[Archived] Rovers V Brighton

[Parsonblue]

Not at all, I used to work in Accrington and I live in Blackburn. The last time we had heavy snowfall which led to traffic coming to a standstill there was no snow and even a spot of sunshine in Accrington (when I eventually managed to make it out of Blackburn).

It was pouring down in Accy all day yesterday and throughout the match at the Crown but, as the club have spent money on the pitch over the past two summers it stood up to the rain very well and was in perfect condition. The weather was the same in both places just the pitches were different. I think meadows has explained the reasons why the Rovers game didn't go ahead. No great mystery just a bit of a miscalculation in not listening to the recommendations of the groundstaff.

[DanLad]

Is it possible that the powers that be at Rovers were firm believers that the world was going to end on the 21st December 2012 in accordance with the 'Mayan prophecy'? They would clearly have sent a message to the ground staff to not bother, hence game called off.

Or maybe they had insisted on the sprinkers being on full pelt to help douse the rain of burning meteorites?

[Paul]

Having read all the conspiracy theories, which I feel are unlikely I thought it time to bring a small amount of expertise to bear on the subject. I work in Horticulture and a part of my education, many years ago, revolved around soil structure and drainage systems. I'm not an expert of football pitch construction but have a vague idea. The following theory as to the cause of the waterlogging presumes the river Darwen behind the Riverside was in full flood which is likely.

Any soil,or sports pitch, is made up of organic matter, mineral (soils) and air and water in the pores which exist in the structure of the soil. Under most conditions there is balance between the amount of air and water held in the pores in the soil structure. Air is held near the surface and water in the lower pores. All soils have what is known as "field capacity," i.e. the maximum amount of water the pores can hold; when the pores are completely full the ground is saturated (waterlogged) and any further rainfall simply runs off the surface. This is the situation across huge areas of the country for the last few weeks, probably even months.

All the surrounding area in Blackburn is at field capacity, therefore all rainwater is running off and draining into local rivers rather than being absorbed by the ground soil.

Water in a soil is pulled downwards by gravity, large pores drain because there is not enough suction (within the soil) to hold the water in the pore against gravity, small pores, where the suction is greater than the pull of gravity do not drain. This is why sandy soils, where the particles are large, and hence the pores are large, drain easily under gravity, but clay soils, where the particles and pores are very small will hardly drain under gravity and require drainage schemes.

Below a modern football pitch is an extensive network of pipes laid in and covered by a highly permeable material of some type. The pipe work will have thousands of tiny holes in it to allow water to drain through the permeable material into the pipes and then drain away to an outflow, in Rovers case I presume this is into the river Darwen at the back of the stand.

Modern pitches are constructed from the bottom up with the pipework, permeable material and a "sand" layer (it may not be actual sand but will have a similar effect), on top of the sand layer the pitch is laid. The turf will have been grown in a very free draining "soil mixture" probably containing a high level of sand or other permeable material. I believe this mixture has some form of mesh laid over it with more soil mixture on top. The turf is then grown on the upper layer. When ready the turf is lifted with it's growing layer and laid on the pitch. The purpose is to provide strength through the mesh binding the root system and soil tightly together and free draining via the highly permeable soil mixture. Water drains through the pitch into the sand zone and then into the pipe system and away.

The most likely explanation for the pitch being waterlogged is the outflow into the river Darwen was below the full flood level of the river (the river being much higher than usual) meaning water could not drain out of the pitch drainage system. Consequent to this as more rain fell the drainage system would fill with water, the gravitational pull to drain the pitch would be nullified and the normally very porous sand base and soil mixture would fill to "field capacity," once full the water then has nowhere to go and stays on the pitch.

If the team trained on the pitch on Friday it is arguable but highly unlikely this caused a problem. Any running, walking etc. on any soil compacts the surface. Football pitches though are constructed to allow for this compaction and for there to be a minimal effect. If the pitch doesn't become waterlogged during a full game it seems to me unlikely a training session would have sufficient impact on the surface to damage the pitch.

The river was full, nowhere for the water to drain. Nothing more or less in my opinion.

Now we need someone who knows far. far more than I to pop along and say this is nonsense - it's as far as I can go..........

[blueboy3333]

Watched the Big Match Revisited last night on ITV4. By a strange twist of fate it had highlights of Brighton v Rovers from 1979. We lost 2-1. Can't remember who scored our goal as i was rather drunk, but it was a freekick Stuart Pearce would have been proud of.

Anyway, one of their goals only happened because two smoke bombs were thrown on the pitch by Brighton fans and landed right in front of Butcher in the 6 yard box. He couldn't see a thing as a header went past him into the net. The ref allowed the goal to stand. I'd like to think yesterdays postponement was in some way connected with that fateful day back in the 70's. The questions we should be asking ourselves today are, is Butcher still alive, and does he have access to the Ewood sprinkler systems?

[ABBEY]

Was there not a big tank laid though when the drains were done and a way of cutting off the water and river reaching . This I seem to remember was done to avoid flooding . Not a conspiracy theory just saying .

[Stuart]

Watched the Big Match Revisited last night on ITV4. By a strange twist of fate it had highlights of Brighton v Rovers from 1979. We lost 2-1. Can't remember who scored our goal as i was rather drunk, but it was a freekick Stuart Pearce would have been proud of.

Anyway, one of their goals only happened because two smoke bombs were thrown on the pitch by Brighton fans and landed right in front of Butcher in the 6 yard box. He couldn't see a thing as a header went past him into the net. The ref allowed the goal to stand. I'd like to think yesterdays postponement was in some way connected with that fateful day back in the 70's. The questions we should be asking ourselves today are, is Butcher still alive, and does he have access to the Ewood sprinkler systems?

There's a YouTube video of the highlights in the OP - or at least there was when the thread was started.

How that goal stood with those smoke bombs is ridiculous.

[den]

The only thing I remember about the drains into the river, was that a few years back it was realised that the drains were actually facing the wrong way - i.e. they were facing the river current. Hence the river when running strongly would stop the pitch water from draining away and hold it in the ground. Since then, when I assume the drains were re-routed, we've had very few postponed games.

While I don't hold any suspicions about yesterday's postponement, I was surprised we were called off when others played on good surfaces. Something went wrong with the drainage, I don't think it was just down to nature.

[Kamy100]

Allegedly at Henning's insistence first team trained at Ewood on Friday, which didn't leave enough time to repair/prepare the pitch for game on Saturday with the huge amount of rain that fell on Friday afternoon/evening and on Saturday.

[den]

More likely that the top had formed a crust Kamy. When that happens even spiking or airating doesn't work. Pitches need relaying regularly because of that. Wonder when Ewood was last re-laid?

[ABBEY]

More likely that the top had formed a crust Kamy. When that happens even spiking or airating doesn't work. Pitches need relaying regularly because of that. Wonder when Ewood was last re-laid?

Before ralf got laid

[Al]

I for one was very pleased that the match was called off. Seeing that downpour through my window I had already decided that there was no way I was trogging from my car to the ground in that lot to sit wet and freezing for two hours in a windy stand and than to have to brave the elements again to get back to my car. No bloody way.

Now I will be able to watch the match at a rearranged date in comparitive comfort.

Thanks ref. You did us all a favour.

[Rover_Shaun]

Sainsbury at Bamber Bridge had lots of leaks......just imagine what the roof of the Riverside would like?

Just been refurbed too. Not that I can afford to shop there

[Andy]

Allegedly at Henning's insistence first team trained at Ewood on Friday, which didn't leave enough time to repair/prepare the pitch for game on Saturday with the huge amount of rain that fell on Friday afternoon/evening and on Saturday.

This is definitely right, having spoken with a member of the ground staff.

Training on the ground on the Friday mixed with heavy rain made the pitch unplayable.

[den]

Don't accept that training on the pitch 24 hrs earlier, would have made the pitch hold water. Ewood isn't a mud bath any more. It's one of two reasons IMO. Either the drains aren't as efficient as they used to be, or the surface has crusted and the water doesn't get to the drains quickly enough..

[Friarsnig]

The pitchside sprinklers have been left on overnight.

I'll take the credit for starting this unusual rumour yesterday. Little did I suspect that my tongue in cheek joke would be taken so seriously by so many humourless arsey types.

For future reference, so I don't confuse the witless ones again, how should I have made the irony in my comment even more obvious?

[Doug]

Don't know whether its been mentioned, but, didn't we have a game called off against the crazy gang in the 90's due to waterlogged pitch, after the game had started. Remember them making a right mess of the pitch in front of the Darwen end.

[Harrier7]

Don't know whether its been mentioned, but, didn't we have a game called off against the crazy gang in the 90's due to waterlogged pitch, after the game had started. Remember them making a right mess of the pitch in front of the Darwen end.

Correct. I was there treating my wife to see the Wombles for a rare match for her. Sat miserably getting drenched at the front of the Blackburn End until we were put out of our misery. Did she ever go again? Answers on a postcard!

[Sparky Marky]

Don't know whether its been mentioned, but, didn't we have a game called off against the crazy gang in the 90's due to waterlogged pitch, after the game had started. Remember them making a right mess of the pitch in front of the Darwen end.

Game never started.

[Doug]

Game never started.

Cheers, I just remembered them performing for their fans by running and sliding in front of them. Presumed it had kicked off.

[Ossydave]

Yeah the Wimbledon game didn't kick off, they were acting the goat sliding about doing 'Kilnsmans' etc

[Gav]

I'll take the credit for starting this unusual rumour yesterday. Little did I suspect that my tongue in cheek joke would be taken so seriously by so many humourless arsey types.

For future reference, so I don't confuse the witless ones again, how should I have made the irony in my comment even more obvious?

This site has become a joke in recent times and your comments have just proven that, interesting to note who took your comments as facts, sad really.

[Paul]

More likely that the top had formed a crust Kamy.

Not possible given the weather conditions. If it was a clay soil the top could quickly become compacted but not the soil type used for a modern football pitch.

[ABBEY]

JUST SO YOU KNOW ...ITS NOT ALL DOOM N GLOOM ,THE BRONCOS KEEP WINNING

[rovermagic]

We are Rovers supporters since 1990 who moved to London at end of '90s and made drive all the way up on 22nd. Found out about postponement at 1245 when already past Manchester on M6. Went to Accie Stanley -saw Beattie - and like others shocked that pitch ok there while nearby Ewood unplayable. 21 of 22 other matches in top two tiers played. Spoke to ex Accie Stanley player and Rovers supporter at Accie. Yes river hurts drainage. Yes no conspiracy. But underinvestment now in everything from sports science to physio to management structure to pitch maintenance. Boy is Shebby as effectively new John Williams a joke. The premiership is SO much the poorer for the absence of Williams and David Dein. And especially John Williams. Ex-Accie Rovet spoke above wisdom you do not see on this Board. For him we are right still to be behind Berg but 5 points from 8 games is not really acceptable. Josh King IS a good acquisition with power, pace, directness that turned Burnley game. For him too many - esp Murphy - just turning up to pick up massive wage packet (and be near family). Will make huge difference when Best is back. CKR a whinger but puts himself about a bit and thus a good thing. Robbo not carrying his considerable weight and good thing he is shipping out. Question is will Berg be allowed to bring in say three more of his own as good as Josh King but in goal, centre defence and centre mid. Plus his back room staff. Or will Shebby wreck it. You have to fear that Shebby who has absolutely no clue will wreck it. Please God bring back John Williams.

[SouthAussieRover]

John Williams is at Man City???