[Archived] Rovers £54.5m in debt.

[Gav]

Houdini never liked Blackburn, he's on record as saying it was the toughest audience he ever faced so we can count him out....

[West Yorks Rover]

There's no possibility of hitting a zero point. Turnover will keep falling faster than costs can be cut. In turn, cutting costs helps to guarantee a decrease in future turnover.

It.'s a tailspin venky's won't get out of since they don't have enough liquidity to provide the cash injection required to pull us out of it.

I think it's inevitable things willl come to a head next summer. If we somehow survive that then we'll have a transfer embargo to labour under as well as lower parachute payments. We'll be putting our youth team out.

It will need a combination of Houdini, red Adair and midas to sort this pretty little mess out

Funny the academy and training centre seems to be the only area they have spent wisely.

[tomphil]

Houdini never liked Blackburn, he's on record as saying it was the toughest audience he ever faced so we can count him out....

Some of our players present and past may well agree with him there

[Roverthechimp]

There's no possibility of hitting a zero point. Turnover will keep falling faster than costs can be cut. In turn, cutting costs helps to guarantee a decrease in future turnover.

It.'s a tailspin venky's won't get out of since they don't have enough liquidity to provide the cash injection required to pull us out of it.

I think it's inevitable things willl come to a head next summer. If we somehow survive that then we'll have a transfer embargo to labour under as well as lower parachute payments. We'll be putting our youth team out.

It will need a combination of Houdini, red Adair and midas to sort this pretty little mess out

I expect our turnover to actually increase for this year - better crowds, better league position (hopefully) and actually having a shirt sponsor. If we can edge towards the playoffs then even a small increase in tv revenue/receipts may appear.

The next two years (without promotion) will naturally see a reduction in turnover as we lose 8m in handouts but we should also have reduced our prem league level wages. Provided we are in the championship with a team that fights, a manager that seems to be "a decent bloke" then i suspect crowds will stabilise around the 12 - 16k level which would stabilise our income until the next "cull" in 3 years time when the final handouts disappear. At that point we will probably see if our youth setup is capable of providing a championship team supplemented by loanees...

[RibbleValleyRover]

If I was Venky's, I'd be looking at option 2. The club's already mired in the red, what's a few more million? With the right investment, we could achieve promotion and all of the debt would be instantly wiped out. They aren't going to find any serious buyers out there who will help recoup their losses, and there's no way asset-stripping our squad will bring home the bacon, and as you already said it will see us relegated. Of course, the problem with 'option 2' is that the reason we're in this state in the first place is because of Venky's "good intentions".

If option 2 is a viable option to Venky's then it would be the best option. Problem is it's going to take a lot more than players to achieve that. I also think a lot of fans wouldn't stomach/tolerate some of the key decisions that would have to be made.

Changes aren't going to happen though, we all know where we are heading.

[Amo]

Problem is it's going to take a lot more than players to achieve that. I also think a lot of fans wouldn't stomach/tolerate some of the key decisions that would have to be made.

I disagree with that first part. We're 4pts off the play-offs, and most of that has been spent without our two most creative players available (Dunn & Rochina). If we could buy another player in that mold, and another striker, we'd have enough firepower to maintain a proper promotion push. However, Venky's idea of being proactive would probably mean sacking Bowyer and putting Judan Ali in charge with Shebby as DOF. We just need them to write the cheques and let Bowyer and what remains of the boardroom to get on with the job.

[RibbleValleyRover]

I disagree with that first part. We're 4pts off the play-offs, and most of that has been spent without our two most creative players available (Dunn & Rochina). If we could buy another player in that mold, and another striker, we'd have enough firepower to maintain a proper promotion push. However, Venky's idea of being proactive would probably mean sacking Bowyer and putting Judan Ali in charge with Shebby as DOF. We just need them to write the cheques and let Bowyer and what remains of the boardroom to get on with the job.

I disagree and I don't think our situation is anywhere near as rosy as some make out. For one we have only beaten 1 team this season that looks like a genuine promotion candidate and that's Watford, most of our wins have come from some of the dross of the division. In some of those losses against some of the better sides in the division Bowyer has been found out tactically, it wasn't just a case of the strength of the playing squads.

If the season is really promotion or bust then there needs to be widespread change (and yes that would include the manager if we have just one final shot at doing this and giving it our best effort) from top to bottom especially in regards to the culture and mentality. This won't happen, Venky's don't have the desire to do so and the fans wouldn't tolerate seeing Bowyer go.

You might think we have a shot at promotion, I don't from what I've seen so far and that scares me considering the financial situation at the club.

[thenodrog]

I am sure globally-renowned companies are falling over themselves to pay through the nose for the naming rights to a 2/3 empty stadium of a mid-table Championship club smack in the middle of one of the most economically deprived and shafted areas of the UK

Can't be sure..... but do I detect a touch of sarcasm there meadows?

[Stuart]

We just needed them to write the cheques and let Bowyer Williams and what remains of the boardroom to get on with the job.

That's more like it. The way you had it was with the horse so far bolted that you can't see it on the horizon.

The suggestion that they should write cheques for Shaw to cash actually makes me want to hurt something.

But you are right, we are 4 points off the play-offs. If we remain so (or better) by 31st December then January will be a very difficult period for us all.

Raise the stakes, or throw their cards in? Or amble on and call it success if there are no buyers at Venkys prices?

[Bucksrover]

Just bought 2 tickets for brighton- another 50 quid in the pot. Call off the bailiffs.

[Amo]

I disagree and I don't think our situation is anywhere near as rosy as some make out. For one we have only beaten 1 team this season that looks like a genuine promotion candidate and that's Watford, most of our wins have come from some of the dross of the division.

Who mentioned rosy? I'm dealing in facts here. As it stands, we're a mid-table side that's in with a shout of the playoffs. There have been several games this season where we've lacked that little bit of quality in the final third. If we can keep ourselves in and around the playoffs and improve the squad in January, then promotion would not be beyond the realm of possibility. Do I expect that to happen? Noooooo-pe!

If the season is really promotion or bust then there needs to be widespread change (and yes that would include the manager if we have just one final shot at doing this and giving it our best effort) from top to bottom especially in regards to the culture and mentality. This won't happen, Venky's don't have the desire to do so and the fans wouldn't tolerate seeing Bowyer go.

You might think we have a shot at promotion, I don't from what I've seen so far.

No argument there. Venky's have had three years to put together a proper board-room structure and a proven manager in charge. If they haven't figured it out by now, they never will. Last season they tried to take a more hands-on approach to footballing matters and we ended up with Shebby Singh and a revolving door of managers. Bowyer landed himself the job by accident, not design, and by that point Venky's were probably fed-up of paying compo. Personally, I feel a lot safer when they don't try to make things happen. Bowyer's not ideal, but he's doing a steady job considering the upheaval he's had to deal with, and he has the fans united for once. I'd be more inclined to stick at this point, rather than risk another twist.

[broadsword]

Can't see us making the play-offs. Even if we did we.'d have no more thwn a puncher.'s chance. Especially if Rhodes goes in jan.

If it really was promotion or bust, your arse would be squeaking right now, we.'re hardly firm favourites. .

Doomed, aye

[Proudtobeblue&white]

Are they just leaving Shelflife & GB to it now? They don't trap up, finance director leaves, no replacement - are they hoping Degsy will switch the lights off at the end? It is just very odd, putting money down the mine, without any sort of game plan (not that they ever had one beyond Jerome's vision) and just stating we need promotion!

Hiving off JR won't achieve that, so are they just waiting for doomsday?

I don't get it, what the Kean are they up to?

[Stuart]

But Bryan, we need to forget staying up. We need to get there before we worry about that. Even then we need to take the loser's money and go back down. The parachute payments clock starts ticking again and we buy ourselves some time.

If things are as dire as the accounts show then we need FFP-approved income, and quick. Unless you have another source you can tap?

Other than that it's the honourable but ill-considered drop down the leagues and the Trust, hopefully with a business partner or two, pick up the pieces.

Either way our future is not going to be anything like the last 20 years (before the last 3) so it comes down to: how do you take your poison, fast or slow?

[Proudtobeblue&white]

But the point is they threw money at promotion last year and failed. Whilst GB is bringing stability, we aren't PO material, never mind promotion. If the talk about JR is true, then their ambition to go up makes no sense, as they are happy to sell the crown jewel.

Yet they prop us up financially, and according to Kamy shun potential suitors.

Pride? Before the fall?

As I say, without them speaking, I don't get what's now in it for them?

[Waggy76]

My 1st away game was against Rochdale in 1972 and we lost ! Not the Roger Jones game ....

I am more than happy to revisit old haunts if the Venkys go !

Venkys have to go for the club to survive , whatever league we end up in ...

[OscarRaven]

I disagree with that first part. We're 4pts off the play-offs, and most of that has been spent without our two most creative players available (Dunn & Rochina). If we could buy another player in that mold, and another striker, we'd have enough firepower to maintain a proper promotion push. However, Venky's idea of being proactive would probably mean sacking Bowyer and putting Judan Ali in charge with Shebby as DOF. We just need them to write the cheques and let Bowyer and what remains of the boardroom to get on with the job.

Yep spending more money on transfers and wages, thats the solution to a 50million plus debt problem.

Send in your CV, Venky's might appoint you to the board, your clearly signed up to the premier league or bust plan.

[Athlete]

I wonder if Venkys have an exit plan in place ? either :

1. promotion or bust by putting more debt on a club they're going to bin come what may but by more borrowing/spending they may achieve that aim and make a few bob then punt the club at a break even or small profit

2. sell Rhodes , etc in Jan to balance books then admin the club

3. The most likely scenario take the last substantial parachute payment next summer , sell off the last remaining jewells and liquidate or admin VLL and BRFC .

4. carry on business as usual and our debt this time next year will be closer to 100Mill

think my moneys on option 3....

+ the FA stood by and let it happen.................

[AlanK]

I don`t care what anybody says, the fact of the matter is that the club down the road have proved that good management on and off the field can yield success on a shoestring budget. We should all take a leaf from their book. All credit to them. It makes a mockery of teams in this league spending £8m on a forward. Truth hurts eh?

[Paul]

Spot on Alan

[cesus]

I don`t care what anybody says, the fact of the matter is that the club down the road have proved that good management on and off the field can yield success on a shoestring budget. We should all take a leaf from their book. All credit to them. It makes a mockery of teams in this league spending £8m on a forward. Truth hurts eh?

Spending £8m on a striker in this league is ridiculous so I agree with that.

I will point out one fact about those down the road and one they cannot deny is the season they went up under Coyle they went Kean or bust, they couldn't afford to keep up with transfer payments (Eagles & Eckersley) and were about to be hit with a transfer embargo, they went balls out and it paid off. They pocketed the vast majority of the profits of the premiership money after paying off creditors (mainly directors) and that has reaped stability. They found stability when football was at its least stable, good luck to them & well planned, but and it's a massive but Burnley could be nearly finished now had things not gone their way.

[footypix]

I don`t care what anybody says, the fact of the matter is that the club down the road have proved that good management on and off the field can yield success on a shoestring budget. We should all take a leaf from their book. All credit to them. It makes a mockery of teams in this league spending £8m on a forward. Truth hurts eh?

John Williams proved that good management worked for 10 years.

His only mistake was getting Ince. He soon put that right by getting Big Sam in as replacement. It has been suggested on here more than once, that the decline of Rovers is being done on purpose.

What I want to know is this? What has happened to the £40m+ that the club brought in through player sales since Venky arrived?

[Simon Says]

John Williams proved that good management worked for 10 years.

His only mistake was getting Ince. He soon put that right by getting Big Sam in as replacement. It has been suggested on here more than once, that the decline of Rovers is being done on purpose.

What I want to know is this? What has happened to the £40m+ that the club brought in through player sales since Venky arrived?

Why would someone do this on purpose?

[Guest Norbert]

Are they secretly Burnley fans?

[rhodie]

John Williams proved that good management worked for 10 years.

His only mistake was getting Ince. He soon put that right by getting Big Sam in as replacement. It has been suggested on here more than once, that the decline of Rovers is being done on purpose.

What I want to know is this? What has happened to the £40m+ that the club brought in through player sales since Venky arrived?

It has taken a hell of a lot more money to keep the club going than the £40+ million we have got from player sales, that`s why we are in so much debt. Reading the article it says our wage bill alone is just under 37 Million. I don`t think that figure is taking into consideration transfer fees or paying players and managers out of their contracts either.