[Archived] Jordan Rhodes

[RevidgeBlue]

Nothing wrong with that model for a club of our size. We've been doing it before the Venky's rolled up.

And selling top players and replacing them with inferior ones under both the Walker Trust and the current owners is the reason we no longer enjoy Premiership status.

I agree with Den to that extent, what I don't agree with him on is that ALL the players who have left were big losses, at least not by the time they left.

Yet here he is wanting to sell our best player and replace him with several inferior ones. I find it fairly bizarre.

Imo Mark Hughes identified the only way to achieve sustained success when he was here - hold on to your best players at all costs andbuild round them.

[Amo]

And selling top players and replacing them with inferior ones under both the Walker Trust and the current owners is the reason we no longer enjoy Premiership status.

I don't think there was really an Ajax strategy under Venky's, though. Giving them way too much credit. Especially when we see all the players we've had to pay off recently. Where do Nuno Gomes, Danny Murphy or Dickson Etuhu work into the 'buy low, sell high' model?

[BooyakaSha]

I can west brom being more interested in Best than Rhodes, Best has shown he can do well in the prem and his value and salary are a lot lower than Rhodes's, I cant imagine Best will be happy sitting on the bench for to long if we carry on with the formation and line up from todays game(which I hope we do)

Hoping it's the case. Losing Rhodes right now isn't in anyone's interest at Rovers surely.

[Parsonblue]

And selling top players and replacing them with inferior ones under both the Walker Trust and the current owners is the reason we no longer enjoy Premiership status.

I agree with Den to that extent, what I don't agree with him on is that ALL the players who have left were big losses, at least not by the time they left.

Yet here he is wanting to sell our best player and replace him with several inferior ones. I find it fairly bizarre.

Imo Mark Hughes identified the only way to achieve sustained success when he was here - hold on to your best players at all costs andbuild round them.

Surely you are not seriously comparing the strategy of John Williams and Venky's as one of the same? The big difference Rev was that John Williams always bought one decent player whenever we sold one. Even Jack found that the club wasn't big enough to keep a player if he was determined to go. The trick was always to find decent replacements. Williams was able to do this but Venky's haven't really tried and have simply allowed quality to leave with thinking of what to put in its place.

What last season proved is that a goalscorer on his own is not going to bring success, particularly a goalscorer like Rhodes who relies totally on others to create his chances. In many ways Rhodes is the icing on the cake but I'm not sure we've baked the cake yet, let alone looking to decorate it!

I don't think we need worry though as I can't see any other club willing to pay what we paid for Rhodes let alone improve on it. We overpaid for him and until he improves other aspects of his game we are unlikely to find many takers at the price we want.

[RevidgeBlue]

I disagree we always adequately replaced our players Parson, Duff was never adequately replaced, ditto Shearer, the young Dunn, Bellamy, RSC, Bentley, Warnock etc.etc.

And I'm not so sure last season told us that much about Rhodes, maybe a prolific striker can't get an otherwise terrible team promoted but you might just as easily say that without him and a less prolific marksman up top we would have gone down.

[Mani]

And you're still talking out of your backside as much now as you were then.

Must be some player then if he can just mope through training and turn it on when he wants on matchdays.....

I have absolutely no reason to "talk out of my backside" because I gain nothing from it at all.

It seems to me that the sequence of events have actually turned drastically towards that conversation I heard.

But I'll tell you what mate, you find another sand pit to bury your head in...and remember, just because you don't want something to happen doesn't mean it won't happen!!

Far to many fans on here only ever hear what they want to. Look past the end of your nose and you will see that Shaw has publicly courted Rhodes to PL clubs and that it's fairly obvious that the club would happily let Dann go (signed Kilgallon to replace). Best also appears available reading various sources.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist or believe what I said!...just lift your head out of your sand pit every so often.

[Jimmy612]

I disagree we always adequately replaced our players Parson, Duff was never adequately replaced, ditto Shearer, the young Dunn, Bellamy, RSC, Bentley, Warnock etc.etc.

And I'm not so sure last season told us that much about Rhodes, maybe a prolific striker can't get an otherwise terrible team promoted but you might just as easily say that without him and a less prolific marksman up top we would have gone down.

That's been the crux of the argument since this time last year Simon. Shebby and Co thought that they could buy their way to the PL by signing a kid who scores a lot of goals. No thought for how he fits the formation/style of play/ team mates around him. 'Just stick him up front and we're sure to go up'.

Those who built their house on sand eh?

That £8m money should have been invested by binning of that slimy keaner of a manager, appointing a proper one - who in turn would have prevented tosh like Gomes, Murphy, Etuhu, Best and all the Portuguese clan being bought - saving us what? £15m??

Then we should have reinvested that finance into building a balanced squad with a solid spine, a degree of quality in the right positions, a desire to win and most of all, no big time charlies.

Anyway, I think we can all agree that buying Rhodes for the amount we did, in our position was a huge mistake. Let's fast forward to where we are now....

Will Rhodes actually win us promotion? No - 1. He doesn't contribute enough in a game against a half decent side with 11 men. 2. The squad isn't good enough IMO to go up.

IF we lost Rhodes and bought in FOR EXAMPLE, Billy Sharp or Matty Fryatt from Hull (name more if you like) would we go down? I don't think so.

What if we also brought 2 or 3 additional players of good quality who could weigh in with goals, create chances etc. Could we then have a squad worthy of challenging?

Now If I'm in GB's shoes and he feels that he could take some of the money for Rhodes and invest in 2 or 3 or 4 good quality players then imo we cannot lose on this. What if he knows this and he has already got his ducks in a line? What if he is behind Shaw and Mani's coach saying 'lets shift this bugger quick sharp and give me 4 days and i'll bring in him, him and him'

Maybe we can all look and say 'it's a gamble what if he can't get anyone' - I said at the start of the season. We won't go up, we shouldn't go down. You replace Rhodes with a decent Championship striker (insert name here), plus one or two shrewd extras, and you might find that we have a stronger side, capable of holding our own.

Rhodes is a good finisher, he is in no way a world beater and I don't think he ever will be. I suspect GB might just be prodding Shaw in the hope of getting rid sooner rather than later.

[blueboy3333]

I have absolutely no reason to "talk out of my backside" because I gain nothing from it at all.

It seems to me that the sequence of events have actually turned drastically towards that conversation I heard.

But I'll tell you what mate, you find another sand pit to bury your head in...and remember, just because you don't want something to happen doesn't mean it won't happen!!

Far to many fans on here only ever hear what they want to. Look past the end of your nose and you will see that Shaw has publicly courted Rhodes to PL clubs and that it's fairly obvious that the club would happily let Dann go (signed Kilgallon to replace). Best also appears available reading various sources.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist or believe what I said!...just lift your head out of your sand pit every so often.

I think if proof were needed that Rovers wouldn't be averse to selling then it came from Shaws comments yesterday re Jordan 'wanting' to go to the Prem. If Rovers could get £10m for him i'm sure they'd like to reinvest the lot in 3 or 4 young excellent prospects. Obviuosly the likes of Nahki Wells would have to be one of them. As for Kilgallon, he wasn't bought to play left back or sit on the bench so i'm pretty sure they want rid of Dann. Bowyer, like every other manager given the choice, would want to bring his own players in. He's pretty much brought in a whole new midfield and defemce, it may be fair to assume he'd want a new striker and perhaps even a goalkeeper.

All this @#/? peddled by Nixon and others on here about HAVING to sell because the club is in finacial meltdown were just a ruse to unsettle the club and Rhodes.

Knowing Mani and his connections I have zero reason to doubt anything he has stated here .

He is very very close if not closer than most to the goings on , on the training ground .

Rovers do not have to sell Rhodes , have had no pressure from the top to sell him , and if he is sold it will be simply because the Manager fancies the cash for reinforcements .

Jordan had an issue earlier in the summer with certain people's influences in the playing side at team selection .

One of those players has left , however his issue went straight to the top which didnt go down well with the management or coaching team.

Jordan is happy at Rovers , but if pushed out will go , however the pushing out is not happening at board or ownership level . Make of that what you will !!

I'm still of the opinion Jordan will be here come this time next week as the owners have reiterated their desire to keep the only decision they ever got right

That can only mean the manager wants rid so he can reinvest in other players without breaking FFP rules?

[chaddyrovers]

Ha ha are you referring to my credibility or his?

Either way, see for yourself three weeks ago on the transfer thread...I said that I'd been privy to a conversation with a member of the coaching staff who'd said that Rhodes had looked disinterested in training and that they were disappointed in what he offered other than goal scoring. The person said they'd "snap the hand" off anyone willing to give them their money back...

They also stated that GB was not a fan of egos and that Best, Dann and King had BIG egos...at the time he stated that Best maybe pushed out..

Since that time the "bust up" between best and GB has come out and Rhodes is very obviously being pimped out to anyone who'll listen.

The person also said that there had been nothing mentioned about having to sell..

Iv said it before...I'm not an itk..I'm a normal fan but the conversation DID happen 100% and since then all seems to have happened. Believe it of not IF Blackburn get an offer of their money back + a bit Rhodes will go..I will be gutted but this guy has no need to lie to anyone!

I just hope we have a replacement lined up!!

I thought Rhodes all round game was better and his movement and hold up play was much better on Saturday.

Knowing Mani and his connections I have zero reason to doubt anything he has stated here .

He is very very close if not closer than most to the goings on , on the training ground .

Rovers do not have to sell Rhodes , have had no pressure from the top to sell him , and if he is sold it will be simply because the Manager fancies the cash for reinforcements .

Jordan had an issue earlier in the summer with certain people's influences in the playing side at team selection .

One of those players has left , however his issue went straight to the top which didnt go down well with the management or coaching team.

Jordan is happy at Rovers , but if pushed out will go , however the pushing out is not happening at board or ownership level . Make of that what you will !!

I'm still of the opinion Jordan will be here come this time next week as the owners have reiterated their desire to keep the only decision they ever got right

thanks Glen for update.

was the player that left a certain DM? also other Dunn and Dann?

Are you saying that Bowyer wants Rhodes?

Judging by Bowyer comments during the summer, he was building a team around Rhodes by bring in players like Judge and Taylor plus now Marshall and keeping hold of Rochina

[thenodrog]

Rhodes being sold wouldn't worry me too much, simply because the quality of the teams performances wouldn't be affected in any great way.

What would worry me though is how Bowyer would spend the money, assuming he was given all of it. A sale could go either way. Results might deteriorate (they couldn't deteriorate much though from what they've been since he's been here and before), or results might improve quite a lot.

Wont Huddersfield want some?

[thenodrog]

You've got to find it funny when people come out and say that we'd be better off without Rhodes. Come on the lads the only real source of goals for us and no-one will replace that if he ever left.

Of course they will. I first learnt that lesson when Fred Pick went for big money... then Fergie....then Tony Field.... then Andy Crawford.... then SG.....then Speedie....... then Big Al himself.....then Sutty...... then Matty Jansen...... then RSC. Truth is it's no massive deal cos imo Jordan Rhodes is 2nd / 3rd from the bottom of that list anyway.

If BRFC is in any danger it isn't from centre forwards leaving cos it's happened for generations and it happens right throughout football.

[thenodrog]

The answer is equally simple.

No.

Wrong Simon. The correct answer is 'possibly...... but not as much as Hufddersfield could'.

[thenodrog]

The main question is , how many strikers are available at less money who will guarantee 30 goals this season ?

'GUARANTEE'? THATS JUST DAFT. RHODES CANT EVEN GUARANTEE THAT. HE DIDN'T GET THERE LAST SEASON AND WHO IS TO SAY HE WONT GET INJURED?

[den]

Yet here he is wanting to sell our best player and replace him with several inferior ones. I find it fairly bizarre.

I want to sign several inferior players? Where the hell have you got that from Rev? No wonder you find it bizarre.

Look, Rhodes isn't our best player, he's our top goal scorer. That's where you don't follow the discussion. if he was our best player and top goalscorer, not one single fan would be happy to see him leave - on top of the fact that we would have no chance of hanging onto him.

[Stuart]

'GUARANTEE'? THATS JUST DAFT. RHODES CANT EVEN GUARANTEE THAT. HE DIDN'T GET THERE LAST SEASON AND WHO IS TO SAY HE WONT GET INJURED?

Whilst I agree with the principle, I'm pretty sure he scored 30 last season in league and cup.

[thenodrog]

I think if proof were needed that Rovers wouldn't be averse to selling then it came from Shaws comments yesterday re Jordan 'wanting' to go to the Prem.

Don't shoot the messenger here. Shaw is just being honest. No Championship club could hang on to any of their players if any Prem clubs come a calling.

[LDRover]

We would if we didn't use the money wisely.

I guess it's a simple question, with a yes or no answer -

Could we improve results by reinvesting the Rhodes money?

I'm absolutely certain we could.

Totally agree Den.

First and foremost you don't invest 8 million in one player not to get promoted or make a handsome profit. I don't think either will happen so, if there is any ambition to go back up, (and surely there has to be) then there has to be investment throughout the team.

If money is as tight as we're led to believe, the sale of Rhodes to strengthen other areas is the only option.

Rhodes is a great finisher but for me a penalty box player and that's all. I hardly think he has opposition managers changing game plans and opposing centre halves too stressed pre-match. He's not going to bully them with strength, stretch them with pace and movement or bamboozle them with outrageous skill. Keep him out of the box and he's pretty much redundant. This changes with good service and creativity in the side, we haven't got that and that's where investment is needed.

[Stuart]

Don't shoot the messenger here. Shaw is just being honest. No Championship club could hang on to any of their players if any Prem clubs come a calling.

We all know this though, but the only person that keeps bringing it up is him.

If money is as tight as we're led to believe, the sale of Rhodes to strengthen other areas is the only option.

If it's as right as we're led to believe the only option will be to sell Rhodes and pay off some debts with the proceeds.

[RevidgeBlue]

Anyway, I think we can all agree that buying Rhodes for the amount we did, in our position was a huge mistake. Let's fast forward to where we are

.

We most certainly can not!

The 8m spent on Rhodes was almost like a one off exceptional expenditure after Best sustained a long term injury and we faced going into the season without a recognised striker apart from CKR who arguably was more of a wide man. That 8m was money very well spent imo and guarantees either

a) A decent return on our investment or

b ) 25-30 goals per season as long as he's here. That second option is just fine by me. I'd love to see him here for another 4 seasons scoring c120 goals. The reality though is he's unlikely to be here next season if we fail to go up this.

However before any of that happened we spent massive money by Championship standards on 3 marquis ex Premiership players in Murphy Etuhu and Best and a faded former world superstar in Nuno Gomes. Unless Etuhu comes to a bit that all looks to be money extremely badly spent. Then came Shebby's seven? Portugeezers. By and large that was money extremely badly spent. Then Appleton came in and was allowed to bring in six players on loan most of which was very badly spent imo.

That's at least fifteen or sixteen players, the money for which ought to have been capable of building a team capable of a serious challenge for promotion.

Rhodes came in and did his bit scoring 28 goals. He is not the problem. How many other players can hold their hand up and say they performed last year? Not many. That's where the problem is.

[RevidgeBlue]

Of course they will. I first learnt that lesson when Fred Pick went for big money... then Fergie....then Tony Field.... then Andy Crawford.... then SG.....then Speedie....... then Big Al himself.....then Sutty...... then Matty Jansen...... then RSC. Truth is it's no massive deal cos imo Jordan Rhodes is 2nd / 3rd from the bottom of that list anyway.

If BRFC is in any danger it isn't from centre forwards leaving cos it's happened for generations and it happens right throughout football.

Whether or not it's inevitable we're always worse off in the immediate aftermath though aren't we Gordon?

[darrenrover]

We most certainly can not!

The 8m spent on Rhodes was almost like a one off exceptional expenditure after Best sustained a long term injury and we faced going into the season without a recognised striker apart from CKR who arguably was more of a wide man. That 8m was money very well spent imo and guarantees either

a) A decent return on our investment or

b ) 25-30 goals per season as long as he's here. That second option is just fine by me. I'd love to see him here for another 4 seasons scoring c120 goals. The reality though is he's unlikely to be here next season if we fail to go up this.

However before any of that happened we spent massive money by Championship standards on 3 marquis ex Premiership players in Murphy Etuhu and Best and a faded former world superstar in Nuno Gomes. Unless Etuhu comes to a bit that all looks to be money extremely badly spent. Then came Shebby's seven? Portugeezers. By and large that was money extremely badly spent. Then Appleton came in and was allowed to bring in six players on loan most of which was very badly spent imo.

That's at least fifteen or sixteen players, the money for which ought to have been capable of building a team capable of a serious challenge for promotion.

Rhodes came in and did his bit scoring 28 goals. He is not the problem. How many other players can hold their hand up and say they performed last year? Not many. That's where the problem is.

Indeed Rev. £8 million well spent and salary earned as opposed to what £ transfer fees wasted? (I don't know the figures) in addition to £10 million in non-productive salaries wasted. You could go on... .....

[RevidgeBlue]

I have absolutely no reason to "talk out of my backside" because I gain nothing from it at all.

It seems to me that the sequence of events have actually turned drastically towards that conversation I heard.

But I'll tell you what mate, you find another sand pit to bury your head in...and remember, just because you don't want something to happen doesn't mean it won't happen!!

Far to many fans on here only ever hear what they want to. Look past the end of your nose and you will see that Shaw has publicly courted Rhodes to PL clubs and that it's fairly obvious that the club would happily let Dann go (signed Kilgallon to replace). Best also appears available reading various sources.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist or believe what I said!...just lift your head out of your sand pit every so often.

So according to you, we're happy to sell Rhodes, Best, and King, which in the absence of DJ and Rochina leaves us with .....errrr no available strikers.

Sounds like a plan.

You stick to your stories of him being difficult in training and I'll stick to the evidence of my own eyes of his attitude and demeanour in interviews and what I've seen of him on the pitch ta very much.

[thenodrog]

Whether or not it's inevitable we're always worse off in the immediate aftermath though aren't we Gordon?

Quite right but only cos we havent taken the bull by the horns and planned replacements first. Imagine if we had not bent over whilst Shearer rogered us but rather sold him and used half the money from his sale to bring in Zidane and Dugarry and the other half to strengthen the rest of the squad? Unfortunately we kept an increasingly disillusioned superstar and brought in the likes of Matty Holmes and then Per Pederson to replace him.

Lessons learned the hard way through more than a touch of naivety unfortunately.

[JAL]

So according to you, we're happy to sell Rhodes, Best, and King, which in the absence of DJ and Rochina leaves us with .....errrr no available strikers.

Sounds like a plan.

You stick to your stories of him being difficult in training and I'll stick to the evidence of my own eyes of his attitude and demeanour in interviews and what I've seen of him on the pitch ta very much.

Is Mani actually revealing to us a manager that is struggling to man manage a senior player.

[RevidgeBlue]

Quite right but only cos we havent taken the bull by the horns and planned replacements first. Imagine if we had not bent over whilst Shearer rogered us but rather sold him and used half the money from his sale to bring in Zidane and Dugarry and the other half to strengthen the rest of the squad? Unfortunately we kept an increasingly disillusioned superstar and brought in the likes of Matty Holmes and then Per Pederson to replace him.

Lessons learned the hard way through more than a touch of naivety unfortunately.

Zidane wouldn't come. Dugarry would come but wouldn't come without Zidane. Why should they really after our best player by far had left? Maybe if Shearer had still been there the outcome would have been different. Good players attract other good players and vice versa imo.

Is Mani actually revealing to us a manager that is struggling to man manage a senior player.

I doubt it.