[Archived] Michael Appleton - New Rovers Manager

[martonrover]

Bolton were in a worse position when Freedman took over so I think comparisons are valid.

I agree almost entirely with OnlyoneJackWalker but wouldn't trust Venky's to make the right appointment should they decide to dispense with Appleton.

I think it's simply a case of hoping against hope he comes up roses.

[G Somerset Rover]

Again, look at Souey's form when he took over at the end of 99/00 with the most expensive side in Div 1. Of course, Souey had more years under his belt, more contacts, and was able to establish the quality & unity to turn things around in the following season. Appleton is still very much an unknown quantity at this point.

And there's the rub. Venky's have taken so many gambles that they just didn't need to make.

[den]

Mark Davies, their best player, is out with a cruciate ligament injury and I'm not sure if Stuart Holden is out long term too.

On the first point, we don't know what debris Bolton had. What we do know is that the previous incumbent in the manager's chair shared an agent with another infamous shyster and had also presided over an inglorious relegation campaign the previous season.

I think comparisons are valid.

Mark Davies, their best player, is out with a cruciate ligament injury and I'm not sure if Stuart Holden is out long term too.

On the first point, we don't know what debris Bolton had. What we do know is that the previous incumbent in the manager's chair shared an agent with another infamous shyster and had also presided over an inglorious relegation campaign the previous season.

I think comparisons are valid.

The injury situation isn't near to comparable. Best, Olssen, King, Williamson, Etuhu, Kazim Richards all missing big chunks of the season. Dunn, Robinson and Givet all being "unavailable" for whatever reason as well. All players that can't be called on.

Freedman didn't have to take over a club in turmoil either.

The comparison last night was even with all those players missing, Bolton were/are no better than Rovers.

Bolton were in a worse position when Freedman took over

Freedman didn't have half the problems, every manager since Kean, has had.

[martonrover]

The injury situation isn't near to comparable. Best, Olssen, King, Williamson, Etuhu, Kazim Richards all missing big chunks of the season. Dunn, Robinson and Givet all being "unavailable" for whatever reason as well. All players that can't be called on.

Freedman didn't have to take over a club in turmoil either.

The comparison last night was even with all those players missing, Bolton were/are no better than Rovers.

Freedman didn't have half the problems, every manager since Kean, has had.

Some valid points though I would question how much difference some of the injured players would make.

The fact is, as others have said, Appleton is a relatively unknown quantity with no track record of success.

Whilst Freedman hardly has a wealth of experience he'd kept Palace up from a tricky position and then built a team to push for promotion.

[LeChuck]

Some valid points though I would question how much difference some of the injured players would make.

Really? A lot of those would have started if fit.

Martin would have replaced Markus.

King > Stewart

CKR > Pedersen

Best > Campbell

guessing Williamson > Lowe as well.

Kean

Henley Dann Hanley Martin

CKR Williamson Jones King

Best Rhodes

That would have been a hell of a lot stronger.

[Blue blood]

Tbh I'm not sure we'd have brought Jones in had we not had the injuries we've got. Could see us continuing with Lowe and Murphy if injuries hadn't forced our hand. Had a suspicion Williamson would be more used as a utility player. Maybe all the injuries has shoved the spotlight onto Murphy and shown him up to the manager a bit more - showing he utterly can't be relied upon.

Having said that we've badly missed CKR's physical presence up front and Martin unlike his brother can cross. Both would improve the team drastically.

[LDRover]

The injury situation isn't near to comparable. Best, Olssen, King, Williamson, Etuhu, Kazim Richards all missing big chunks of the season. Dunn, Robinson and Givet all being "unavailable" for whatever reason as well. All players that can't be called on.

Freedman didn't have to take over a club in turmoil either.

The comparison last night was even with all those players missing, Bolton were/are no better than Rovers.

Freedman didn't have half the problems, every manager since Kean, has had.

Sorry den, don't want this to turn into injury ping pong but Bolton are missing/have missed regular first teamers Wheater, Chung Yong Lee and Mears for a significant chunk of the season. They were also missing their first choice keeper Bogdan last night. Some of the rovers players you mention wouldn't play in our best team anyway (Williamson, Etuhu, King and probably Robinson)

I maintain that the injury situations are comparable.

As for the state of both clubs, we know ours is a mess, there's may not be as much of a mess off the pitch but we do know that they were relegated last season after over ten years in the top flight and that they started this season badly.

I'm not bashing Appleton for the sake of it (he has a hell of a lot to prove mind you) but the stats don't help his cause.

My own personal opinion is that changing the manager again will not help as the people charged with selecting a replacement are obviously not up to it. I don't get the blind optimism though based on changing a midfielder who's patently not up to it and a full back who is of very poor quality and quite possibly the most hated player to ever pull on a rovers shirt. Those are decisions anyone of sound mind would've made.

[Rover_Shaun]

He has bought in Stewart, Jones, Bentley, Williamson, Rekik and Campbell.

Williamson - Has only played one game which was in the victory against Arsenal. Surely you're not stupid enough to judge him after that?

Rekik - Has been poor and was rightly dropped. Only a youngster though so will take him time to adapt. Regarded as City's brightest youth prospect, so was a good loan signing.

Campbell - Scored 10 in 17 at his previous club in the Championship. Hasn't been a good signing for us so I will give you that.

Jones - Looks a decent enough midfielder and a just refreshing to see someone actually put a shift in, in midfield.

Stewart - Nothing special on the left handside, but better than Pedersen.

Bentley - Starved of 1st team football for over 18months. He needs time to get his sharpness back. Never played yesterday as he was still recovering from illness.

So other than Campbell, I fail to see your point. Unless of course, you can enlighten me.

I was more referring to him thinking that those signings are what was needed for a promotion push (campbell has had more clubs that Jack Nicklaus, Bentley is a busted flush, Stewart is poor, Jones is average and looks good amongst even bigger dross, if Rekik is Citys future they have none, Williamson is no better than Lowe). 4 defeats in 5 show him to be disastrously wrong. Heaven help us if he actually gets a budget in the summer

[den]

Sorry den, don't want this to turn into injury ping pong but Bolton are missing/have missed regular first teamers Wheater, Chung Yong Lee and Mears for a significant chunk of the season. They were also missing their first choice keeper Bogdan last night. Some of the rovers players you mention wouldn't play in our best team anyway (Williamson, Etuhu, King and probably Robinson)

I maintain that the injury situations are comparable.

As for the state of both clubs, we know ours is a mess, there's may not be as much of a mess off the pitch but we do know that they were relegated last season after over ten years in the top flight and that they started this season badly.

I'm not bashing Appleton for the sake of it (he has a hell of a lot to prove mind you) but the stats don't help his cause.

My own personal opinion is that changing the manager again will not help as the people charged with selecting a replacement are obviously not up to it. I don't get the blind optimism though based on changing a midfielder who's patently not up to it and a full back who is of very poor quality and quite possibly the most hated player to ever pull on a rovers shirt. Those are decisions anyone of sound mind would've made.

That's OK LD.

Appleton still has it all to do, but for me, he's at the very least shown that he knows what he needs. Whether he can achieve it, who knows?

[Blue blood]

He has bought in Stewart, Jones, Bentley, Williamson, Rekik and Campbell.

Williamson - Has only played one game which was in the victory against Arsenal. Surely you're not stupid enough to judge him after that?

Rekik - Has been poor and was rightly dropped. Only a youngster though so will take him time to adapt. Regarded as City's brightest youth prospect, so was a good loan signing.

Campbell - Scored 10 in 17 at his previous club in the Championship. Hasn't been a good signing for us so I will give you that.

Jones - Looks a decent enough midfielder and a just refreshing to see someone actually put a shift in, in midfield.

Stewart - Nothing special on the left handside, but better than Pedersen.

Bentley - Starved of 1st team football for over 18months. He needs time to get his sharpness back. Never played yesterday as he was still recovering from illness.

So other than Campbell, I fail to see your point. Unless of course, you can enlighten me.

Will grant you Williamson as we've not seen him but other than Jones how many have actually looked to improve the team regardless of results?

I'd challenge your assertion that Stewart is better than Pedersen. Granted Peds blows hot and cold but he's been involved in a number of our goals and has had some good reviews. Stewart hasn't cut it at 2 other championship clubs - hardly an improvement.

Bentley, Rekik and Campbell all on paper seem decent signings.The first 2 are familiar with either the club or manager, both have potential/talent, whilst Campbell has a good record with Ipswich. Problem is how much have they actually added? How much have they improved the team? How many good performances have we had out of them?

Bar Jones I'm not sure any have really improved the squad which is frustrating. I guess on paper they look decent signings and granted not every transfer works out but Jones, a megre 1 of all the loanees so far is not an encouraging response.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not Appleton out. He has a plan, he's as good as we're going to get, and he seems to know the situation. Binning Orr and Murphy is another positive (damn Kean for making a genuine phrase sound hollow). As are some of the comments he's made. But I think that he seems to have a lot to learn about player recruitment as only one of his recruits is really enhancing the team.

[den]

Let's not forget, when questioning his judge of a player, that he saw through a lot of the tripe who had been hanging around the club, straight away. That's rarely mentioned.

[rovers11]

This article is only from 'Shoot' - http://www.shoot.co.uk/news/latest_article/C49/championship/rovers_relegation_fight/ - but it raises an interesting question: are Rovers now in a relegation fight?

I would tentatively say 'yes'. I don't think for a second we will get relegated (we only need one win and a couple of draws) but with us not playing in the league now until a week sunday it means the teams below us will have played two games before we have even kicked a league ball.

We could be as low as 18th or 19th and only 1/2 points off. That would certainly get the nerves jangling. For the 1st time this season I will be looking out for the bottom 4 or 5 clubs results this weekend and hoping they lose!

[Rover_Shaun]

Let's not forget, when questioning his judge of a player, that he saw through a lot of the tripe who had been hanging around the club, straight away. That's rarely mentioned.

He did recall Orr? And continue to play Murphy weekly as well as sign David (LET 2/10) Bentley

[RevidgeBlue]

Appleton may or may not be successful in the long run but he now needs to be backed by the owners with some money in the summer to rebuild the squad on solid foundations - hard working grafters who are hungry for success and who will be prepared to battle their way out of this League.

No offence Parson, in the past I've almost always regarded your contributions as being absolutely spot on but the statement highlighted in bold above makes me shake my head in disbelief.

Based on what exactly? I could understand your logic if he'd enjoyed huge success as a manager elsewhere but the fact is that his career record as a manager is poor, firstly at Portsmouth, secondly at Blackpool and he is carrying that dubious work on here now at Ewood. His was a hugely risky appointment from the off and it seems clear to me even at this stage that it has disastrously backfired.

In my view a good manager builds a solid base at the back giving his flair players a platform from which to express themselves. Appleton has either removed anyone with any creativity from the squad or won't give them any minutes on the pitch meaning that we're almost entirely reliant on Rhodes snapping up a half chance. If he doesn't score, we don't. Plus, as well as results being dreadful he's made us more or less unwatchable.

I can understand the reluctance to remove him based on the fact he's our fifth manager this season, but that for me isn't a good enough reason to persist with him. He must be judged on his own merits, not given leniency simply because there's been a high turnover immediately before his arrival. To turn it around should we persist indefinitely with Jim Iley or Steve Kean because there'd been a high turn over before they arrived? And I really would place MA in that sort of bracket.

I also completely agree with Paul on his assessment of Campbell.If he and most of the other loanees are the calibre of player Appleton is targeting, then we can only dream of a permanent stay in the lower divisions, probably lower than the one we're currently in as well.

Let's not forget, when questioning his judge of a player, that he saw through a lot of the tripe who had been hanging around the club, straight away. That's rarely mentioned.

Eh? brought back Orr, Pedersen and Marcus Olsson who had been rightly discarded and also persists with Jason Lowe who also should be nowhere near the side either..

[eire3382]

Its realy hard to judge MA so far. I never had any hopes of promotion this year once the fat one was kept on.

We all agree the squad is a mess and that there are only a handful if players worth keeping long term (if they stay that is).

But if you break down some of the issues we all know the bald fat pig had then we see that MA is a huge step in the right direction.

I am a little concerned with his tactics to date but then he really doesn't have much options to change things (poor squad).

His honesty is refreshing and for that alone he deserves some credit. Our form is very up and down but thats been the case for a long time (remember old trafford, Ares at ewood and then all the rubbish in between).

MA needs to be given the summer to overhaul the entire squad, it needs to happen early in the summer to bed everyone in.

If the chicken farmers don't support him this summer then we are cooked and he might walk away. His transfers to date give me cause to hope but its probably another faulse dawn. Either way he needs time and as long as we don't get dragged into a relegation dogfight I will wait to judge.

[Blue n White Rover]

I was more referring to him thinking that those signings are what was needed for a promotion push (campbell has had more clubs that Jack Nicklaus, Bentley is a busted flush, Stewart is poor, Jones is average and looks good amongst even bigger dross, if Rekik is Citys future they have none, Williamson is no better than Lowe). 4 defeats in 5 show him to be disastrously wrong. Heaven help us if he actually gets a budget in the summer

Those signings are the best he could make from the loan market. Who would you have gone for if these players are not good enough? Would you him rather have a flutter with Ronaldinho, Beckham etc?

[Rover_Shaun]

Another strange one is that before xmas those who said the squad was poor were shouted down by the massive majority.

Now it seems the squad being poor is being used as a reason to keep Appleton even though (I say this through gritted teeth) that Kean amassed the points that will save us from relegation with that squad.

I will say it again. The calibre of his loan targets do not fill me with any confidence that we will be anywhere near the play-off places this time next season under this manager.

Some will also say that Berg was almost as bad as Kean however when you compare our current managers bread and butter record to Berg's it's pretty alarming

Berg P9 W1 D3 L5 F10 A16 Pts6 GD-6

Appleton P9 W2 D3 L4 F5 A11 Pts9 GD-6

*I ignore the Palace away game and Charlton home game as each manager did not have sufficient time to prepare.

Those signings are the best he could make from the loan market. Who would you have gone for if these players are not good enough? Would you him rather have a flutter with Ronaldinho, Beckham etc?

Now don't be silly. Who is to say those signings were the best on offer???? They are just the best his imagination could come up with (a few are desperation signings). Sadly he is paid to make those choices, whereas I am not

Can anyone see us winning any of the next 3? I can't

[Blue n White Rover]

He did recall Orr? And continue to play Murphy weekly as well as sign David (LET 2/10) Bentley

Orr is an experienced RB who thought would do the job. He saw him play and dropped him because he has not been performing. However, he was excellent against Arsenal so we know the potential is there.

Bentley played through illness on Saturday and many other players could have been taken off before him, but that illness made the decision easier for Appleton. He hasn't played competitive football in over 18months. You can't expect him to work wonders after 2 games.

[Rover_Shaun]

So what was the point in signing Bentley if he can't cut it? We need players who are 'improvements' and can hit the ground running

[Blue n White Rover]

So what was the point in signing Bentley if he can't cut it? We need players who are 'improvements' and can hit the ground running

Bentley is an improvement on our previous right midfielder, Fu Kin Nowan!

Bentley can cut it, it's just a case of giving him time to settle in as he hasn't played for 18 months as I said in my previous post.

[Rover_Shaun]

At the time of his signing the manager was still under the dillusion that we could make the playoffs, hence no time for passengers

[Blue n White Rover]

At the time of his signing the manager was still under the dillusion that we could make the playoffs, hence no time for passengers

Surely he's an improvement on what we had/didn't though?

[den]

He did recall Orr? And continue to play Murphy weekly as well as sign David (LET 2/10) Bentley

He did recall Orr? And continue to play Murphy weekly as well as sign David (LET 2/10) Bentley

I was talking about the dozen or so Portugese no marks and a few others who patently weren't good enough.

[Parsonblue]

No offence Parson, in the past I've almost always regarded your contributions as being absolutely spot on but the statement highlighted in bold above makes me shake my head in disbelief.

Based on what exactly? I could understand your logic if he'd enjoyed huge success as a manager elsewhere but the fact is that his career record as a manager is poor, firstly at Portsmouth, secondly at Blackpool and he is carrying that dubious work on here now at Ewood. His was a hugely risky appointment from the off and it seems clear to me even at this stage that it has disastrously backfired.

In my view a good manager builds a solid base at the back giving his flair players a platform from which to express themselves. Appleton has either removed anyone with any creativity from the squad or won't give them any minutes on the pitch meaning that we're almost entirely reliant on Rhodes snapping up a half chance. If he doesn't score, we don't. Plus, as well as results being dreadful he's made us more or less unwatchable.

I can understand the reluctance to remove him based on the fact he's our fifth manager this season, but that for me isn't a good enough reason to persist with him. He must be judged on his own merits, not given leniency simply because there's been a high turnover immediately before his arrival. To turn it around should we persist indefinitely with Jim Iley or Steve Kean because there'd been a high turn over before they arrived? And I really would place MA in that sort of bracket.

I also completely agree with Paul on his assessment of Campbell.If he and most of the other loanees are the calibre of player Appleton is targeting, then we can only dream of a permanent stay in the lower divisions, probably lower than the one we're currently in as well.

Eh? brought back Orr, Pedersen and Marcus Olsson who had been rightly discarded and also persists with Jason Lowe who also should be nowhere near the side either..

We didn't have any flair players Rev. We had a bunch of show ponies who were never going to be good enough for this League. Do you think the likes of Rosado, Rochina and Formica would have lasted five minutes under Souness, Hughes or Allardyce?

Having appointed this guy they have to back him. Sack a sixth manager in a season and who would touch this club with a barge pole?

There are huge problems at this club and I suspect that whoever was manager they would need a season or two to sort it out. I'm not saying Appleton is the answer but this instant rush to judgement is crazy. I fully accept that if we lose to Millwall and Burnley the mob will be baying for his blood. But what then? Is it Shebby's turn again to appoint a manager and will the Bollywood actor be back in the frame?

The bottom line is that we had an excellent manager in Big Sam but Venkys got rid and it has been a downward spiral ever since. At the moment I'm more than happy to judge Appleton in twelve months time to see if he is taking the club in the right direction. Whilst Venkys are running things I would accept mid-table in the Championship as being a step in the right direction!

[DE.]

If Bentley being here means Orr can be left out then that's good enough for me. I said right from the start Bentley would be bang average and that's what he is. Once the nostalgia is pushed aside, his recent record clearly indicates what he once had is long gone. You see glimpses of it every so often, but as a consistent threat he's finished IMO.