[Archived] Bowyer

[T.J.Newton]

As naïve as it may sound I believe Jack Walker would have sold(or even given the club away) to somebody that he knew had the clubs best interests at heart and he could trust to run the club properly If he felt he couldn't afford to run it himself anymore, I don't think he would ever have sold to the likes of venkys(regardless of how much they where offering)

[ABBEY]

I think you'll find my opinion is shared by most on here.

dont quote him!! its sweet ignoring him...but is that not what me n thee have been banned for ? personal attack.?

[yoda]

As naïve as it may sound I believe Jack Walker would have sold(or even given the club away) to somebody that he knew had the clubs best interests at heart and he could trust to run the club properly If he felt he couldn't afford to run it himself anymore, I don't think he would ever have sold to the likes of venkys(regardless of how much they where offering)

Is that not what he did ie the Walker trust

[Rover_Shaun]

Personally I am prepared to give him more time - unlike our near neighbours we have yet to have a settled squad. Indeed every time we seem to be getting a run together one of our best performing players seem to get injured.

For those comparing this seasons points total to lasts - need to remember one very important thing - we only finished on the points we did because of the excellent start under Kean - so you are basically bigging up Kean Truth of the matter - we had an unbelievable start to the season where we played awful and yet got results - this season we have had a far more consistent level of performance throughout the season - unfortunately with occasional one/two match dips in performance (many of which have coincided with injuries to key players).

You could do Alan Myers job with posts like that.

We will continue to flatline under Boreyer

[Butty]

But we've had chance after chance of getting into real contention for the play offs this season and then failed to turn up.

Why?

That is why I think we'll miss out. Is it due to Bowyer though? Possibly. But we have such a young team and I think he is the man to get the best out of them at the moment, any talk of getting rid is ridiculous.

[yoda]

That is why I think we'll miss out. Is it due to Bowyer though? Possibly. But we have such a young team and I think he is the man to get the best out of them at the moment, any talk of getting rid is ridiculous.

It wouldn't be ridiculous if some one like Souness trapped up

[Rover_Shaun]

I feel he is getting all he can out of them. Is it a problem with him or the players?

[thenodrog]

dont quote him!! its sweet ignoring him...but is that not what me n thee have been banned for ? personal attack.?

Bans down to personal attacks by certain power crazed newbies more like.

[ABBEY]

oh aye i forgot ha

[47er]

Is that not what he did ie the Walker trust

He had died remember. I think he thought he'd got sufficient protection in there but he hadn't.

Maybe he just trusted his family and closest advisers to do the right thing?

[yoda]

He had died remember. I think he thought he'd got sufficient protection in there but he hadn't.

Maybe he just trusted his family and closest advisers to do the right thing?

You are probably correct, the right thing probably got its description changed after he had gone

[Stuart]

You are probably correct, the right thing probably got its description changed after he had gone

Tbf I think description got changed when the money required to compete got too stupid, and the gates became dwarfed by TV money.

Relegation could have meant them suffering the kinds of losses Venkys (supposedly) have.

People forget that we were on the slide before Venkys came in. It must have been too big a gamble for the Walkers to take.

They were probably right.

[47er]

Tbf I think description got changed when the money required to compete got too stupid, and the gates became dwarfed by TV money.

Relegation could have meant them suffering the kinds of losses Venkys (supposedly) have.

People forget that we were on the slide before Venkys came in. It must have been too big a gamble for the Walkers to take.

They were probably right.

From purely their own point of view.

[Stuart]

Obviously.

[thenodrog]

From purely their own point of view.

It is their money remember.

[West Yorks Rover]

Tbf I think description got changed when the money required to compete got too stupid, and the gates became dwarfed by TV money.

Relegation could have meant them suffering the kinds of losses Venkys (supposedly) have.

People forget that we were on the slide before Venkys came in. It must have been too big a gamble for the Walkers to take.

They were probably right.

Well we finished a healthy 10th the last full season before they came in, with a reasonable overall debt of £18-20m,

which would have been fixed with the sale of Phil Jones to Man U which was always going to happen, a couple more

seasons and even more TV money announced(40% inc).

We may have been ok for quite a few more years with BS and the same board you know !

[Adam C]

At the start of the season a lot of people expected us to be mid-table and being optimistic sneaking into the play-offs. We are very much at that level now, I think Bowyer has gone the right way about it with the players he's brought in, the majority being young British players and we have also managed to shift a lot of the Portuguese and other deadwood. I knew as soon as I saw the team on Saturday we were going to struggle and so we did. Although I wasn't expecting such a drubbing. Yes, at times his tactics and substitutions can be questioned but there have been times he's got it right. If we can finish in the top 10 this season it will be a solid foundation to build on and in my opinion if we got rid of further deadwood in the summer and strengthened as we have done this season it would bode extremely well for us. BUT that is all down too whether it is truely a case of promotion or bust for us and if that is the case we are in serious trouble no doubt about it. I have faith in Bowyer to get the best out of the players for the rest of this season and I feel if we don't go up this season which is unlikely he can take it to the next step next season IF the club is in a fit state too. I really don't think he's doing a bad job.

Butty that is the most sensible perspective on this season's performances that I have read. I was going to post pretty much the exact same until I read it.

I would just add that not many people currently giving off about Bowyer's selections etc can remember what it was like under Kean and then Appleton. How many of the people complaining that we are not going to go up this season can remember stating that all they wanted was stability?

Bowyer is getting his team together, he has not even had one full season at the helm yet and I think he deserves until a few games into next season to show that he can take us up. I just worry that the result of the derby may be poor and the board could react to this (plus the inevitable vitriolic outbursts) with a knee-jerk decision that will harm the club long term.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

I just worry that the result of the derby may be poor and the board could react to this (plus the inevitable vitriolic outbursts) with a knee-jerk decision that will harm the club long term.

Given current form - Burnley will go into the game as clear favourites. IF we get beat - it will be the manner of the defeat that will be as important as getting beat itself. Burnley work extremely hard as a team - the least I expect is that we match that work rate.

[Adam C]

Given current form - Burnley will go into the game as clear favourites. IF we get beat - it will be the manner of the defeat that will be as important as getting beat itself. Burnley work extremely hard as a team - the least I expect is that we match that work rate.

True enough DMTP. If the players are not motivated for this one then there is something seriously wrong right enough.

[den]

How do you know what conditions were attached to the will den?

I must say the decision to provide a legacy of financial safety for generations of direct family v chucking good money after bad in the direction of the likes of Kean, fat controller, Murphy, Agnew, Best and numerous anonymous Carlos Kickaballs simply isn't a difficult decision is it? Jack might as you say want BRFC to dine at the top table but surely not at the expense of his descendants. Football never made much financial sense in my lifetime but now it is just ludicrous. Rem to put it into context we paid Alan Shearer a quarter of the money that we are (still) paying each one of Murphy, Best and Etohu! And unless I am mistaken ST's cost less than they did back then.

Not rocket science is it?

"If you can't stand the heat in the kitchen... get out'. They did. Move on.

I understand you thinking that throwing money at Rovers was a bad idea Gord. 100% understand that. However Jack left his wishes in the hands of the trustees. It wasn't the trustees money, it wasn't the families money, it was Jack Walkers money. If he'd have wanted only the family to benefit from his legacy, then he wouldn't have included the football club in there, - but he did, He said he did and Paul Egerton Vernon said he did. I'm sure the rest of the Walker family have been looked after as well haven't they? In 2000 when Walker died PE Vernon stated the club was a beneficiary of Walkers trust fund for the foreseeable future (or words to that effect, can't be bothered to check the exact wording). Within 7 years or so, they had withdrawn funding completely and by 2010 they had sold Walkers legacy to Mrs D and her co-horts. A bunch of Indian chicken farmers who didn't have the slightest inkling of what Blackburn Rovers or English professional football was about.

I'm not going to go through all this again as we've done it before. My initial comment was that if we were looking for conspiracy stories, for me that's the biggest one. Jack Walker put the well being of a club he'd put possibly a hundred million pounds of his own money into, into the hands of his trustees and that's what happened. Now if you want to believe that was really what he would have wanted, I can't go along with that one little bit.

[Al]

I am still thinking that the most logical time is this season, when someone thinks the ten points won't relegate us? ..but my holiday is going to be in an institution!

Maybe I see it wrongly but what is the point of going into administration from the Venkys point of view when nearly all the debt is to them personally? They may as well capitalise it than just write it off.

They were there to carry out JW's wishes, not do as they pleased with his legacy.

Precisely and they knew damned well that this is the last thing that Jack would have wanted. He would have been furious at what they did with his legacy.

[den]

Precisely and they knew damned well that this is the last thing that Jack would have wanted. He would have been furious at what they did with his legacy.

Abso-blooming-lutely Al.

[thenodrog]

We may have been ok for quite a few more years with BS and the same board you know !

We would but remember the vociferous Ewood Lemmings had already sharpened their knives for Sam. Lots of booing at that 3-0 home victory yet when he was sacked most polls showed only about 15% wanted him to go. Empty vessels certainly made more noise then didn't they?

[thenodrog]

I understand you thinking that throwing money at Rovers was a bad idea Gord. 100% understand that. However Jack left his wishes in the hands of the trustees. It wasn't the trustees money, it wasn't the families money, it was Jack Walkers money. If he'd have wanted only the family to benefit from his legacy, then he wouldn't have included the football club in there, - but he did, He said he did and Paul Egerton Vernon said he did. I'm sure the rest of the Walker family have been looked after as well haven't they? In 2000 when Walker died PE Vernon stated the club was a beneficiary of Walkers trust fund for the foreseeable future (or words to that effect, can't be bothered to check the exact wording). Within 7 years or so, they had withdrawn funding completely and by 2010 they had sold Walkers legacy to Mrs D and her co-horts. A bunch of Indian chicken farmers who didn't have the slightest inkling of what Blackburn Rovers or English professional football was about.

I'm not going to go through all this again as we've done it before. My initial comment was that if we were looking for conspiracy stories, for me that's the biggest one. Jack Walker put the well being of a club he'd put possibly a hundred million pounds of his own money into, into the hands of his trustees and that's what happened. Now if you want to believe that was really what he would have wanted, I can't go along with that one little bit.

You appear to have forgotten Fred Walker den. It was his money as well and he and his family were not all that interested in football as Jack was.

Lets be totally honest.... we could not have expected to go on forever in the top division given the inflation that has occurred in the Prem. Sooner or later even if Jack had not died he would have had to get out of the madhouse or be dragged down.

Rem Pickering at Derby and Hayward at Wolves? Hall at NUFC, Jordan at Palace? They were reckoned to be backing their club but I never hear of them now. Are they scorned by respective supporters? Prob loads more owners too that have been left behind by the madcap inflation.

The Walker wealth gave us 20 years that we never thought we'd get. Be thankful. It was never ever going to go on forever with a club with the limitations of ours.

[den]

You appear to have forgotten Fred Walker den. It was his money as well and he and his family were not all that interested in football as Jack was.

Lets be totally honest.... we could not have expected to go on forever in the top division given the inflation that has occurred in the Prem. Sooner or later even if Jack had not died he would have had to get out of the madhouse or be dragged down.

Rem Pickering at Derby and Hayward at Wolves? Hall at NUFC, Jordan at Palace? They were reckoned to be backing their club but I never hear of them now. Are they scorned by respective supporters? Prob loads more owners too that have been left behind by the madcap inflation.

The Walker wealth gave us 20 years that we never thought we'd get. Be thankful. It was never ever going to go on forever with a club with the limitations of ours.

Jack couldn't have done anything with Fred's money Gord - and I am thankful for what Jack did as you know. However, we're not talking about Jack's contribution. Do you think Jack would have stopped all funding to the club for three years - AND sold it to Mrs Desai? Of course you don't.

Sorry for diverting the thread.