Cricket

[47er]

39 minutes ago, den said:

leaders in a new ear

Let's hope it isn't a tin one Den!

 

39 minutes ago, den said:

Every side will fear you.

I worry that Australia won't. Maybe India won't either.

[jim mk2]

Aren't England just copying Australian strategy from 20 plus years ago? They had a golden crop of batsmen who amassed big scores very quickly at more than 4 runs an over - which was very fast for Test cricket at that time. The idea was to put a big total on the board and then give Warne etc loads of time to work their magic and bowl teams out.

 

[den]

18 minutes ago, 47er said:

Let's hope it isn't a tin one Den!

 

I worry that Australia won't. Maybe India won't either.

Oops, changed it!

[Gav]

1 hour ago, den said:

It’s brilliant to watch and the desire to play attractive, attacking test cricket is fantastic to see. England rightly see themselves as leaders in a new era, a new approach. If they are successful and blow teams away regularly other sides will have to follow. 
 

As in any professional sport though,  It “IS” about results. Play this way and win and you’ll be number one in the world. Every side will fear you. Play this way and start losing regularly and nobody will fear you. You’ll become cannon fodder and derided. As for now, it’s superb. Ben Stokes currently looks like the best cricket captain in the world.

Test match cricket has always been about not losing rather than winning, its ingrained into the fabric of the game across the globe. I'm surprised its taken this long for a new approach to the game, but I'm delighted its England leading the way as den says above.

The only problem moving forward, you have to get into a commanding position to adopt this approach and against the Aussies in recent times we've been blown away far to often.

[oldjamfan1]

3 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

Aren't England just copying Australian strategy from 20 plus years ago? They had a golden crop of batsmen who amassed big scores very quickly at more than 4 runs an over - which was very fast for Test cricket at that time. The idea was to put a big total on the board and then give Warne etc loads of time to work their magic and bowl teams out.

 

Not really Jim. Many of the wins in the summer came about by England chasing down big totals which had previously been thought unattainable. Its more about being generally aggressive and attacking in all areas. We certainly don't have a Warne or a peak McGrath to fall back on but we do have multiple match winners. 

[Gav]

After losing the toss, England have dismissed Pakistan for 304, this time in less than a day on a very flat wicket, tremendous effort.

A long way to go in this one, but a great effort and the new leg spinner Ahmed takes 2 on debut. 

Edited December 17, 2022 by Gav

[chaddyrovers]

This England team under Stokes just get better and better. The way he managed Rehan Ahmed on his debut and make him feel of the team was superb management and I'm pleased we picked him on his talent and not gone the other way saying he is too young for test cricket. If you good enough then you are old enough. 

That Googly ball for his second wicket was excellent to dismissed Ashraf. 

[47er]

On 17/12/2022 at 23:10, Gav said:

After losing the toss, England have dismissed Pakistan for 304, this time in less than a day on a very flat wicket, tremendous effort.

A long way to go in this one, but a great effort and the new leg spinner Ahmed takes 2 on debut. 

Thought Ahmed was great. Had another one turned down on appeal as well. Astonishing for an 18 year old. Leg spin is the hardest cricketing skill to master I'd think and they peak into their 30's. Spun it much more than Leach.

That he can be so good at 18 gives us years or promise to look forward to.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by 47er

[Gav]

11 hours ago, 47er said:

Thought Ahmed was great. Had another one turned down on appeal as well. Astonishing for an 18 year old. Leg spin is the hades cricketing skill to master I'd think and they peak into their 30's. Spun it much more than Leach.

That he can be so good at 18 gives us years or promise to look forward to.

 

I saw a old Sky segment where Warne picked him out as a 12/13yr old as one to watch, said he’d play at the highest level and he knew a thing or two about leg spin.

🤞

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

11 hours ago, 47er said:

Thought Ahmed was great. Had another one turned down on appeal as well. Astonishing for an 18 year old. Leg spin is the hades cricketing skill to master I'd think and they peak into their 30's. Spun it much more than Leach.

That he can be so good at 18 gives us years or promise to look forward to.

 

A good wrist spinner should be getting more turn than a good finger spinner. That’s why a really good leg spinner is worth their weight in gold. I got a few tips back in the day from Tommy Greenhough the old Lancashire and England leg spinner. He lived close to me in the 1960’s.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[47er]

19 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

A good wrist spinner should be getting more turn than a good finger spinner. That’s why a really good leg spinner is worth their weight in gold. I got a few tips back in the day from Tommy Greenhough the old Lancashire and England leg spinner. He lived close to me in the 1960’s.

Ha! Remember him. Haven't heard his name in years. Had a really odd run-up as I recall. Gripped the ball like it was made of china.

Edited December 18, 2022 by 47er

[47er]

42 minutes ago, Gav said:

he knew a thing or two about leg spin.

He certainly did. Best ever.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

15 minutes ago, 47er said:

Ha! Remember him. Haven't heard his name in years. Had a really odd run-up as I recall. Gripped the ball like it was made of china.

He started out at “ Fieldhouse “ just around the corner from where I live. That was when “ John Brights “ was a huge cotton empire and the ground was in the shadow of their massive mills. Lots of their employees played for “ Fieldhouse “, I think Tommy was one of them before he signed for Lancashire. They also had a very good works football team with their own ground. There are houses on both grounds now although “ Fieldhouse “ moved to a new ground on the other side of town and still have a team.
 

In fact there are houses on most of the works pitches I played on as a young player. I can only think of one that is still in existence and even that has changed hands.

Regarding his grip he had a lot of trouble with his fingers later in his career.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[47er]

58 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

He started out at “ Fieldhouse “ just around the corner from where I live. That was when “ John Brights “ was a huge cotton empire and the ground was in the shadow of their massive mills. Lots of their employees played for “ Fieldhouse “, I think Tommy was one of them before he signed for Lancashire. They also had a very good works football team with their own ground. There are houses on both grounds now although “ Fieldhouse “ moved to a new ground on the other side of town and still have a team.
 

In fact there are houses on most of the works pitches I played on as a young player. I can only think of one that is still in existence and even that has changed hands.

Regarding his grip he had a lot of trouble with his fingers later in his career.

As I remember he held the ball really low down and gripped it like he was frightened of dropping it. I don't think his style ever changed from when he first played for Lancs.

[chaddyrovers]

Brook is in Superb form again. Another Hundred and his 3rd in the series. 

 

[47er]

Ahmed killing 'em. 4 for 44. Not bad for an 18 year old on debut!

[47er]

5 for! youngest test player ever to take 5 wickets on his debut. Pakistan all out 216.

Well done Ahmed Rehan!

167 to win.

Edited December 19, 2022 by 47er

[chaddyrovers]

England just keep impressing day by day under Ben Stokes's captaincy

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

19 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

England just keep impressing day by day under Ben Stokes's captaincy

They’ve been brilliant on this tour. Usually Pakistan is a bit of a graveyard for English touring teams so to win 3-0 is a fantastic effort by all concerned.

Edited December 20, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[den]

McCullum and Stokes instilling an approach to test cricket that I don’t think has been seen before. They aren’t interested in drawing any game, it’s either win or lose - and players individually failing is completely tolerated. There’s no criticism of them whatsoever. So there is only one approach which is to try to win the game whatever the situation and by all accounts the players to a man have bought into it and are benefitting immensely from it.

I think we’re in for an amazing era. Let’s see where we go. One things for certain, if this current success continues every other test side will have to follow.

Edited December 20, 2022 by den

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

19 minutes ago, den said:

McCullum and Stokes instilling an approach to test cricket that I don’t think has been seen before. They aren’t interested in drawing any game, it’s either win or lose - and players individually failing is completely tolerated. There’s no criticism of them whatsoever. So there is only one approach which is to try to win the game whatever the situation and by all accounts the players to a man have bought into it and are benefitting immensely from it.

I think we’re in for an amazing era. Let’s see where we go. One things for certain, if this current success continues every other test side will have to follow.

It’ll be a while before another nation goes to Pakistan and wins 3-0.

[den]

14 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

It’ll be a while before another nation goes to Pakistan and wins 3-0.

Yes, possibly.

Two points on that…

1) we caught them by surprise with our approach. They just didn’t know how to combat it

2) They looked a poor side, but England might just have made them look poor.

The key is how quickly England scored their runs. It gave them long enough to take 20 wickets in all three tests. 

[chaddyrovers]

On 20/12/2022 at 09:07, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

They’ve been brilliant on this tour. Usually Pakistan is a bit of a graveyard for English touring teams so to win 3-0 is a fantastic effort by all concerned.

I have enjoyed watching how our players have played the spinners out there and be positive without being Reckless 

On 20/12/2022 at 13:07, den said:

The key is how quickly England scored their runs. It gave them long enough to take 20 wickets in all three tests. 

You are correct 100% on this point

[AllRoverAsia]

Yet another T20 in South Africa and a few injuries have made "timely" recovery.

Viewing T20 as a more entertaining form of baseball and whilst I got my TV timings a bit wrong I saw enough to know that Brevis is going to excel at this format.

[jim mk2]

England well and truly made a mess of that run chase.