[Archived] iOS 7

[M-K]

Following the settlement of the latest Apple vs Samsung lawsuit in the US, here's a good article about the making of the iPhone and Samsung's history of deliberately infringing patents. They counter-sue and stall for years, then settle when they're about to face an import ban. By then the original product is completely out of date anyway, or the competitor they stole from has been marginalised or forced out of the market by Samsung's economies of scale.

(very good, long read)

http://www.vanityfair.com/business/2014/06/apple-samsung-smartphone-patent-war

Some choice quotes:

"Christopher Stringer, one of the iPhone designers, looked at the Galaxy S in near disbelief. All that time, he thought, all that effort trying out hundreds of designs, experimenting with the size of the glass, drawing different icons and buttons, and then these guys at Samsung just take it?"

"They never met a patent they didn’t think they might like to use, no matter who it belongs to."

(former Samsung patent lawyer)

[Biddy]

But it's not settled is it? The court awarded Apple $119m (a far cry from the $2.2billion Apple wanted) and they also awarded Samsung $158,000. Ok, that's small change but it was for a patent Apple was violating (sorry, Apple never copy or steal). As the article linked says, Samsung are REALLY annoying at delaying and appealing. What is expected is actually for BOTH sides to appeal. Utterly ridiculous. Why can't they both just hold their hands up and stick to what the courts say. it is totally and utterly boring now.

[M-K]

Did you read the article? It's about Samsung's tried and tested tactic of stealing a rival's product, then stalling the courts for so long that the rival has either gone out of business or Samsung has begun to dominate.

There's some eye-opening stuff in there. When Samsung were visted by court-appointed inspectors in a Korean antitrust case, the inspectors were initially refused entry to the building. CCTV footage later revealed that Samsung employees were busy destroying or removing infringing products from the production lines, and even eating the evidence.

That's a big part of why they've been able to crush so much opposition - forcing Pioneer out of the TV market, turning Sharp into a small player, despite openly stealing their ideas. Samsung staff are so loyal, they'll eat incriminating evidence to protect the company.

They're the evil empire!

[Biddy]

Did you read my response? I agreed that Samsung are annoying and use the courts and patent appeals to their advantage.

I was also saying that this particular case is not actually settled as both sides are yet again expected to appeal. So both sides are dragging it out.

Also, all "for profit" organisations are evil in some capacity. Apple hit the news a lot a couple of years ago due to the Foxconn plants in China (where the iphone is made) having appaling working conditions. Only after hitting the news about people jumping from the buildings did Apple investigate. Looks like they are turning that around now. http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/apple-s-chinese-factories-improved-working-conditions-1.2461718. Obviously it's not just Apple, they are all as bad as each other.

[M-K]

There's "a bit annoying" and there's having a corporate ethos based on theiving ideas and gaming the legal system. Very different, I think. 10,000 people fired when Pioneer's TV arm collapsed.

Anyway, I know I'm never going to convince you that Apple are in the right this time.

[Biddy]

It's not that which I am arguing. Samsung are wrong, they copied many elements which is why they keep losing in courts. My stance to highlight that it's not all black and white. Apple are not the god like company that many make out. In this world of profit and shareholders everyone is out to simply make money. There is no greater good.

It is interesting however that Apple normally win in their back yard (the US) when they only have a 50-50 record in the rest of the world. For example the time they had to publicly apologise to Samsung on the UK Apple Website and in trade publications. The US wins remind me of the story Alan Sugar tells in his autobiography about when he tried to sue Western Digital over faulty hard drives that they sold to Amstrad which then failed in the CPC's which ultimately crippled the Amstrad line. The evidence was overwhelming that WD knew the drives were faulty but the US courts stuck up for the local business.

[CapeTownRover]

There's "a bit annoying" and there's having a corporate ethos based on theiving ideas and gaming the legal system. Very different, I think. 10,000 people fired when Pioneer's TV arm collapsed.

Anyway, I know I'm never going to convince you that Apple are in the right this time.

Not trying to be funny here, but Google have not said much on certain aspects of ios 6 and 7, which was very much part of the Android ecosystem. 1 the pulldown notification system as an example. The fact that they are suing Samsung alone, despite the likes of LG, HTC etc and pretty much every chinese branded handset having pretty much the same or similar to samsung. Make of that what you will.

[Stuart]

Some good posts there M-K.

Tough audience though.

[CapeTownRover]

Lets be honest here Stu lol, Im not much of an iOS fan, but i think the success of Apple has been phenomenal. The design and build quality is one of if not the best. In saying that, why are Apple suing only Samsung? There are Htc, Sony, LG, The Chinese brands who use the same Android software as Samsung. Only difference is, that they all use a different skin on top of the OS. Sammy uses touchwhizz, Htc has Sense , Sony has Timescape, Motoroloa has Motoblur etc etc. its clear that due to the sales from Samsung compared to the rest of the Android using manufactureres, that Apple knew exactly where they could get the most money. But anyway Stuart my friend, you have a great day and i hope you win the lottery

[M-K]

I think Apple inspires stronger emotions in more people than probably any other company. On one hand you've got creepy weirdos holding candlelight vigils for Steve Jobs, and on the other there are people who prefer to ignore the wider issue and instead pick over Apple's failings. Apple infringed some patents (but not wilfully and systematically); Apple uses Foxconn (incidentally, everyone uses Foxconn - it's the third largest tech company in the world, despite not producing anything under its own brand. It employs 1.2 million people.)

In this particular case, Samsung engineers came up with a list of 120+ points where the iPhone was better than their own product, and set about adopting as many of them as they could - everything from the size and shape of the phone to the look of the icons. They were warned by Google that their phone was infringing a lot of Apple property - i.e. it was a blatant clone - but they released it anyway, knowing that by the time they had to answer for their thieving ways in court, they'd have already got a massive headstart over all the other companies who didn't just rip off the iPhone lock stock and barrel.

They've done it before in other markets and they've succeeded again, leapfrogging the likes of Sony, Nokia and Motorola. All off the back of stolen property. Surely that makes them the bad guys, and Apple are only standing up for what's right.

[CapeTownRover]

Fair enough MK, but why only go after Samsung? The way i see it, HTC, LG, etc have all done exactly what Samsung are doing. The fact that Apple has gone in all guns blazing against Samsung, meant the others slipped under the radar, as i said before, its where Apple could get more money from.

If Apple could patent round edges, then im sure the rest of the manufacturers could patent larger screen size, water and dust resistent features etc etc. for me things like that are stupid anyway, and i dont believe that anybody should be allowed to patent an edge or a curve

[Biddy]

But Apple have gone after pretty much all the major players and likewise others have fought back. This is a pretty good diagram on it (there are plenty of others out there)

This wiki details a lot too http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smartphone_patent_wars

So it's not just Apple vs Samsung. Apple are quite rightly going primarily after the company that is causing the biggest dent to its own profits.

Your comment about patenting a rectangular device with rounded corners is just one example where the patent system is completely broken. I think that's the exact one that Apple lost on in the UK courts.