[Archived] The Gary Bowyer Thread

[imy9]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:13, RevidgeBlue said:

Are you not counting some players who have initially gone out on loan then been sold or paid off at a later date twice?

Also if you're counting the ten that have gone out this summer, that's not really relevant as the season hasn't started yet and we're only really judging Bowyer on results over the past two seasons.

So as far as I can see it's roughly 33 in and 34 out so as far as I can see so imo he's been given completely free reign by the owners within the constraints of our budget yet we're hurtling backwards on the pitch under his stewardship at a rate of knots.

The permanent ins and outs are a fair reflection of the overall squad as that is what we are left with. Minus 14 players over 2 seasons is a lot of players. Look at the wages gone during that time too. Wouldn't be an exaggeration to say 20 million a season gone. Working with a negative budget with transfers and wages the squad overall looks decent as long as we don't lose any more players.

Jal- brown is on less than 10k a week so what 500k for last season and varney probably the same but he spent large chunks elsewhere so less than a million for both? Now how about the 3 million and 7.8 million profit GB has made om two players in 18 months?

[JAL]

So what was Varney on if you know what Brown was on which I seriously doubt you know Imy9 and how much did the club lose in wages, buyer fees, league placings etc., and continue to lose as is in the case of Chris Brown.

Let's not forget Varneys January replacement Taylor who cost money and did nothing either - another amount of cash thrown away.

How much more digging do we need to do to completely dismiss your notion.

[RevidgeBlue]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:53, imy9 said:

The permanent ins and outs are a fair reflection of the overall squad as that is what we are left with. Minus 14 players over 2 seasons is a lot of players. Look at the wages gone during that time too. Wouldn't be an exaggeration to say 20 million a season gone. Working with a negative budget with transfers and wages the squad overall looks decent as long as we don't lose any more players.

Jal- brown is on less than 10k a week so what 500k for last season and varney probably the same but he spent large chunks elsewhere so less than a million for both? Now how about the 3 million and 7.8 million profit GB has made om two players in 18 months?

It depends on whether those players are central to the first team squad, on the edges of selection or mere squad fillers. If you've a squad of 40, losing some players who never figure isn't going to make a great deal of difference.

Prior to this summer GB hasn't had to lose anyone of any significance. The fact we're doing so now is as much down to his own shortcomings as being under an embargo imo.

[tomphil]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:53, imy9 said:

The permanent ins and outs are a fair reflection of the overall squad as that is what we are left with. Minus 14 players over 2 seasons is a lot of players. Look at the wages gone during that time too. Wouldn't be an exaggeration to say 20 million a season gone. Working with a negative budget with transfers and wages the squad overall looks decent as long as we don't lose any more players.

Jal- brown is on less than 10k a week so what 500k for last season and varney probably the same but he spent large chunks elsewhere so less than a million for both? Now how about the 3 million and 7.8 million profit GB has made om two players in 18 months?

He did well bringing those two in but in the main he / we just gave them a platform for regular games and there is an element of luck in it as well. Tom Cairney looked anything but a 3 mill player last season so I don't know how that deal got set up but someone has played a blinder.

As in Rudys case no one expected him to do ever so well so it wasn't a masterstroke just a bit of a gamble that paid off. Surely the player himself has to take the lions share of the credit for taking the chance Bowyer gave him. I didn't see Gaz run on the pitch and give Rudy a leg up to get to all those headers did you Rudy also owes Craig Conway abloody good drink out of his signing on fee.

[imy9]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:59, JAL said:

So what was Varney on if you know what Brown was on which I seriously doubt you know Imy9 and how much did the club lose in wages, buyer fees, league placings etc., and continue to lose as is in the case of Chris Brown.

Let's not forget Varneys January replacement Taylor who cost money and did nothing either - another amount of cash thrown away.

How much more digging do we need to do to completely dismiss your notion.

http://m.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/doncaster-rovers/doncaster-rovers-blackburn-boss-bowyer-hits-out-at-ryan-1-6694285

I said 10k a week, this suggests a lot less. Odd comment about Brown. Considering he hardly played how did he cost us league places? Now if you had said Duffy had cost us league places then that theory has some legs. Now based on that how much do you reckon Varney was on, a championship striker signed on a free on a one year deal?

Also how does a winger become a replacement for a striker?

[blueboy3333]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:59, JAL said:

So what was Varney on if you know what Brown was on which I seriously doubt you know Imy9 and how much did the club lose in wages, buyer fees, league placings etc., and continue to lose as is in the case of Chris Brown.

Let's not forget Varneys January replacement Taylor who cost money and did nothing either - another amount of cash thrown away.

How much more digging do we need to do to completely dismiss your notion.

Taylor cost nothing and turned up at the end of March. You really must do a lot lot better if you're going to dismiss someone else's post in such an arrogant fashion.

Any more news on the scouse agent you keep making stuff up about mentioning?

[LewisF]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:18, Jbizzle said:

Going from 7th to 8th was it?

8th to 9th

[JBiz]

  On 31/07/2015 at 15:59, LewisF said:

8th to 9th

Hurtling backwards at a rate of knots!

[scotchrover]

I have to say, have just looked through last season's squad, it beggars belief how we weren't near the play-offs with what we had. We had a lethal strike force (even under Bowyer), several midfielders who'd been promoted previously (Cairney, Evans, Marshall and Conway), as well as the former England number one. Take out Hanley, our defence wasn't too bad either, with one even being called up to a good Wales squad, and another recently signing for play-off finalists Boro. If this doesn't show that Bowyer's not up to the job, I don't know what will.

[tomphil]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:04, Jbizzle said:

Hurtling backwards at a rate of knots!

Ten points behind 8th place this time though...........

[Amo]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:04, Jbizzle said:

Hurtling backwards at a rate of knots!

From 2pts off the playoffs to 11pts is a serious regression.

[ABBEY]

Awwwwe don't burst the stability and bowyer bubble

[imy9]

  On 31/07/2015 at 14:59, RevidgeBlue said:

It depends on whether those players are central to the first team squad, on the edges of selection or mere squad fillers. If you've a squad of 40, losing some players who never figure isn't going to make a great deal of difference.

Prior to this summer GB hasn't had to lose anyone of any significance. The fact we're doing so now is as much down to his own shortcomings as being under an embargo imo.

The season we were relegated we spent about 12 million in transfer fees. Since then Bowyer has spent a million plus on ONE player. If he had the choice would he have bought those players or better players? We have had to cut costs too to our wage bill. Bowyer didn't sign the players but they have meant he has been severely restricted as to what he can bring in.

He still should have done better but he has done a good job.

Tomphil- two players bought 18 months ago are sold for 3 million and 7.8 million profit. Bowyer deserves the credit for this. Gestede was a poor man's Best according to Kamy when he signed lol. Cairney has improved as a player too under Bowyer. If he gets slated for the Brown's and Varneys of this world then he should get credit for the Cairneys and gestedes.

[tomphil]

Of course he deserves some credit and I've given it to him all I'm saying is there are more elements to it including the lads themselves. Pity he can't do it again by spending a few hundred grand. Also there are no big bids coming in for Hanley, Olsson, Evans or Marshall so let's not get carried away. Rudy was a bit of a one off all he really needed was a chance in a team were he was the main man.

[roverandout]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:29, imy9 said:

The season we were relegated we spent about 12 million in transfer fees. Since then Bowyer has spent a million plus on ONE player. If he had the choice would he have bought those players or better players? We have had to cut costs too to our wage bill. Bowyer didn't sign the players but they have meant he has been severely restricted as to what he can bring in.

He still should have done better but he has done a good job.

Tomphil- two players bought 18 months ago are sold for 3 million and 7.8 million profit. Bowyer deserves the credit for this. Gestede was a poor man's Best according to Kamy when he signed lol. Cairney has improved as a player too under Bowyer. If he gets slated for the Brown's and Varneys of this world then he should get credit for the Cairneys and gestedes.

Credit for making a profit? And how does that help rovers cause exactly? We were a premiership club a few years ago and now we are a feeder club, well done bowyer, clever boy. He's still brought in a shed load of players no matter their cost. Mick McCarthy got Ipswich into the play-offs on a tuppence with only one regular scorer.

[imy9]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:38, roverandout said:

Credit for making a profit? And how does that help rovers cause exactly? We were a premiership club a few years ago and now we are a feeder club, well done bowyer, clever boy. He's still brought in a shed load of players no matter their cost. Mick McCarthy got Ipswich into the play-offs on a tuppence with only one regular scorer.

Credit for getting us players that are actually worth more than what we have paid. Which in turn has meant that we are closer to getting out of the embargo?

McCarthy is still in the same league as us. Good manager and has spent little but working at a stable club which is run like a club.

Second part of that is Venky's fault not Bowyer. He seems to have the interests of the club at heart and saved us from relegation, for which I will always be grateful.

[Husky]

Is he still here? @#/?!

Can someone send me a text alert when he's finally gone.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:29, imy9 said:

The season we were relegated we spent about 12 million in transfer fees. Since then Bowyer has spent a million plus on ONE player. If he had the choice would he have bought those players or better players? We have had to cut costs too to our wage bill. Bowyer didn't sign the players but they have meant he has been severely restricted as to what he can bring in.

He still should have done better but he has done a good job.

Tomphil- two players bought 18 months ago are sold for 3 million and 7.8 million profit. Bowyer deserves the credit for this. Gestede was a poor man's Best according to Kamy when he signed lol. Cairney has improved as a player too under Bowyer. If he gets slated for the Brown's and Varneys of this world then he should get credit for the Cairneys and gestedes.

Allardyce didn't sign Ince's players but he immediately produced top half form with them anyway in 2008/09. He got performances out of the ones he could (Robinson, Simpson, Andrews) and ditched the ones he couldn't (Fowler, Grella, Villanueva). I don't remember anyone using the "not his players" excuse for any defeats we had back then.

Yeah we've had to cut costs to the wage bill, but during Bowyer's time here its still been a very big wage bill by Championship standards, and a squad containing very sought after players. What would any other side around us have done with the strike force we had? Probably achieved automatic promotion. And I'd say there's plenty of managers in the division who could have made Hanley one of the best centre halves and King one of the best centre forwards in it as well.

[Athlete]

  On 31/07/2015 at 11:53, chris_h said:

Instead of having a dig at people why don't you.......................................

........well you know the rest.

Oh hello he here is from under his stone.

The person from down under who antagonises people who actually go the games..

Didgeridoo.. You know the rest

[Gav]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:38, roverandout said:

Credit for making a profit? And how does that help rovers cause exactly? We were a premiership club a few years ago and now we are a feeder club, well done bowyer, clever boy. He's still brought in a shed load of players no matter their cost. Mick McCarthy got Ipswich into the play-offs on a tuppence with only one regular scorer.

Ipswich are in the same division as us, playoffs or no playoffs.

Derby spent millions and in the same division as us.

Bowyer spent nowt and we finished mid table, he's no world beater but he's not as bad as some make out.

Your anger should be aimed at the owners, they're the problem, be part of the cure!

Venkys out.

[roverandout]

My anger is aimed at venkys mainly but also venkys stooge

[Gav]

  On 31/07/2015 at 17:06, roverandout said:

My anger is aimed at venkys mainly but also venkys stooge

So by that definition anyone appointed manager under Venkys would be a Venky stooge?

Let's just get the ****s out, the manager is a side show.

[martonrover]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:53, imy9 said:

Credit for getting us players that are actually worth more than what we have paid. Which in turn has meant that we are closer to getting out of the embargo?

McCarthy is still in the same league as us. Good manager and has spent little but working at a stable club which is run like a club.

Second part of that is Venky's fault not Bowyer. He seems to have the interests of the club at heart and saved us from relegation, for which I will always be grateful.

Agreed, Bowyer did well initially to keep us up but the fact he's been given more power than the MD has been one of the main problems.

Brought in a good number of players, (Mick McCarthy would be envious), but been unable to produce a settled team or formation.

His scattergun recruitment policy is part of the reason we're now in a mess. Simply no strategy or vision.

[roverandout]

No, any real manager wouldn't be blowing their trumpet every five minutes which is why we will never get a real manager I suppose

[imy9]

  On 31/07/2015 at 16:57, Steve Kean said:

Allardyce didn't sign Ince's players but he immediately produced top half form with them anyway in 2008/09. He got performances out of the ones he could (Robinson, Simpson, Andrews) and ditched the ones he couldn't (Fowler, Grella, Villanueva). I don't remember anyone using the "not his players" excuse for any defeats we had back then.

Yeah we've had to cut costs to the wage bill, but during Bowyer's time here its still been a very big wage bill by Championship standards, and a squad containing very sought after players. What would any other side around us have done with the strike force we had? Probably achieved automatic promotion. And I'd say there's plenty of managers in the division who could have made Hanley one of the best centre halves and King one of the best centre forwards in it as well.

Big Sam is a top class manager though. With decades of experience. Bowyer has only been a manager for 3 years.

We also had John Williams the best Chairman in the league. It makes a huge difference. We have Shaw now...dare we continue with this conversation.

As I said he has plenty of faults but I would put money on him having a successful career as a manager after he leaves us. To clarify working with a champion ship club with a low budget. Can't see him getting a club up to the Pl.