[Archived] Never Again !

[T.J.Newton]

I buy mostly online simply because its cheaper and you can usually find precisely what your looking for in minutes, if I had more money id love to go and casually browse around town and shop at leisure but its just not an option for me on a tight budget, the only things I don't buy online are food and clothes.

[Paul]

Problem is Paul that the Kindle is a far superior product and the books are cheaper to buy. The LET is a useless rag these days. Read the back page in Asda and you've read it.

I'm not sure it's a superior product, books have been around for a very long time, but I think it is a product which very much suits our lives and provides a great deal of convenience. My wife has a Kindle and uses it extensively, I have a Nexus 7 which runs Kindle and it provides me with the opportunity to read at times when I wouldn't simply because the books would be at home.

You're right about the LT, we only really ever got it for Rovers news which is why the internet has replaced it.

I still think the uniqueness aspect is important. This weekend I've shopped at Booths (great cheese, good wine), Spout House Farm (excellent lamb, good beef, great cakes, real free range eggs) and Browns the Butcher (sausages to die for). All offering really good products, some unique to the area, and at very good prices - except Browns who must sell the most expensive sausage in Lancashire!

[Mr. E]

The fact that there are people agreeing with the OP shows why we are where we are. "Oh, I don't care that Venks have destroyed 100+ years of history and tradition, my only concern is whether or not a bunch of kids are saying bad things or not!"

This is what it comes down to really. Venkys may be the ones behind the fall, but BRFC's fans sat on their asses and let this happen. Real football fans like Liverpool and Everton would have never let this happen. Uncle Jack and this great club was let down my fools content to sit on their asses and complain about the noise than stand up for this once great club. That is the real tragedy.

[Waggy76]

The fact that there are people agreeing with the OP shows why we are where we are. "Oh, I don't care that Venks have destroyed 100+ years of history and tradition, my only concern is whether or not a bunch of kids are saying bad things or not!"

This is what it comes down to really. Venkys may be the ones behind the fall, but BRFC's fans sat on their asses and let this happen. Real football fans like Liverpool and Everton would have never let this happen. Uncle Jack and this great club was let down my fools content to sit on their asses and complain about the noise than stand up for this once great club. That is the real tragedy.

A lot of truth in the above statement ...

[T.J.Newton]

The fact that there are people agreeing with the OP shows why we are where we are. "Oh, I don't care that Venks have destroyed 100+ years of history and tradition, my only concern is whether or not a bunch of kids are saying bad things or not!"

This is what it comes down to really. Venkys may be the ones behind the fall, but BRFC's fans sat on their asses and let this happen. Real football fans like Liverpool and Everton would have never let this happen. Uncle Jack and this great club was let down my fools content to sit on their asses and complain about the noise than stand up for this once great club. That is the real tragedy.

Liverpool and Everton have far bigger fan bases, when their fans kick off I bet the proportions of protesting fans are not much different to what ours where, they just have far more in numbers so they make a louder noise and get more attention, I bet they also have far more professional experienced fan groups to organise their stuff, we had a small group of fans that became brag that where having to learn as they went along and they made mistakes(all be it with the best of intentions) that turned fans off what they where doing.

[thenodrog]

This is what it comes down to really. Venkys may be the ones behind the fall, but MOST BRFC's fans sat on their asses and let this happen. Real football fans like Liverpool and Everton would have never let this happen. Uncle Jack and this great club was let down my MANY fools content to sit on their asses and complain about the noise than stand up for this once great club. That is the real tragedy.

Indeed. The protestors were met by derision and scoffs by the rest of the supporters people who went to Ewood on match days. It felt almost as if the people who were the first to see the writing on the wall back then were an embarrassment to the rest who wimpishly slunk down to the ground and then slunk off again.

[Neil Weaver]

Indeed. The protestors were met by derision and scoffs by the rest of the supporters people who went to Ewood on match days. It felt almost as if the people who were the first to see the writing on the wall back then were an embarrassment to the rest who wimpishly slunk down to the ground and then slunk off again.

Some folk (no names mentioned) are fond of putting folk in pigeonholes like tremblers and grovellers. Others have a grip on reality.

[darrenrover]

Indeed. The protestors were met by derision and scoffs by the rest of the supporters people who went to Ewood on match days. It felt almost as if the people who were the first to see the writing on the wall back then were an embarrassment to the rest who wimpishly slunk down to the ground and then slunk off again.

I disagree.

When the protests started what were they all about? Steve Kean? Venkys? Sacking Alardyce? Williams, Finn etc departing? Anderson and his Cronies? Initially, other than Mystic Meg, who could have foreseen the outcome?

When we were playing Chelsea off the park and a protest plane appears overhead, for 20 minutes the players froze! Where was the sense in that?

I accept now that clearly Venkys have been clearly duped right from the start and perhaps have wised up only to be chucked a curveball in the form of FFP.

Gordon, you appear an intelligent guy, where the Kean would we be now without Venkys financial support? Don't answer btw because we all know where.

I'm not a Venky supporter, far from it but I'd like to think I'm a realist. They've been appalling as owners to date, decimated the club probably as a consequence of parasitic advisors and have probably suffered horendously financially as a consequence of their involvement.

I'll probably be castigated but at least they've stuck with it despite all! Have our supporters done likewise with 'our club' and if not why not?....

[Ewood Spark]

I disagree.

When the protests started what were they all about? Steve Kean? Venkys? Sacking Alardyce? Williams, Finn etc departing? Anderson and his Cronies? Initially, other than Mystic Meg, who could have foreseen the outcome?

When we were playing Chelsea off the park and a protest plane appears overhead, for 20 minutes the players froze! Where was the sense in that?

I accept now that clearly Venkys have been clearly duped right from the start and perhaps have wised up only to be chucked a curveball in the form of FFP.

Gordon, you appear an intelligent guy, where the Kean would we be now without Venkys financial support? Don't answer btw because we all know where.

I'm not a Venky supporter, far from it but I'd like to think I'm a realist. They've been appalling as owners to date, decimated the club probably as a consequence of parasitic advisors and have probably suffered horendously financially as a consequence of their involvement.

I'll probably be castigated but at least they've stuck with it despite all! Have our supporters done likewise with 'our club' and if not why not?....

Spot on 'darrenrover'. This post is the best summation of the situation surrounding events around Ewood I have seen for a long long time.

[Stuart]

where the Kean would we be now without Venkys financial support? Don't answer btw because we all know where.

You make it sound like we should be grateful.

More pertinent (if we are being hypothetical) is where would we be if they hadn't taken over in the first places. Chances are it would have been the PL.

Oh, and the protests were very strongly aimed at the removal of Kean. Sadly because people couldn't be bothered to join the protests it allowed Kean and his cronies to spin it as a minority against him. Had we stuck together against the charlatan and the entire fanbase protested he wouldn't have been able to do this.

It only turned to Venkys when it was clear they believed Team Kean's version of events and stuck by him.

It still upsets me to think of all those "Rovers fans" supping outside the BBE beer tent, watching Chelsea v Arsenal on the big screen. Many of whom I'm sure are now preferring to do exactly that than stick by Rovers.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

And they did...

[Ewood Spark]

You make it sound like we should be grateful.

More pertinent (if we are being hypothetical) is where would we be if they hadn't taken over in the first places. Chances are it would have been the PL.

Oh, and the protests were very strongly aimed at the removal of Kean. Sadly because people couldn't be bothered to join the protests it allowed Kean and his cronies to spin it as a minority against him. Had we stuck together against the charlatan and the entire fanbase protested he wouldn't have been able to do this.

It only turned to Venkys when it was clear they believed Team Kean's version of events and stuck by him.

It still upsets me to think of all those "Rovers fans" supping outside the BBE beer tent, watching Chelsea v Arsenal on the big screen. Many of whom I'm sure are now preferring to do exactly that than stick by Rovers.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

And they did...

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

[Majiball]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

But the protests were just a consequence of Venky's actions, they would always have happened under their watch.

[Stuart]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

That's just completely untrue from start to finish.

I expect us to disagree over this but I don't expect you to... I'll stop short of saying lie... re-write history to support your argument.

Does 1% ring any bells? Have you forgotten our match day record on relatively few protest days.

Perhaps you are recalling the Wigan match. That wasn't a protest, it was a mass epiphany.

Kean backed by Venkys' pride/ignorance/belligerence/naivety/stupidity (delete as appropriate) got us relegated, not the protests. Although I agree the lack of fan unity did cost us but not in the way you believe.

[Majiball]

That's just completely untrue from start to finish.

I expect us to disagree over this but I don't expect you to... I'll stop short of saying lie... re-write history to support your argument.

Does 1% ring any bells? Have you forgotten our match day record on relatively few protest days.

Perhaps you are recalling the Wigan match. That wasn't a protest, it was a mass epiphany.

Kean backed by Venkys' pride/ignorance/belligerence/naivety/stupidity (delete as appropriate) got us relegated, not the protests. Although I agree the lack of fan unity did cost us but not in the way you believe.

If only Sam could teach a team to play football as opposed to hoofball then the fanbase would have been united.

[Parsonblue]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

I think that's a view that many of us share Ewood Spark although, having said that, supporters always have the right to protest. In the past protests were always spontaneous rather than pre-planned and were, as a result, far more powerful. I think it was the pre-planned nature of the protests which upset many supporters who had gone down to Ewood to support the team. Venky's however, must be the one's held responsible for our decline. The sacking of Sam, without a replacement, and the forcing out of John Williams and Tom Finn were decisions which ultimately destroyed the club and have placed it in a position which, with the arrival of FFP, means that we are unlikely to see Premier League football at Ewood Park anytime soon.

[den]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

Important points were being dropped because of Kean and the way he was forcing every good player we had out of the club. We're still dropping down the leagues because of it. Nothing at all to do with the fans - unless more should have joined the protests earlier.

[arbitro]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

It really is going over old ground again but the first few organised protests were only against Kean. And had the Indians took heed of these there was a chance we may have stayed up (conjecture I know). A new manager was the only chance we had and anybody who could not see that even at such an early stage of the season doesn't know the game. Frustration boiled over in the West Brom and Bolton games and Kean bore the brunt of this but that wasn't organised, it was sheer frustration. The first time I remember the Indians being publicly chastised by the fans was against Norwich when we were actually winning.

And why was the team struggling? Was that because of the fans? Not a chance. It was down to the ineptitude, arrogance and lack of leadership of a manager so far out of his depth and the ignorance of the owners.

[47er]

Important points were being dropped because of Kean and the way he was forcing every good player we had out of the club. We're still dropping down the leagues because of it. Nothing at all to do with the fans - unless more should have joined the protests earlier.

Trying to keep out of it, its all been said before. But "well said" Den!

Incredible that anyone can blame fans for what we know went on.

[jim mk2]

If only Sam could teach a team to play football as opposed to hoofball then the fanbase would have been united.

Old ground, been debated many times before and proved to be wrong, but it still has to be said: that's an idiotic post.

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

The cart followed the horse. The protests took place because of the incompetence of the manager and the team. To blame the fans for that debacle of a man and a manager is wrong.

[Majiball]

Old ground, been debated many times before and proved to be wrong, but it still has to be said: that's an idiotic post.

Humour, dear fellow nothing more. But it's not been proven wrong at all.

[Rover_Shaun]

Christ Almighty. Over 12 months on from relegation and some still haven't bloody well woken up

Venkys aided by Kean relegated this club. Not the fans, not even those who just sat on their hands and said 'shut up and back the team' in the face of all evidence. Or those who abused those that looked for the change that would retain the clubs PL status. At the end of the day the buck starts and stops in Pune. That is the only ivory tower

Venkys have been let off the hook. A death by a thousand cuts is now deemed prefereable to ridding the club of their disease.

Can we go back to castigating foul mouth fans or discussing the many shortcomings of the town of Blackburn?

[thenodrog]

I disagree.

When the protests started what were they all about? Steve Kean? Venkys? Sacking Alardyce? Williams, Finn etc departing? Anderson and his Cronies? Initially, other than Mystic Meg, who could have foreseen the outcome?

When we were playing Chelsea off the park and a protest plane appears overhead, for 20 minutes the players froze! Where was the sense in that?

I accept now that clearly Venkys have been clearly duped right from the start and perhaps have wised up only to be chucked a curveball in the form of FFP.

Gordon, you appear an intelligent guy, where the Kean would we be now without Venkys financial support? Don't answer btw because we all know where.

I'm not a Venky supporter, far from it but I'd like to think I'm a realist. They've been appalling as owners to date, decimated the club probably as a consequence of parasitic advisors and have probably suffered horendously financially as a consequence of their involvement.

I'll probably be castigated but at least they've stuck with it despite all! Have our supporters done likewise with 'our club' and if not why not?....

A point I've made many times since relegation under the heading of 'be careful what you wish for'. We are right royally fooked now if they were to sell up and pull the plug, and given that they have neither affinity or a link to the club that is a very real possibility.

Problem is that I prophesied disaster when they turned up at the start, and when we still had the Prem tipping 50m pa in our bank a/c, a good chairman and board and one of the top 6 managers in the country. But even I didn't know how quickly disaster would strike through a combination of sheer stupidity, naivety and base greed.

As for the protests .. they were initially against Steve Kean's tenure as manager. (I attended through frustration but I said on here at the time that Kean was the wrong target cos it should have aimed at the Venky's. It was obvious back then that all the signs led to a disastrous future for the club). As it stands the protests turned out to be well founded given the lies,deceit a subsequent but totally predictable relegation.

btw Ewood Spark likes your post it appears. All I can say is that the 60 quid he spent on that superb rib at the weekend should have been spent on fish.... and he should have eaten the lot!

[thenodrog]

I think that's a view that many of us share Ewood Spark although, having said that, supporters always have the right to protest. In the past protests were always spontaneous rather than pre-planned and were, as a result, far more powerful. I think it was the pre-planned nature of the protests which upset many supporters who had gone down to Ewood to support the team. Venky's however, must be the one's held responsible for our decline.

The sacking of Sam, without a replacement, and the forcing out of John Williams and Tom Finn were decisions which ultimately destroyed the club and have placed it in a position which, with the arrival of FFP, means that we are unlikely to see Premier League football at Ewood Park anytime soon.

No good pontificating now pb. Those events had happened 6 months and more before the protests started. The writing had been on the wall for some time. How come you were so slow to catch on to the dire situation?

[Parsonblue]

No good pontificating now pb. Those events had happened 6 months and more before the protests started. The writing had been on the wall for some time. How come you were so slow to catch on to the dire situation?

I stopped worrying about the dire plight of the club the moment that Fred Pickering was sold to one of our title rivals in the early 1960's I've come to accept that I will experience good times and bad times following the Rovers and unless I stop attending matches I'm not going to change that situation. Personally, I just enjoy the football be it good, bad or indifferent.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

The protests recieved a massive amount of publicity at the time ... in fact in the consciousness of the average football supporter ALL Rovers supporters were labelled protesters, a viewpoint I came across quite often. IMO The only thing they 'achieved' was to place an extra burden on the shoulders of an already struggling team. Nothing will convince me otherwise that important points were dropped because of the actions of some of our 'support'.

Nonsense.