[Archived] BRFC Action Group

[Ben-2000]

I also think some of the agenda driven posters on here need to take along hard look at themselves, its easy to lay into people whilst sat on your arses doing absolutely nothing, and you know who you are!

I have thought this for a while now!

This messageboard has always been the same though.

[bypass06]

If it makes the loons take notice and stop this charade then I am all for it

At the end of the day the majority of posters on here are embarrassed by it and don't want Appleton but as soon as BRAG convey that message they all turn on BRAG.

Make your minds up

Couldn't agree more.

[den]

_{Whilst I don't agree with BRAG seemingly getting involved in managerial appointments, surely they're just responding to the membership, much in the same way unions do.} If the members are 'up in arms' about a situation then its the unions obligation to take necessary action on the memberships behalf.

Even unions don't work that way Gav. They advise their members of what's legally possible and what their views are. They will make recommendations - in other words they try to lead their members with the best advice.

[DE.]

_{Whilst I don't agree with BRAG seemingly getting involved in managerial appointments, surely they're just responding to the membership, much in the same way unions do.} If the members are 'up in arms' about a situation then its the unions obligation to take necessary action on the memberships behalf. Now the other side of this coin is that the unions are also obligated to advise members accordingly, if they believe such action would damage the credibility of the organisation or the action is just plain stupid! so it works both ways. I also think some of the agenda driven posters on here need to take along hard look at themselves, its easy to lay into people whilst sat on your arses doing absolutely nothing, and you know who you are!

Agreed Gav. The same agenda-driven posts repeated infinitely are far more irritating than anything BRFCAG are doing. No statement put out by BRFCAG against the owners/directors in response to the Appleton approach could have been released without implicating Appleton is part of the problem and a reason for cutting comms with Venkys. It is ridiculous to argue otherwise.

At least someone is trying to do something. It is mind boggling to see posts suggesting we just sit back and let Shebby, Shaw, Agnew and our lunatic owners make football decisions with no opposition whatsoever. Just cheer the lads and everything will be reet, I suppose?

[Tyke87]

I don't think Appleton would be a good appointment at all but id sooner have him than Taylor any day of the week. Where was this outrage and statement when we were heavily linked with Taylor who seems to have been shebbys choice? Who are BRAG to make these sort of threats? I have no doubt the group was set up with good intentions for the club butit seems to have evolved into a monster that's embarrassing the club as much as shebby. I thought the mckinlay statement was disgusting at the time and this is even worse. It smacks of a petulant child who can't get his own way so kicks off. You don't represent the majority of fans of the club yet we all get tarnished by these ridiculous actions.

[DE.]

I don't think Appleton would be a good appointment at all but id sooner have him than Taylor any day of the week. Where was this outrage and statement when we were heavily linked with Taylor who seems to have been shebbys choice? Who are BRAG to make these sort of threats? I have no doubt the group was set up with good intentions for the club butit seems to have evolved into a monster that's embarrassing the club as much as shebby. I thought the mckinlay statement was disgusting at the time and this is even worse. It smacks of a petulant child who can't get his own way so kicks off. You don't represent the majority of fans of the club yet we all get tarnished by these ridiculous actions.

Was there ever an official statement from the club regarding the approach of Taylor? Or did people just get into a massive strop over bookmakers odds suddenly tumbling on him?

I appreciate we didn't have an official club statement on McKinley either, however, that was a Shebby choice and BRFCAG were aware of the approach and acting accordingly. As Appleton is almost certainly a Shaw choice BRFCAG would not have known about it til now, as their main source - Shebby - is totally out of the loop right now.

[PAFELL]

Was there ever an official statement from the club regarding the approach of Taylor? Or did people just get into a massive strop over bookmakers odds suddenly tumbling on him?

I appreciate we didn't have an official club statement on McKinley either, however, that was a Shebby choice and BRFCAG were aware of the approach and acting accordingly. As Appleton is almost certainly a Shaw choice BRFCAG would not have known about it til now, as their main source - Shebby - is totally out of the loop right now.

Singh should be out of the loop. We only had to hear his radio interviews to know that.

[LeChuck]

So apparently BRAG have dialogue with Shebby, Shaw and Agnew? Well if that's case, why wasn't the message about fans' feelings towards Appleton's appointment conveyed PRIVATELY? That's the normal way to conduct such business.

Of course, the answer is obviously that a few people are on an ego trip and jumped at the chance to get anything into the press now that they have a platform to do so.

I'd love to hear someone from BRAG justify a public announcment versus a private meeting.

[DE.]

Shebby should be out of the club, let alone out of the loop.

So apparently BRAG have dialogue with Shebby, Shaw and Agnew? Well if that's case, why wasn't the message about fans' feelings towards Appleton conveyed PRIVATELY? That's the normal way to conduct such business.

Of course, the answer is obviously that a few people are on an ego trip and jump at the chance to get anything into the press now that they have a platform to do so.

I'd love to hear someone from BRAG justify a public announcment against a private meeting.

How do you know a private meeting hasn't taken place?

Besides of which, what makes you think a private meeting would have any impact whatsoever on proceedings? Shaw and Agnew certainly don't give a toss about the fans, and Shebby's power is diminishing by the day.

[Athlete]

Protest??? It is news to me

the LT statement fellow IMO could do more harm than good as what manager wants the incresed pressure as MM said we are no longer shopping at Waitrose more like home bargains...to be honest it isn't the fans decision who the manager should be it should be the board ( a very incompetent bunch of fools at that ) and BRAG do not speak on behalf of the majority of BRFC fans no matter how many members you claim to have thats a fact !

[RibbleValleyRover]

The board doesn't have to listen to anything the fans or groups say when it comes to making appointments. In fact history has shown us the club doesn't care one iota about the fans so why the uproar about a group speaking out? Surely the BRAG leadership is only repeating what their members are telling them.

Funny how the valid point in that statement is being totally ignored, i.e. the squabbles at board level and the inefficiency of the present structure being detrimental to the club.

[rovers_rob]

The board doesn't have to listen to anything the fans or groups say when it comes to making appointments. In fact history has shown us the club doesn't care one iota about the fans so why the uproar about a group speaking out? Surely the BRAG leadership is only repeating what their members are telling them.

Funny how the valid point in that statement is being totally ignored, i.e. the squabbles at board level and the inefficiency of the present structure being detrimental to the club.

Maybe if Appleton wasn't mentioned then the point about the internal bickering wouldn't be ignored. He shouldn't have been mentioned if the point was to highlight the board.

[Gav]

The board doesn't have to listen to anything the fans or groups say when it comes to making appointments. In fact history has shown us the club doesn't care one iota about the fans so why the uproar about a group speaking out? Surely the BRAG leadership is only repeating what their members are telling them.

Funny how the valid point in that statement is being totally ignored, i.e. the squabbles at board level and the inefficiency of the present structure being detrimental to the club.

Absolutely, doesn't fit in with peoples agendas though RVR, will certainly people fall off the 'gravy train' if they don't keep up the anti BRAG line on here?

I'll say no more.

[DE.]

Maybe if Appleton wasn't mentioned then the point about the internal bickering wouldn't be ignored. He shouldn't have been mentioned if the point was to highlight the board.

I've only read the statement as per the LT, but he wasn't mentioned by name was he? BRFCAG said 'if the appointment happens' but made no specific mention of Appleton. Obviously they do mean him but it's hardly a vicious attack on his personal character. The reasons for the appointment being bad are numerous and not all related to him as a person or manager.

[LeChuck]

The reasons for the appointment being bad are numerous and not all related to him as a person or manager.

I don't follow. If it's true than Shaw has come up with Appleton as his number one choice and Venky's have backed him, then that is how things should be.

I'm not saying Shaw is the best man to be doing it, but in our structure Shaw is the man who should be making that decision.

What reasons, other than Appleton's suitabability, are there for opposing the appointment?

[Tom]

Absolutely, doesn't fit in with peoples agendas though RVR, will certainly people fall off the 'gravy train' if they don't keep up the anti BRAG line on here?

I'll say no more.

I'm not sure what this is alluding to but can you see the potential pitfalls with stating the managerial appointment as an issue?

What happens now if he is appointed? He already has been offered zero grace so will people be chanting Appleton out from the get go?

He will know that some fans will be on his back as soon as things start to go pear shape and that doesn't seem healthy for the club

[DE.]

I don't follow. If it's true than Shaw has come up with Appleton as his number one choice and Venky's have backed him, then that is how things should be.

I'm not saying Shaw is the best man to be doing it, but in our structure Shaw is the man who should be making that decision.

What reasons, other than Appleton's suitabability, are there for opposing the appointment?

The problem is people accepting Shaw appointing anybody with Venky's backing is "how things should be". It almost certainly is not. I don't care what our structure suggests. If Ronald McDonald was in Shaw's position would I have to accept his decision for manager too?

Reasons for opposing the appointment:

- It's being done in a stupid, underhanded, unprofessional way, again. See our statement, then Blackpool's statement.

- Bowyer and McPhillips are doing a great job so far and are not really any less of a gamble than Appleton.

- It will likely disrupt the squad AGAIN after we've started to get a decent run going.

- It's another underwhelming appointment that will not increase gates or foster any goodwill from the fans to the owners, something that desperately needs to happen.

- More unneccessary compo payout for Appleton when there are managers out of work who are more proven than he is.

On and on and on... none of the above has anything to do with Appleton as a person or his potential as a manager.

[Exiled in Toronto]

The problem is people accepting Shaw appointing anybody with Venky's backing is "how things should be". It almost certainly is not. I don't care what our structure suggests. If Ronald McDonald was in Shaw's position would I have to accept his decision for manager too?

Reasons for opposing the appointment:

- It's being done in a stupid, underhanded, unprofessional way, again. See our statement, then Blackpool's statement.

- Bowyer and McPhillips are doing a great job so far and are not really any less of a gamble than Appleton.

- It will likely disrupt the squad AGAIN after we've started to get a decent run going.

- It's another underwhelming appointment that will not increase gates or foster any goodwill from the fans to the owners, something that desperately needs to happen.

- More unneccessary compo payout for Appleton when there are managers out of work who are more proven than he is.

On and on and on... none of the above has anything to do with Appleton as a person or his potential as a manager.

All but one of those reasons would apply to appointing Alex Ferguson

[DE.]

All but one of those reasons would apply to appointing Alex Ferguson

Yes, I am sure appointing Alex Ferguson would be a bigger gamble than Bowyer & McPhillips, disrupt the squad, underwhelm people and give unneccessary compo because there are managers out of work better than Ferguson.

Take a step back and think before you post pal.

[den]

Reasons for opposing the appointment:

- It's being done in a stupid, underhanded, unprofessional way, again. See our statement, then Blackpool's statement.

Just on this one point - why do you say that?

[LeChuck]

The problem is people accepting Shaw appointing anybody with Venky's backing is "how things should be". It almost certainly is not. I don't care what our structure suggests. If Ronald McDonald was in Shaw's position would I have to accept his decision for manager too?

To answer that hypothetical last question...yes. Shaw is essentially in the role that John Williams held and should be making the decision on the new manager.

Who else should be deciding? Certainly not Shebby Singh. Certainly not Paul Agnew. And I'm not talking personally there, I'm talking about their roles within the club structure.

If Shaw makes a balls up then hopefully they'll appoint someone else in his position. But for the time being, allowing Shaw to make such a decision is a step in the right direction in terms of having a proper structure in place.

[den]

To answer that hypothetical last question...yes. Shaw is essentially in the role that John Williams held and should be making the decision on the new manager.

Who else should be deciding? Certainly not Shebby Singh. Certainly not Paul Agnew. And I'm not talking personally there, I'm talking about their roles within the club structure.

If Shaw makes a balls up then hopefully they'll appoint someone else in his position. But for the time being, allowing Shaw to make such a decision is a step in the right direction in terms of having a proper structure in place.

Spot on.

[Paul]

To answer that hypothetical last question...yes. Shaw is essentially in the role that John Williams held and should be making the decision on the new manager.

That's quite interesting, and I would agree with you, however when I was in the Radio Lancashire theatre at the Shebby Singh Q&A, he (Shebby) stated quite openly that his (Shebby) role was that of the JW figure.

So there lies the problem

[PAFELL]

To answer that hypothetical last question...yes. Shaw is essentially in the role that John Williams held and should be making the decision on the new manager.

Who else should be deciding? Certainly not Shebby Singh. Certainly not Paul Agnew. And I'm not talking personally there, I'm talking about their roles within the club structure.

If Shaw makes a balls up then hopefully they'll appoint someone else in his position. But for the time being, allowing Shaw to make such a decision is a step in the right direction in terms of having a proper structure in place.

Correct. Sod all to do with anybody else. Shaw - like him or not - is in the job. He stands and falls on his choices.

That's quite interesting, and I would agree with you, however when I was in the Radio Lancashire theatre at the Shebby Singh Q&A, he (Shebby) stated quite openly that his (Shebby) role was that of the JW figure.

So there lies the problem

For Shaw to make the approach to Blackpool last night. He must have been given the green light to do so. Maybe this came from his trip to Pune. Maybe his role was rediffined when he went to see venkys. Shebby Singh, may have had the role when he did the interview. But it appears something has changed.

[Mike E]

To answer that hypothetical last question...yes. Shaw is essentially in the role that John Williams held and should be making the decision on the new manager.

Who else should be deciding? Certainly not Shebby Singh. Certainly not Paul Agnew. And I'm not talking personally there, I'm talking about their roles within the club structure.

If Shaw makes a balls up then hopefully they'll appoint someone else in his position. But for the time being, allowing Shaw to make such a decision is a step in the right direction in terms of having a proper structure in place.

Shaw is in Williams' Role

Singh is in a marketing role (so Beamish? Simon Willaims?)

Agnew is still in his PR role when all is said and done.

I just want to clear up, because I was getting wound up earlier far too easily. I do agree with MOST of what BRAG does. But I do not believe any statements on behalf of their members should be made in public, as they run the risk of indirectly speaking on behalf of people who don't have internet access or don't even know the group exists! By all means make your feelings clear in a private setting.

But in public, you are nothing more than a fan group. Nobody within the club (to be honest) should give a @#/? what you think about any managerial appointment, player bought or coach hired. Any on-field matter is for the club to deal with and not us (until it gets ridiculous like under Kean).

I agree with their sentiment (fully) that Venky's must go, as must Shebby (imo) who is getting too big for his boots, as must Agnew (imo) who is tainted from his relationship with Kean. Shaw is the only one with any credibility intact. He's a cock, judging by the few times I've met him, but he's good at his job (it would seem). What I wholly disagree with is the fact that Appleton's apparent appointment is the reason they are choosing to 'act against Venkys' again. Not only is that entirely disrespectful to any manager, let alone Appleton, but the group are tainted by the fact this opinion will be seen by the wider world as the GENERALLY HELD OPINION. Which is an utter fallacy.

Most fans I've come across wouldn't be happy with Appleton, but would accept his role and support him until he proves he doesn't deserve it. BRAG have a habit of telling the world that 'the fans believe this', when in fact there is little to suggest such a thing other than disgruntled emails and tweets. It's a knee-jerk reaction. Rather like Venkys tend to do.

Quite why any public statement should be put out when less than half their membership state this to be their opinion is beyond me. I thought this was a democracy? Elected leaders who then peddle an opinion they know to be held by only 12% (for certain) and state it as a general opinion is not democracy.

I appreciate that BRAG mean well, but imo (and it is only my opinion, so perhaps it counts for zilch) they keep slipping on bananas that are easy to avoid. And I must say I don't care for Glen's holier-than-thou attitude, especially when placed alongside Mark and pk, who have answered many many points with consideration and thought.