[Archived] Henning Berg - Rovers Manager

[blueboy3333]

Complete rubbish summary of our players from Blueboy333. Shows exactly why some fans are so out of touch with where the blame for this mess lies.

Could you be more specific because you couldn't be any less? Any of the player points you'd like to specifically counter?

ant the less of the insults about being 'out of touch'.... ya big c o c k

[blueboy3333]

+100

a '+100' for that? It's an intellectual maelstrom on here today.

[BiggusLaddus]

Our squad might have a few good players in it, but I can't put together any team of 11 that isn't appalling.

We do not have players who can cope with a 2 man central midfield. When we play this way we surrender possession and invite pressure onto our (creaking) defence.

Traditional answers to this are to flood the midfield with bodies and rely on the athleticism of your single striker and 2 wide men to make up for their lack of numbers, or bypass midfield completely and play long balls up to a big strong lump.

We don't have a big strong lump, maybe we will when Best is fit.

We don't have an athletic lone striker, but maybe we will when Best is fit.

The only athletic wide man we have is playing left back.

We need a strong striker and a new central midfield. We need a new left back so we can play Olsson wide left and we need a centre back who can win headers.

Anyone have any suggestions that Berg could use before January?

[Salgado Is A Hero]

In terms of loan signings, hopefully some of the ones already at clubs, who we should have been all over, are only until January and then we can try and get them ourselves eg Frimpong, Warnock, Jerome Thomas etc

If we want a wide man, we should try and sign Gary Mackay-Steven from Dundee United.

Central midfield? Guthrie at least.

[blueboy3333]

After doing some reading on the internal turmoil at Lillestrøm, evidently with several power-struggles, one thing seems clear: Berg is not a yes-man.

Some possible negatives:

- Man-management:

There has been criticism of his man-management skills at Lillestrøm, and that he's been too autoritative and demanding on his sorroundings. When he was sacked at Lillestrøm, it happened after a long time of reportedly internal turmoil (in addition to lack of results on the field). Some reports of a culture of fear in the club. How much of this is true is uncertain. (There was a lot of rumours going around before his sacking, and some could be attributed to people spreading rumours in a power-struggle trying to force him out. )

- Media-handling:

He may appear grumpy / un-enthusiastic / negative. I'm not saying he's not charismatic or a good motivator to the players, but he never appeared that way in the media. There'll be no funny quotes, or joking around. You'll be lucky if you ever see him smile during press interviews. Don't think the journalists will like him particularily well, contrary to say Holloway.

He's been facing critisism for his negativity both as a manager for Lyn and Lillestrøm, but while working as a pundit in TV he gradually did soften up and started to lighten up, so maybe he'll be more outgoing than ever this time around.

It must have been the players fault at Lillestrom as well!

[Salgado Is A Hero]

One last point about the "tactics and coaching" versus the "it's all about players" debate - then I'll shut up.

Let's look at one manager in the 60's and two much newer managers.

Was Jack Marshall so successful because he was a great tactician, or was he successful because he had a team that lined up - Else, Bray Newon, Clayton England McGrath, Ferguson McEvoy Pickering Douglas Harrison?

Mark Hughes had a poor start to his Ewood spell but turned it round. Did he turn it round because of some immediate improvement in his coaching abilities, or did he turn it round because he signed Savage, Bellamy and Bentley among others?

Was Dalglish successful because he was one of the countries finest tacticians, or was he successful because of the players he bought?

Now apart from that, take a look back at some of the old programmes of the seasons when we were relegated. Take a look at those squads. Did we have bad squads, or did we have really good players but went down because of the managers tactical and coaching credentials?

The game has changed though.....even very recently.

"Motivating managers" such as Souness didn't enjoy as much success later on in their careers as being tactically astute became a lot more important.....the same could probably be said about Martin O Neill.

Norwich came all the way from League 1 and managed to comfortably finish mid-table.....even when they would be changing their formation, game-plan and team selection in the last few months to try and prevent 2nd season syndrome.

They added in the summer and in January Howson, Snodgrass, Bassong and I think Damien Johnson as well......but they started the season badly and everyone had written them off......they didn't lose anyone from Lambert's time of note and added the aforementioned players yet were struggling badly.

Then the players got used to each other and the manager's tactics and now they're flying.

[G Somerset Rover]

Central midfield? Guthrie at least.

I mentioned him too on the transfer thread. He'd be exactly the player we could do with in central midfield. Sweat, blood and some bite.

As for central defence, I haven't a clue. In retrospect it was a shame we couldn't have flogged Samba to Villa and got Collins in part exchange. He's having a stormer at West Ham and would have been perfect in this division.

[Gally]

Agreeing with some of the previous comments, I'd feel sorry for whoever was manager at the moment, not because we don't have certain quality players, but that the players we have are simply incapable of fitting into a coherent system.

We took a massive gamble at the start of the season, paying wages we can't afford on a Murphy/Etuhu partnership in midfield, hopefully ensuring we outplay the majority of teams, and on Jordan Rhodes to ensure we're clinical in front of goal.

To say the least, it's totally backfired. Rhodes is a brilliant goalscorer, and I don't have a bad word to say about him really, but in recognising how he plays, you also need to recognise that he needs service. This would be fine if, as the plan was, we were outclassing teams, but seeing as we're not, we're also incapable of getting the best out of Rhodes.

In short, our squad is incapable of outplaying teams due to our ineffective midfield, and we are incapable of playing more directly as Rhodes/Rochina/Gomes are incapable of being targetmen. There is absolutely nothing that Berg can do about this other than making the best of it and waiting until January.

[Rover_Shaun]

When January comes and January goes and we are still sh.it what then? Another window wasted, another 6 months of failure, another season writted off, millions added to the debts, thousands added to the wagebill, hundreds knocked off the season ticket list

[PAFELL]

If Berg was removed - then who would or could, Rovers go for.

[Amo]

If Berg was removed - then who would or could, Rovers go for.

Based on Venky's current form... Wayne Hemingway.

[Rover_Shaun]

By May Berg will have failed miserably at the task he was given and will be fired anyway. By then we have compensated him, his backroom staff, the old backroom staff, as well as wasted another window and wasted valuable finances on Berg's choices of players which, if they follow the trend of his reign so far, will be more leaches on the clubs finances.

Only drastic action can get the club back to at least fighting for a playoff place next season and thats to remove Singh, Agnew, Shaw, Berg and his staff then employ competent replacements and start the rebuilding process.

To do nothing is to basically write off the next season and a half

[blueboy3333]

Agreeing with some of the previous comments, I'd feel sorry for whoever was manager at the moment, not because we don't have certain quality players, but that the players we have are simply incapable of fitting into a coherent system.

We took a massive gamble at the start of the season, paying wages we can't afford on a Murphy/Etuhu partnership in midfield, hopefully ensuring we outplay the majority of teams, and on Jordan Rhodes to ensure we're clinical in front of goal.

To say the least, it's totally backfired. Rhodes is a brilliant goalscorer, and I don't have a bad word to say about him really, but in recognising how he plays, you also need to recognise that he needs service. This would be fine if, as the plan was, we were outclassing teams, but seeing as we're not, we're also incapable of getting the best out of Rhodes.

In short, our squad is incapable of outplaying teams due to our ineffective midfield, and we are incapable of playing more directly as Rhodes/Rochina/Gomes are incapable of being targetmen. There is absolutely nothing that Berg can do about this other than making the best of it and waiting until January.

FFS. That's why teams have managers. That's Bergs job. That's why he gets paid. And if there's nowt he can do about it then why pay him. Lets trust in Shebby though eh cos he knows a good manager when he see's one! and he knows his footy!

But lets not criticise Henning cos he's 'one of us'. Is he bolloxxx. He's a jobbing manager, and not a good one. Wake up FFS. So what if he played for us? So did Hendry, would people want him in charge?

Bottom line. 1 win in 9. Worse results than Kean with the same players.

1 win in last 11 at Lillestrom.

S h i t e appointment.

S h i t e board

S h i t e Owners

S H I T E Christmas.

Fook em all.

[Gally]

FFS. That's why teams have managers. That's Bergs job. That's why he gets paid. And if there's nowt he can do about it then why pay him. Lets trust in Shebby though eh cos he knows a good manager when he see's one! and he knows his footy!

Of course it is. He needs to get the best out of what he's got.

What I said is that our squad has been assembled in a way in which we've signed a set of individuals, some good, plenty not so good, without considering at all how they might play together. The result is what we see every week, chaos on the pitch with no obvious cohesion.

Berg's job is to change this for the better as soon as possible, and if results don't change when he's had the ability to change the squad, then by all means criticise him. Until then, recognise he's got a brief which other managers which we've almost sainted in the past would struggle with. How would Allardyce have played with this team?

[Sparky Marky]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="Blue and White Army" data-cid="1349686" data-time="1355765616"><p>

By May Berg will have failed miserably at the task he was given and will be fired anyway.

</p></blockquote>

Yeah, cos these knobs have a track record of sacking incompetent managers, don't they?

[Speedie Dived]

FFS. That's why teams have managers. That's Bergs job. That's why he gets paid. And if there's nowt he can do about it then why pay him. Lets trust in Shebby though eh cos he knows a good manager when he see's one! and he knows his footy!

But lets not criticise Henning cos he's 'one of us'. Is he bolloxxx. He's a jobbing manager, and not a good one. Wake up FFS. So what if he played for us? So did Hendry, would people want him in charge?

Bottom line. 1 win in 9. Worse results than Kean with the same players.

1 win in last 11 at Lillestrom.

S h i t e appointment.

S h i t e board

S h i t e Owners

S H I T E Christmas.

Fook em all.

Nobody can currently argue Berg is doing a good job, however there is still a huge unknown over his managerial ability, these are not his players or his backroom staff. We do know that the majority of these players are not good enough, or have been and no longer are.

One thing to take into consideration, players can relatively quickly end a manager, i don't see these players currently busting a gut for berg.

[blueboy3333]

Gally, i'd imagine Fat Sam would organise them defensively and grind out results. This is what he did after he took over Ince's team. The players got slated in that team too under Ince. They were the dogs proverbials a few months later. Sam certainly wouldn't allow his team to give so many goals away from set pieces and crosses. Thats basic organisation at any level of football.

I agree there was not much thought put into recruiting the players but Berg has to get them playing as a team. There's enough players competing for each position. Lots of managers take over poor teams and get results. Bergs gone from a short passing team, to 4-5-1, to 4-4-2 and now a more direct game in just over a month. The results have got worse. Things may improve come January but if he can't win in this league with what he's got at his disposal then he might as well give up.

As for his brief he took over a team in a good position. 6th in the league i think. We've since got 6 points. We'r probably bottom of the form table over the last month. Even Kean got results with this team and he's rightly ridiculed as an awful manager. So did Black. Have the players changed? No.

I'd never saint Sam BTW. Probably Hughes. Deffo Daggers & Harford. Happy days!

[John]

Interesting to know who is really calling the shots over backroom staff changes and why the delay?

[Athlete]

Interesting to know who is really calling the shots over backroom staff changes and why the delay?

think we all know who is calling the shots and it's not Henning

[Gally]

Gally, i'd imagine Fat Sam would organise them defensively and grind out results. This is what he did after he took over Ince's team. The players got slated in that team too under Ince. They were the dogs proverbials a few months later. Sam certainly wouldn't allow his team to give so many goals away from set pieces and crosses. Thats basic organisation at any level of football.

I agree there was not much thought put into recruiting the players but Berg has to get them playing as a team. There's enough players competing for each position. Lots of managers take over poor teams and get results. Bergs gone from a short passing team, to 4-5-1, to 4-4-2 and now a more direct game in just over a month. The results have got worse. Things may improve come January but if he can't win in this league with what he's got at his disposal then he might as well give up.

As for his brief he took over a team in a good position. 6th in the league i think. We've since got 6 points. We'r probably bottom of the form table over the last month. Even Kean got results with this team and he's rightly ridiculed as an awful manager. So did Black. Have the players changed? No.

I'd never saint Sam BTW. Probably Hughes. Deffo Daggers & Harford. Happy days!

There's a lot there I agree with, and we certainly can't use this excuse forever, but even when Sam came in, he still had the sort of team which he could fit into a proper gameplan.

The point I'm making is that our team is littered with players who are good if they are surrounded by the right team. Strikers who can score if you give them the right service, attacking midfielders who can do damage but can't defend unless the rest of the team covers for them, fullbacks who can attack but can't tackle, centre halves who can win a ball but have no pace to play a high line.

This would be fine if we could strike a balance, we could play Tugay at 38 if we had Savage beside him, and sadly we don't have enough Savages, Reids or even Mokoenas in the squad to knit a proper team together.

I do agree that we have talent in the team though. I've no idea who is available in January, or where we are with our budget, but I genuinely think just one good signing in the right area like Palacios (no idea if that's realistic) could solve loads of problems just by giving us better balance.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

100% agree with you blueboy. There's a distinct reluctance to face up to reality at the moment, pretty much entirely due to supporter loyalty to Berg. Thankfully his record so far is so atrociously bad that its managing to make some decent headway against that. But its worrying how many still think he should be given time to rebuild something he is very, very rapidly finishing destroying.

Lyn Oslo: 2005 - 3rd, 2006 - 7th, 2007- 9th, 2008 - "left by mutual consent"

Lillestrom: 2009 - 11th, 2010 - 10th, 2011 - sacked whilst 12th

Rovers - 6th to 15th in 9 games.

I mean there's liking a guy, and then there's completely distorting reality in pretending he can be a good manager. He's never been a good manager, every club he's been at seems to get worse the longer he stays. We've entered a realm of Shebby Singh created insanity and some fans are still trying to justify it and pretend its the players fault.

[Stuart]

100% agree with you blueboy. There's a distinct reluctance to face up to reality at the moment, pretty much entirely due to supporter loyalty to Berg. Thankfully his record so far is so atrociously bad that its managing to make some decent headway against that. But its worrying how many still think he should be given time to rebuild something he is very, very rapidly finishing destroying.

Lyn Oslo: 2005 - 3rd, 2006 - 7th, 2007- 9th, 2008 - "left by mutual consent"

Lillestrom: 2009 - 11th, 2010 - 10th, 2011 - sacked whilst 12th

Rovers - 6th to 15th in 9 games.

I mean there's liking a guy, and then there's completely distorting reality in pretending he can be a good manager. He's never been a good manager, every club he's been at seems to get worse the longer he stays. We've entered a realm of Shebby Singh created insanity and some fans are still trying to justify it and pretend its the players fault.

That's very, very harsh. Berg has picked up a really keany stick - whether he thought he knew he was getting into or not.

There are also some valid reasons for the Olso results in the second and third seasons - if not the Lillestrom ones.

We seem to have got ourselves completely hooked into a 'reality' that Singh is calling the shots and Berg is another stooge. Maybe that in itself is an ironic way of cutting Berg some slack but we really don't know the truth.

Let's see how the backroom team shapes up and what happens in the January transfer window. We are watching someone try to get to grips with Kean's unbalanced, unfit squad - who to top it off are demotivated. He must have inherited the worst squad of any Rovers manager in the last 25 years!

After winning his first game, Hughes took 9 games to get another win - and most people would have him back in a heartbeat.

[Rover_Shaun]

As for creating his own team I'd be surprised to see more than two cheap and underwhelming additions to the squad. After all we blew the budget on Rhodes

[Athlete]

what happens in the January transfer window. We are watching someone try to get to grips with Kean's unbalanced, unfit squad -

if you listen to the Q+A doesn't look like there will be much incoming wise in January didn't you know King on loan is like a Jan signing and best coming back seen as a new signing...according to the shabster

[Salgado Is A Hero]

To play devil's advocate, or some might say to bury my head in the sand, there is always the chance Shebby might have just said that without meaning it.

As in when a team clearly states they have money to spend then they are overcharged for players in the coming transfer window.

I remember Carson Yeung saying Birmingham had 50 million to spend and then when they wanted Kenwyne Jones from Sunderland I think it was, they were quoted 15 million for him.

Then again, there's a good chance we won't have money to spend.

I don't buy into the argument they want to do things on the cheap though......we could have bought a striker for a lot less than 8 million.

So with the added tv money, I wouldn't be surprised if they splashed the cash again.