[Archived] The Daily Mail - Cancer in print,

[T4E]

Do people still buy newspapers? Anyone who pays for the news in this day and age is beyond mental.

If there were no newspapers and someone went on Dragons Den and pitched the idea they'd be rightly laughed out of the place.

[adopted scouser]

Do people still buy newspapers? Anyone who pays for the news in this day and age is beyond mental.

If there were no newspapers and someone went on Dragons Den and pitched the idea they'd be rightly laughed out of the place.

I don't know, many people like the feel of a newspaper, I know my Dad would be lost without the crossword in the Daily Telegraph.

Personally I'm drawn towards the Sun, for world beating puns as headlines, err, and the tits

[T.J.Newton]

Do people still buy newspapers? Anyone who pays for the news in this day and age is beyond mental.

If there were no newspapers and someone went on Dragons Den and pitched the idea they'd be rightly laughed out of the place.

+1

[thenodrog]

I cant be arsed reading about all this guff but the sins of the parents shouldn't be visited on the children. Especially when dirty tricks (if that is what they are) are so unecessary. Milliband wont get in whilst his major policy as a Prime Minister of this nation would be a ridiculously vague attempt to cut fuel bills for two feckin years.

So was old Milliband a raging commie who resented that hand that was feeding him or not? I'm not a betting man but my money would be full on the fact that he was.

[jim mk2]

"Old man" Miliband was a patriot who fought in the second world war but who did not like some of the small-minded people who inhabit these islands (see above).

[Amo]

"Old man" Miliband was a patriot who fought in the second world war but who did not like some of the small-minded people who inhabit these islands (see above).

So that's a 'yes'?

[thenodrog]

"Old man" Miliband was a patriot who fought in the second world war but who did not like some of the small-minded people who inhabit these islands (see above).

Was he really? Well it was the small minded people who inhabited these islands who saved his bloody bacon wasn't it? As well as the bacon of his entire race lest we forget. Have you ever wondered how many Jews would be around today if Hitler had prevailed? Old 'Ralph' Miliband was just another disgruntled academic with a massive chip on both shoulders and unbelievable ingratitude if you ask me.

btw there were about 30 million other patriots conscripted by the Red Army to fight the "Patriotic War" against Hitler. They were all commies too.

[jim mk2]

He fought for his country - apart from keeping toilet manufacturers in business what have you ever done ?

[Sparky Marky]

"Old man" Miliband was a patriot who fought in the second world war but who did not like some of the small-minded people who inhabit these islands (see above).

No he was a communist like you Jim.

[somersetrover]

Was he really? Well it was the small minded people who inhabited these islands who saved his bloody bacon wasn't it? As well as the bacon of his entire race lest we forget. Have you ever wondered how many Jews would be around today if Hitler had prevailed? Old 'Ralph' Miliband was just another disgruntled academic with a massive chip on both shoulders and unbelievable ingratitude if you ask me.

btw there were about 30 million other patriots conscripted by the Red Army to fight the "Patriotic War" against Hitler. They were all commies too.

Don't forget that it was Stalin and his red army or 'commies' as you so eloquently called them that won the second world war not Britain or America, if Stalin hadn't of industrialised the Soviet Union, Germany would have won the war that you can be certain of and also remember that 9 out of 10 German soldiers died at the hands of the Red Army. Also Stalin and the Soviets were trying to defeat Fascism as far back as 1936, whilst the British (except for a 305 great men who were part of the International Brigades) stood by and did nothing.

As for your question about the Jews well very few Jews would be around today if Hitler had won and there would be none practicing in Europe. Again never forget that it was the Red Army that liberated more concentration camps than any other army, including of course Auschwitz. If it wasn't for the Stalin and his Red Army millions more Jews would have died than the 6 Million that did.

No he was a communist like you Jim.

He wasn't a communist he was a Trotskyite Revisionist, like all of his mates in the 'New Left' as they called themselves.

[perthblue02]

Ed Miliband received 10,000 emails of support after the vindictive Mail attack on his father according to the Beeb.

So he's the Steve Kean of the political world?

[Audax]

Let's not forget all of the people of Ukraine and other places that suffered under Stalin, the Bolsheviks, the deal between Hitler and Stalin, etc.

The term Holodomor refers specifically to the brutal artificial famine imposed by Stalin's regime on Soviet Ukraine and primarily ethnically Ukrainian areas in the Northern Caucasus in 1932-33.

http://holodomorct.org/history.html

Scholars disagree on the relative importance of natural factors and bad economic policies as causes of the famine and the degree to which the destruction of the Ukrainian peasantry was premeditated on the part of Joseph Stalin.^{[7][12][13][14]} Some scholars and politicians using the word Holodomor emphasize the man-made aspects of the famine, arguing that it was genocide; some consider the resultant loss of life comparable to the Holocaust.^[15] They argue that the Soviet policies were an attack on the rise of Ukrainian nationalism and therefore fall under the legal definition of genocide.^{[16][17][18][19][20]} Other scholars argue that the Holodomor was a consequence of the economic problems associated with radical economic changes implemented during the period of liquidation of private property and Soviet industrialization.^{[17][18][21][22]}

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor

[meerkat]

Marxism is not stalinism.

[meerkat]

Appreciation: Ralph Miliband
by Tony Benn
26 May 1994

The death of Ralph Miliband (obituary, 23 May) has deprived socialists everywhere of one of the greatest thinkers of his generation, and has stolen him from those who had the privilege of his friendship.

Ralph was a veritable giant of a man who had an almost unique capacity to understand - and explain - the world in which we live, and to open up a credible vision of what might be achieved if we set our minds to it, free from any sectarian pre-conceptions. Unlike some academics who keep themselves aloof from the daily business of politics, Ralph was always interested and wanted to be involved, once attending a tiny little seminar on the future of socialism which the Bristol South-East Labour Party had organised to encourage discussion.

I had first met him many years ago and attended the inaugural meeting of the Socialist Society in the early eighties, in which he was deeply interested. But our closest association dates from the time when he offered to bring together a small group of socialists to help me in the campaigns in which I was involved in the eighties.

We called it the Independent Left Corresponding Society and it met regularly; it was at one of those meetings that the idea of convening the Chesterfield Socialist conferences was first mooted. At those conferences, Ralph was always listened to with intense interest and respect, as later when the Socialist Movement emerged from the same beginning.

It is a great tragedy that in recent years there has been a virtual black-out - or vilification of - socialist writing and writers, for the books and articles produced by Ralph Miliband will, in retrospect, be seen to have illuminated contemporary politics in a way that few other commentators can rival. Happily he had completed his last book, Socialism In A Sceptical Age, sent it to the publishers before his death and spoke of it, with characteristic modesty, at his 70th birthday party held at his home earlier this year.

Ralph and Marion, and their sons David and Edward, were a very close family with a great capacity for making friends and we shall all be mourning, with them, the death of this lovely man.

[Paul]

Was he really? Well it was the small minded people who inhabited these islands who saved his bloody bacon wasn't it? As well as the bacon of his entire race lest we forget. Have you ever wondered how many Jews would be around today if Hitler had prevailed? Old 'Ralph' Miliband was just another disgruntled academic with a massive chip on both shoulders and unbelievable ingratitude if you ask me.

btw there were about 30 million other patriots conscripted by the Red Army to fight the "Patriotic War" against Hitler. They were all commies too.

Out of interest if you "can't be arsed with all this guff" how is it you feel sufficiently informed to comment in such a manner on a man you probably didn't now existed till this week?

Myself I've no knowledge of RM but I can see the Daily Mail has behaved in an appalling manner. We don't need a character assassination of his father to help us judge his son.

[Paul]

One thing which I had forgotten from my childhood was my parents' attitude towards the Daily Mail. Both were middle class, Conservative voting, patriotic, had no issue with Thatcher, etc.

However now its been mentioned I recall the Daily Mail was not permitted in our house and was reviled as a newspaper because of its support for Moseley. This would have been 30 or more years on from that support. My mother, who was the one against the paper, would have been 6 at the time of the Moseley campaign.

[meerkat]

According to Louis P. Lochner, Tycoons and Tyrant: German Industry from Hitler to Adenauer (1954) Rothermere provided funds to Hitler via Ernst Hanfstaengel.

Lord Rothermere disposed of his shares in the Daily Mirror in 1931. He now concentrated on the Evening News and The Daily Mail. In the 1930s Rothermere moved further to the right. When Hitler became Chancellor on 30th January 1933, Rothermere produced a series of articles acclaiming the new regime. The most famous of these was on the 10th July when he told readers that he "confidently expected" great things of the Nazi regime. He also criticised other newspapers for "its obsession with Nazi violence and racialism", and assured his readers that any such deeds would be "submerged by the immense benefits that the new regime is already bestowing on Germany."

Rothermere now began a campaign in favour of the Nazi Party. The Daily Mail criticized "the old women of both sexes" who filled British newspapers with rabid reports of Nazi "excesses." Instead, the newspaper claimed, Hitler had saved Germany from "Israelites of international attachments" and the "minor misdeeds of individual Nazis will be submerged by the immense benefits that the new regime is already bestowing upon Germany."

So we have a Lord Rothermere Chairman of Associated Newspapers (and controlling shareholder) who is ranked 51st in the Sunday Times Rich List 2006 with an estimated wealth of £1.02 billion, despite this he pays NO TAX IN THE U/K. a Friend of the Tory Party and David Cameron.

This poses the question, why is one man allowed so much power in a democracy, which is now blown to pieces by the fact that The Snowden files show surveillance and the above makes our so-called democracy a myth, a False Belief.

A former member of Margaret Thatcher's cabinet has accused the Daily Mail of "telling lies" about Ralph Miliband after the newspaper claimed that the Marxist writings of the late father of the Labour party leader meant that he hated Britain.

In the biggest blow yet to the Mail editor, Paul Dacre, who has launched a strong defence of his paper's decision to claim that Ralph Miliband had left an "evil legacy", Lord Moore of Lower Marsh said his former tutor was a good man who never had a bad word to say about Britain.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/oct/02/thatcher-ally-daily-mail-ralph-miliband-lies?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

[Blue n White Rover]

I don't know, many people like the feel of a newspaper, I know my Dad would be lost without the crossword in the Daily Telegraph.

Personally I'm drawn towards the Sun, for world beating puns as headlines, err, and the tits

How a person with the name 'scouser' in his name buys The Sun is beyond. A paper I wouldn't wipe my own @#/? with.

[Stuart]

Do people still buy newspapers? Anyone who pays for the news in this day and age is beyond mental.

If there were no newspapers and someone went on Dragons Den and pitched the idea they'd be rightly laughed out of the place.

Lol. Those people you sneer at are the ones ensuring that you can read it for free. Either through newspaper purchase or tv/online subscription.

You're welcome.

P.S. Presumably you hate stamps too?

Meerkat: you'll need to avoid Hugo Boss products and Ford vehicles too!

[adopted scouser]

You haven't read many of his posts in this section of the forum, then?

:D It's just a username (that you should never change).

15 years on Merseyside has gifted me with many, many good friends, and I understand the Sun thingy but as I used to say 'loathe everything provided by Murdoch but you've all got Sky Sports'.

Wind your neck in Gladys

[Amo]

Don't forget that it was Stalin and his red army or 'commies' as you so eloquently called them that won the second world war not Britain or America, if Stalin hadn't of industrialised the Soviet Union, Germany would have won the war that you can be certain of and also remember that 9 out of 10 German soldiers died at the hands of the Red Army. Also Stalin and the Soviets were trying to defeat Fascism as far back as 1936, whilst the British (except for a 305 great men who were part of the International Brigades) stood by and did nothing.

As for your question about the Jews well very few Jews would be around today if Hitler had won and there would be none practicing in Europe. Again never forget that it was the Red Army that liberated more concentration camps than any other army, including of course Auschwitz. If it wasn't for the Stalin and his Red Army millions more Jews would have died than the 6 Million that did.

Stalin was a far greater evil than Hitler.

People always seem to go on about the Nazi concentration camps without even considering the horror of the gulags, not to mention the Holodomor - a man-made starvation of the Ukrainian people that wiped out millions of innocent men, women and children. Your history lessons will keep quiet about that one, though. Can't imagine why...

[T4E]

Lol. Those people you sneer at are the ones ensuring that you can read it for free. Either through newspaper purchase or tv/online subscription.

You're welcome.

P.S. Presumably you hate stamps too?

Meerkat: you'll need to avoid Hugo Boss products and Ford vehicles too!

Don't be ridiculous. The internet is full of free news/information/opinion that has nothing to do with organised print publication. If every newspaper in this land ceased to exist it would only mean the countless informed and unpaid people that fill the internet with information would be more revered. The idea that I would walk to a shop and part with money to find out what I could find out by picking up my phone is ludicrous. Infact, not only can I find out the same information on my phone, I can then use a search engine to find countless other takes and opinions on the same story instead of just getting one side of it.

And yes, you're right, I do dislike stamps. I run my own business and a family of 4 children and haven't bought a stamp in about 10 years. Totally inefficient way to move information around.

Btw - this thread must set a new record for evidence of the existence of Godwin's Law. First post in fact

[Mike E]

Btw - this thread must set a new record for evidence of the existence of Godwin's Law. First post in fact

I go on a wrestling forum where a thread's first post was 'Nazis; discuss'

[somersetrover]

Stalin was a far greater evil than Hitler.

People always seem to go on about the Nazi concentration camps without even considering the horror of the gulags, not to mention the Holodomor - a man-made starvation of the Ukrainian people that wiped out millions of innocent men, women and children. Your history lessons will keep quiet about that one, though. Can't imagine why...

The famine of 1933 was caused by a combination of poor climatic conditions and sabotage on the part of the Kulaks in the face of the collectivisation of agriculture. Of course it was a travesty that these people died but Stalin and the Soviet Government were not responsible for it that was the Kulaks. It is imperialist propaganda that says Stalin deliberately caused this and the numbers that died are also hugely exaggerated. As for these “Gulags” I will assume that you mean the Labour Camps where the serious and dangerous criminals were sent. Deaths in the labour camps were at their peak in 1934 where 5.2% of the prison population died due to the general shortage of resources in society as a whole, in particular the medicines necessary to fight epidemics. This problem was not only in the labour camps is happened throughout society, as well as in the great majority of countries of the world. Once antibiotics had been discovered and after the Second World War, the situation changed dramatically. In fact, the worst years were the war years when the Nazi’s imposed very harsh living conditions on all Soviet citizens. During those 4 years, more than half a million people died in the labour camps which 6was half the total number dying throughout the Stalin years. Also do not forget that in the same period, 26 million people died among those who were free to defeat fascism. In 1950, when conditions in the Soviet Union had improved and antibiotics had been introduced, the number of people dying while in prison fell to 0.3%. But again numbers that died are hugely exaggerated through imperialist propaganda.

Marxism is not stalinism.

There is no such things as Stalinism as Stalin was a Marxist (except in the mad minds of Trotskyites). Stalin put in place both the economic and social policies that Marx wrote about in The Communist Manifesto and Das Kapital.

[meerkat]

Stalinism was Stalins interpretation of Marxism, which we all know was a total disaster.

I repeat that Marxism is not stalinism.