it isn't playing well), etc. and here you are saying it is relevant to us as snow (and there is no snow in Southeast Asia).

Your discrimination against people from other countries is astounding.

Even as somebody who is vehemently anti-discrimination, I'm confused as to why you are offended by the comment from Plastic Head. It isn't discrimination, he just isn't aware that football is important in Malaysia (he didn't say Southeast Asia). If anything, it's just ignorance, and understandable at that (Malaysian football fanaticism is hardly the talk of England). In a way, it's a far more negative/worrying thing that football is really popular over there, yet Malaysia are no good at it. It isn't like he said Malaysia is a backwards place. Please don't be so quick to shout 'discrimination', it makes it much harder to fight it when it actually does come around, as everybody brings out their 'Oh no, the PC brigade' banners. Ever heard of the boy who cried wolf?

[Black Burn]

Even as somebody who is vehemently anti-discrimination, I'm confused as to why you are offended by the comment from Plastic Head. It isn't discrimination, he just isn't aware that football is important in Malaysia (he didn't say Southeast Asia). If anything, it's just ignorance, and understandable at that (Malaysian football fanaticism is hardly the talk of England). In a way, it's a far more negative/worrying thing that football is really popular over there, yet Malaysia are no good at it. It isn't like he said Malaysia is a backwards place. Please don't be so quick to shout 'discrimination', it makes it much harder to fight it when it actually does come around, as everybody brings out their 'Oh no, the PC brigade' banners. Ever heard of the boy who cried wolf?

Sorry, I guess I meant ignorance, not discrimination.

[DP]

Sorry, I guess I meant ignorance, not discrimination.

Correct, But the point about shebby Singh is spot on. He is a joker and was never taken seriously in Singapore as a pundit, and they have some really bad pundits.

[Blue n White Rover]

I agree and disagree with this thread. Patience is key, however over the last 24 months the inept decision making has led to many fans losing trust. We're fed up of all the lies and more importantly the lack of communication from the owners. They have bought in Shebby who has tried to bridge this gap, and fair play to him as he is slowly making progress.

We just want normality back at our club, we've been patient for over 2 years and who knows, it could take a further 2 more years if fans stop putting the pressure on the owners. If we stop now, then the owners may assume we are happy, now that Kean has left and continue to make thoughtless decisions. We need to make them aware that the problems haven't been resolved by getting rid of Kean.

[mhead]

This thread is well-meaning...but we are now long-suffering and for the last two years all downhill.

Saturdays match was a shambles. I was shocked by the lack of tempo to our play. I do not mind passing the ball around but not at an 8 year olds pace. The energy contrasts in the last 2 Home Matches: Boro/Wolves vs Rovers has been alarming.

We cannot be patient we are just alarmed at how low we have sunk.

[Roverthechimp]

This thread is well-meaning...but we are now long-suffering and for the last two years all downhill.

Saturdays match was a shambles. I was shocked by the lack of tempo to our play. I do not mind passing the ball around but not at an 8 year olds pace. The energy contrasts in the last 2 Home Matches: Boro/Wolves vs Rovers has been alarming.

We cannot be patient we are just alarmed at how low we have sunk.

My take on it (and i think that of the OP) is that we have at last got somebody who is dealing with the problems - Shebby. He may not be the most traditional saviour and at times he demonstrates he is far from perfect but since he came in we have seen the removal/resignation of our coach, an insistance that we go through a proper procedure to employ a proper manager, a focus from the coaching staff on our shocking defence and i'm sure that somewhere in a meeting room during the course of this week there will be a discussion on why our players seem relatively unfit when compared to their peers.

As you say 2 years we have been suffering from mismanagement and a prat as coach - it's going to take more than a couple of weeks to put everything right again