[Archived] BRFC Action Group

[Black Burn]

It doesn't matter what you think, you're not a member of BRAG I'd wager, so you can't bring about change.

If you feel so strongly about the damage BRAG are doing then join the group and help them, don't sit behind a PC and bitch day in day out.

That's what he said.

That's also what he said. And the statement you quoted could be interpreted as "if you want your opinion to matter, join them and do something about it because sitting behind a PC and complaining isn't going to change anything." instead of your insistence on "I am not entitled an opinion because I'm not a member." He didn't say you're not entitled to an opinion, he said it's useless to strongly express your opinion and complain on a messageboard, but more useful to join them and change them from within if you feel that strongly about them.

[Gav]

If you feel any criticism myself (or anyone else) makes about BRAG has been in some way unwarranted or untrue, then feel free to challenge the arguments raised. These personal attacks are quite frankly pathetic, GAV. You're basically peddling the belief that whatever BRAG do - no matter how misguided or detrimental to the club - they should be above reproach because 'it's better than nothing'? Do you honestly want to keep this up?

And, since you're so obsessed with me, if you care to look to the left you'll see that I'm a member of Rovers Trust. Might not be much but they have my support because I see them as a worthy cause who have largely acquitted themselves in a professional manner. If only the same could be said for BRAG.

Nobody is attacking you personally, you should lighten up a bit, if you feel the need to attack BRAG at every opportunity then be prepared to have those views challenged, especially when you're doing nothing but hammer the group for trying.

I applaud your affiliation to The Rovers Trust by the way, thats a step in right direction.

[Ozz]

I'm a member of Rovers Trust. Might not be much but they have my support because I see them as a worthy cause who have largely acquitted themselves in a professional manner. If only the same could be said for BRAG.

Good lad! There's more to you than big boobs and computer games.

[Stuart]

Good lad! There's more to you than big boobs and computer games.

To be fair his boobs have shrunk now he's playing less on his computer games!

[47er]

Shill #1 meet Shill #2.

Thing is 47er, you never actually give any reason why these arguments against BRAG are unfair. You just come on trying to peddle your usual persecution complex to detract from the real issues. Like I said in another thread, things were actually quiet on the BRAG front. This is entirely a reaction to them making yet another spectacular own-goal when it comes to relations with the fans and fan-groups alike. Why you're turning this back onto the fans, I do not know - oh wait, I think I do.

You might want reasoned debate on the topic of BRAG Tom but we are much more likely to get posts like this.

Personal insults and some obscure reference to some unknown motive on my part is your style Topman.

I have no idea what you are talking about by the way. I just happen to think that the group which has worked hardest to attempt to resolve the problems our Club faces deserves more than a daily kicking from the likes of you who has done NOTHING.

That's all there is about it for me and I won't be posting on this topic again. Good to see that, by and large, BRAG are ignoring it all.

[thenodrog]

I have no idea what you are talking about by the way. I just happen to think that the group which has worked hardest to attempt to resolve the problems our Club faces deserves more than a daily kicking from the likes of you who has done NOTHING.

Indeed but consider that despite sterling service the Home Guard were stood down when their was no further use for it.

[Gav]

You might want reasoned debate on the topic of BRAG Tom but we are much more likely to get posts like this.

Personal insults and some obscure reference to some unknown motive on my part is your style Topman.

I have no idea what you are talking about by the way. I just happen to think that the group which has worked hardest to attempt to resolve the problems our Club faces deserves more than a daily kicking from the likes of you who has done NOTHING.

That's all there is about it for me and I won't be posting on this topic again. Good to see that, by and large, BRAG are ignoring it all.

Absolutely.

[SouthAussieRover]

Absolutely.

What an awesome post by the 47er pussy cat!

Yet more drivel by the anti-Walker Trust buffoon.

[Mike E]

You might want reasoned debate on the topic of BRAG Tom but we are much more likely to get posts like this.

Personal insults and some obscure reference to some unknown motive on my part is your style Topman.

I have no idea what you are talking about by the way. I just happen to think that the group which has worked hardest to attempt to resolve the problems our Club faces deserves more than a daily kicking from the likes of you who has done NOTHING.

That's all there is about it for me and I won't be posting on this topic again. Good to see that, by and large, BRAG are ignoring it all.

The only personal insults I've seen are from you and GAV. And you have yet to answer any valid criticism raised about the AG.

[Gav]

The only personal insults I've seen are from you and GAV. And you have yet to answer any valid criticism raised about the AG.

Personal insults? You need to get out more if you've taken offence to anything I've written over the past few pages.

[Mike E]

Personal insults? You need to get out more if you've taken offence to anything I've written over the past few pages.

You haven't aimed them at me, so I have taken no offence. And I assume Topman (and the like) are well above rising to the bait of you and 47er. You HAVE insulted him just because he has an opinion on the group that doesn't match yours.

Once again: Neither you or 47er have made any valid rebuttal of the criticism's raised against the AG. Your responses are generally 'it doesn't matter what you think about it because you're not a member'. Well as long as they conitnue shove words into my mouth and the mouths of others, I'll continue to have an opinion on them.

[T.J.Newton]

Indeed but consider that despite sterling service the Home Guard were stood down when their was no further use for it.

Brag and Dads Army comparison, hehehe love it

[Gav]

You haven't aimed them at me, so I have taken no offence. And I assume Topman (and the like) are well above rising to the bait of you and 47er. You HAVE insulted him just because he has an opinion on the group that doesn't match yours.

Once again: Neither you or 47er have made any valid rebuttal of the criticism's raised against the AG. Your responses are generally 'it doesn't matter what you think about it because you're not a member'. Well as long as they conitnue shove words into my mouth and the mouths of others, I'll continue to have an opinion on them.

You've not been around here long enough to lecture me on insults, so don't bother.

Topman can look after himself, he doesn't need you to fight his battles for him.

As for the rest of your post its the usual drivel in my opinion, you're just another one who thinks he can sit behind his computer screen and cause as much grief for BRAG as possible without actually doing anything yourself to help the plight the club finds itself in.

Its interesting that you feel BRAG shoves words into your mouth, I don't feel that and I'm a supporter just like you, starnge that.

[Andy]

As for the rest of your post its the usual drivel in my opinion, you're just another one who thinks he can sit behind his computer screen and cause as much grief for BRAG as possible without actually doing anything yourself to help the plight the club finds itself in.

To quote Bundesburn from the other thread:

"And, finally, the argument posed by some based around the adage "it's better than nothing," is inherently flawed. Doing nothing maintains a relative status-quo, the terms and parameters of which are understood and accepted. Action for the sake of action is as likely to change for the better as it is to change for the worse. Accepting your limitations will do wonders for your ability to make sure you don't do any harm."

Quite right too.

[Mike E]

You've not been around here long enough to lecture me on insults, so don't bother.

Topman can look after himself, he doesn't need you to fight his battles for him.

As for the rest of your post its the usual drivel in my opinion, you're just another one who thinks he can sit behind his computer screen and cause as much grief for BRAG as possible without actually doing anything yourself to help the plight the club finds itself in.

Its interesting that you feel BRAG shoves words into your mouth, I don't feel that and I'm a supporter just like you, starnge that.

1. That's what you think.

2. That's what you think (sorry, Toppers!)

3 + 4. AGAIN, you clearly don't address any of the points I make! The group did very well re: protests, but now I feel it needs to take a back seat. No group of fans should have any say on Rovers' football matters unless they are a director at the club or something. They continue to contradict themselves in poorly worded and far-too-long press releases. If they stuck to independent travel and their community projects, while only talking about club matters when it is called for. What right do they have (as a voice of the fans, whether they like it or not) to put down Appleton before he even managed here? None.

You'll notice I don't criticise the other groups. This is because they are more professional and constructive in their actions. And I don't aprticularly like them either tbh. The AG still acts like a protest group, while fans (including it's 8000 members) are not in uproar about anything at all.

For what it's worth, I have done nothing because there is no reason to. Kean is out. Venkys are in, but there is nothing I can do about that other than pledge to the Rovers' Trust, which I cannot afford to do.

And tbh, GAV, your ignorance is just pathetic. If you think a post with considered criticism (and perfectly helpful advice for the group in some cases) is 'drivel' then God help you.

[only2garners]

but there is nothing I can do about that other than pledge to the Rovers' Trust, which I cannot afford to do.

But you can join the Trust as a member for just £10. It's one member, one vote, so your vote will have a s much weight as any of the pledgers.

[Gav]

To quote Bundesburn from the other thread:

"And, finally, the argument posed by some based around the adage "it's better than nothing," is inherently flawed. Doing nothing maintains a relative status-quo, the terms and parameters of which are understood and accepted. Action for the sake of action is as likely to change for the better as it is to change for the worse. Accepting your limitations will do wonders for your ability to make sure you don't do any harm."

Quite right too.

Thats complete and utter bunkum in my opinion, look at the people who have signed up for the Trust for instance, they're 'doing something' aren't they, much like BRAG who are 'doing something' also.

You may not agree with whats these groups are doing, but when the club is being raped and pillaged its not acceptable to criticise others, when you're doing absolutely bugger all, in my opinion.

[Mike E]

But you can join the Trust as a member for just £10. It's one member, one vote, so your vote will have a s much weight as any of the pledgers.

That I did not know.....be with you in one moment.

[T.J.Newton]

You've not been around here long enough to lecture me on insults, so don't bother.

Topman can look after himself, he doesn't need you to fight his battles for him.

As for the rest of your post its the usual drivel in my opinion, you're just another one who thinks he can sit behind his computer screen and cause as much grief for BRAG as possible without actually doing anything yourself to help the plight the club finds itself in.

Its interesting that you feel BRAG shoves words into your mouth, I don't feel that and I'm a supporter just like you, starnge that.

hasn't it been explained enough on here that the above highlighted is a pathetic baseless easy excuse and you still haven't come up with a single thing to justify brags recent actions/statements you just keep repeating the same lazy mantra-'what have you done'.

also criticising somebody on a forum for using the forum to criticise somebody is quite stupid, dont you think!!!

[Andy]

Under no circumstances is it better to do something badly than it is to maintain the status quo.

[ABBEY]

1. That's what you think.

2. That's what you think (sorry, Toppers!)

3 + 4. AGAIN, you clearly don't address any of the points I make! The group did very well re: protests, but now I feel it needs to take a back seat. No group of fans should have any say on Rovers' football matters unless they are a director at the club or something. They continue to contradict themselves in poorly worded and far-too-long press releases. If they stuck to independent travel and their community projects, while only talking about club matters when it is called for. What right do they have (as a voice of the fans, whether they like it or not) to put down Appleton before he even managed here? None.

You'll notice I don't criticise the other groups. This is because they are more professional and constructive in their actions. And I don't aprticularly like them either tbh. The AG still acts like a protest group, while fans (including it's 8000 members) are not in uproar about anything at all.

For what it's worth, I have done nothing because there is no reason to. Kean is out. Venkys are in, but there is nothing I can do about that other than pledge to the Rovers' Trust, which I cannot afford to do.

And tbh, GAV, your ignorance is just pathetic. If you think a post with considered criticism (and perfectly helpful advice for the group in some clubcases) is 'drivel' then God help you.

Haha other groups more professional . Did you hear the background shouts on the 100 club video? People panned me for ranting at the venkyscum . At least I was in their faces best I could and not rudely interrupting and snidely swearing . Remind me again why si Barnes withdrew it?

[Mike E]

Haha other groups more professional . Did you hear the background shouts on the 100 club video? People panned me for ranting at the venkyscum . At least I was in their faces best I could and not rudely interrupting and snidely swearing . Remind me again why si Barnes withdrew it?

No idea what you're talking about Shaun. Haven't seen this video. Not sure what the RoversTrust or many others under the Blackburn United umbrella have to do with it. But I do know that the AG still thinks it needs to be all-out action regardless of what their poorly-worded statements do for the reputation of the fans and therefore the club.

Eg, from the FF:

"Further to the recent initiative by the Blackburn Rovers Action Group, the Fans Forum, who have been representing supporters' concerns to the club for the last 14 years, respects the right of every supporter to decide when and why they choose to attend or not to attend matches.

As a Fans Forum we would all like to see as many supporters attending matches on a regular basis supporting both the players and manager. Hopefully the recent progress seen under Gary Bowyer and Michael Appleton will help contribute to that outcome, starting with Bristol City on Saturday."

I long for the day the AG put something as collected and professional as that.

[Gav]

hasn't it been explained enough on here that the above highlighted is a pathetic baseless easy excuse and you still haven't come up with a single thing to justify brags recent actions/statements you just keep repeating the same lazy mantra-'what have you done'.

also criticising somebody on a forum for using the forum to criticise somebody is quite stupid, dont you think!!!

I'm not on here justify anything that BRAG does or says, you've got me mixed up with someone else.

[Mike E]

I'm not on here justify anything that BRAG does or says, you've got me mixed up with someone else.

May I ask: Why are you trying to make me (and others) justify having an opinion about the AG?

1. They put out statements with little apparent thought. While some of us (myself included) were uninspired at the appointment of Appleton, we did not suggest it was action-worthy, but the AG leapt onto it because they had a few emails. How do they justify such action, given it directly contradicts their mission statement?

2. The AG's press statements often contain poor spelling and grammar, which is unprofessional. Ricky, myself and a few others have offered to proof-read before release and, to my knowledge, no-one has been acknowledged in this respect, let alone their help accepted. The group also complains that their statements are cherry-picked, when they are far too long and any journalist worth his salt will cherry-pick the bits worth reporting.

3. Anything the group says will be construed as the opinion of the majority of Rovers fans (the name 'BRFC Action Group' suggests as much). Many times, this is simply not the case, which is why so many get angry with the group. You'll say 'that's not the group's fault' and you'll be quite right. But it is the case nonetheless and is detrimental to opinions of the fans of this club from fans of other clubs. It makes us look absolutely tin-pot. Look at the ridicule ManUtd and Liverpool protest groups got from other fans; that is the ridicule with which we are viewed now. The best way to stop this is for the group to shush up.

Those are the 3 main points I (and others) have made. What is unjust about these views? They are not 'baseless drivel', they are genuine criticisms with good reason and advice behind them for the betterment of the group. Other groups under the Blackburn United umbrella don't have these problems, so the AG doesn't need to have them either. But as long as they ignore advice from the wider support-base and continue to make mistakes, they will be hated amonst rovers fans.

Take that last sentence. Who else can it be applied to? (Venkys). Got it in one. That's why the AG continues to draw angst from ordinary fans. My father dislikes the group simply for Glen appearing on SSN giving a view that he completely disagreed with. That's just one man, who's been a fan of rovers for 65 years now. What about other fans who've felt similarly? 'Just drivel', ofc......

[Black Burn]

Hey, Abbey, are you Shaun Trencher?