Cricket

[Gav]

Just watched the BT Sport highlights and was pleasantly surprised after avoiding the score all day today. 

Ben Stokes brave brave lad, playing with an obvious side injury and took several blows, Butler useless yet again, he needs dropping, Wood played a great knock giving it to the Aussies and Bairstow rode his luck at times but brilliant, just brilliant.

I doubt it will make much difference in the end, but credit where credits due, a bit of fight at last.

[matt83]

Not managed to see a much of this game but hopefully with rain forecast will somehow scrape a draw.

What little I did see was Buttler’s 8 deliveries yesterday. Painful viewing. Thought he looked ok in first innings of series for an uninspiring 30 odd, since then he’s just looked so terrible.

Can’t say it’s any surprise. He was rightly dropped from test cricket. Farcically given a test recall based purely on his white ball prowess, not played one county game since and has done exactly what he did to warrant getting dropped in the first place.

[AllRoverAsia]

I've managed, quite deliberately, not to see much of this game. Got to say I'm sorry to have missed a decent go by Bairstow.

I will watch Day 5 to see if we can bat through. 

Didn't waste my time and took in SA v India.

[47er]

It feels like a win!!!

[jim mk2]

Unexpected and It shows how low England have sunk when a draw is considered a good result. 

[matt83]

Back to the 90s treating draws like wins. 😂.

Tense last hour. No result but after 5 days more entertainment in the dying embers than the could squeeze into a fireworks laden t20/16.4.

ps. Absolutely shamefully attended by the convicts. Pathetic numbers covid or otherwise. 

[Gav]

1 hour ago, jim mk2 said:

Unexpected and It shows how low England have sunk when a draw is considered a good result. 

We have won a series 4 times in Australia in the past 50yrs, we've not sunk at all, we have always been cr@p. 

Well battled today, finally showing a bit of fight, sadly it counts for nothing in the grand scheme of things other than to highlight the fact many of the current team simply aren't good enough.

Edited January 9, 2022 by Gav

[chaddyrovers]

Atherton and Hussain praised Zak Crawley's innings and his technique in the fourth innings. 

 Hussain: 'Class act' Crawley deserves run in England side (msn.com)

England need to find his partner to opening with for the next test series. Also think we need to replace Malan at 3 

I would keep Root as Captain unless Stokes would take the role on. 

I wonder when we will find out Sliverwood future. Isn't Giles there now in Australia and with the team. I still think Giles and Sliverwood should be sack and replace with Paul Farbrace as Director of Cricket with Mike Atherton as Chief selector role. Then appoint Alec Stewart has Test Cricket head coach and Paul Collingwood as one day and twenty20 head coach. 

[chaddyrovers]

In making 77, Crawley notched the highest score by an England opener on this tour and it was only the second time in 18 Test innings since his double hundred against Pakistan that he had passed 30.

Former Australia captains Ricky Ponting and Ian Chappell both gave the youngster a massive vote of confidence, with Ponting telling Channel 7: "I like the look of this young man, there's something about him.

"He seems to be a little different with his attitude and intent than most of the other English batsman we've seen on trial in this series so far."

Chappell, meanwhile, told BBC Test Match Special: "Crawley is the future of England. You would want to go a long way with him before you drop him. You don't want to talk technique with him. You just have to keep his confidence up."

 

[oldjamfan1]

4 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

In making 77, Crawley notched the highest score by an England opener on this tour and it was only the second time in 18 Test innings since his double hundred against Pakistan that he had passed 30.

Former Australia captains Ricky Ponting and Ian Chappell both gave the youngster a massive vote of confidence, with Ponting telling Channel 7: "I like the look of this young man, there's something about him.

"He seems to be a little different with his attitude and intent than most of the other English batsman we've seen on trial in this series so far."

Chappell, meanwhile, told BBC Test Match Special: "Crawley is the future of England. You would want to go a long way with him before you drop him. You don't want to talk technique with him. You just have to keep his confidence up."

 

That’s all okay but as others have said, if Crawley is the best we can come up with as an opening batsman then we are fucked.

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, oldjamfan1 said:

That’s all okay but as others have said, if Crawley is the best we can come up with as an opening batsman then we are fucked.

well everyone is their opinion but you have 4 very good former international players plus I have seen comments from Shane Warne all praising Zak Crawley and his technique. 

if you feel there is better county players who can open the innings please name them

[oldjamfan1]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

well everyone is their opinion but you have 4 very good former international players plus I have seen comments from Shane Warne all praising Zak Crawley and his technique. 

if you feel there is better county players who can open the innings please name them

I can’t - that’s my point Chaddy!!

[chaddyrovers]

6 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

I can’t - that’s my point Chaddy!!

You got 5 former international cricketers who played alot of test cricket all praising him. Should we ignore them? 

I will keep Crawley as opener and maybe try Tom Haines from Sussex. I would keep the eye on Warwickshire batsman Robert Yates, 

 

[oldjamfan1]

26 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

You got 5 former international cricketers who played alot of test cricket all praising him. Should we ignore them? 

I will keep Crawley as opener and maybe try Tom Haines from Sussex. I would keep the eye on Warwickshire batsman Robert Yates, 

 

You are completely missing the point mate. If Crawley is the answer then we are in a whole heap of trouble.

I don’t care what any number of ex pros are saying - he is not a great opening batsman by anyone’s measurement. 

[chaddyrovers]

3 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

You are completely missing the point mate. If Crawley is the answer then we are in a whole heap of trouble.

I don’t care what any number of ex pros are saying - he is not a great opening batsman by anyone’s measurement. 

So who in the county championship game are better options? Not many but that's fault of the County Championship game not Crawley. So why not give him a proper run as an opener with a new opener in the test series for the away series in West Indies in March and then home series against New Zealand and South Africa. 

If he has done enough to impress and been praised by these 5 ex-pros including 2 former England captains and 2 former Australia captains plus a world class player then I will take their opinions 

[den]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

You got 5 former international cricketers who played alot of test cricket all praising him. Should we ignore them? 

I will keep Crawley as opener and maybe try Tom Haines from Sussex. I would keep the eye on Warwickshire batsman Robert Yates, 

 

There were plenty of people inside football who backed Steve Kean.

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, den said:

There were plenty of people inside football who backed Steve Kean.

and thats got nothing to do with this thread. Lets focus on the Cricket discussion. 

If you want to disagree with the opinion of 5 ex-pros including 2 former England captains(Michael Atherton and Nasser Hussain) and 2 former Australia captains(Ian Chappell and Ricky Pointing) plus a world class player(Shane Warne) then thats your choice but given that they know it takes to have a successful international test cricket career its hard to disagree with their opinion. 

[den]

8 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

and thats got nothing to do with this thread. Lets focus on the Cricket discussion. 

If you want to disagree with the opinion of 5 ex-pros including 2 former England captains(Michael Atherton and Nasser Hussain) and 2 former Australia captains(Ian Chappell and Ricky Pointing) plus a world class player(Shane Warne) then thats your choice but given that they know it takes to have a successful international test cricket career its hard to disagree with their opinion. 

It’s got everything to do with this thread Chaddy.

You don’t even have to have played cricket, never mind been captain of your country to have an opinion of a player. I could, but won’t trawl back and get many very critical opinions from ex pros of Crawleys technique.  
I “think” only last week the ex England opening batsman mentioned Crawleys technique when he was talking about the England sides performances in the Ashes. I posted the link on here.

Edited January 9, 2022 by den

[jim mk2]

This is the worst England team in my lifetime with some of the worst batsmen I’ve seen at a technical level from any Test country. 

We went through some bad times in the 1990s but at least we had the likes of Hick and Ramprakash who could at least hold a bat straight. The likes of Hameed, Burns, Sibley and Crawley have such idiosyncratic styles that it’s no surprise they have failed at Test level and their selection is an indictment of the poor quality of bowlers in county cricket. 

Crawley has proved nothing with his 77 in the second innings. His has probably had poorest technique of them all, plays with his bat away from his body and plays far too many loose shots and will never be the answer as an opener

In Melbourne it was typical of England to show a bit of backbone when the series had already been lost. Where was the fight in the first 3 Tests?

The English game needs a complete overhaul. ideally I’d like to see the whole regime including Giles cleared out and coaches and brought in from abroad at every level. 

[Gav]

1 hour ago, jim mk2 said:

This is the worst England team in my lifetime.

Not true.

Joe Root is seen by many people in the game as Englands greatest batsman. James Anderson is also seen by many in the game as Englands greatest bowler. Add Ben Stokes and Stuart Broad to that list and actually you’re seeing some of the best players this country has ever produced in the current team. 

[Dreams of 1995]

The absolute worst openers though. Gotta agree with Jim 😬 on this one. Even Crawley is uninspiring. I’m a fan of the white ball game but one of a minority in preferring the red ball. It just seems to be at the bottom of England’s priorities. 
 

In doing so we have a bunch of white ball players. The openers don’t soften the ball up enough for the rest. You want players like Root at 4 or Stokes after him coming in when the ball is softened. He will have more of a chance. I think last time we played the Aussies we opened with Roy. Unstoppable in the white ball game, bloody awful with a red ball.
 

Burns looks genuinely uncomfortable when batting which is odd for an opener. Hameed will give his wicket away every game no matter if he’s looking in good nick. I think unfortunately the openers are spoiling the squad. A great middle order, decent bowlers but not a spinner in sight but just bang average openers. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

10 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

And another thing. I wouldn’t put any weight on Australians praising Crawley. They’re convicts who want to keep England as weak as possible. A flawed player like Crawley in the Dngland team suits them fine

It’s like when the Aussies used to play the county sides in between test matches. If one of the county sides had a young batsman who the papers we’re bigging up for a test debut you could bet your house he’d get a big century against them. Followed by a couple of single figure scores in the next test !

It worked every time.

[chaddyrovers]

14 hours ago, den said:

It’s got everything to do with this thread Chaddy.

sadly Kean has nothing to do with this. 

14 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

We went through some bad times in the 1990s but at least we had the likes of Hick and Ramprakash who could at least hold a bat straight. The likes of Hameed, Burns, Sibley and Crawley have such idiosyncratic styles that it’s no surprise they have failed at Test level and their selection is an indictment of the poor quality of bowlers in county cricket. 

Hick and Ramprakash batting technique werent anything surprise and still have massive issues. Hick was fantastic against Fast medium pacers and flat wickets but awful when it started swinging or pitch had some pace and bounce in it. 

There is no perfect batting style or technique. Look at Some of the best players in the last 25 years like Ricky Pointing or Alistair Cook or Brian Lara or Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis. None of them had the perfect batting technique but all produce plenty of runs for the national team. 

14 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

The English game needs a complete overhaul. ideally I’d like to see the whole regime including Giles cleared out and coaches and brought in from abroad at every level. 

That's it Jim bring in overseas coach. Why not appoint people like Mike Atherton, Alec Stewart who know test Cricket and county game. 

13 hours ago, Gav said:

Not true.

Joe Root is seen by many people in the game as Englands greatest batsman. James Anderson is also seen by many in the game as Englands greatest bowler. Add Ben Stokes and Stuart Broad to that list and actually you’re seeing some of the best players this country has ever produced in the current team. 

Exactly Gav. Another massive overreaction again by Jim which is no surprise is it. 

Root is one of England's greatest Batsman, Anderson is the best England bowler as his wicket column says. Stokes is the best all rounder since Botham and Broad is world class bowler. 

If I have to pick England best 11 since I started watching England in 1994/1995. My team would be this :-

Atherton, Cook, Vaughan(C), Root, Stewart(wk), Stokes, Flintoff, Swann, Gough, Broad, Anderson. 

Thorpe, Pietersen, Strauss all unlucky to miss out. 

[den]

Someone’s confusing “individuals” with “team”

Rovers squad that was relegated in 1966…

https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379166.jpg?fallback=png		Fred Else	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	31/03/1933
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/80647.jpg?fallback=png		John Roberts	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/194.gif	Australia	24/03/1944
Defender
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/381412.jpg?fallback=png		Benjamin Anderson	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/43.gif	Scotland	18/02/1946
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/111638.jpg?fallback=png		Mike England	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/55.gif	Wales	02/12/1941
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379180.jpg?fallback=png		David Holt	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	07/01/1945
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379168.jpg?fallback=png		Dick Mulvaney	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	05/08/1942
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/18294.jpg?fallback=png		Keith Newton	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	23/06/1941
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379170.jpg?fallback=png		Billy Wilson	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	10/07/1946
Midfielder
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/18386.jpg?fallback=png		Ronnie Clayton	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	05/08/1934
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/241205.jpg?fallback=png		Mike Ferguson	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	09/03/1943
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/211316.jpg?fallback=png		Walter Joyce	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	10/09/1937
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/118860.jpg?fallback=png		Eamonn Rogers	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/22.gif	Ireland	16/04/1947
Forward
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379175.jpg?fallback=png		Martin Britt	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	17/01/1946
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379171.jpg?fallback=png		John Byrom	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	24/04/1944
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379274.jpg?fallback=png		Malcolm Darling	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/43.gif	Scotland	04/07/1947
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/27173.jpg?fallback=png		Bryan Douglas	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	27/05/1934
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/288726.jpg?fallback=png		Mike Harrison	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	18/04/1940
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/381300.jpg?fallback=png		Roly Horrey	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	07/03/1943
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379277.jpg?fallback=png		George Jones	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	21/04/1945
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/70736.jpg?fallback=png		Andy McEvoy	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/22.gif	Ireland	15/07/1938
https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/klein/379169.jpg?fallback=png		George Sharples	https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/flaggen_neu/12.gif	England	20/09/1943

 

[lsp82]

Not unexpected but and absolute shocking bowling performance from Woakes and Wood. Great start and then absolute rubbish thrown down by these two has seen the Aussies in position to win the test on the first day. England essentially down to 3 front line bowlers with stokes and now Robinson not bowling. Two of whom have been rubbish. Let's hope Broad takes some more wickets or this could be at least 400 for the Aussies. 

Edit Head has got himself out may be hope yet. Although they should be nowhere near 200 on this wicket. 

Edited January 14, 2022 by lsp82